Quote Originally Posted by affreeman View Post
In winter weather when it's cold enough that any precipitation is going to be snow and not rain, I leave the hammock and tarp at home and pack my a bivy sack and a CF pad. With plenty of mold-able snow on the ground sleeping comfortably is not an issue.

All I am trying to do here is compare 2 specific tarps. I'm not interested in the doored version of either tarp, nor do I ever pitch my tarps with the sides all the way down to the ground. I know doors serve others well, but they're not what I am looking for at the moment.
OK, so 3 season no doors. Get a 12' RL
I would not buy either tarp you listed.