An ULTIMATE sub-zero hammock hang

[turk]

Hey folks. I am looking for some guidance and expertise.

I need to build the ultimate sub-zero hammock set-up. ... and I only have a few weeks left in which to do it.

Specifically I hope some hammockers that have slept in single-digits and gone below zero deg F might chime in here. But I would certainly welcome any and all comments from anyone that understands insulation systems and how to best keep my weight down.

I am gearing up for a snowshoe & pulk, bushwack trip for 3-4 days in northern ontario. I am expecting day time temperatures of around -13 deg F and night-time lows between -25 to -40 deg F. With winds ranging from 20-60 MPH. A quick consultation of my windchill chart gives me a worst-case senario of "feels like" -91 deg F. under full exposure at night. My information is based on average weather and temps for a specific area for that time of year. Wanting to be extra cautious, I would like to be WELL prepared for my worst case weather scenario. Not just surviving and huddled in a ball until morning... but sleeping sound and comfortable.

Only a few more weeks until the trip. I have been backyard testing every weekend in 20's, and teens. My personal low temp record is only single digits. I know I am asking for much more than taking the next step ..... rather more like one gigantic leap. But there are great people here, and I know I will get the knowledge, and expertise to pull this off.

What I need are suggestions to either refine or replace my hammock insulation system. to get me down to about -40 with no
additional heat source.



Here is what I am working with so far:

JRB prototype hammock tent. Sealed up tight with both doors closed, offers very good wind protection. I can also bank snow against the walls for added insulation and heat retention from the stove.

Titanium Goat Wood stove. I don't want to have to rely on this stove for all-night comfort, but rather have it as an option. Of course I realize that in my worst-case senario from above... I will be running this stove at maximum output all night long, and trying to sleep in short intervals between tending the inferno.

Hammock - ENO single.

Maybe i am dreaming but here is my concept for a bare minimalist sleep system. Feel free to laugh if you think I am being way too optimistic.

4 Piece insulation system:

JRB Old Rag Mountain + JRB Rocky Mountain No Sniveller as stacked underquilts. Feathered Friends Rock wren (in bag mode) + JRB Nest as top insulation.

Sleep wear: under-armour long underwear, + 400wt Fleece pants + wind pants + drywick LS shirt + wool sweater + toque + fleece face mask + ski goggles + drywick socks + down booties + down mittens


I own 4 additional down-filled bags, and 6 synthetic bags in a wide range of temperature ratings. If you think I need to be adding an additional layer to my insulation system please let me know. And where I should be adding it. Top layer, or bottom.
Also please feel free to comment on my proposed sleep clothing, as I can certainly adjust that for more or less core temp warmth.
If necessary I may need to sleep in my parka, or use part of a modular 2 or 3 piece jacket system comprised of a down jacket, fleece, and waterproof/windproof layers. I would like to avoid that if possible, so that these items can dry from daytime exposure to snow. I am not fully decided on what my final outdoor clothing system will be, so its still flexible.

Any and all thoughts, advice and general help would be most welcome.

[ZDP-189]

I saw your excellent review of the Titanium Goat wood stove:

http://hikinghq.net/forum/showthread.php?t=2327

How do you plan to use that in conjunction with your hammock tent. Surely, you're not going to rest it on your lap?

[ZDP-189]

I suppose a more sensible suggestion would be to replace the hammock-tent with a large basha with closed ends and combined with a reflective emergency film, and build a reflector behind your stove also covered in a reflector. Any sleeping bag/ quilt you have would cover you, rather than envelop you, becauseyou'll be absorbing heat from the stove through the bottom of the hammock.

That way, you will combine the benefits of basha camping (warmth, circulation, stars with hammocking (no ground conduction, light weight).

[turk]

I have many pictures posted in different threads around the forum. Here are a couple recent ones from christmas day, so you get an idea of what the setup looks like inside:


You are completely right in suggesting the basha, as it is an already proven ground concept. I should have mentioned that my primary goals is to work with the JRB Hammock Tent, and Ti-goat stove as to provide real-world field testing in very low temps. As you can see from above, I have the same benefits you described in basha camping, already altered and designed for hammock.

I have done extensive testing ... but my weakest areas, and the reason for this thread is my lack of knowledge and confidence
in my hammock insulation system. I sure as heck own enough gear. I just need to find the best way to put the right components
together to stay safe in temps potentially reaching -90 deg F. Its almost 100 deg's colder than the coldest weather I
have hammocked in. Maybe I should have posted this in the discussion thread I already started for hot hammocking. But I don't know how to move a post now that its made. (happens when you are still up and typing at 2AM) perhaps a mod could move this for me. Either way I am still looking for conventional wisdom on un-heated hammock insulation and getting well below zero deg F.

[Dutch]

It sounds like to me that you have all the insulation that a person could possibly carry. I can't really fathem -90 windchill. The only thing I could suggest is looking into Beyond fleece pants and coat. I have the combo and the stuff is great, but a litttle pricey. It also may take too long to make it for your trip. In any case don't become a turk-cycle. I'm pretty sure you will be hitting some kind of record in a hammock. I have to ask what you plan your pack weight to be?

[neo]

I have many pictures posted in different threads around the forum. Here are a couple recent ones from christmas day, so you get an idea of what the setup looks like inside:


You are completely right in suggesting the basha, as it is an already proven ground concept. I should have mentioned that my primary goals is to work with the JRB Hammock Tent, and Ti-goat stove as to provide real-world field testing in very low temps. As you can see from above, I have the same benefits you described in basha camping, already altered and designed for hammock.

I have done extensive testing ... but my weakest areas, and the reason for this thread is my lack of knowledge and confidence
in my hammock insulation system. I sure as heck own enough gear. I just need to find the best way to put the right components
together to stay safe in temps potentially reaching -90 deg F. Its almost 100 deg's colder than the coldest weather I
have hammocked in. Maybe I should have posted this in the discussion thread I already started for hot hammocking. But I don't know how to move a post now that its made. (happens when you are still up and typing at 2AM) perhaps a mod could move this for me. Either way I am still looking for conventional wisdom on un-heated hammock insulation and getting well below zero deg F.

wow interesting pictures,what keeps the tarp from melting neo

[turk]

wow interesting pictures,what keeps the tarp from melting neo

The chimney pipe exits the roof through a fire-proof roof jack made by titaniumgoat.com The temperature of the chimney ranges anywhere from
300-900 deg F. The fabric of the tent is also fire retardant. And I use a series of screens in the chimney pipe to stop sparks from getting airborne.

Are your buddies tenting right next to you?

Yes definitely. I am hoping to make a last minute purchase and get express delivery on the JRB 8x8 tent, if it is at all possible. But I don't know if they will release in time for the trip. I would love to kill 2 birds with one stone and perform testing on both models at once. The JRB 8x8 tent, as an unheated shelter... pitched completely below snow level (weather and safety permitting)
Thats putting a great deal of faith in a piece of gear I've never seen and will have no time to trial test.

I have to ask what you plan your pack weight to be?

Sled - Shappell Jet Sled carrying 25-30lbs Backpack - Golite Jam pack - carrying 10-12lbs
Worn items - in excess of 15lbs including snowshoes, clothing, water and camera equipment.

The trip is inspired by a similar winter bushwack by a group of hikers out of michigan that set out on an extremely ambitious snowshoe and pulk hike in Feburary of 07 in the neighbourhood I grew up in. While their initial distance goals were quickly abandoned, I still think is was a very impressive venture. I have put major time into researching and trying to learn about the gear, techniques and skills they used in similar terrain, weather and water crossings. (Some pics Below from that trip) I have spent the last year buying some key pieces of gear and generally getting ready.

[neo]

The chimney pipe exits the roof through a fire-proof roof jack made by titaniumgoat.com The temperature of the chimney ranges anywhere from
300-900 deg F. The fabric of the tent is also fire retardant. And I use a series of screens in the chimney pipe to stop sparks from getting airborne.


Yes definitely. I am hoping to make a last minute purchase and get express delivery on the JRB 8x8 tent, if it is at all possible. But I don't know if they will release in time for the trip. I would love to kill 2 birds with one stone and perform testing on both models at once. The JRB 8x8 tent, as an unheated shelter... pitched completely below snow level (weather and safety permitting)
Thats putting a great deal of faith in a piece of gear I've never seen and will have no time to trial test.


Sled - Shappell Jet Sled carrying 25-30lbs Backpack - Golite Jam pack - carrying 10-12lbs
Worn items - in excess of 15lbs including snowshoes, clothing, water and camera equipment.

The trip is inspired by a similar winter bushwack by a group of hikers out of michigan that set out on an extremely ambitious snowshoe and pulk hike in Feburary of 07 in the neighbourhood I grew up in. While their initial distance goals were quickly abandoned, I still think is was a very impressive venture. I have put major time into researching and trying to learn about the gear, techniques and skills they used in similar terrain, weather and water crossings. (Some pics Below from that trip) I have spent the last year buying some key pieces of gear and generally getting ready.

now this is what i call an extreme outing,i love it,it look like it dont get any better than this,i envy you dude neo

[neo]

The chimney pipe exits the roof through a fire-proof roof jack made by titaniumgoat.com The temperature of the chimney ranges anywhere from
300-900 deg F. The fabric of the tent is also fire retardant. And I use a series of screens in the chimney pipe to stop sparks from getting airborne.


Yes definitely. I am hoping to make a last minute purchase and get express delivery on the JRB 8x8 tent, if it is at all possible. But I don't know if they will release in time for the trip. I would love to kill 2 birds with one stone and perform testing on both models at once. The JRB 8x8 tent, as an unheated shelter... pitched completely below snow level (weather and safety permitting)
Thats putting a great deal of faith in a piece of gear I've never seen and will have no time to trial test.


Sled - Shappell Jet Sled carrying 25-30lbs Backpack - Golite Jam pack - carrying 10-12lbs
Worn items - in excess of 15lbs including snowshoes, clothing, water and camera equipment.

The trip is inspired by a similar winter bushwack by a group of hikers out of michigan that set out on an extremely ambitious snowshoe and pulk hike in Feburary of 07 in the neighbourhood I grew up in. While their initial distance goals were quickly abandoned, I still think is was a very impressive venture. I have put major time into researching and trying to learn about the gear, techniques and skills they used in similar terrain, weather and water crossings. (Some pics Below from that trip) I have spent the last year buying some key pieces of gear and generally getting ready.

make sure you take and post plenty of pictures,i am looking forward to hearing about your trip neo

[Just Jeff]

A good snow shovel and plenty of time to make a snow trench. If a 60mph gust takes down the tent, you'll be dangerously exposed for the few minutes it takes to freeze.

Are your buddies tenting right next to you?

Pushing the envelope - I like it. Be safe.