Scout Leaders?

[mountain_man_mike]

Somebody will come along with a prescription from a doctor for sleeping in a hammock and Philmont may reconsider. If the ruling is truly bear related I'd like to see the study done to justify it.

[dallas]

Somebody will come along with a prescription from a doctor for sleeping in a hammock and Philmont may reconsider. .

Good idea!

I sent an e-mail to the Philmont director of operations outlining my case to at least allow advisors to use hammocks.

Maybe if enough others chime in the squeeky wheel will get some grease.

[dkperdue]

Somebody will come along with a prescription from a doctor for sleeping in a hammock and Philmont may reconsider. If the ruling is truly bear related I'd like to see the study done to justify it.

I've got a fused ankle and for the last few of years I got the Navy Docs to add on my BSA annual health form that I need to be allowed to use a mountain bike at summer Camp. One summer camp said it was against their rules but allowed it when I used the magic 3 letters > A-D-A

[mountain_man_mike]

One summer camp said it was against their rules but allowed it when I used the magic 3 letters > A-D-A

Those are powerful letters and although BSA can seem to be cemented, they can also show flexibility when pressured.

[Hambone]

Assistant Cubmaster/Webelos Den leader, Pack 61 Nashville, Arkansas.

[dallas]

While I'm not sure I totally agree with their position at least they took the time to reply to my request that they consider allowing advisors to hammock camp.

Thank you for your information about hammock camping.

Unfortunately, we have not changed our policy on the use of hammocks at Philmont Scout Ranch.

One of the bear issues that you did not address is the actual location of the hammock. Many times the person in the hammock would not be camping in the cluster with the other participants. A person camping isolated from the group can be a target for the bear. It is out of place and in need of investigation. We also have many areas that do not have adequate trees for camping.

Philmont is different than many other camping areas in the country. Over three months we will camp 23,000 individuals. This adds a lot of pressure to the resources including the trees. It is one of the reasons we have to be so careful about the bear procedures.

Again, thank you for helping to provide leadership for a crew this summer. With your effort another group of Scouts will have a great experience.

[wizardofhaws]

Thanks for sharing the reply Dallas. I can see the concern with impact on the trees but that could be addressed with proper strap usage. The argument about sleeping area is a more valid concern. As I understand it Philmont has very strict rules on camp locations to deal with all the bears. So having a few campers in a different location messes with that.

Will keep an eye on it to see if it changes before 2013 when we go with our Scouts.

[dallas]

This is what I sent to them:

Maybe if they get enough requests they will consider it. Eventually.
Or we need to convert the rule makers to hangers.

I love Philmont. I was fortunate to take Woodbadge at the PTC (Woodbadge 83), was an advisor on a trek in 2008 (612-P8) and am going back this summer (609S) and I’m really looking forward to it!

I would like to request that the leadership of the camping operations consider allowing advisors to use hammocks at Philmont.

I believe that there are several reasons that the BSA should consider this:

1) Leave No Trace: hammocks leave less impact on campsites than tents do
2) Youth Protection: hammocks are single occupant structures. This prevents any kind of potential issue of an adult and a Scout in the same tent.
3) Baden Powell himself camped in a hammock sometimes.

As I understand it, the main two reasons for not allowing hammocks are to
1) protect trees, and
2) bear safety.

Protecting the trees is a legitimate concern and hammocks should be required to be attached with straps at least 1” in width. When a hammock is properly hung with straps the trees are not damaged. There are rules for tents (no ditching) so it is completely appropriate that there are rules for hammocks.

The bear safety issue is more difficult to address since as far as I know, there has never been a bear attack on a hammock dweller, but there certainly have been bear attacks on tent dwellers. The same bear safety rules should certainly apply to hammocks as tents at Philmont.

In the interest of full disclosure, I’ve been a hammock camper for about 5 years now. I’m 54 years old and I’ve discovered that the ground is a lot harder now than it was when I was a kid.

I really enjoy backpacking and camping and have found that I much prefer sleeping in a hammock than in a tent. I’ve hammock camped with my oldest son at Northern Tier and with my youngest son backpacking on the Colorado Trail. I’ve found that these trips were much more enjoyable with the hammocks.

They can be set up over sloped or rocky ground without damaging the area, your gear stays dry in heavy rains, they can be used as a chair (dual use!) and there is just something special about resting in a comfortable hammock.

Like I said, I love Philmont. I’d love it even more if I could take my hammock!

Maybe you could at least allow advisors to use hammocks until you see if there are any problems. I’ll be glad to volunteer!

[titanium_hiker]

if this is a ranch, why not bring a stand?

[wizardofhaws]

Well thought out response Dallas. If you need more people to help with this discussion please reach out to us.

Titanium_hiker, there is a ranch portion that has cabin type tents. Most however attend Philmont to participate in the 7-11 day treks. There is a large bear population in the area so they take bear saftey very seriously.