A question on integrated vs. external bug netting

[Cold Butt Stephen]

I am sorry if this has been covered already, but my searches were unsuccessful, so here it goes.

Do y'all prefer integrated bugnetting like in the HH, or something more like the ENO Guardian ?

I know that the Guardian is pretty darn heavy (weighing in at 16 ounces), but does the integrated netting work? I just took a trip out with no netting into the bayou of Louisiana (where I'm living now). Now, I swear that Louisiana has mosquitos the size of small dogs, but they definitely bit me through my hammock and the pair of boxer briefs I was wearing .

Do y'all treat your hammock with anything to prevent this if you have integrated netting, or are the bugs just less vicious there?

[Bubba]

Some people treat their hammocks with permethrin. Other hammocks like the Warbonnet Blackbird and Traveler have double layer models which help prevent getting bitten. The separate bugnets are handy if you want to be able to use your hammock with or without the netting depending on the weather or time of year.

[Rat]

Permethrin thread

I treat and have never had a problem; but I don't live in Louisiana either. If I had to chose on netting it would be something like the ENO Guardian, or warbonnets bug net @ only 7.5 ounces. Of course as odds said, a WBBB dbl would proly fix ya right up as well.

[nacra533]

I think the consensus is to treat the bugnet and hammock with Pemethrin. Once dried, it is relatively harmless. This is the chemical they use in bug repellant clothing. It's also safe for use on pets. You can find it in the camping section of walmart in name brand formulas.

I purchase it at the local feed and seed in concentrated form and use it around the house to control pests as well. There are various concentrations.

Although I live in GA and have lots of bugs here as well, I prefer a separate bugnet because I remove it in the winter. I also like the ability to adjust my UQ while in the hammock without trying to do it while locked inside like you are with an integrated hammock and bugnet.

I have the ENO net and it is very well made and heavy. It's also tough to hang and position a UQ inside the net because of the zipper. I rarely use it. I use one very similar to the one in the link below but I used bugnet material instead of tulle. Tulle is a pain to work with and not very durable. I think a bunch of folks were working on this at the same time, which I think stemmed from Just Jeff's bug sock and hammock sock.

http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/s...ad.php?t=21153

[pedro]

Separate bug net here. Because of all the points that Nacra made.

It's also safe for use on pets.

Permethrin is not safe for all pets. It is toxic, potentially lethal, for cats and fish.

[lori]

Separate bug net here. Because of all the points that Nacra made.





Permethrin is not safe for all pets. It is toxic, potentially lethal, for cats and fish.

Addendum: It is very toxic to cats and fish in liquid form.

Once my clothing is dry, my cat has rubbed, lain on, sat on etc. and not yet developed so much as a skin rash. I think she'd be dead by now if it were toxic once dry and bonded to fabric.

[rjcress]

I think the consensus is to treat the bugnet and hammock with Pemethrin.

I both laughed and cringed when I read this.

Sorry that this is a bit tangential to the original question... but relevant to the bug protection theme.

Short explanation:
Please, Please! If you choose to use a chemical bug treatment on your gear, re-treat every time you go out.

Not short at all explanation:
I worked for an animal pharma company until recently, and our Parasitologists continually lamented the impact that infrequent treatment with parasisticides has on the insect population and the continued efficacy of the parasiticides.

When first applied in adequate dose the parasiticide (Permethrin, in this case) is effective at killing the bugs. ALL of them. However, over time, the potency diminishes to the point that some bugs, the ones with a higher resistance to the parasiticide (often attributed to mutation), are not killed by it. The classic natural selection scenario plays out, and we end up with a higher and higher percentage of bugs that have a higher level of resistance, and therefore, the parasiticide becomes less effective, and eventually useless.

On the individual level, it is easy to write this off as not applicable, as the time in a particular area, frequency of exposure, etc are unlikely to be sufficient to have a major impact on the environment. However, in areas where this type of use is common... like, say, shelters along the AT... where consensus has created a consistent and high frequency of useage, it is entirely plausible to see the bug population evolve resistance relatively quickly. In the past this wasn't a problem, as developing new molecules could be done fairly cost effectively. Today, all the easy ones have been used, and development of new molecules is much more difficult, time consuming, and costly. So when the current crop of parasiticides become ineffective, we may be in for a rude awakening.

For a great example, look up the recent and steadily decreasing efficacy of Frontline for treatment of fleas on dogs. As owners try to stretch the duration between applications, fleas are exposed to decreased levels of the parasiticide and some survive... and breed... resulting in more fleas with a higher tolerance for Frontline. Frontline is a great parasiticide, but it has been abused by well meaning folks that didn't understand what they were doing was creating a problem.

So, not trying to beat anyone up for using bug spray, just though y'all might find it interesting that about the worst thing that people can do with any parasiticide like this is to apply once a year and let the potency diminish markedly over time. I suspect that most people have never been told that, If reapplied frequently enough that the potency never diminishes enough that mutated/resistant parasites can survive, then this particular problem is solved. This is not really a bug spray and hammock issue as much as it is a global use of parasiticides in the environment issue.
ie. imagine the impact poor use of parasiticides has on bugs that destroy crops.
Practices like issuing military uniforms treated with Permethrin are not sustainable practices, unless they are retreated frequently.
I can only imagine the level of resistance developing among mosquitos on military installations.

BTW, per the NIH http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0001040):
What side effects can this medication cause?

Permethrin may cause side effects. Tell your doctor if any of these symptoms are severe or do not go away:
skin irritation
rash
redness
swelling

Wikipedia lists even worse side effects.

[cataraftgirl]

I gave this subject a bit of thought recently. I have a Trek Light hammock, which is your basic gathered end hammock. I like the hammock, and most of the time use it on river trips where mosquitos aren't a problem. But once a year we do an early summer trip on the Green River thru Desolation Canyon which has truly horrendous mosquitos & no-seeums. I also like to read in my hammock before going to sleep, and get annoyed by the little flying bugs & moths that are attracted to my headlamp. I wasn't sure that I wanted to put on & take off a large bug net every time I set up. Some nets have either a vertical or horizontal zipper and some are just big net socks that you slide back to get out. Another feature I liked about the all in one hammock with net, is that it will help contain my sleeping bags that I use as top quilts.
So now I have a WBBB on order. You might want to do a search and look at the thread about the HUG, a DYI partial bugnet. Another option.
KJ

[dejoha]

+1 for separate bug netting.

I've used built-in and separate bug netting and I'm working on testing a new half bug net (HUG) because I'm a gram weenie and I like to exit quickly from a hammock when necessary (usually when I backpack with my kids who often need middle-of-the-night attention. Getting stuck inside a bug net has been frustrating!

I also like separate bug netting because I can leave it at home if/when I don't need it. The HUG net is a new experiment, thinking of the hammock as a complete system and using the different pieces as integral parts of bug protection.

[blackswift]

I like to have a hammock with integrated netting for all but the winter season. In the winter, I'll just use a different hammock without netting. The Switchback hammock allows you to roll your netting up above you like a tarp in snakeskins, so you can easily exit fast on either side when not in use. I really am liking my Switchback.