MacPack ponderings...

[Rat]

Glad I could help! I really need to check this thread more often...

[WV]

Glad I could help! I really need to check this thread more often...

Very timely, Rat. I just took a break from my current project to check the forum. Current project: cutting my MM Front Pack in half and adding aluminum stays to turn it into "balance pockets" like those on Aarn packs. It required a minor modification to my Molly Mac Pouches also (moving one of the straps over so it uses adjacent columns on the PALS array), but I think it's going to work pretty well. I still have to make the holsters on the hip belt to take the bottom ends of the stays, though, and that may be a bit more complicated. Depending on how I encapsulate the stays with straps for attaching to the PALS array, I may be able to do without the FrontPack halves entirely for lighter loads and attach the stays directly to the MM Pouches, but I expect I'll want to use the Front Pack halves to hold my knife and other small pouches. The versatility of this system is wonderful.

Sorry no pics - my camera is broken. I'll get Mac to document this at Mt. Rogers (if it works.)

[MacEntyre]

I'll get Mac to document this at Mt. Rogers (if it works.)

...be glad to do that, Dave!

I thought about making the Front Pack stand up on stays, Aarn-like, but the simplicity of hanging it on the load lifters was more appealing.

[Rat]

Very timely, Rat. I just took a break from my current project to check the forum. Current project: cutting my MM Front Pack in half and adding aluminum stays to turn it into "balance pockets" like those on Aarn packs. It required a minor modification to my Molly Mac Pouches also (moving one of the straps over so it uses adjacent columns on the PALS array), but I think it's going to work pretty well. I still have to make the holsters on the hip belt to take the bottom ends of the stays, though, and that may be a bit more complicated. Depending on how I encapsulate the stays with straps for attaching to the PALS array, I may be able to do without the FrontPack halves entirely for lighter loads and attach the stays directly to the MM Pouches, but I expect I'll want to use the Front Pack halves to hold my knife and other small pouches. The versatility of this system is wonderful.

Sorry no pics - my camera is broken. I'll get Mac to document this at Mt. Rogers (if it works.)

WV, a worthy project. Here is how I added a stay pockets to my belt when I added my front Aarn style pockets. I also used a 4 Liter MacPouch (and played with a few others I have) but I used a solid fiberglass rod 3/32" round 26" long. To attach to the front straps I made a cross piece like suspenders use; the support stay threaded through this from one hip and tied into the opposite side shoulder strap.

The belt pocket used a piece of 1 " webbing (but 3/4" may be better) and an attachment system just like the Kifaru Lock and Dock uses; basically a tri glide sewn on the the long side of the stay pocket and hooked into the the middle rows of PALS webbing. This allowed the stay to thread through the top and middle rows of PALS and into the pocket that was about the same height as the lowest PALS row. This seemed to hold the stay very well.

The chest cross piece was just two layers of Cordura with the same Lock and Load attachment system, two on each shoulder strap. The stays ran through the cross piece via channels that are closed at the upper end. The stay was long enough that it bent a little and held it all in place. However, the MacPouches were pretty floppy. In order to keep them stable I would need to add some kind of backing (like you are doing with the front panel halves) to get a better connection to the pouch; I thought about a half circle with a couple of rows of PALS on it that the stay would thread through the round side and the backing would hug my ribs. As it was I tried to use various methods of attachment via shock cord and 3/4" webbing; but nothing really worked like I wanted it.

I abandoned the idea at this point as donning the pack was much more involved and I felt I was adding an overly complex system for the benefit I was going to gain. The current front panel design simplicity won out.

Keep in mind I have never seen an Aarn pack so I really don't know exactly how they suspend the front pockets. I was tempted to buy some ribz pockets and modify them but again, what I have is simple and it works.

The best thing that came from this was how well the Kifaru Lock and Load system works for attaching pouches to the PALS array; it is easy to build, very secure, quick on and off and can be added to scavenged pouches easier than full PALS tails/webbing on most pouches.

I have in fact adapted my hunting pouches to use the Kifaru Lock and Load system on my MMP and they have been great in use.

[MacEntyre]

I abandoned the idea at this point as donning the pack was much more involved and I felt I was adding an overly complex system for the benefit I was going to gain. The current front panel design simplicity won out.

Just as my efforts ended...

...how well the Kifaru Lock and Load system works for attaching pouches to the PALS array...

I must be living under a rock... I hadn't seen that! Most ingenious! Will it work with a simple tri-glide?

[Rat]

I must be living under a rock... I hadn't seen that! Most ingenious! Will it work with a simple tri-glide?

yes, it works perfectly with just a regular tri-glide.

[WV]

The best thing that came from this was how well the Kifaru Lock and Load system works for attaching pouches to the PALS array; it is easy to build, very secure, quick on and off and can be added to scavenged pouches easier than full PALS tails/webbing on most pouches.

I have in fact adapted my hunting pouches to use the Kifaru Lock and Load system on my MMP and they have been great in use.

I must be living under a rock... I hadn't seen that! Most ingenious! Will it work with a simple tri-glide?

Me, too! (Funny I don't remember seeing Mac under that rock with me.) It sent me digging through my box of Fastex parts looking for tri-glides. Rat, I see that Quest Outfitters has "wide tri-glides" as well as regular ones in the 1" width. The regular ones I have on hand look like they might twist and come loose if there was enough pull on the straps. I tried using some ladderlocks in place of triglides, and they look like they'd never come loose. Any experience with the wider tri-glides? Also, do you use 1" webbing and hardware?

I abandoned the idea at this point, as donning the pack was much more involved and I felt I was adding an overly complex system for the benefit I was going to gain. The current front panel design simplicity won out.

Just as my efforts ended...

Keep in mind I have never seen an Aarn pack so I really don't know exactly how they suspend the front pockets. I was tempted to buy some ribz pockets and modify them but again, what I have is simple and it works.

I am familiar with the Aarn system, so I'm trying to copy the parts I like about it. We'll see how it goes. I believe I'll end up with something that I'll find easier to put on, but that's conjecture right now, and, if true, it might just be that it will be similar to what I'm used to.

Thanks for your help on this. I'm going to make extensive use of the Lock and Dock system for additional smaller bags.

[Rat]

I have only used 3/4" tri-glides and have not had one come loose. It would take a whole lot of twisting and jerking to get it to fail I think.

One the last hunt I ran, crawled and stalked through some pretty thick brush and never had an attachment point failure with the 3/4" L&L.

I am slowly changing my thinking Mac! I started off with 3/4" and will switch to 1" if needed! I was thinking I may use a 1" tri-glide on 3/4" webbing, but like I said, no failures so far...