Whoopie Sling Suspension

[SlowBro]

The yarn needle works fine, but I still find it kind of awkward to make these that way. I saw an aluminium knitting needle at wally world and wondered it i cut it to length if it would work like a push fid. I'm not currently in a position to try but I might when i get home. Any thoughts?

I thought of the same thing, but my wife wouldn't let me chop up one of her knitting needles. So I made do with the darn yarn darning needle. I think a size 3 knitting needle cut to size might be perfect as a fid.

[angrysparrow]

The yarn needle works fine, but I still find it kind of awkward to make these that way.

The weaving needle I linked above is 5 inches long, which is long enough to 'load' a full 12 inch bury on with room to pull at the end.

Or is it 'pulling' the bury through that you find awkward?

[Ken]

I don't have pictures, but I made a couple of fids from 1/8 brass tubing. I soldered the proper size of solid brass rod in one end, then shaped and polished that end to a blunt point. On the opposite end I soldered in a loop of guitar string/music wire to use as an eye. These work very well.

Ken

[GrizzlyAdams]

....
But, my experience with lengthening the loop doesn't quite rise to the level of awkward. If I grasp the top of the constrictor with one hand, and the loop in the other, it pulls readily. It may help that I 'start' pulling the top of the constrictor before pulling the loop, though. Maybe?

ah, that's good, I just tried that and it is much much better. I was really focused on taking the load off the constrictor and didn't see that grabbing things only up at the loop was going to do that. It doesn't, but the constrictor loosens up any way. Good deal.

And SloBrow...yes....I'm trying to do my testing with a loaded hammock. "Field conditions" you know <grin>

Grizz (also in the Smuf Club)

[TeeDee]

made a couple of whoopie slings from Amsteel blue (1/8"), have been in and out of hammocks supported by them all weekend.

I'm seeing the same stiffness as others report on loosening up and adjusting the loop. Tightening the loop up isn't too bad, with one hand I can take the load off the bury (lifting the hammock end), with the other push the "envelope" part up, loosen, and use that hand pull the other end to shorten the loop. Making the loop larger is a bit more problematic, even awkward. Need to take the load off the bury with one hand, loosen the bury, then with the other hand simultaneously pull the loop through the bury to make it longer while pushing on the envelope to keep it from closing up.

This must be my dense day - are you working with the UCR or the Whoopie Sling?

I haven't experienced the problem you are having. I think it might be because I very seldom ( never ?!? ) adjust the Whoopie Sling with the hammock hung on my suspension. I hang the suspension and adjust it. This takes a minute or 2 or 3 - don't really know since I have never been bothered to time it. Time isn't my objective, just ease of use. Also, what else do I have to spend my time doing at the end of the day??

Anyway - since I never have any weight on the suspension when setting up and don't need to adjust after that, I haven't experienced your problem. Also, I have never enlarged (or loosened ) the loop with it connected to the hugger - only before I hang it on the marlin spike. After I hang the loop on the marlin spike, I only pull the loop smaller and then that is only necessary on one end since the first end is adjusted for size before hanging on the marlin spike. For the second end, I make the loop a size I know is too big, hang on the marlin spike and pull it smaller once. That's it.

I guess I've been using my SLS and MSLS system so long, it's hard for me to understand, but why would you find it necessary to loosen the loop when on the Marlin Spike??

Now I think I may have experienced your problem when using Whoopie Slings on my tarp tie outs - loosening the loop with the loop pulled tight can be a pain. I almost went back to Figure 9s for my tarp tie outs, but thought of toggling the Whoopie Sling to the tarp tie out loop. For the toggle I just pick up a very small stick, 1/8" x 1" to 2". On take down I pull the toggle - done.

Since any alternative suspension is competing with the on-line marlin spike for my love and attention, the whoopie from Amsteel is out of the competition.

I don't understand - why are the Whoopie Slings and UCR competing with the marlin spike?? I use the Whoopie Sling with the Marlin Spike. The two complement each other beautifully??

I guess I just don't understand your use of either the Whoopie sling or the Marlin spike.

I had some slippage with a Amsteel UCR, didn't care for that, and figured needing to use some sort of tie-off knot pushed it right back into the league with using hitches in my book Conclusion : Amsteel whoopies and UCR's ain't for me.

Yeah I had slippage with the UCR also until I made the bury long enough and even then I found it too easy to loosen them. Of course, I didn't think of Frawg's solution. So I stick with the Whoopie sling - more rope, but also no way I can make a mistake with them and less bury and hence a shorter minimum tree span.

I still have Vectrus though and it behaves differently on the UCRs I made and slept on earlier in the week. I'll make a whoopie sling from it and see.

I'll climb on this bandwagon if I can find a solution that makes it easy to do small adjustments to suspension length that is reliable and notably easier than the marlin spike loop I use. That's a tall order...

having fun fooling around with this though...

Grizz

Again, I guess I must have been using my SLS and now my MSLS systems too long. I totally do not understand the need for small adjustments. I make only one adjustment for one Whoopie Sling on one end of the suspension in set-up and then no more are required or needed.

Also, again, I simply do not understand why you cannot use the Whoopie Sling with the marlin Spike. I do. It's part of what makes my MSLS and the Whoopie Sling work.

This must be my dense day.

[TeeDee]

I've made Whoopie slings in a few different lengths now, and I've found the same thing that everyone else is reporting, in that Amsteel seems stiff going around the hugger-knot behind the marlinspike toggle. And Grizz's report that it's easier to shorten the loop than to enlarge it is correct.

But, my experience with lengthening the loop doesn't quite rise to the level of awkward. If I grasp the top of the constrictor with one hand, and the loop in the other, it pulls readily. It may help that I 'start' pulling the top of the constrictor before pulling the loop, though. Maybe?

Has anyone else experienced smurf-hands from working with the Amsteel Blue? Every time I've made one of the slings it leaves my hands tainted blue, although it does wash off easily. Per TeeDee's reports, I'd like to try a sling from AS-78 but haven't found it at a reasonable price, yet.

Also, in regards to the first post in this thread and using a yarn-darning needle for the buries. That works fine, but it's a bit easier to use a longer needle for pulling through the buries. I found a blunt-nose weaving needle at Hobby Lobby that was incredibly cheap and works fantastically.

AS - I see that Grizz's experience with the Whoopie sling is more widespread.

I just don't have any problems with the SLS using Whoope Sling style loops or my newer MSLS. No need to enlarge is the key to my success I think.

For the splicing I have found that I like the largest needle in the Dritz doll needle package. It is necessary to blunt the point first though. I like the doll needle because I can use it for both the 3 mm AS-78, Amsteel and Amsteel Blue and with the 1.75 mm Lash-It I use for guy lines.

However, for the 3 mm rope like the AS-78, I really prefer the Brion Toss splicing wand. It is long enough for the longest bury and the snare makes pulling a bury a lot easier.

However, the needles do work and are 1/20 the cost.

Also, the needle I can carry for field splicing.

[angrysparrow]

AS - I see that Grizz's experience with the Whoopie sling is more widespread.

I just don't have any problems with the SLS using Whoope Sling style loops or my newer MSLS. No need to enlarge is the key to my success I think.

Yes, if you haven't been enlarging the loop under load, then you're certainly avoiding this minor downside entirely. But, once I realized that I didn't have to unload the suspension to loosen it, only by changing the grip I used to adjust it, there was no issue any longer.

The only times that I do minor adjustments where I need to enlarge the loop is if I don't hang the huggers exactly level with one another, or if I want to lower the hammock a little. I guess the amount of forethought that I put into each hang is less than what you have accustomed yourself to doing with the SLS/MSLS technique.

[TeeDee]

.....

Has anyone else experienced smurf-hands from working with the Amsteel Blue? Every time I've made one of the slings it leaves my hands tainted blue, although it does wash off easily. Per TeeDee's reports, I'd like to try a sling from AS-78 but haven't found it at a reasonable price, yet....

Yes, the Amsteel Blue does a good job of bluing your hands. I like the un-dyed AS-78 better for that also.

I had to buy a 600' spool to get a decent price on the AS-78. But then I had already purchased 100' at APS's much higher price - more than double - and so knew what I was getting. So the 600' has been a very worthwhile investment for me. I anguished on it for a long time, until I realized that I was on my second 600' spool of 1.75 mm Lash-It and ready to order my third. So I just ordered both at the same time.

[GrizzlyAdams]

TeeDee-
I'm not using a ridgeline for the hammock. I have a ridgeline under my tarp which serves all the auxiliary purposes a hammock ridgeline serves, but not the main one of setting the length of the suspension. I use the ridgeline under the tarp to take the stress off the sewn in center tabs. At least on my JRB tarp I saw these start to pull away under strain; so now the tarp hangs over a ridgeline and is positioned on it and held in place by prussiks attached to it, and those tabs. Makes it very easy to center the tarp over the hammock, once hung, which is particularly important with my bridge hammock under a MacCat Deluxe, because it Just Fits if I'm careful.

So, no ridgeline for the hammock. Means that when I hang it I do little adjustments here and there to the suspension lines and the position of the tree huggers to get the hammock hung where I want it, at the height I want it, with enough tension on the suspension to give me a flat lay. That's where I use small adjustments. And, when in the hammock I feel that it isn't level, out I go to adjust a little more.

On the marlin spike...my "default" suspension these days does the following.
1. Put marlin spike hitched toggles on the tree webbings.
2. Take cord from hammock, loop over the toggles at the tree, bring the standing end back, and form another marlin spike hitch on the line. The toggle on that one simply serves to fasten the bottom of the loop just made over the toggle at the tree. This second hitch is easy and fast to form, easy and fast to undo, easy and fast to redo after changing the length of the cord from hammock to toggle-at-tree. I demo'ed this in one of my suspension tutorial videos starting at around 7:50.

Finally, I've made up both UCRs and whoopie slings. The observation about relative difficulty in increasing the loop size applies of course only to the whoopie sling.

Grizz

[TeeDee]

...I guess the amount of forethought that I put into each hang is less than what you have accustomed yourself to doing with the SLS/MSLS technique.

Probably not - the procedure I developed for the SLS and then simplified and carried on to the MSLS is exceedingly simple - my first design priciple is KISS which I always ignore at my own peril

Procedure:

1. measure tree span by pacing it
2. set one end of suspension to proper length
3. hang second end and pull once to proper length
4. hang hammock on suspension

I've used the procedure without a ridge line and a gathered end hammock and it is just as simple to use.

The key is in steps 2 and 3 and knowing how to set the "proper length". Even there, the only mystery is knowing how long your ridge line ( or "virtual" ridge line ) is so that you know how long to make the suspension from the end of the hammock to the tree. Once you know that, the rest is simple geometry and is actually done before you leave home. The lengths can be marked on the suspension and the only number I need to remember is 2 and 3, i.e., 2" to 3" for the necessary slack to maintain.

Exceedingly simple. It has to be if I expect myself to do it without thinking after hiking all day and am ready to render myself supine.