Well,,,I have to say this,,cause of the back and one lower vertebre that can give me fits from rolling a stock car racing 7 times.. I have to have a darn good pillow and forget the weight of it for the neck and back..otherwise I wake up and feel the pain every now and then. I had been using a Cocoon synthetic pillow for a number of years,,weight was 6 oz,,then I decided to try the black rock down pillow,,and it weighed like a 2.5 oz or close to that,,but it was flat when I laid my head on it and it really sucked for side sleeping,,then I get the RR hammock from WarBonnet and its so flat I really need the pillow,,so I take all the down,,about 1.5 oz or so out of black rock, and add it to the Coccoon synthetic,,still not enough,,add alittle more synthetic to it and make it finally just right,,but now I am over 9.5 oz for a pillow that I really love in using it for the RR,,but know it is super heavy and really tight to throw in the pack as there is no compressing it much if any. And it bugs me that I have a really nice pillow, and trashed the black rock pillow,,so I order 2 oz of down of Wilderness Logics,,and stuff it all in the Black Rock,,still not enough for pure pleasure,,Order another oz of down from WL,,and stuff it in the Black rock,,still not enough. Now the wife is quizzing the heck out me what I am doing with all this down that I been ordering,,and I am not saying anything,,and I order another oz of down off WL,,and believe me when I say,,it was really hard to get that last oz, of down in that small pillow that already had 3,,but I got it all in, And WOW! I have a pillow,,that will compress and fit nicely in the bottom of my packs,,weight is 5.4 oz of which is not really bad,,but laying my head on this pillow is now pure heaven,,as 4 oz of down takes alot to compress it, and laying on my side is pure purfection. But the downside to this little escapade of screwing around is the cost of this pillow is now about 100 bucks,,of which the wife doesn't know about nor am I going to tell her either. Pure Bliss is sometimes alittle expensive, but well worth it.