Western Mountaineering Under Quilt

[mychal]

I wonder how this compares to Hammock gear stuff in the field because the WM quilt has 8 oz of fill while the HG 20 degree has 12 oz of fill--the HG 40 degree has 7 oz of fill (standard size).

Me too... But the WM UQ is significantly tapered on the ends, so the lower amount of fill could be attributed to that.

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[obxcola]

I'm going to try and work out the difference in weight based on fill and actual square footage of the WM quilt compared to a Hammock Gear incubator 20. Will repost when I'm uninterrupted and I can get my denominator and numerator straightened out.. sheesh.

[Coldcityely]

I know it’s supposed to be a minimalist quilt and that’s what western mountaineering does well, but the lack of down actually in the quilt makes me sceptical it’s really a true 20* quilt. For $280 I would feel a lot better about getting a nice underquilt from UGQ or HG that I trust would keep me warm down to its rating. But I also would like to read reviews and hear what others have to say. I’m interested in the math of diffference in weight based fill and square footage comparing the WM to the HG, because reading the HG 40 has about the same amount of fil as the WM 20 makes me wonder how it’s possible for the slinglite to be a 20* quilt.

[OlTrailDog]

Great to see a USA company of the high caliber of WM delving into the hammock world. I've owned an Antelope for decades, simply an excellent bag from an excellent company. Also owned a WM Megalite, but I realized that I didn't need/want the extra room or length for my skinniness. I replaced it with a Brooks Range Mountaineering Alpini 30 regular size for a summer bag and it has served me well.

[ObdewlaX]

I've noticed the Slinglite in WM's product lineup too and I dig that color! No doubt it'd be top quality like everything else they do & I'd love to give one a try but at $280, there are quite a few options out there at that price & less. However, if at 13 oz. it's honestly rated to 20 deg., that might be worth it. I'm sure with a suitable clothing base layer & top quilt, it'd work fine down into the 20's. I'd like to think there's a top quilt coming along at some point to compliment the Slinglite.

I too have a couple of WM bags and they have always performed.... an Antelope MF for when it gets really cold & an old Iroquois, which has been my go to 3 season bag for the tent & hammock forever. Not made anymore, it weighs ~13 oz and I've been using it as an top quilt with the hammock & works well in the cooler months.

[obxcola]

OK let me see if I can get this straight.

Using what I could find out about the WM it's 45 inches in the middle and 26 at the ends and 74 inches long. Someone better at geometry might correct this but the best I can figure that makes each half a 45 inch x 26 inch isosceles trapezoid.

The formula per wiki for that is the height x the average of the 2 parallel ends or 37 (half of 74) x 35.5 x 2 or why not just 74 x 35.5 = 2627 divided by 144 (square foot in inches) = 18.24 square feet. The listed weight is 13 oz. so that's 18.24 square feet weighing 13 oz or 13/18.24 = .71 oz per square foot.

The fill is listed as 8 oz. for 18.24 '2 so 8/18.24 =.4385 so we'll call it .44 oz 850 down per square foot.

by the way I guess this leaves 5 oz. for the skin, baffles , suspension and what not so misc. material is 5/18.24 or .274 oz. of shell & etc per '2

Comparing with what I can figure out about a Hammock Gear Incubator 20:

Listed size of the nearest comp length of 74" is 73 by 44. Depending on how close this comes out we could take the extra inch x 44 and re-factor but that's another round of tedious math. So 73 x 44 = 3212"2 / 144 = 22.305 square feet weighing 20.25 ounces

20.25 / 22.305 = .907 call it .91 ounces per square foot so the Hammock Gear is @ .20 of an ounce heavier per square foot.

the fill is listed as 11 oz for the 22.305 square feet so 11/ 22.305 = .493 call it .49 ounces down per square foot so there's .05 ounces more down per square foot. Based on the WM size of 18.24 that accounts for basically 1 ounce. ( BTW it is my impression that 1 oz added to a 18.24 square foot quilt could have a significant impact)

The material and whatnot including the suspension is 20.25 - 11oz fill or 9.25 of shell, baffle, suspension etc or 9.25/22.305 = .4147 call it .414 per square foot so that's a major factor in the weight difference of .14 oz per square foot. Based on the WM size of 18.24 that accounts for 2.55 ounces

The difference in overall size 22.305 '2 - 18.24'2 = 4.07 ' 2 at the HG weight per square foot of .907 accounts for 3.69 ounces.

So add the 3.69 + 2.55 + 1 or 7.24 ounces + 13 = 20.24 so that's a good double check.

OK so here's the questions I have:

1. WM lists the material as 15 denier> The HG listed weight is for.10 denier argon .67 which HG lists as weighing @.9 oz less for the 20 incubator. than their 15 denier argon.90. So how come the WM material, suspension etc weight is still that much less? Skimpy suspension? unobtainium fabric?

2. The HG does have more fill per square foot but not a lot more so based on fill weight per square foot the WM stats don't seem way out of line so far as accounting for the fairly amazing 13 oz listed weight but the extra ounce spread over the WM size could make the listed temp rating questionable. A 25 degree quilt when the temp drops to 22 can be a real bummer come about 5 AM.

3. THE $ Question: the 4.07 ' 2 less total area accounts for 3.69 ounces. Does the taper to 26 inches work? Is it worth it? How much would it add to construction costs having unequal baffle lengths?

Does any other quilt maker taper at the ends? Do they taper that much? I calculate the WM ends to be .41 shorter than the middle.

Someone earlier in the thread noted they'd encountered one on the AT and you could not work a diagonal position with the narrow tapered end; or not without opening a gap that let in cold air. I'd switch back,copy and paste the quote but afraid to leave this post at this stage.. Any other reviews or experiences out there?

Evidently this underquilt came out just this year?

BTW I have an HG underquilt and a WM sleeping bag and think both are excellent products and no axe to grind or pot to sweeten with either and wish both nothing but the best!

[snwcmpr]

BTW I have an HG underquilt and a WM sleeping bag and think both are excellent products .....

Me too. I have not transitioned to a TQ.
I am thinking that WM is not yet targeting this area of the market. But, will be, very soon.

Ken in NC

[J.young]

just got my slinglite today. also own HG underquilts. the WM is deffinitly a lighter smaller package but appears could use a couple more oz. of down. seems to have thinner areas. the high viz green is transparent and can see spots of the black reverse side material showing through the down. hopefully will get to testing the next couple days. getting a good diagonal lay may be difficult as it seems to be sized more for the smaller UL hammocks on the market

[J.young]

finally got around to trying my slinglite out today. cold and very windy here in central Ohio. as suspected the slinglite was a little small for me in a double nest. I'm over 6' and not a small guy. worked decently with a cocoon/straight lay but couldn't get the coverage I wanted diagonally. mainly up near my head and or feet depending on how adjusted. the slinglite is a bit smaller than my HG 20 incubator so it doesn't have the extra girth to really wrap under you. not as warm either. could use a couple oz. overstuffing I think. I think 30+ would be a much more accurate temp rating. for anyone of smaller stature though I believe the slinglite would be a doable lightweight uq. my daughter used it with a grand trunk ultralight and the fit was perfect and a nice diagonal lay. possibly fidlin with the top edge hooks attaching them to hammock edge you could achieve an asymmetrical uq mounting that would match your lay in a larger hammock. maybe next time. all in all this is a well made and very light weight uq. I can see keeping this in the rotation for warmer weather hangs and kayak trips.