Cuben Tarp Failure beyond repair

[nothermark]

In my discussions with Adam, he mentioned,,yep,,cuben was used in sails, but not as much as you think,,and the sails they used are smallish in size. He also mentioned to me, that him and Joe of Zpacks have hundreds of tarps made for customers, and thru the grapevine of the industry,,other makers of cuben camping gear have often questioned the usage of .51 cuben material being used in tarps as they are leaning to heavier cuben material in their mfging processes. snip

So we are at 2 failures out of hundreds of tarps made out of .51?

[Sailor]

Regards sails...while they may be hoisted in the sun, their design is to even loads and the wind cools them. And, the fabric is heavier, except for one season racing sails. I don't see a close association wth a stationary tarp...

[Ol Grumpy]

Exotic fabrics in racing sails are selected on a weight (lighter the better) vs resistance to stretch and distort beyond design parameters. Longevity is well down on the list of desirable characteristics- for a racing sail. Many exotic fabrics are very much weakened by UV degradation. It's quite normal to have a laminate made from different materials, to achieve specific design criteria. There is little beyond an academic interest or curiosity to glean from any comparison to CF; used as a tarp material.

CF is a manufactured laminate. It will be very interesting to see what comes of any testing or investigations into this failed laminate.

One certainty is that the lighter the fabric- the less the safety margin- the closer to the point of failure that will be found in even 'normal use'.

CF has many desirable characteristics beyond UL weight. Personally I prefer a slightly heavier fabric weight and the increased durability that comes with it. But I also fully get the quest for absolute minimum weight. In the end we all win and benefit from the new methods.

[Acer]

So we are at 2 failures out of hundreds of tarps made out of .51?

Its the same question I asked Adam...any other failures like this? And yes,,so far,,and reason for the posting,,,to find out if any cuben tarp problems by other users, we so far, have only a couple of failures that is known of. Actually pretty darn good for .51 if this is the only major major weakness.

[Hawk-eye]

Very informative thread. Thanks for sharing. I have a HG cuben tarp as well. I really like the weight savings but I have found that to be the only real reason to get cuben. It is definitely considerably less durable, particularly with punctures as i have found. My next tarp will likely be another silnylon tarp to use in colder weather and shorter hikes/car camping etc. I'll probably snag another Superfly at some point for that.

I'd add one more plus to Cuben fiber ... after having packed my Superfly up wet to hike out ... the Cuben tarp does not absorb water and is easier to shake/wipe excess water off even packing it in the rain. But I guess that is also really a "weight" issue too. Just a nice characteristic of Cuben vs Sil to me.

[Acer]

I'd add one more plus to Cuben fiber ... after having packed my Superfly up wet to hike out ... the Cuben tarp does not absorb water and is easier to shake/wipe excess water off even packing it in the rain. But I guess that is also really a "weight" issue too. Just a nice characteristic of Cuben vs Sil to me.

Aabsolute plus in my book too, I really love cuben tarps myself and all the Pros of it vs. the Cons.

[MDSH]

My "field repair" in the back yard is holding very well for two straight days of steady rain (but no wind of which to speak). The bonds are all holding with the sheer strength of the tape. A double layer of the fabric tore in that one spot. It was the leading edge with the poncho attached that took a gust with the poncho gathering the full force of the wind. I see a loop failing on that same NE corner from which the wind was blowing. It was just too much and my mistake entirely. When I closed the end it parted the wind much better.

This material is wonderful but not magical. The laws of physics still apply!

.

[rhjanes]

Well, I had the same issue, last year. I have a HG cuben. I took it in 2012 out on the Buffalo River. Zero issues. I came back to Texas and set it up in the back yard. Under cedar trees, so it was in the shade always. I left it up for TWO months. The tension and probably heat of Texas Summer, started pulling the fabric the same as the original poster describes it. Up at the ridge line tie's, the fabric seemed to pull apart. I contacted HG and heard from both Adam and Jen. I mailed it back, as they wanted to evaluate it. Basically, it was repaired by them. A few 4 and 6 inch squares of fabric up at the RL tie outs. I've messed with it since then and will probably bring it to the Texas Butt bake this weekend. So, I agree, the super light weight trade off is in some durability. But also think of this, it was set up in shade, but Texas heat, for like 60 days. Or 1440 hours deployed. I did some math. Say you go hike the AT. Figure tarp set up 8 hours a night, 6 days a week, for 5 months. Total hang/deployed time would be 960 hours. So a cuben tarp should survive an AT thru hike.

[Cannibal]

OK, just heard back from Brian at OES. I asked him if he remembered the weight of cuben material he used on my MacCat Deluxe since I've left mine exposed on numerous occasions without noticing any negative effects. My cuben MacCat was made using the .74oz version of the material.

Doesn't really matter much for the current problem, but I thought the info might be helpful for the overall discussion about cuben tarps.

Keep in mind, I'm a little bit closer to the sun than many of you and most of my camping takes place even closer to the sun. U/V exposure is a constant companion here and when Genuine Draft and I camp, we tend to do a lot more camping than hiking. On the conservative side of things, I'd wager my cuben tarp has seen about 150 hours of direct sunlight since I picked it up. No worse for the wear....yet.

Edit: And I like my tarps pitched drum-tight.

[Acer]

Awesome information MDSH, rhjanes, and Cannibal...just what this thread was meant to create. For other users out there,,keep the info flowing about extreme usages of cuben tarps. Nice to know how far we can take them before any problems might spring up in usage of them.