Help with synthetic vs down top quilt

[Jlotarsk]

I am about to pull the trigger on a top quilt, but am a little nervous converting to down. I have been using an old North Face Cat's Meow +20 synthetic as my top quilt, but its 20 yrs old and its time for something new and lighter. I really love the idea of down...low weight and compressibility, but what happens if it gets really damp outside? I consider myself a cold sleeper. I guess I kind of want some reassurance that everything will be OK, but also would like to hear from those whose Down failed them if in fact it did. I will be doing most of my backpacking in the Midwest (Great Lakes Region), but maybe Colorado once in a while. This would be for summer and fall only.

Also, minor question...I like the JRB Hudson River or EE Rev X 20. I can get the JRB with Active Dri Down but its going to be about $35 more than the EE. Will it make any difference?

Thanks for any and all feedback.

[pepsiaddict60]

I all ways chose synthetic when I was on the ground. Carried a hammock for relaxing in durring the day. at night slept in a tent. Walked into REI found my wish, a Hennessy Hammock , next two years replaced my sleeping synthetics with Hammock Gears down gears quilts. kind of poor..... so it took me 2 Xmases......

I used synthetics because I had woken up in a pool of water in a tent. Now hanging from trees, have not been damp even in Oreagon with the HH stock tarp.

[pepsiaddict60]

More to the story. I got really pissed off at "mankind" in the middle 80s, spending alot of time in the woods alone. Figured if I did not get some kind of survival training, what I was doing was going to kill me. Took a begainers survival course learned the backpacking basics and a new mind set. After that all of life got easier. Basic rules in every thing you do.

[lobodelanoche]

Though I'm new here, I would suggest that if you ever plan on going on trails you might have to go to ground, at the very least keep a synthetic in your quiver (along with a pad). I would defiantly go with down for any time you are guaranteed a hang. I live in the high desert where a hang is not always there. I plan on eventually having both down and synthetic for that very reason. hope I helped.
Paul

[Rolloff]

As long as you are going to be using your insulation in an application, where you can bail back to your vehicle, or pull off the trail and do a zero, to mechanically dry your insulation, I'll pretty much always pick down.

Bug out, or in a situation where the above is not safe or feasible, trips into hostile environs lasting longer than a few weeks, I'm going high quality Synthetics.

Yes. I believe both of the treatments available for down, are worth the price of the pony, but for me it doesn't change any of the above. Even with moisture resistant down, you'll still get more distance and piece of mind using a good UQ protector or Hammock Sock IMO. The one thing the treatments can't promise, is the 5-10 degrees additional warmth socks can provide.

Then again why not do both?

Rolloff

[Zigerot]

All wet sleeping bags are miserable, be they synthetic or not, but i like down for the comfort and the weight.
It might be psychosomatic, because it is so light, but im always amazed by how much heat is getting generated/trapped in a down bag.
As far as the dampness, any good bag is going to have a treated materiel (most likely silnylon) on the outside.
ive been in some pretty wet conditions with a down bag and as long as it is not a huge fog bank (which is like camping underwater) then i have been warm and toasty.

[webhanger]

The key to down is your ability to keep it dry especially in the worst of the unpredictable situations. Having a way to get it dry when all has gone wrong can make a potentially serious situation survivable.

I tend to stick with synthetic personally because over many years the unpredictable has happened over and over again and my bags have been completely soaked. Dry bags can get torn and no decent repair or replacement is available for some time. That chance storm or any number of unpredictable things can happen. I am confident I can deal with one freezing night with wet gear personally. Two or three gets to be dangerous. Synthetics will dry out much faster than down. Synthetics have saved my bacon more than once. Therefore the weight has been worth it.

That said there are lots of folks around here that use down as their primary insulation as will likely become evident down the road in this thread. If I can predict the type of weather I will be in over a few days or maybe a week I would not run away from down.

As I get older and more recreational with my out of doors activities, down becomes more attractive and will find its way into my gear locker eventually. I am presently coveting a few new pieces of downy goodness but am a little hesitant to jump just yet.

Sorry if this seems bi polar. I hope my point is easily evident.

Either way I hope you find much happy hanging.

[sr1355]

We are offering Allied Resist Down Plus in all our quilts standard. This is a second gen DWR down with 5-6 times the resistance to moisture related issues than the award winning Resist Down. Our in house testing has produced some pretty amazing results with our illume DWR fabrics and ARD+. We offer both a 700GDD and 850GGD, both ARD+ in your choice of fill amounts.

[BillyBob58]

We are offering Allied Resist Down Plus in all our quilts standard. This is a second gen DWR down with 5-6 times the resistance to moisture related issues than the award winning Resist Down. Our in house testing has produced some pretty amazing results with our illume DWR fabrics and ARD+. We offer both a 700GDD and 850GGD, both ARD+ in your choice of fill amounts.

This stuff may well get rid of the reasons I still occasionally pack in synthetic bags or quilts. Have you managed to get that batch in a jar of water wet yet? How long has it been or how long did it take?

Are you going to offer clothing?

[adkphoto]

Down vs synthetics is one of the oldest arguments on record

I've used down for over 20 years now and will never go back to synthetics until someone makes a feather better than a goose. It's lighter, more compressible, more durable, and just plain more comfortable over a wide temperature range than synthetics. (Side note: I used to have a Cat's Meow, but I sent it back to TNF because it wouldn't loft and would not keep me warm below 40° even though it was rated for 20°. I exchanged it for a down sleeping bag.)

With DWR treated fabrics and down, plus good care in packing and site selection, you shouldn't have any problem. I've had situations where my quilts got covered with dew, but it will shake right off and has no impact on warmth.

People tend to use the argument that synthetics dry faster than down or keep you warmer when wet. In fact if either get wet, you *will* be cold, and you'd better get out of the woods before your situation turns dangerous. In the summer time, this may not be a problem, but if your life depends on it, don't let your insulation get wet.

Some tips:
Get DWR coated fabrics and down like Underground Quilts has on their quilts
Pack your insulation in waterproof dry bags or heavy plastic trash compactor bags (I do both if I expect rain)
If you expect damp or wet weather, an underquilt protector can save you from splashes and dew.
The cover on my Dangerbird has kept my quilts dry from dew and blowing snow.
Get a tarp that has good coverage for rainy weather.
Use some sort of drip ring on your hammock suspension

Have fun!

David