Insultex between layers of WBBB

[MacEntyre]

By bottom do you mean ...below the climashield? ...I was planning on the Insultex to the outer cover and the climashield to the inner cover.

I think that is what Scott meant. That's what I would suggest.

BTW: Thanks for the quick shipping Mac

You are entyrely welcome!

- MacEntyre

[sclittlefield]

I think that is what Scott meant. That's what I would suggest.- MacEntyre

Yup, exactly what I meant. Below the Climashield.

I was thinking of shaping the IX as well. Good plan. I'll try it straight first though.

[NotToWorry]

That is why I think it is low density polyethylene, like you find on top of a new VCR when you open the box... they look identical to me.


- MacEntyre

Thanks Mac, I have some already. But your answer still leaves me confused. The sheet insulation you find 'on top of a VCR when you open the box' is exactly the packaging stuff I'm talking about--you can buy it in 100-500 ft rolls. Is this the same material as IX but without the scrims? The facing scrims quilted to the IX only add some strength & tear-resistence to the IX--they don't add anything to the insulating properties of the IX.

[MacEntyre]

...exactly the packaging stuff I'm talking about--you can buy it in 100-500 ft rolls. Is this the same material as IX but without the scrims?

Yes. Without the scrims and without the microperforation. Joe Sr. told me that in addition to the quilting, it is microperforated.

If you want a non-breathable IX type vapor barrier insulation, then such a roll of polyethylene is it!

Probably a lot cheaper, eh?

[NotToWorry]

Yes. Without the scrims and without the microperforation. Joe Sr. told me that in addition to the quilting, it is microperforated.

If you want a non-breathable IX type vapor barrier insulation, then such a roll of polyethylene is it!

Probably a lot cheaper, eh?

Thanks Mac. Of course the packaging sheet insulation I'm familiar with is a bit thicker than IX, but IX is often used in double & even triple layers, so maybe there's no significant difference there. From my own 'blow test', it seems to me that the breathability of IX is quite low--more than GoreTex but less than SilNyon--it's actually quite close to 1.1 ripstop--so maybe it's the wind-block & low-degree of breathability (or moderate-to-strong vapor barrior) that makes IX warm & suitable for outdoor use. Joe Sr., the manufacturer, made some remarkable warmth claims to me, as I'm sure he has to you as well--most of his claims had to do with active sports, not passive sports like sleeping; which suggests to me that the vapor barrier qualities are critical to it's function. In fact, he indicated that his experience with sleeping bags was dismal; although he didn't say exactly why. I guess I'm excited, but still a bit skeptic. Like you, I'd like to hear more real-time outdoor stories---just what this group is doing right now. I can't wait to hear all the results--I just wish I had time to be out there as well. Thanks for telling us about IX & making it available to everyone for testing. I love this stuff....

[MacEntyre]

...suggests to me that the vapor barrier qualities are critical to it's function.

Makes sense... but how does that jive with the best use I've made of IX, in the insulated sock on the outside of a PeaPod? Seems that the vapor barrier qualities in that location would be least apparent, with the conductive insulator properties doing all the work.

[NotToWorry]

Makes sense... but how does that jive with the best use I've made of IX, in the insulated sock on the outside of a PeaPod? Seems that the vapor barrier qualities in that location would be least apparent, with the conductive insulator properties doing all the work.

Yeah, good point. That's why I like real live tests! But the vapor barrier features were also at work blocking entry of cold wind & blocking escape of warm body mositure. Have you comparied other materials as shells in similar situations? I know that's a lot of work, but it might be most informative. For instance, does a full vapor barrier (plastic, survival blanket, etc) give similar results? If you had no condensation buildup with IX, that would be a big plus---but condensation buildup can be highly dependant on the outside humidility; sometimes you get lots & other times you get none using the same equipment. You almost need to test two setups side by side at the same time to be certain. Or did you have unseen condensation buildup in the PP insulation? Weighing the PP before & after might be useful; although I've often found 3-6 oz of condensed moisture by weight in an unprotected PP just from normal nightly use. Significantly more than that might suggest a vapor barrier buildup. Have you tried removing a comfortably warm IX layer during the night to see what effect it was having? Or replacing the IX during the night with something else? You better hurry up Mac, winter'll be over with soon! LOL

[MacEntyre]

You better hurry up Mac, winter'll be over with soon! LOL

The only thing on that long list that I have done is to eliminate cold spots that showed up in the middle of the night at 21*F, by putting a yard of raw IX inside the PeaPod. The cold spots immediately went away, never to return. I think the IX performance both inside and outside the PeaPod were highly dependent on the fit.

Inside the PeaPod, the IX worked because it was not compressed... so you might say the PeaPod was rigged a little slack.

Outside the PeaPod, the IX worked because it was an excellent fit, from one end to the other... so you could say the PeaPod was slightly compressed by the insulated sock.

Anyway, I'm not likely to do all that testing... I'm just going to make what I think will be most useful. The IX Hammock Sock will work as a supplement to an UQ or a PeaPod; it will also work well by itself in warmer weather. An IX Insert will work as a supplement either outside or inside an UQ. IX might also do well as the top layer of a top blanket.

At Mt Rogers, I will insulate my hammock with nothing but IX layered in the Hammock Sock. Things1, on the other hand, will be comfortably snoozing in a Speer hammock, with a PeaPod and a Speer Top Blanket, underneath a Speer Winter Tarp. At least I get the Frog Sac for a top blanket!

One of these days, I want to make synthetic, insulated moccasins.

- MacEntyre

[caddoguy]

Let's make this easy.... I have great sucess with the following set up. Cheap wally world pad in concert with s.p.e.d. with blue wally word pieces in them ... slide it between the layers of wbbb and sleep like a baby. the end.

[Rockdawg69]

Let's make this easy.... I have great sucess with the following set up. Cheap wally world pad in concert with s.p.e.d. with blue wally word pieces in them ... slide it between the layers of wbbb and sleep like a baby. the end.

Except, some of us are trying to do away with the bulk of the pads, especially for long distance hiking. Would be nice for extra temp coverage to have a thinner "blanket/quilt/etc." that mates to a UQ and could be put in a stuff sack and not take up a bunch of pack space either inside or outside.