Synthetic Love

[oldgringo]

Yanno those unforecast boomers that pop up in the summer, seemingly out of nowhere? Well I came home to a dandy yesterday. Over an inch of rain, leaves shredded from trees, limbs down. Must have been the whole enchilada, with a side order of micro-burst.

I have a new hammock that I was rigging for a weekend trip that had been left out. It was soaked, and holding water. Ditto the underquilt. But here's the deal: it's a summer weight KAQ, and when I removed it from the hammock and shook the water off, it was nearly dry. Try that with down. The wet hammock presented a bigger problem than the "wet" quilt.

I love my down quilts, and have no plans to jump ship, but dang! I'm impressed.

[Acer]

I also left a hammock out with a 50 degree KAO modified to fit perfect, my RR in a diamond 12' x 12' older MOSS tarp, (when MOSS used to make them) testing rainworthyness, and hammock was soaked due to the big blow of the storm, and the Jarbidge was all but dry and in 30 minutes after the storm was dry with hammock still wet. This is coninsidental that you posted this as I was thinking the same thing and making the comments to the wife how dry the UQ was that I used it last nite in the house with the air and fans blowing on me to keep me cool enough to use in my other RR with the other RR still drying. I have a 50 down UQ, but find myself using my 50 Jarbidge more and more over it as its now become my summer go to UQ.

[BillyBob58]

Let me be the first to welcome you fellows to the club!

Maybe I'm just crazy, but as you might know, I have long taken a more or less contrarian (sp?) view to the idea, held by many, that there is no real difference in wet down vs wet synthetic, they are both miserable and cold when wet. But I have never agreed with that view point. And maybe you remember my testing a few years back of my CS jacket with a WPB shell. I wanted to test if the shell was actually breathable and would allow the insulation to dry from body heat, allow the vapor out, and if the insulation had any warmth when soaked ( by pouring water inside the jacket) before a hike in 32* rain/snow/wind. After a 30 something minute 1.6 mile walk, it was bone dry!

I have maintained that, even if both down and CS are equally cold when wet, something I doubt from personal experience, still one thing seems certain to me: the synthetic, almost any synthetic, will dry many times faster, and sunshine is not really needed to get this done. Heck, a syn UQ will dry just from gravity if it doesn't freeze. Squeeze it out and the rest will slowly just drip out of the insulation to the ground, and body heat will help the drying also.

Another widely held viewpoint with which I take exception is: "if you can't keep your down dry, you should stay out of the woods!". So sounds like you guys need to stay out of the woods? Cannibal also, as I remember hearing about how he got his original Yeti wet two different times on his AT hike. ( But hooray it was CS, so no disaster!) And maybe some of the guys from last winters Mt. Rogers epic, experienced hikers all, have some thoughts on this subject? And I have known plenty of other very skilled and experienced hikers who, sooner or later, get their gear wet. It is hard to overcome a tarp that springs a leak in a downpour, or one that a tree branch has pierced. Or sweat.

So what do I mostly use? Down! I think none of the above is all that important as long as you have a safe and easy bail out, and most of the time that is the case for most of us. If the worst happens, then that worst is a shortened trip. But when I am on a trip where there is no way I am getting back to a vehicle or warm shelter without a 2 or more day hike, sometimes I get a little nervous and super paranoid about keeping my down dry. Sometimes I still take down, but it does make me nervous. Most often, I take a mixture of synthetic clothes and down sleep gear on those trips. But I have been known to go all synthetic also, depending on my level of paranoia. That is one reason I keep my beloved variable layer CS WB Yeti, one of the finest pieces of equipment ever designed!

Of course, I have also become sort of a VB advocate over the years, so maybe I'm just weird! ( no need to start a poll on that fact)

[Owl]

And i give you in the "similar yet different" vein, the Hennessy Super Shelter.

Last year I was getting a drink of water while setting up camp, dropped nearly an entire 1L nalgene bottle full of water right on top of the underpad I was about to attach to the hammock. (Gotta love arthritis in the hands)

Wide-mouthed nalgene of course landed mouth down on top of the pad, all the contents evactuated directly onto the pad.

I freaked (was a winter hang), and snatched the pad up off the ground...only to watch the water bead up and run off the synthetic OCF pad like it was a sheet of glass.

I've occasionally found condenstation floating around loose down with the pad...but I've not yet had a wet pad. Considering that the other elements of the system are mostly water-proof as well, turns out that I don't think I'd worry even the whole thing fell into a creek, as long as I could dry the hammock body itself out.

I've got my first down UQ now...and it'll be interesting to do some 'side by side comparisons on how they work.

[Rolloff]

My best Synthetic testimony was on a late October night with a stuck truck out around the lake. Sleet and heavy rain, soaked a Snowlion Polarguard puff jacket completely through. I was walking for several miles to find a farmhouse with a light still on. My friend was ok as long as he kept moving in whatever jacket he had, but I was good to go. Wet, but warm. By the time we had contacted a wrecker, and returned to the vehicle, things had turned to snow. It took the truck heater to thaw out and keep my buddy warm, but my jacket was dry.

In probably less than an hour, after the temp dropped, and it began snowing, my body heat had as far as I was concerned completely dried out the Snowlion Jacket.

Down is warmer, lighter and packs smaller, but don't you know that jacket was in my pack everywhere I went, until it was no more.

[BillyBob58]

And i give you in the "similar yet different" vein, the Hennessy Super Shelter.

Last year I was getting a drink of water while setting up camp, dropped nearly an entire 1L nalgene bottle full of water right on top of the underpad I was about to attach to the hammock. (Gotta love arthritis in the hands)

Wide-mouthed nalgene of course landed mouth down on top of the pad, all the contents evactuated directly onto the pad.

I freaked (was a winter hang), and snatched the pad up off the ground...only to watch the water bead up and run off the synthetic OCF pad like it was a sheet of glass.

I've occasionally found condenstation floating around loose down with the pad...but I've not yet had a wet pad. Considering that the other elements of the system are mostly water-proof as well, turns out that I don't think I'd worry even the whole thing fell into a creek, as long as I could dry the hammock body itself out.

I've got my first down UQ now...and it'll be interesting to do some 'side by side comparisons on how they work.

WOW! I've got a good HH wet pad story too, which also worked out good, but it's no match for yours! For one thing, it wasn't winter and the lowest temps were mid 40s to 50.

My best Synthetic testimony was on a late October night with a stuck truck out around the lake. Sleet and heavy rain, soaked a Snowlion Polarguard puff jacket completely through. I was walking for several miles to find a farmhouse with a light still on. My friend was ok as long as he kept moving in whatever jacket he had, but I was good to go. Wet, but warm. By the time we had contacted a wrecker, and returned to the vehicle, things had turned to snow. It took the truck heater to thaw out and keep my buddy warm, but my jacket was dry.

In probably less than an hour, after the temp dropped, and it began snowing, my body heat had as far as I was concerned completely dried out the Snowlion Jacket.

Down is warmer, lighter and packs smaller, but don't you know that jacket was in my pack everywhere I went, until it was no more.

That is a most impressive experience! It would seem that your experience was indeed the proverbial "warm when wet"! Plus, real quick to dry!

[gargoyle]

Enchiladas. I like enchiladas.

[nothermark]

The downside of synthetic is that it always is warm. I have often heard that Down decreases loft somewhat as the temperature rises and fluffs as it falls. It is not perfect but it does widen the range where it is comfortable. Anecdotal evidence agrees.

FWIW I am in total agreement with using mixed or all synthetic insulation on trips where there is no easy bail and water is an issue. It is also worth noting it's easier to walk out wrapped in a quilt than to sleep wrapped in a jacket. ;-)

[engine386]

I think good apex synthetic quilts are a superior choice for summer quilts. Anything above 40 deg range. The weight difference is very slim and it packs down nearly as good, but with the great safety margin. I have a custom set from Tim Marshall @ enLIGHTened equipment which are awesome.
I have my down quilts for winter, but for the muggy/wet summer, synthetic wins out.

[Acer]

Now, Now, BillyBob58....I realize if you can't keep your down dry maybe you need to stay out of the woods. However,,last few storms we have had in the past couple of 3 weeks as had frontal winds leading them of 40 to 60mph with howling blowing rains in sheets. We have had about 10 plus inches of rain for month of June alone and this last one dumped 3/4 inch of rain in about 20 minutes and was over as quick as it started. And have been testing some equipment in the heat and storm out as well,,so stuff did get wet as all get out. And will later on damages again to my HG cuben tarp for the second time in a year. Stay tuned. And Hang on!