MW3 or MW4?
trying to pull the trigger on the JRB Winter Set Sale, but would appreciate some wisdom from other JRB Winter Set users:
1. The extra $30 and 6 oz doesn't seem like much to give for the additional rating of the MW4 UQ. I don't anticipate being in the single digit temps much, but thought it'd be better to vent the MW4 in mid 20F temps rather than being on the edge of the MW3 rating. What are thoughts?
2. I have a HH Explorer Deluxe, bottom entry, but getting the 2QZQ mod #4. However, will the Mt Washington UQs allow the HH side tie-down shock cords to still be used - or not?
Thanks for any thoughts / advice / experience you can offer...
P.S.: I'll be using the MW3 or MW4 UQ with the Old Rag Mtn TQ in winter or the Sierra Stealth TQ in milder temps
That is hard to advise you on which one you need, all according to your needs of course. I have both ( MW3 is a convertible model).
Originally Posted by hawghangar
I have slept fine using the MW4 in the high 20s and snowing, no venting needed at all. I have also done one night at 10F in it no problem. One night in the high 40s or low 50s(not sure) I woke up soaked in sweat with the MW4 and a 21 oz Golight TQ that they used to call a 20F but I think now they call it a 40F. I really could not vent it with the stock hook up on a JRB bridge without some sort of mod. But maybe with less TQ I would have been fine?
As for the MW3, it seems extremely warm to me, maybe warmer than rated, though obviously it won't be as warm as the 4.
Both are great, lofty quilts. Both are differentially cut which means less worry about having a quilt adjusted too tight and crushing loft. The suspension is different than some other models, even some JRBs. It is a simple end connected suspension, rather than the popular perimeter style. There are pros and cons to each type I think. I think the end style is less likely to develop some of the problems I read about here, such as a sag with gap developing during the night, but I sure can not prove that. I am just basing that guess on the frequency of requests for UQ help I see here at HF. I personally have used moth types of suspension with no issues. But I do have to pay more attention to my perimeter style.
Oh I forgot: I have not used either of these on my HHs (I tend to use my HH Super Shelter), only with my WBBB and mostly with my bridge hammocks. But both MWs have loops on the side which I think are designed to fit the HH tie outs. But if you have a zip mod, I don't think you will need them. Just let the UQ wrap up around you, and reach out and give it a tug if you think it needs the position adjustment.
Thanks BB - as always good advice. Here is my planned logic to incorporate the JRB Winter Set with my existing HHSS and Sierra Stealth (40F) TQ:
Originally Posted by BillyBob58
1. Temp < high 20s: MW4 (vent as necessary) UQ + Old Rag Mt TQ
2. High 20s < Temp < Low 40s: MW4 (vent as necessary) UQ + Sierra Stealth TQ
3. Temp > 40s: HHSS + Sierra Stealth TQ
I'm concerned that the MW3 might get cool below high 20s... and am trying to maximize range of temps without scrapping existing equipment.
Regarding the side tie-outs, I guess it would be unusual that I would need the bug net in place while in the temperature range that required the MW UQ - so maybe this is a non-issue.
You think I'm off the mark with any of this logic?
I've used a JRB MW3 convertible, with a pad, down to -11F and was plenty warm.
I picked up a second hand mtw3c with similar goals as you, with a 20 degree low temp. What I have found in testing is that for me the 20-25 degree rating is closer to the 25 degree side. At 30 degrees and above I was warm, but as temps started to head toward the mid 20's I was not cold, but started to feel cool, and bellow 25, It was in need of a small piece of reflectex. So the rating are good, but for me a cold sleeper, I bottom out at 25. A few things you could think about if you wanted to go with the mtw3 would be to spend the money saved on a underquilt protector which I am looking at getting. Hoping it will add the few degrees extra warmth, and block the wind. Looking back, I think I would have just went for a Greylock 4 and would have been easily hit my 20 degree goal. All that being said, the quilt is very nice and well made.
IMO It would be easier to add insulation to the MW3 than to vent the MW4. I am a cold sleeper, usually 10° off ratings, and have had the MW3 into the low twenties with the addition of a 2QZQ UQP, a silk liner, and synthetic sleepwear. With the full length of the MW4, venting might be an inconvenient proposition.
The Old Rag Mtn TQ should work into your lower anticipated temperature range, and transition into the Sierra Stealth TQ range; plenty of venting options with the TQ.
A caveat to this is that I am new to hanging, and am simply relating my limited experience.
YMMV, HYOH, etc.
No, not off at all but as always depending on your individual cold tolerance, and see Chebaca's post. And depending on what kind of experience you have been having with the HHSS.
Originally Posted by hawghangar
Just something to keep in mind: if you successfully use an HHSS, let's say down into the 40s, when you go from the HHSS to an UQ, you give up the wind block properties of the HHSS undercover. If you have a sheltered site and or a big enough tarp with an excellent pitch- or no wind - this will be of no consequence. If you are exposed to the wind for whatever reason, it can be very significant. Also, FWIW, you will be giving up the VB and whatever radiant effect the space blanket has. I think the space b. /VB is very helpful, as I also use it to push the bottom rating of my PeaPod even lower than 20. YMMV. But something to keep in mind when you switch to a totally different system.
OTOH, several here have reported successfully using an MW4 pretty much all by itself below zero. Many others in the low single digits. For me, 10F on a bridge hammock, very windy(with inadequate tarp coverage) 18F on a WBBB, all nice and warm. Plus if you study up on it, no reason you could not augment it with a space blanket if desired, just make sure you know what you are doing. But it looks like you are not planning to push it much lower than 20, so you should have plenty of reserve even if you sleep a bit cold.
The MW3, you might push that a bit beyond it's rating. Consider Chewbaca'a results. But if that is only a rare event, you shouldn't be too miserable. Plus, there is always that space blanket, or even augmenting with a thin pad on rare occasions.
Consider those Greylocks also, unless a special MW sale is on. My favorite way to use my MW3 convertible is in short mode, which goes from the top of my head ( on a bridge hammock) to my knees.
And Fartintone ( aka Cool Hand Luke :laugh: ) makes good points about venting as opposed to augmenting the MW3 when needed. Plus you do save some money and oz with an MW3. Oh, so many ways to skin the cold cat!
This becomes the $64K Question to make this decision! If venting the MW4 is problematic, then I think I'd rather worry about supplementing the MW3 on the RARE occassion that I'm hanging in temps < mid 20F, than have a sweaty back on the FREQUENT occassion hanging in the upper 20F and lower 30F.
Originally Posted by fartintone
I just FedEx'd the HH to 2QZQ for the mod #4.... may need to ask them to return it with a breathable UQ protector to supplement the MW3 (can just about pay for it with the savings between the MW3 and MW4).
...too many options....:confused:
True, there are so many options, good options at that!
Originally Posted by hawghangar
I was no where near a sweaty back in the upper 20s with an MW4. It was very unseasonably warm in April at one of Ed Speer's hang outs in NC the time I woke up sweating so much. The low was somewhere between 47 and 51. The sweating may have been as much or more my TQs fault than the UQ, since heat rises.
Pulled the Trigger!
Swallowed hard and just ordered the 3 Season Winter Set on Sale... includes the Mt Washington 3 UQ and Sierra Sniveler TQ.... hopefully this will give me adequate combinations down to the high teens / low 20s.
Thanks for all the input - and patience while I "think out loud" and over analyze these decisions.