HH Supershelter/Undercover and Down Quilt Question

[bwg]

Hi Folks --

I'm thinking about buying the HH supershelter/undercover and I've read here on the forums of folks supplementing the supershelter with various items such as pack towels, KAQs, various thermal blankets, etc.

I was wondering what one may expect if the OCF pad was replaced or supplemented by half of a wide, down sleeping bag or down quilt. I see often on ebay wide, down sleeping bags rated at ~20F and if such a bag were cut lengthwise it would make a decent quilt that perhaps could be fit between the undercover and the hammock.

Is the undercover adjustable and strong enough to support something like this? Would it sag and create air gaps, or would it compress the down?

Would a vapor barrier be needed here?

What practical experience, if any, have you had with such an experiment?

[koaloha05]

Without the SpaceBlanket (sb) between the ocf and hammock always woke up with moisture beads on the ocf. A down quilt would become damp from your body moisture. Don't think you can get enough air movement between the SS and quilt to prevent a moisture problem. SS with SB and ocf is a relatively warm combo. The undercover alone adds some warmth. My assumption is trapping a bit of warmed air and cutting the wind. UQ require tweaking to prevent body weight compression of the loft. When I use the HH ULBP with a JRB Nest went without the undercover or used the JRB WeatherShield which breaths a little bit. The undercover had nothing to do with suspending the Nest. Just there for cutting the wind or for insurance against driving rain.

[kwpapke]

I was wondering what one may expect if the OCF pad was replaced or supplemented by half of a wide, down sleeping bag or down quilt. I see often on ebay wide, down sleeping bags rated at ~20F and if such a bag were cut lengthwise it would make a decent quilt that perhaps could be fit between the undercover and the hammock.

Is the undercover adjustable and strong enough to support something like this? Would it sag and create air gaps, or would it compress the down?

Would a vapor barrier be needed here?

What practical experience, if any, have you had with such an experiment?

I did my -26* hang with Shug with this kinda setup. Do not replace the OCF pad, but supplement.

Yes, the UC was plenty strong enough for me to have a 30F down bag in it. The down compresses a little, but not enough to seriously impact.

You do need a vapor barrier above - the Space Blanket you ARE placing on top of the OCF pad works nicely for this.

I've only put a down bag in the UC once, the -26 night. My more common technique is to put my down jacket under the OCF pad in the UC. Works great, multi-tasks the gear. Wear the jacket all evening or all morning, put it in the UC while sleeping.

--Kurt

[bwg]

Thanks everyone for the feedback, it is helpful.

Pan, I have considered the MWUQ and it certainly looks top-notch, but I don't follow your notion of expense and weight with SS, etc. The standard SS weighs about 21 to 23 oz (including all three pads, less if kidney and torso pads not used/available) and costs about $140 or less. If I understand everyone's feedback on various forum threads, the SS can be used to 20F or perhaps lower. The SS is also good for warmer weather (thinking summer with lows in 50s or 60s) and the weight then should be around 10 to 15oz. If I need to take it lower, it seems that I can butcher an older down sleeping bag ($50 or less from ebay) to supplement the underpad in the SS. With supplemental down insulation the SS would weigh more than the MWUQ, perhaps by 8 to 12 oz.

Is the MWUQ versatile in layering like the SS? If the MWUQ came in two components/layers that would allow for winter and summer use--say a thin down layer for summer/early fall/late spring, and a second thicker down layer for winter--then I'd certainly be interested.

Thanks for the note and giving me another option to consider.

[bwg]

Pan -- I've been reviewing the MWUQ and the Winter Nest. Both seem to receive excellent reviews. Why did you recommend the MWUQ rather than the Nest? Is the MWUQ more versatile across different types of hammocks; do folks find the entry slit in the Nest unnecessary so the MW is more popular for a HH?

[Peter_pan]

Thanks everyone for the feedback, it is helpful.

Pan, I have considered the MWUQ and it certainly looks top-notch, but I don't follow your notion of expense and weight with SS, etc. The standard SS weighs about 21 to 23 oz (including all three pads, less if kidney and torso pads not used/available) and costs about $140 or less. If I understand everyone's feedback on various forum threads, the SS can be used to 20F or perhaps lower. The SS is also good for warmer weather (thinking summer with lows in 50s or 60s) and the weight then should be around 10 to 15oz. If I need to take it lower, it seems that I can butcher an older down sleeping bag ($50 or less from ebay) to supplement the underpad in the SS. With supplemental down insulation the SS would weigh more than the MWUQ, perhaps by 8 to 12 oz.

Is the MWUQ versatile in layering like the SS? If the MWUQ came in two components/layers that would allow for winter and summer use--say a thin down layer for summer/early fall/late spring, and a second thicker down layer for winter--then I'd certainly be interested.

Thanks for the note and giving me another option to consider.

Bwg,

Your post #1, spoke of replacing the ocf with a cut up cheap bag.... thus the system under review appreaded to be HHSS (less ocfs) plus the cost of the bag (weight and dollars?), plus the SB.....Thus 140+ 50?+5....Good to 20*?... Maybe for some, maybe not?...Good independant evaluation of HHSS is at BGT.....Plusthere are unknown specs and weight of the cut up bag.... Just seems like potential for weight and cost growth approach....Plus multiple pieces to manage..... .

It is certainly workable.... and if you have some of the pieces already it may be the least costly way to go....If you try it be sure to report out.

Also I mentioned the MWUQ for the 20* edge in comparision only....The Winter Nest would still be a 10* edge for comparision at the same price....It just seemed like the better value comparision....Either is an adequate answer if 20* capability is all that is requirered....In the 20 * minimum case, the WN would offer the added convience of the entrance slit.... Trade-offs

Pan

[BillyBob58]

Pan -- I've been reviewing the MWUQ and the Winter Nest. Both seem to receive excellent reviews. Why did you recommend the MWUQ rather than the Nest? Is the MWUQ more versatile across different types of hammocks; do folks find the entry slit in the Nest unnecessary so the MW is more popular for a HH?

HHSS/MWUQ and PeaPod user here. Like 'em all, pros and cons as usual. The main advantages to the MWUW are: a lot of warmth for the weight ( as low as zero for some folks at 27 or 28 oz?), relatively small pack size considering temp rating, total coverage of both sides, head and feet which works real nice and convenient in the real world IMO.

But the main advantage is the dif cut leaving essentially no worries about down compression from mis-adjustment. This makes for a very quick and sure set up, a benefit shared only with one or two other UQs ( Snugfit/WB Yeti, others? ).

But if you don't need this kind of warmth, the SS or some of the other alternatives might suit your needs, even though it's real nice not having to worry about down compression under your weight or from too tight adjustment.

[koaloha05]

bwg, I'm a cold sleeper. One of those people who needs some form of bottomside insulation once night temps drop into the 70*F. Use some combo of the HH ocf/sb/JRB WS2 or the Nest on the BB down to ~50*F for bottom side insulation and either a BMW UL90 quilt or the Nest as a top quilt. Colder I switch over to the MWUQ and Nest as a top quilt. Loosening the foot & head ends of the MWUQ allows some temp control. Nice thing about uq, overkill for insulation can be easily managed. Better than being under insulated.

The MWUQ is pretty much idiot proof in setting up. The NEST for an underquilt requires a little tweaking. Lowest temps I've gone and no where close to the bottom edge using the MWUQ & Nest combo with just a baselayer for sleeping in has been the low 20*F. Not a winter camper. The MWUQ is a bit more than I need. Glad to hear that the Jacks are coming out with a lighter 3 season version.