What role does clothing play in YOUR sleep system?

**Just Jeff** · 03-07-2010, 09:59

Some random thoughts on insulation layers...all getting to the fact that I'm tinkering with my Colorado winter system and might start carrying more clothing and a thinner TQ. So how do you use clothing in your sleep system?

- Some people sleep in very few clothes under their top quilt or in their sleeping bag, and a few people don't use any sleeping bag or top quilt, preferring to sleep only in thick insulated clothes with a pad. I'm thinking about a mix of the two.
- In three-seasons I don't carry much at all for worn insulation. If I'm in camp, I just set up while I'm still warm from hiking, eat a quick dinner, and go to bed. If it's cool (usually when I first wake up), I put on the No Sniveler as a poncho. This has worked great so far.
- In Colorado winters, I should probably carry a true worn insulation layer. I've been using the REI Generator. It works and it's really light considering the cost (nowhere near Nunatak)...I think it was $100 at a member's sale. But it doesn't have an integrated hood.
- For sleeping, I definitely see the advantage of a hood integrated onto the jacket. I've been using the JRB hood...it's great and very warm. Sometimes when it's cold enough to really cinch it up, the drawstring slides up near my face, and I have to make sure it stays tucked inside my jacket around my neck. (I don't want to add velcro to my jacket, which would solve that problem.) A lighter and more form-fitting solution would be a true winter jacket with the hood attached.
. -- The problem I see with this is that the JRB hood is THICK and luxurious, and most hoods on down jackets are thick enough to keep you warm when you're awake and moving...not when you're asleep and your metabolism plummets. I could add a balaclava under the hood, and that would give me a layering option for when I'm moving around but it's not cold enough for the big hood. But it's more weight and another piece of gear to keep up with.

So what I've been thinking about is something like a 1-1.5" down jacket with integrated hood, coupled with either an elephant's foot (14 oz for 20F) or the No Sniveler (or another TQ of similar loft).

This might be a little more weight b/c of the extra fabric when compared to using only a thicker top quilt, but it's also more convenient in winter up here. And probably safer, too.

I also have a Montbell ThermaWrap...so even in the cooler shoulder seasons up here I could wear that and the Stealth instead of taking the NS.

So what do y'all think? Would you rather carry minimal worn insulation and a thicker TQ, or more worn insulation and a thinner TQ? Pros/cons of each?

**Shug** · 03-07-2010, 10:22

I have been paring down my winter wear .... still bringing a good and warm TQ or SB. For me not having to be forced to crawl in my TQ and hammock because of inadequate clothing limits me. That said ... the quest for the perfect winter clothing system is ongoing.
I like to sleep in less these days ... I sweat less. But I have to get up at some point and add a layer say round 4:30AM. This is a usual pee break for me. Or I just always wake up. I like it ... it keeps a lot of condensation out of my TQ in winter and I can/could extend my trip.
I have always carried a big down parka 1 1/2 lbs. Been leaving it behind in favor of my MontBell down inner jacket (short sleeves). It is warm but not enough for a deep Minnesota winter so I also carry another thicker down vest. Add my JRB down sleeves and I am good. I still have my synthetic pull-over and Packa or rain jacket left. If all that does not keep me warm .... exercise or crawl in. Legs ....Thermawrap pants and rain pants over what I am wearing and usually good to bed.
Sleep for me is two pairs SW socks and sometimes in real cold JRB sleeves, long-johns, SW top with collar and zip and 100 weight polar fleece top, wrist-warmers, balaclava, hat, hood. Face mask if way below 0º
Key to my warmth are wrist-warmers, balaclava and BlackRock hat.
I feel warm.
Shug

**Dutch** · 03-07-2010, 10:26

I also use my jrb hood only it is velcroed to my down jacket. If it is cold enough to have a down jacket I'm pretty much going to sleep with it on. It makes it nice to have my arms out and read. I really don't remove clothes from hiking at all. Maybe change my socks but that is it. I have done 100 miles already without removing my socks once. I now it is gross. I use to carry sleeping clothing but they got cut in weight reduction. Now I may have a shirt and tights that I add for camp and to sleep in and early morning camp. But I concider it added insulation and will take a lesser quilt since I have boosted my layers. On my coldest night I should be wearing everything and staying warm and I will feel successful. Then I will have a rain coat and a hot water bottle if it isn't working like planned. Mostly all this is out of laziness and desire to have a light pack. I'm not trying to be sweet smelling and I usually am not.

I think one time when I slept in my rain pants after eating a whole bunch of roasted garlic hummus I created a new eco-system based on methane gas. When I got home I found a whole bunch of sea monkeys that died as soon as they were exposed to fresh air and sunlight.

**Just Jeff** · 03-07-2010, 10:37

Originally Posted by Dutch

I'm not trying to be sweet smelling and I usually am not.

No, but I bet you look good in your tights and hiking skirt.

**Shug** · 03-07-2010, 10:39

Originally Posted by Dutch

.
I think one time when I slept in my rain pants after eating a whole bunch of roasted garlic hummus I created a new eco-system based on methane gas. When I got home I found a whole bunch of sea monkeys that died as soon as they were exposed to fresh air and sunlight.

I just gagged on my Special K!!! .... Man that is funny!!!!!!

**Dutch** · 03-07-2010, 10:45

Originally Posted by Shug

I just gagged on my Special K!!! .... Man that is funny!!!!!!

Sea Monkey are always funny, especially down your pants.

**gRaFFiX** · 03-07-2010, 11:56

Originally Posted by Dutch

I think one time when I slept in my rain pants after eating a whole bunch of roasted garlic hummus I created a new eco-system based on methane gas. When I got home I found a whole bunch of sea monkeys that died as soon as they were exposed to fresh air and sunlight.

Dutch, you made me burn my lip on my coffee. You are one funny SOB!

I ate a whole jar of Greek Peppers with some homemade Tacos on my last overnighter of the summer. I had hung on a ridge near 6500' so the night was cold and windy, and I had my SB cinched over my face. Well at some point during the night, there was an emergency evacuation from the rear, and with the SB over my face, I "Dutch Ovened" myself summtin fierce!

As far as my sleep system goes, I change outta my hiking cothes into lite sweat pants and a cotton t-shirt, a synthetic balaclava, and a fur lined aviator's hat with the ear flaps clipped down. If it's going to be really cold (Shug don't laugh, California gets cold in winter... for us) I put on my thermal underroos. I usually wear a clean pair of socks because my feet get really cold, and any sweat will take the heat away. I also will bring my nalgene, with boiling water, to bed if it's really cold and have luke-warm water for breakfast when I wake up.

It's not perfect, but it works for now.

**Triggerhpy** · 03-07-2010, 12:26

Increase the dead air space around you fron you tarp in. Cover your head, dry socks and gloves. With that said, the rest is up to you and your style of sleeping. I go with KIS-KIF. Keep it simple, keep it fun.

**E.A.Y.** · 03-07-2010, 13:21

Great timing for this discussion! I'm thinking of switching things up a bit.

In the past I've brought a change of clothes for sleeping in and used a heavier top bag. Basically, my hiking clothes, a lightweight sweater for just in case, and sleeping clothes. Means I tuck myself into my hammock and read until I'm sleepy if it gets chilly in the evening.

This spring, I'm thinking of trying out more layers at night and a lighter top quilt. Especially since my upcoming overnighter is with a group and I'll probably spend more time sitting around chatting at night then I usually do. So the more portable layers of insulated jacket and fleece pants will come in handy and a lighter quilt than I usually would carry this time of year will mean the insulation-for-sleeping weight is about the same, with more versatility in the system.

I do sweat a bit when I sleep so I am not sure this will work for me, but a short overnighter is probably the best place to test it out.

I'm dithering around about underquilts/pads/combo. I'll probably make up my mind for this next weekend's trip on Friday night!

**ikemouser** · 03-07-2010, 11:23

I sleepin 200wt icebreakers bottoms and a thick smartwool zipup top. I also have nitriles gloves and kombi goretex/prima loft mitts and a balaclavas in my gear shelf on the wbbb. For warmer times I swap ou the 200 bottoms for 150s and the smartwool for a 150 wt tee. Winter - 2 no snivs And a pad if needed, summer-yeti and big Agnes pitch pine. Keeping gloves and balaclavas close gives me allthe range I need. J have taken
my w inter setup to 15f with no prob.