Question about "off the trail" backpacking camping. GSMNT

[jcamp8]

I would consider myself and my group of friends novice overnight backpackers but we have done several day trips around the GSMNT area, and I would also say we have sufficient outdoor survival skills, knowledge, and gear. My question is, do you absolutely have to stay in a shelter? What if the destination you want to set up camp for a backpacking trip has no shelter within 5 miles? I have several trips planned with some buddies (all hammock campers) where we hike up a mountain, camp somewhere around the summit then descend the next day. These are really strenuous and long hikes to do in a day. I really want to be able to see the sunrise in the morning from the view up top. The ones I have in mind (Thunderhead, Mt. Cammerer) don't have a shelter available near the summit. We're good guys and would practice the leave no trace rules. Whats the risk of getting caught by a ranger and getting fined even if we have backpacking permits? Could we camp about 100 yrds away from the trail and be ok? Again im a novice, so any advice is good advice to me. Thanks fellow hangers. Btw, GSMNT doesn't allow camping outside of a shelter as far as I know.

[DanglingModifier]

Here's a quick summary of GSMNP rules from what I can recall:

If you're camping on the AT in the park, and not a thru hiker, you must have a backcountry permit, reserve a shelter in advance, and sleep inside the shelter. No non-shelter AT tent/hammock camping for you in that scenario. If you are an AT thru hiker you need to camp in a shelter if there is room, and only move out of the shelter (i.e. use tent/hammock at shelter site) to allow room for section hikers who have reservations.

If you aren't on the AT in the park you need the appropriate backcountry permit to stay in designated backcountry campsites. In those backcountry campsites you can use a tent or hammock freely.

There are lots of threads here on the forum that go into this in more detail (and likely more accuracy). Here is a quick run down by the park service: http://www.nps.gov/grsm/planyourvisi...untry-regs.htm

I can't speak to how likely you are to be caught if you camp in non-designated sites, but the penalties look like they can be quite severe. Voices, light, and smoke can travel further than you think in the woods. It's also harder to practice leave no trace rules than you might imagine. Chances are you'd be doing some backcountry damage in an already very stressed park. I'd look for approved backcountry sites close to your intended destinations to be safe and compliant.

[Canoefor2]

Remember the the GSMNP is the only national park that was to be the park of the people and with that you are allow to be in the park about anywhere you want. However, with that said they do like you to be around the shelters if you want to camp. However, you can stealth camp away from the shelter but i would recommend that the group not be greater then 8 and will still have to fill out a shelter location as well (nearest shelter). One more note pick a less popular trail as both that you listed are not.

[Canoefor2]

Youmay want to look at Stratton Bald which is in the national forest in just over the boarder into NC via Highway 68. You can also hike out to the hangover which is 2 to 3 miles past the Bald. It has grat sunsets and the hangover when it is clear you can see back to Knoxville.

[jcamp8]

Ok, thank you guys. Found Spence Field shelter so hopefully I can reserve that in time. Just gonna have to delve into some more research to prepare for these trips!

[jcamp8]

Youmay want to look at Stratton Bald which is in the national forest in just over the boarder into NC via Highway 68. You can also hike out to the hangover which is 2 to 3 miles past the Bald. It has grat sunsets and the hangover when it is clear you can see back to Knoxville.

Looks awesome. Could you elaborate on the hangover? Is that like a hammock thing, or like the name of a location??

[Canoefor2]

Once you are up on stratton bald you can hike out to the location call the hangover
http://cherokeehikingclub.org/hike2010-09-11.htm

[O-Boy]

I completed a 1 week solo trip to GSMNP in late April and there are hundreds if not thousands of miles of trails throughout the Park besides the AT. Look at the Park's website, it has all the rules and lots of resources to help you plan your group's trip. The maps and travel guidebook are valuable tools to your planning. Calling the Park HQ and speaking to the rangers will give you info like the best places to leave cars without fear of it not being there or vandalized while you are on the trail. Backcountry/primitive sites consist of the following, a fire pit, bear cables, and sometimes a picnic table and that's it. These campsites are used to limit the footprint in the park and about the only way to tell where you are besides intersections with other trails. Believe me, you'll think your stealth hanging at 98% of these sites!

[Mr. Jowee]

According to a pretty detailed trail map I purchased a few months ago, there aren't too many shelters that aren't on the AT. In fact I only see one non-Appalachian Trail shelter; Laurel Gap on the Benton MacKaye Trail.

You have to reserve shelters and campsites. This is the most popular park in the country, and people are careless, messy animals who would wreck the place. So they keep the damage to a minimum by making people stay in certain designated areas. The designated spots are some of the best anyway, and the picnic table (if there is one) is nice, as is the convenience of a permanent bear-bag system. Also, you can't use a hammock (or tent, bivvy, tarp, etc.) at a shelter. You have to sleep in the shelter. I think there are exceptions if it's full (which should never happen, since you have to reserve it, right?). Also, I've heard of people hanging hammocks in the shelters, from rafters or support joists. I can't attest to the chances of being caught or fined for hanging inside or out. Hammocks are a-okay in backcountry sites.

Most of the shelters along the AT are anywhere from 4 to 8 miles apart, with the exception of the first shelter north bound (Mollies Ridge, 11 miles from the previous shelter). There are about a dozen shelters along the AT, and it's 72 miles long, so... anyone got a calculator? The spacing of backcountry campsites, however, varies a great deal depending on which trail you're on. Could be a couple miles to the next site, could be a dozen plus.

Planning the route is fun.