Hello from the Pacific Northwest (with some questions)

[Insaniac99]

I have always loved hammocks (even the 'terrible' webbed ones that everyone apparently makes fun of) and this past year I bought an Eno Doublenest to relax on. I have been using it to just relax in the local areas and on a few car camping trips where I brought my hammock to hang out during the afternoon. I found it amazingly comfortable despite using it 'wrong' in the banana style (I plan on trying the off-center lay, but I really like my head elevated and not having to use any head or neck support) and it immediately made me want to camp with it but I didn't really feel prepared.

Before I continue here is my hammock/sleeping related gear list (some which I gathered with the idea of eventually sleeping outside, I had NO idea that what I wanted to do was so popular):

• ENO Doublenest
• ENO Atlas Straps
• ENO Guardian bug net
• Glacier's edge 40* sleeping bag (ugh, I hate this because it is big and heavy and doesn't pack down so is by far my bulkiest item but I can't afford a good bag right now, I plan to see if my standard down comforter would work :-/ )
• 100' coil of 550 paracord ( I might shorten this, but I love the utility of paracord for repairs and DIY, I use it to hang my bug net and plan to use it for my tarp)
• 25' of (i believe) 4mm Paracord (it is thicker and has over double the strength of 550 Para, I used this for the times that I was surrounded by trees that were too big or too far apart to use my preferred straps)
• Ozark Trail All-Purpose Tarp 8' x 10' (It is what I used as my 4-man tent's groundcloth)

My friend and I are planning on doing a light-weight backpacking trip in a few weeks (possibly the weekend of the 13th or a few days earlier but we don't have the date set yet, definitely no earlier than the 9th) I really want to hammock sleep on the trip but I'm also pushed to doing it in terms of simple need, we are going light and minimal new gear purchases (neither of us have been backpacking since the 90's when packs were almost always 40+lbs)

While doing my preparation and evaluating possible necessary gear purchases I found the only thing I am truly missing to sleep comfortably in my hammock is some under hammock insulation (I think). The weather averages for at least one of the areas we are talking about ranges from high forties to mid seventies with the records being high-20s or low-30s to low 90s.

I want to buy gear that will get great bang for buck (works in a range of seasons, if I can only use it in super rare circumstances I would rather get something else and augment for those rare times), pack decently light and compact, I can have by the time the trip comes, and is comfortable.

I have a 50l pack that I will be purchasing^ because I don't have a pack at all so my remaining funds are limited.

So to wrap this up some questions:

1. What would be a good bottom insulation? I am tempted by the cheapness of the blue CCF, but I am also tempted to try the no-sew parka liner mod I read about if I can find one locally ( I don't think I can get access to a sewing machine before my trip and haven't sewed since middle school) but I don't have a good grasp on insulation/weight or insul/bulk ratios on any of the bottom layer options; comfort is also a big deal. I have a second sleeping bag that could zip into my first, but I don't see how I could bring two in my pack o_O
2. I REALLY prefer the carabiner style set-up, the stupid ease and simplicity of adjustment and everything else make it my preferred method, (the fact that I rock climb and have many carabiners make it even easier to choose) but what do people normally do in the PCNW where the trees can be huge and/or far apart?
3. Is it worth changing my tarp? I know this is a cost/weight analysis that I ultimately have to decide on for myself but I'd like to hear opinions.
4. Where should I place the importance on gear purchases and/or replacement for a nicer time (comfort, pack-size, weight) I think priority 1 with that list is getting a nice sleeping bag or topquilt but I don't have that kind of cash right now, but I am not sure about the others which leads to...
5. Are any of these purchases/replacements amazing buys, or ridiculously inexpensive solutions that makes that a easy and cheap change, even it it isn't as important? An example is IF I can get the no-sew parka UQ to work (it is available in my area, I don't botch it, and it will work for the temperatures I'm expecting) it is about a $15 change from what I hear that would be great
6. Is there something that I might have laying around the house that might be great and I'm overlooking?

I have been lurking this forum for a couple days and you guys seem quite friendly and I look forward to learning more about hammocks. I appreciate the time you have taken to read this and am grateful for any advice or opinions you offer.


^The Osprey Atmos 50 because it is on sale for $150 which is right on my price-range, has a decent capacity and outside gear attachment that will serve until I get to the point where i could use a more specialized pack, (For example, I doubt my sleeping bag will fit in my bag and will have to strap on) and the lifetime warranty is SUPER appealing

[Catavarie]

First off, welcome to the forums.

Now onto your questions:

I'd suggest picking up a pair of ratchet straps ($10 at walmart) and removing the hardware to use as strap extenders instead of the 4mm cordage. Be sure not to get the nylon ones as they tend to stretch.

The Walmart CCF pad is most likely going to be your best option for under side insulation. It is both cheaper and warmer than the PLUQ (realistically only going to get you down to about 45°-50° if you are a warm sleeper) and you'll already be at Walmart picking up those ratchet straps.

Check out the Jarbidge KAQ UQ from Arrowhead Equipment for only $100 it is the cheapest produced UQ available.

If you like biners stick with them, especially since it sounds like you have plenty of climbing rated biners already. Be sure to use climbing rated biners for your suspension.

If you have time and the inclination look around your area for new construction. See if they have any extra Tyvek left over that you can scavenge/buy on the cheap. Try to get 10 feet off a full width roll (7 foot width is doable, but the 9 foot gives much more space). A bit of Gorilla tape and an afternoon will see your tarp weight and pack size reduced nicely. Otherwise just use the tarp you have, I started with the same blue 8x10 poly tarp.

As for gear priority: Survivability > Comfort. Prioritize cost where ever it fits for your budget. Good gear doesn't have to be super expensive, but the best gear usually is more costly than okay gear. Once you get an UQ sorted you can take a pair of scissors followed by needle and thread to your sleeping bag and turn it into a quilt and ditch about 40% of the weight and bulk for the cheapest, although not always the prettiest, solution.


If all else fails, wait till it snows and pack everything on a sled and drag it into camp with you.


No matter what though, get out there, be safe, have fun, and pics or it didn't happen. We expect a trip report.

[pgibson]

#1. Ditch all of the Paracord. It's nylon. Is not suitable for any part of a hammock set up other than if you want to make brackets or lanyards. It will stretch horribly for tarp lines, even more so when wet. And even the heavy duty stuff will not be a good choose for any part of suspending your hammock. There are much lighter, smaller and stronger ropes for each task.

#2 what Catavarie said.

Welcome to the forums.

[Dos]

Welcome.
I used to live in the PNW for over 20 years.

yes to what Catavarie said.

and make sure your straps are long enough for the trees up there.

If you can, even a ZLite sleeping pad will work. It was my favorite 'undergear', if you will, on my thru.

What I did for a top quilt, I went on craigslist and found a Marmot 20 degree mummy bag for trade.
I modified it into a top quilt by cutting off the head and the zippers and stitching up the sides. It packs down quite well.

Just do some more research on here.
You will get tons of ideas.

I think your Osprey 50L will be fine. Just pack it well. I used a 65 L Osprey on my thru.
(Shug has a video on how he packs his stuff. It's a good start).

[TallPaul]

Hi and welcome to the forums!
Welcome back to backpacking.

Buying the right gear the first time is a bit at odds with having a trip in two weeks.
If you plan to use the hammock for your trip then I suggest getting the blue CCF.
I am not sure that is what you would use long term - underquilts have quite a following on here - but this is the least money to spend to buy you time to research everything else.

Good luck on your trip - I am jealous of your location!

[Insaniac99]

First off, welcome to the forums.

Now onto your questions:

I'd suggest picking up a pair of ratchet straps ($10 at walmart) and removing the hardware to use as strap extenders instead of the 4mm cordage. Be sure not to get the nylon ones as they tend to stretch.

Thanks for the welcome!

I had been considering the solution of longer straps, I didn't realize they were that cheap. I will probably stop by Harbor freight on the way to see if they have an even better price.

The Walmart CCF pad is most likely going to be your best option for under side insulation. It is both cheaper and warmer than the PLUQ (realistically only going to get you down to about 45°-50° if you are a warm sleeper) and you'll already be at Walmart picking up those ratchet straps.

I have a few more questions about pads, if you don't mind answering them. The first is to ask which pad people mean when they say the the walmart blue CCF as I see four inexpensive pad options on walmart.com (one is green but I wonder if there is a reason why people don't mention that one)

1. Ozark Trial Camping Pad, ~$7.50 dimensions: 72.0 x 20.0 x 0.5
2. Stansport Pack-Lite Camping Pad, ~$11.90 dimensions: 19.0 x 0.4 x 72.0
3. Stansport Extra-Thick Sleeping Pad, ~$18.90 Dimensions: 72.0 x 19.0 x 0.375
4. Venture Products, LLC Outdoors Travel Light Classic Camp Pad, ~$9.40 Dimensions 25.0 x 78.0 x 0.51 and claims it is non-slip surface

None of these list the weight or exact material they use, (I assume there are different varieties of CCF? I used to use a cot or air mattress when car camping and my pad was bought for me when I last backpacked in the 90s) Or are the dimensions the only real difference? For three season camping, does it matter, or will say the extra thickness of the Venture Products make it more difficult to follow the curve of the hammock (seems silly that it would but you never know unless you ask or try it yourself)

Check out the Jarbidge KAQ UQ from Arrowhead Equipment for only $100 it is the cheapest produced UQ available.

If you like biners stick with them, especially since it sounds like you have plenty of climbing rated biners already. Be sure to use climbing rated biners for your suspension.

If you have time and the inclination look around your area for new construction. See if they have any extra Tyvek left over that you can scavenge/buy on the cheap. Try to get 10 feet off a full width roll (7 foot width is doable, but the 9 foot gives much more space). A bit of Gorilla tape and an afternoon will see your tarp weight and pack size reduced nicely. Otherwise just use the tarp you have, I started with the same blue 8x10 poly tarp.

As for gear priority: Survivability > Comfort. Prioritize cost where ever it fits for your budget. Good gear doesn't have to be super expensive, but the best gear usually is more costly than okay gear. Once you get an UQ sorted you can take a pair of scissors followed by needle and thread to your sleeping bag and turn it into a quilt and ditch about 40% of the weight and bulk for the cheapest, although not always the prettiest, solution.

Thanks for the tip about Tyvek, I will see what is available around here, maybe the local restore will have some...

If all else fails, wait till it snows and pack everything on a sled and drag it into camp with you.


No matter what though, get out there, be safe, have fun, and pics or it didn't happen. We expect a trip report.

But then I would have to buy a sled! thanks though, I will definitely take pictures. We have decent cell coverage in large swaths of the cascades so my phone will be with me for emergencies and picture taking.

#1. Ditch all of the Paracord. It's nylon. Is not suitable for any part of a hammock set up other than if you want to make brackets or lanyards. It will stretch horribly for tarp lines, even more so when wet. And even the heavy duty stuff will not be a good choose for any part of suspending your hammock. There are much lighter, smaller and stronger ropes for each task.

#2 what Catavarie said.

Welcome to the forums.

Thanks for the welcome, what would you suggest for cordage? I picked the 550 paracord because

• cheap
• light
• strong
• locally abundant (I had it just laying around anyway, but I'm not adverse to buying some inexpensive cordage if I can get it locally so I know i can get it in time)
• fits (barely) in the clips of my guardian bugnet
• the smooth sheath makes it easy to tie and slide prusik knots for utility points while still clamping down under tension

I would gladly take suggestions on anything that fits all of these, around here the craze is still all about paracord and that is about all anyone suggests.

Welcome.
I used to live in the PNW for over 20 years.

yes to what Catavarie said.

and make sure your straps are long enough for the trees up there.

If you can, even a ZLite sleeping pad will work. It was my favorite 'undergear', if you will, on my thru.

What I did for a top quilt, I went on craigslist and found a Marmot 20 degree mummy bag for trade.
I modified it into a top quilt by cutting off the head and the zippers and stitching up the sides. It packs down quite well.

Just do some more research on here.
You will get tons of ideas.

I think your Osprey 50L will be fine. Just pack it well. I used a 65 L Osprey on my thru.
(Shug has a video on how he packs his stuff. It's a good start).

Thanks for the welcome, it's good to hear about the Osprey! I plan on taking the 10 essentials, my sleeping and cooking gear, then after I have food and water I'll see what I have room and desire for. I plan to go light but once I get the basics my ebook reader and little Sansa are first on the list as those are my tops for nighttime comfort. After that, I don't think I will want for much else personally. I have seen a couple of videos Shug did about how he packs and it made me feel a lot better about my choices because he brings much more than I intend to (As an aside I love his personality, reminds me of a mix between Ernest P. Warrell and Crocodile Dundee, and I probably just dated myself )

Hi and welcome to the forums!
Welcome back to backpacking.

Buying the right gear the first time is a bit at odds with having a trip in two weeks.
If you plan to use the hammock for your trip then I suggest getting the blue CCF.
I am not sure that is what you would use long term - underquilts have quite a following on here - but this is the least money to spend to buy you time to research everything else.

Good luck on your trip - I am jealous of your location!

Thanks! I used to have a g/f who lived in Durham, NC and I spent a month or two there and got to attend the Eno Festival, it was a cute creek ( ) and lots of nice people.

I figure my total budget is somewhere around $50 after my pack, a little above won't hurt. so it looks like my split might be

1. $20-30 sleeping pad
2. $10 straps
3. $10-20 new cordage (what type?)
4. Finally anything I have left over for if I find leftover tyvek

I figure after that I can save up or wait for big sales (and REI resale is coming in October I believe, and there is always Craigslist) to buy any nice gear. That sound about right? Any further suggestions?

[creativeKayt]

Hey! Welcome!!

Can't add much more to the sound advice you've already received, but FYI... We are doing a WA hang at the end of the month. It doesn't help your immediate need, but you will get to know some locals, if you'd can make the journey.



Link to Planning Thread: https://www.hammockforums.net/forum/...ad.php?t=78022

[VictoriaGuy]

Thanks for the welcome, what would you suggest for cordage? I picked the 550 paracord because........

I don't know your location, but if you are anywhere near a chandler (marine supply place) or even a WestMarine store, take $15 and buy some Amsteel 7/32 cord (it's about 25-30 cents a foot). You can use it for hammock suspension and though it's way overkill, it's good for tarp ridgelines as well- it does not stretch, and is strong, and lasts. Use any thinner cordage for Prusik loops on the Amsteel for attaching tarp, etc.
Braided 'Mason Line/Twine' from building supply/HD is good for tarp tieouts, etc, but the paracord will work ok for that, for now - you will need to re-adjust, especially if it gets wet.

Have a good trip!

[Gary_R]

For most of the current temps you can manage with a pad and sleeping bag. Long term you will probably want to diy or buy a good quilt set. As Kayt said we are having a hang end of next month that will be able to show you most of what available, and let you check out setups. Depending where in the NW you are there are peeps locally that would probably be willing to help you out with some things.

[pgibson]

There are a lot of common cords that folks here use....we stock a number of options. Paracord is popular all over but for a rope for camping it kinda sucks. compared to most of the lines we regularly use like Zing it, Lash it, Dynaglide, Amsteel, our 1/16th" draw cord and so on Paracord is not light or strong and cheap is about all it has going for it.

Now a lot of folks love paracord and I am not trying to slam it or anyone that does like it. But compared to some of the other options it has a lot more bulk and weight and is weaker and has a lot of stretch.