Why are my Feet Cold?

[altruistguy]

So I live in MI and I've been hanging pretty much every night for the past three months. Generally, I've been very comfortable. But last night (and about two other recent nights), my feet were pretty cold. I'd love to get some feedback for why -- and what I might do about it. It got down to about 13* last night. I'm thinking that, with the below setup, I should still be pretty comfortable. What am I doing wrong???

Here's my setup:

1) Hammock: WBBB

2) Tarp: WBSF with two doors closed, two open (for easy entry/exit)

3) Sock: WB Travel Sock (zipper fully closed for max heat retention)

4) UQ: HG Incubator 0* with 2 oz overfill. I verified that my feet are completely covered by the UQ. My heels are definitely on the UQ (and the UQ is properly adjusted to be hugging the hammock close there). My toes (flopping against the WBBB's footbox) are definitely covered by the UQ. So I shouldn't need a foam pad under my feet -- right???

5) TQ: EE RevelationX 10* with 5 oz overfill. This was my first night with this -- now my warmest TQ. It was VERY warm everywhere except my feet! It appears not to be a down distribution issue -- appears to be plenty of down in foot area.

6) Headgear. I know -- if your feet are cold, put on a hat. But I'm thinking that I'm really well covered already:
- Seirus Neofleece Comfort Masque.
- Outdoor Research Sonic Balaclava.
- Zpacks Goose Hood.

7) Pillow: Cabela's Camp Pillow.

8) Footwear: Extreme Alpaca Socks.

My only ideas are as follows:

- Maybe in the coldest weather, my Incubator UQ can't adequately insulate my feet and I just need a CCF footpad?

- I've been kind of skeptical of "gathered-end" style TQs like EE's. I've been thinking that in the middle of the foot area, where the end is all gathered together, there is basically zero insulation and therefore a thermal short between the inside and outside of the TQ. Are "gathered end" type TQs just inferior in this way, as I'd been fearing? I've admired the sewn-end TQs for some time, but they are all much more expensive than the amazing deals that EE has been running on their "Ready to Ship" X-line TQs.

- Should I put Plastic Bags over my warm socks as local Vapor Barriers?

What do you think?

[Boston]

I suspect you have a blood circulation issue, causing your feet not to generate enough heat to keep them warm.

1) Are your feet ending up elevated above your chest?

2) The socks may be too tight for sleeping. Try sleeping without the socks, or use loose fitting socks.

3) Plug the hole in the TQ foot box with a sock if you think it might be a problem.

4) If all else fails, try the hot water bottle trick - boil a few cups and put them in a nalgene - wrap it with a spare shirt or sock or something. Keep it near your feet, or your femoral artery.

Are your feet warm when you go to bed?

Try drinking a hot drink, or eating hot food just before bed time. Make sure you're hydrated well and consumed enough calories for the day.

[oldpappy]

I've had this issue if I turn in with cool/cold feet (usually due to being slightly damp/sweaty).
I resolve it by using a hot water bottle (stainless steel) in the foot box - put it in socks to insulate and allow slow heat dissipation.

[OutandBack]

Do your feet sweat alot? Maybe the down in the foot of the TQ is building up moisture over time since you are using the quilts every night. It's been a lot colder over the last few weeks so drying out the quilts will be slower.

[Passinthru]

I suspect you have a blood circulation issue, causing your feet not to generate enough heat to keep them warm.

1) Are your feet ending up elevated above your chest?

Boston may be on to something here. A short while back I spent two consecutive nites at 14 degrees. The first night I was fine -comfortable and warm - but I had slipped down in the hammock some so I raised the foot end a little before the second night. On the second night my feet got very cold about 2 0r 3 in the morning and I could not get them warm again. All clothing and weather conditions were the same. I haven't had a chance to check for sure but I have a new theory that maybe raising the feet too high may lead to cold feet.

[OldRagFreeze]

If your heels are cold, I'd imagine a CCF is the solution. If your feet are just generally cold then I'd think it's circulation related and try out Boston's ideas.

[BillyBob58]

............................

- Should I put Plastic Bags over my warm socks as local Vapor Barriers?

What do you think?

Yes, VB immediately! Combined with the loosest sock you can find, or maybe no socks, just the VB and the footbox of the quilt. You will probably want a very thin liner synthetic sock but again keep it loose. And feet/VB inside some roomy down booties wouldn't hurt either.

Do your feet sweat alot? Maybe the down in the foot of the TQ is building up moisture over time since you are using the quilts every night. It's been a lot colder over the last few weeks so drying out the quilts will be slower.

VB

Boston may be on to something here. A short while back I spent two consecutive nites at 14 degrees. The first night I was fine -comfortable and warm - but I had slipped down in the hammock some so I raised the foot end a little before the second night. On the second night my feet got very cold about 2 0r 3 in the morning and I could not get them warm again. All clothing and weather conditions were the same. I haven't had a chance to check for sure but I have a new theory that maybe raising the feet too high may lead to cold feet.

Maybe there is something to this. But my feet are almost always elevated and I have not yet had trouble with cold feet with any of my insulation systems, even short UQs with CCF under the feet/legs. Still, it might be a problem for someone else, and my forays much below 20 are far and few between and none below zero, so keep that in mind.

If your heels are cold, I'd imagine a CCF is the solution. If your feet are just generally cold then I'd think it's circulation related and try out Boston's ideas.

Good logic right there.

Of course, all the other tricks mentioned all ready like hot water bottles and chem warmers, but I'm sure you prefer to not have to bother with all of that since your quilts should be able to insulate your feet. And CCF pad under your feet or maybe in your quilt footbox to decrease condensation according to many. But if you are using a VB, there should not be any condensation no matter what else you use.

Consider: some have been warm way below zero either with nothing but full length pads as insulation, or with short UQs and pads under legs and feet. But it is hard to predict the individual response to any approach. But while you are trying to figure it all out, the quickest, lowest weight and cheapest thing to try is to throw some VBs over them dogs.

[gmcttr]

Your answer is probably in the above posts, but if you want to plug the hole in your TQ footbox, I cut circles of CCF pad and glued them together with Barge All Purpose Cement to make a plug, cinched the draw cord around it...

IMG_4010 (Medium).JPG IMG_4020 (Medium).JPG

...and that ended any leaks in mine.

[Shug]

I will add this video as it shows how to skew your UQ to get better foot coverage on the Blackbird.
Experiment with various socks. Loose fitting is best. Don't go to sleep with cold feet….they will never warm up. Do camp chores or walk around to warm the feet before crawling in.
Carry forth.
Shug

[HamMike]

Your answer is probably in the above posts, but if you want to plug the hole in your TQ footbox, I cut circles of CCF pad and glued them together with Barge All Purpose Cement to make a plug, cinched the draw cord around it...

IMG_4010 (Medium).JPG IMG_4020 (Medium).JPG

...and that ended any leaks in mine.

That my good sir is an excellent idea! Thanks for sharing!