Hate Tom?

[MedicineMan]

'Tom's actions do not reflect the community spirit of hammockers' well said!
HH had a dynasty based on unique ideas but then profit and potential loss of said dynasty pushed him to push others....we're not a push community but a reach out and assist one. The push became interpreted as greed and that led to many of us searching for alternatives and often what we found was a superior product which led to more pushing in the legal system which led to even more angst among a group that primarily shares. The HH approach could have been different, instead of a letter from an attorney it could have been a reaching hand. Whenever I detect such I move on...anytime I see one vendor slamming another when they could have said 'good idea, wish I'd thought of that' I move on. It's all attitude.

[Trooper]

If they came as an option from Tom with a zipper and no bottom entry, I would own one by now. I thought there was some talk about that as an option? Maybe it was just gossip

-Ricegravy!

The Jungle Hammock is a Hyperlight, with a zipper, sans split. But, for the price I'd just get a different model and send it to 2QZQ or get a Blackbird.

[Pitch]

... He has patented a number of obvious ideas which were no doubt used before he was born ...

I have a few patents myself (electronics, and for completely unrelated art) so I can speak to this a bit.

If the things he patented (or one or more of the claims he uses in the patents) are truly pre-existing concepts and were of public knowledge (and this must be provable) then those claims on the patent involved can be declared null and void in court.

Examples:

If you tried to patent a video-watch or a teleportation device these things can not be patented because prior art exists - namely **** Tracy comic books and Star Trek respectively.

It all comes down to proof of publicly available prior art that pre-dates that moment of invention in the claims.

I'm not saying you're wrong... in fact I know nothing about this guy or his products or his patents or any animosities... " I'm just sayin' " =)

-XexorZ

[Mustardman]

If the things he patented (or one or more of the claims he uses in the patents) are truly pre-existing concepts and were of public knowledge (and this must be provable) then those claims on the patent involved can be declared null and void in court.

And how many guys making hammocks out of their garages after work can afford to go to court to fight it out?


The point is, he uses the THREAT of legal action to strongarm people and try to maintain a stranglehold on the market, while preventing others from innovating. He's like the hammock mafia

[slowhike]

Yep, you'll see that discussed in this thread on patents...
http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/s...ghlight=patent

[BillyBob58]

So what I understand is that the product is fine, it is the personality of the producer to which folks disagree. People will always be passionate about what they have or want and there is no accounting for taste.

Sorry, Pedro. I didn't realize this was such a passionate issue that had been discussed before. I think I have my answer, so I will cease and desist.

That is pretty much it, seems to me. ( EDIT: Maybe not pretty much it regarding personality or accounting for taste or passion for products- the complaints are more related to actions that have been taken or threatened I believe)

IMO, the HH products are just fine in quality and comfort, though many prefer other products. I mostly seem to prefer other products over all. Regardless, the HH brought me into the hammock world and it did a fine job of it. I have never had any real complaint with the comfort of my HH UL Expl, and I don't really have any trouble with the bottom entry. Some times, when the underside of the tarp is pitched close and wet with condensation, it comes in real handy. And after a few nights, I could be in and out of that thing- even with the SS UC in the way- faster than I can with some top entry models.

As for the tarps, the stock is very small but very light. The optional extra cost sil-nylon Hex weighs the same as any other sil tarp of it's size(12 foot RL, 19 oz) and is a very good tarp, though lacking cat cuts.

And since I recently cut the net off and started using WBG's separate net( when a net is even needed), I find the Exp with SS ( or an UQ) is now even much more competitive with all of the others. It really is at least as comfortable for me, for back sleeping, as most any other gathered end(GE) hammock I have tried, and more comfortable than a few. (Ironically, The one gathered end I can think of that definitely beats it for over all comfort is the No Net HH Safari.) Some other GE brands might be a little better for side sleeping, but it's not bad really. I only speak of the longer Exp( or even longer Safari) models, and don't know about shorter models comfort wise. But getting that net out of my face has done wonders and moved this hammock up a notch or two. Plus, it allows me to work so much easier with the SS, adjusting it just right and placing a fleece jacket where it might be needed or checking for compressed loft. The SS is 10 times easier to use with no net in the way, plus it is now easy to use with a WB torso UQ, or even a Pea Pod.

As for TH himself, I don't think there is a problem between him( or HH folks) and his customers. In my experience, the customer service is fine. But at least in the past, TH didn't seem to me much interested in any changes in his product. I base that on conversations with him, and his lack of presence on this forum. Nothing wrong with that, if that is how a producer wants to go. But it might easily lead to folks preferring the product of of someone more interactive with the HF community, especially if the other producers are responding to requested customer suggestions.

And then there is the entire patent thing and even reputed threatened enforcement against DIY folks., as discussed at length elsewhere. I can certainly see how that could turn some folks off, if true.

But as for the products or customer service, I see no problems there, though personal pref might very likely lead one to choose any number of other hammocks. ( I need help, I have chose just about all of them! )

FWIW, which aint much!

[animalcontrol]

I'm all for constructive criticism, but these comments don't seem to have quantifiable nor objective basis. So, why do folks hate Hennessy products so much, but rave over products that seem to be very similar? Kind of like the Blonde/Brunette argument isn't it?

I would also clarify that those comments are opinions and as such, need no quantifiable or objective basis.
As with any other opinion, I'd recommend you try and understand the authors point-of-view. For myself, I've owned or made 10 different styles and shapes of hammocks (less than many others here). If listed them 1 to 10, my HH Exped would come in 10th for the reasons listed above plus I simply never was comfortable.
I hope your HH is your #1 and that you use it frequently...HYOH
Blonde/Brunette? I'd liken it to a Chevette/Corvette, but that is strictly my opinion

[Trooper]

The reason I started this thread was because i noticed comments directed more towards Mr. Hennessy himself (Hence my tounge-in-cheek topic title) rather than the hammocks and a few others regarding where they are manufactured. It made me wonder if there was a problem with the product itself or if people just didn't care for certain features or where they were produced. Was it simply that there was something new available and the old wasn't popular anymore? Was it simply pride in ones own gear? I was hoping to elicit comments about the hammock features and why people preferred certain features.

I had no idea that the hammocking community was so disgruntled by Mr. Hennessy's business practices. I knew that he had patents, as there is an allusion to such on the stuff sack, but I had no idea about his efforts to enforce them nor the community's reaction. It is clear to me now that there is nothing wrong with Hennessy products themselves, which is reassuring since I now own one. I apologize for resurrecting an old and passion-filled topic. I never would have guessed that people actually had personal issues with Mr. Hennessy, and I certainly didn't intend for this topic to take such a negative turn.

Perhaps I should have lurked more...a modus operandi to which I will return. I'm off to watch some of Shug's videos as they always put me in a good mood.

[Dutch]

I'm just glad you didn't start a thread Hate Dutch?. I'd hate to see that list.

[Nest]

It is clear to me now that there is nothing wrong with Hennessy products themselves, which is reassuring since I now own one.

Since you mention it, I will make this one comment on the product quality. I have seen quite a few Hennessy ridgelines snap when someone is in the hammock. Ask on this website what strength line you would use for a ridgeline and a majority of the people will reccomend a line that is near the 600lb+ rating. At trail days last year I was looking for a ridgeline to add to two hammocks for my hiking buddies, and went to Hennessy to ask if he sells spare ridgelines. When I asked him what the line was rated for he said 350lbs. Not sure what model uses that line, but that was a big red flag for me. He said he knew the ridgelines were snapping, and blamed it on people tying the hammocks too tight. That may be true, but the instructions don't mention anything about not tying it too tight as far as I can remember. Regardless, it would be more customer friendly to just spend two extra bucks per hammock to put a ridgeline on the hammock that won't break.