The line between DIY and buying

My first (and only) hammock I made myself. Thinking back to that experience, I saved about $40 vs purchasing a night owl because of the setup costs of the thread injector and measuring/sewing accessories.

It's a nice hammock, I've slept in it on every trip this year. However, I've never slept in another hammock, so my comparisons are vs a tent (sooo much better). My second DIY was an underquilt, and that went sideways on me. I still have to take it apart and try again.

So I'm second guessing myself, and I wanted to hear from the more experienced. To the DIY crowd, are there items you would not try to make yourself? Is DIY cost effective to the weekender? I'm always going to make my own amsteel byproducts, but wonder where the line is for other people between waiting and buying vs. materials and DIY.

Thx

I sewn a sil tarp that I love but the price of them compared to doing rolled hems on a slippery curve is no contest. Especially since you can find perfectly good used ones on teh market.

IMO the DIY procedure is not really worth it based on cost alone. Please note.... I said based on cost alone. Taking all other things out of consideration the cost for a commercial item is too reasonable to do the DIY route. _but_ when factoring in all the other aspects of the project... getting _exactly_ what you want, the satisfaction of making it yourself, the intangibles that figure in you are left with a whole different outcome. For me.. that's where the benefits of DIY are found.

Personally, I have no problem designing and fabricating a $250,000 curved stairway. But the thought of sewing a stuff sack :confused: intimidates me. I buy.

It's the trial, error and experimentation that can make DIY actually cost more than buying.

BUT if you already have a sewing machine and you follow well established instructions it can definitely save you money. I have commercial and DIY hammocks and keep getting tempted to buy other commercial hammocks but then I remember how well the DIYs work and see no need. If you have the time, then DIY is great.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Born_Old

So I'm second guessing myself, and I wanted to hear from the more experienced. To the DIY crowd, are there items you would not try to make yourself? Is DIY cost effective to the weekender? I'm always going to make my own amsteel byproducts, but wonder where the line is for other people between waiting and buying vs. materials and DIY.

Thx

---

Being "cost effective to the weekender" is pretty subjective when it comes to DIY gear. Compared to what? If you count your time towards the project, then no, it won't be as "cost effective" compared to what it can be produced for by one of the cottage industries here on HF. They're able to take advantage of quantity discounts, wholesale prices, having patterns, the experience of having made multiple copies of an item, having a space set up for production, etc. They work a long time prototyping and making patterns so the next one will be easier, faster, better. They all started as DIYers at some point, then turned it into a business.

Most DIYers aren't interested in making money, just saving some. If you're just comparing cost of material you buy vs. finished product shipped to your door, then yes, you can save some money. It will take longer, but you can make some really nice gear yourself. Will it be as good as what you can buy? Maybe yes, maybe not, depending on what you're comparing it to, your skills, and tools.

If you have to buy a sewing machine and material, and only plan to make one item, then you might be better off purchasing a finished product. I already had all the necessities for sewing, so making my own gear was simply a matter of having the raw materials and a plan. I'm outfitting a family of five, so DIYing our gear is pretty important to make our gear dollars go as far as possible.

As far as things I wouldn't attempt....for me, can't think of anything, but I have a lot of experience doing a lot of different things. It's purely a matter of having the tools to do it. If I had a CNC waterjet (like Dutch), I'd make my own Dutch Clips. (The first Dutch Clip was made with a drill press, hacksaw, and file.) In this case I don't have the $xxx,xxx for a cnc, so $12 is a great deal. With down UQs, $240 for a HG Incubator was the cost of material to make two for me and the lovely wife who also hangs. Money saved. It all depends on what you are willing to tackle. It took me a while to wrap my mind around working with down. It's not too big a deal, now that I've done it.

For me, many times I want something with features that aren't available. Then you really have to DIY it. It's part of the fun.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by stairguy

Personally, I have no problem designing and fabricating a $250,000 curved stairway. But the thought of sewing a stuff sack :confused: intimidates me. I buy.

---

Glad there are some folks who love stair jobs. I did two:scared:, and said never again. Down quilts not a problem. :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ramblinrev

getting _exactly_ what you want, the satisfaction of making it yourself, the intangibles that figure in you are left with a whole different outcome. For me.. that's where the benefits of DIY are found.

---

+1:shades:

Dutch: Thanks for the info about tarps. I have a walmart blue special with a kelty/chinook on the christmas wishlist. Then it's saving the pennies to buy something from GargoyleGear!

RamblingRev: Sounds much like my original thoughts on DIY. It's nice to know that I could do it and make it mine. Time/expense/supplies are the balance I am now trying to accomplish. I think now that once I can do it, I'll leave it to the more professional :)

Knotty: I agree on the hammock idea. What about the UQ, the TQ? Those would be my next worries after the shelter (tarp). I think I will be ccfing it until something changes.

Detail_Man: Down scares me. I think having a carpeted apt with 2 cats and a 17mo old makes it even more scary. With time will hopefully come a man cave (albeit one with a thread injector and fabric).

--For those who have done them, snakeskins look to be easy? I'm trying to think of those things I may make after a hammock that will help me practice, not cost a bunch, and help my outdoor experience the most. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Having done DIY.....6 hammocks....5 tarps......two UQs....gloves...a shirt....stuff sacks and a few bits and bobs. It was fun and it feels really terrific to be in or under or on something that you made.
But....I buy most stuff now considering the time it took me to do them.
I would do more tarps...fun.
No more UQs or TQs...unless I decide to make a -30º UQ.
Time is $$$$.
So really.....I don't know what I am ramble typing about.:laugh:
I say try it.
Get your Granny on)))))))
Shug

I think the line can be drawn by your enjoyment of DIYing. I love the challenge, problem solving and pride in one of a kind gear. But with that pride comes a little stress when I miss the mark. As far as saving money, It's two fold. 1st, if you enjoy the process then your time doesn't count as a cost (No fair getting paid to have fun). Secondly: obsessive research, good instructive resources, preoccupation, over-thinking, and over-measuring are a must. Otherwise you'll eat up your savings in material. Nice thing about this type of DIY is you can usually "un-sew" and try again. From what I gather stairs are much less forgiving.

Gathered end hammocks tree straps and whoopies barely count on the DIY scale, that's all I've done so far. Tarps are next, uqs and tqs prolly never

I used to try to make everything myself. It was pretty satisfying when it worked out, but when it didn't, I was left with a lot of parts, material, and a finished product I couldn't really use. Add in the time I spent to the cost, and sometimes it's just worth it to buy. Now I try to limit my projects to skills that I'll use again and again. If I'm going to buy new tools and learn something new to make one thing, or maybe in the long run make three things, then it's not worth it for me.

I like quality workmanship...that leaves DIY out for me, most of the time. The second part of the equation is would we enjoy DIYing say...a down UQ TQ etc? I have made a down vest once, just once. No thanks, never again.

A proud supporter of cottage industries! :D

I have a basic sewing machine and basic sewing skills. I want a bug net for the hammocks with nets. I keep copying instructions and keep not doing anything.

I like the look of Brandon's net (Warbonnet) with the curved zipper. NO WAY could I ever do that.

Anyone want to sell one?

I've made a down UQ and TQ, backpack, rain mitts, hammock, and gaiters. Bottom line: I would MUCH prefer to buy the big stuff (UQ and TQ) because I think making them is a pain in the butt, but I just don't have the cash. The small, easy stuff only take a bit, and can be close to free due to low material use, so I don't mind doing it. Some people seem to have fun making those big projects. Not me!

I like to make stuff, so I DIY more than not. BUT! I like to buy really cool gear from our great vendors, too. For me, the DIY aspects fuel the creative hobbyist inside. And sometimes I just want to try things I haven't seen done or tweak something for a more customized fit. But, if I want something semi-normal and don't want to spend the time making it, I'll buy. The money comparison is about even when I figure in the time I spend.

I'm a woodworker by trade so my work can be somewhat seasonal. When I have money it's because I'm busy with work (too busy too DIY camping gear). But when winter comes and work slows down,it makes sense to DIY. Price wise it doesn't save much, or any. The benifit is making EXACTLY what you want, for example I love my 6'6"X12' digital camo hammock, I wouldn't be able get one of those off of the shelf. Where thread injecting is like money in the bank, is for mods and repairs. I especially make a lot of repairs to my upland hunting clothes (damned barbed-wire). I've also repaired straps, packs and other clothing. I also like getting the same sort of satisfaction, when thread injecting and working with my hands, as I do while woodworking.

P.S. Usually my dyslexia is a pain but sometimes it gives me a chuckle; I read SelfMadeHiker's name as SelfMadeHitler and I thought what a terrible name no one will ever give him advice :D.

I could keep buying hammocks until I settled one one or more, but I'm intrigued to try my own ideas out, so I'm having fun learning in the process.

First lay in a purchased HH = ok
First lay in my first proto barely ready to hang = priceless ( as the commercial says)

I hope my skills rise to meet my aspirations, but the path to that destination is greatly satisfying and worth every step

YMMV

Stoves. I know how efficiently process the unused materials...

Never been much into DYI as to the time constraints..If I had more time, I would spend it hunting, fishing, and hammocking. I really enjoy getting my gear from the cottage makers and then enjoying it and how they made my life so much more enjoyable. They put their sweat, and workmanship into really great products that I know, do to my limited time, couldn't be even closely accomplished, so I will be one of those, that spend my money with them and admire everything they do to perfection. And like I say, spend my time in the woods when I can.

Much of it will depend on where your skills are, and what you're willing to commit to. Nothing is too complex that it can't be broken down into its component parts.
Timing and planning are primary factors, more-so than the monetary aspects are, in my opinion.
After being a designer for years, and being familiar with construction, it was a perfect fit for me. I essentially needed to aquire better sewing skills and familiarize myself with the variety of materials that are availiable to me. It's a matter of starting small and aquiring skills as proceed. I can't count all of the basic bags and sacks I've made since I've gotten into this D.I.Y. camp gear thing.
I'm constantly perfecting one item, and altering another, that's just me, it's a passion. I don't think that you should get into it if cost is primary desire. It's a personal thing of finding patience and pride in your own creations.

Diy- cost effective? Ha! Never! :)

Worth doing? Always!

Financially, most are better off working and paying the pros for their time instead. But...

...if you can make it, have the time to make it and will enjoy end result then do it.
I love using my own made kit, much better than bought as it gives me a bigger grin.

The only bits of kit that I've made that was cost effective was my Underquilts, single layer hammock and a few saws-I did save money, but only just. As they won't fetch much on resale, you potentially lose money there too.

Homemade kit is terrible for the wallet, great for the soul. ;)

If you have the sewing skills and you can get your hands on materials for a good price, then DIY will save you cash.

Its a hobby for me and I get satisfaction from using my homemade gear. Another good thing about DIY is doing repair and customization.

If I wanted to make an all white setup for winter stealth I could, but wouldnt.

You can also make things for other people and make a bit of cash on the side.
Or you can trade for things you cant make.

When I started looking at what I wanted I realized I could probably make some it. My stuff isn't as good as professional made, but I enjoy the challenge. Plus you can save money, if you already have sewing machine.

Like others have said if you have the time it is rewarding, and habit forming, cause once you see what you can do other projects jump on the list...

to me, the major benefit of DIY is that i know how to actually make something. many of my friends cant fix anything. they dont know how anything actually works which is ok if you are in town and just drop by walmart and get a new one. i have been out 3 days from civilization and the 3 day trip turns into a week of hel.l. making your own stuff forces you to learn the basics...it is the reason a learned several knots for when i either dont have hardware or the hardware failed (or floated down the river).

i just bought a hammock bliss no-see-um net because DIY would have cost me more so it isnt like i dont buy ready made stuff......since most people use hammocks out in the boonies, learning how to fabricate some basic kit isnt such a bad idea since your life may depend on it.

That's why I do it - not to save money, though I think I do for the most part. It's hard to calculate because most of the things I make don't exist until I make them.

I think as long as I have enough money to do the diy bit I will. If I want to save money I will use some of our fine cottage folk. also if I want something that looks nice and neat and elegant I will do the cottage bit every time! as my stuff usually works well but looks like it was made by a gnome, (pun intended!) diy is just plain fun!! As I work a lot in cuben, until the last year or two not much was available so I did a lot my self especially in the mode of glue stripping, (I have always been kinda afraid of sewing cuben, but I know several of our better cottagers do it successfully) enjoy,,,gnome

what is funny but when i was a kid in the 1960's, probably half the stuff i bought was a 'kit'....like a leather kit from tandy. kids made stuff all the time....we also modified our stuff and that wasnt something special.today 'modding' is such a big thing but as kids we just did it...?

i think that manufacturers have forgot that area...some like cold steel kinda promote their customers to mod their product (like the trail hawk tomahawk). kel-tec guns has a huge modding following.....i think they would sell more product if they gave us a product we could mod for our personal situation.

i get the feeling that lawsuits might have shut this practice down.......

i wouldnt call it modding but i think that everything i buy from china needs to be 'fixed' as i assemble it because quality control is so bad.

I DIY because I like the challenge of learning something new. I enjoy the process of design and construction. For me creating a piece of DIY gear is almost Zen like for me. It's just me my tools and total focus on what I am doing, leaving the rest of the world behind me for a bit. Like others have said, cost wise for me it comes out to be a little cheaper for me just to buy the materials, than to buy from great Cottage Industry suppliers that are out there. That however doesn't include my time. Lately I have a lot of free time so... not an issue for me.

i love the challenge and satisfaction of DIY. I am also a student and so my means are limited - and I can sort of multitask while doing DIY - I can half watch a movie at the same time.

In terms of the cost savings - for me it is huge, even if I spend a bit of time on making the gear. I have made 4 hammocks, 3 TQs, 2TQs and a tarp all for the cost of what 1 set of professionally made TQ/UQ would cost me. Which means I can take friends/gf out to hang with me and have a variety of rated TQ/UQ combinations...