Hammeck comparison

[ccolclou]

I keep coming back and looking at the Blackbird and the hammecks, particularly the Netty and the Envy. Does anyone here have experience with both of those? I know the BB is famed for its footbox - are the hammecks comparable, or are they totally different? The pictures on Hammeck's website look like there probably is some sort of footbox.

Any opinions on footboxes, general comfort and lay, etc? Is Hammeck (in your own opinion) closest to a BB, Dream Hammock, etc?

I see tons of comparison threads between Dream Hammocks and Warbonnet, curious to find out where Hammeck seems to fall.


Thought about posting this in the other vendors forum, but not entirely sure that's where it should go. Mods, please move if needed!
Thanks!

[jwright]

ccolclou,
I'm really not sure how to answer your questions, I think that each hammock feels different to each hanger.
If it would help, I'm pretty close to you and have a BB, a Dream Hammock TB and a couple of DIY gathered ends.
You could try them out if it would help-shoot me a PM if interested. Sorry I don't have a better answer.
Jason

[The Tree Frog]

I have a Blackbird and just received my new Hammeck Envy. I really like my BB. I think the foot box is a benefit but what I really love is the shelf.

The problem is that I am 6' 2" so the BB is a little short for me. I considered the BB XLC but wanted a top cover for winter camping...and when you add a top cover, you lose the shelf. Plus the XLC a with top cover would be $240 I think.

So, I went with an 11 foot Hammeck Envy in Argon. The Argon material stretches a little and I happen to like that better. Whether it is the Argon or 11' length I'm not sure, but it also helps with calf ride and hyper extension I was experiencing with the Blackbird. I did ultimately lose the shelf because Hammeck Envy doesn't have one but it was less money than the XLC too.

I never tried a Dream Hammock, but I believe the big difference is that a Dream Hammock is a complete customized hammock and you get the pick many of the features. It is made just for you. That is the primary reason to go Dream Hammock. But, you can't do that until you know what you like and want...in my opinion. You don't want to spend a lot of money and then say, I should have done this or that.

Bottom line, you need to figure it out for yourself. No one here will tell you which is "the best" hammock. Watch how few responses you get to your question. The best advice is always to meet up with people at group hangs and try several types. That is the only way you can really judge for yourself.

Enjoy and good luck.

[ccolclou]

Thanks jwright and treefrog. I guess my major question is whether the hammecks have footboxes that are comparable to Warbonnets. It looks like they do, but it's not an advertised or talked about feature if so. I know I need to get out and try some - there are just so many to try, especially with all the new materials that are out now (curse you, Dutch!).

Treefrog, in your opinion, does the BB shelf help with comfort, or just convenience?

[The Tree Frog]

If I understand the construction properly, the foot box is not extra material. It may be the way it is cut but is influenced by the net as well. The Hammeck Envy has a pull out where the "foot box" would be. This give the illusion of a foot box and helps keep the material pulled so you know where or how far your feet can go. I don't notice a better foot box in the black bird.

The shelf is convenience. I don't use an organizer on my ridgeline in the BB. I will in the Envy. It is large enough in the BB to put a jacket, pants, knife, watch, water, whatever you want. Even shoes if clean. Otherwise, people just stuff that gear under or around their legs in the hammock. So, you can do without, but I really like the shelf.

Again, my main reason to change, besides our addiction to new gear, is that I wanted an 11 foot hammock. In my opinion, you can't go wrong with either...unless you are tall and want a longer hammock.

[Zilla]

IMO, is that you should take jwright up on his offer and go lay in a few hammocks, nothing beats trying before buying.and Tree frog - the xlc has the top cover ,the shelf and the footbox, you dont lose anything, from the original bb you get the ft box and shelf, with the xlc you get the ft box the shelf and another foot of hammock.

[meckelangelo]

Hey there ccolclou! First off, thanks for checking us out! I can answer your question, as far as the footbox is concerned. Yes, our Netty and Envy effectively have a footbox, which is created by the direction-specific pullouts and the profile of the bugnet. I recall reading a blog post by Derek Hansen on The Ultimate Hang concerning footboxes. He basically came to the conclusion that any hammock with an integrated bugnet has a "footbox", because the extra material of the bugnet allows you to use more of the edge of the hammock body with your feet. I'll see if I can dig that blog up for you.

Thanks again for looking at our hammocks! Please don't hesitate to reach out to me here or at [email protected] if you have any more questions.

On another note... Derek Hansen has one of our Envys, and will be giving it a review when he finds time. It should have arrived at his door yesterday. However, he's writing a new book, so the review may not be available until the Spring.

[meckelangelo]

Aha! Here it is... http://theultimatehang.com/2014/05/warbonnet-blackbird-hammock-2014-review/ He talks about the footbox in section 3, although the rest of the blog is good material.

You can't go wrong with a WBBB or a WBXLC, they have a lot of great features and an excellent reputation. In fact, you won't regret your decision in going with any of the cottage vendors. We're the new kids on the block, but I'm really proud of what we have to offer!

[BryanS]

I just received my Envy from Hammeck and it's build quality is flawless. I can't compare it to the WBBB but, having not yet had a chance to use it, I'm predicting that I'll be very, very pleased with the Envy.

[ccolclou]

The Envy does look awesome! Plus, that's just a great name for a hammock!
I'm really looking forward to when enough people get them and are able to start comparing with some of the more established brands.

[CoreyR]

I received my new Hammeck Envy Monday evening and took it out for a bit of testing yesterday. I will be including some pictures below. My daughter also ordered one.
We both ordered 10 foot, SL 1.4 Poly D Envys, mine is OD green and hers is Barney Purple. (I love you, You love me...!) Both have the "peekaboo" feature.
I also own, and was heavily influenced in this pruchase by, a Hammeck, 11 foot, Breezy 1.1, DL in Marpat which I got on clearance back in early spring. I love that hammock but I suspec it is going to be surpassed by the Envy.
Let me start of by saying that I do not have enough time playing with the thing to do an honest review here. I can speak, with some authority, on the "Breezy" but I can only give an overview of the Envy.
First off, the quality of workmanship is first rate. The seams all seem (pun intended) to be well sewn, I get a sense of "attention to detail." I got the same feel from my Breezy and it has proven to be an excellent hammock. I anticipate the Envy to meet or exceed that standard.
When I first hung the Envy I was impressed by way it came ready to hang, I mean, they packed it so that you could take it out of the box, throw it into your pack and head to the field. It is good to go. I would never actually NOT check my gear but you could. It is not all all bundled up in little plastic bags and wrapped in sheets of useless "instructions." Just open the carry bag and hang it. I did take a few minutes to switch my dutch clips, my peak bag and my ridgeline organizer over to the Envy. Other than this, I had it up in a couple of minutes.
The next big plus came into play when I actually got into the hammock. Every other hommock I have ever used, going back nearly thirty years, I have had to get into and adjust myself to get a "diagonal lay." Even a good hammock, I sit in and turn myself a bit to get in the "sweet spot." When I sat in the Envy, I lay back and found myself exactly where I needed to be. I just seemed natural. When I ordered the hammock they asked for my usual direction of lay and boy did they get the cut of the thing right. While I was working with it, fitting my underquilt and the like, I got in and out several times. Each time, I was exactly where I needed to be.
I do not know about a "foot box," as I have never been in a WBB, but the Envy does seem cut for diagonal lay and I could not help but notice that my reflectix leg pad stayed in place very easily below my JRB Greylock 4 UQ. In my Breezy it always tended to shift toward the centerline of the hammock even when I was laying diagonally. In the Envy, it seems to want to stay in place to the right side a bit. Of course, I did not actually sleep in the Envy and this was just for a few minutes of testing. It seems this way and could be different at 2 AM on top of Mt Pleasant. LOL
As I stated, my daughter and I both got ours with the "peek-a-boo" feature and I am glad that I did. Once I was in this hammock, and it was zipped closed, it really started to heat up fast. The peak-a-boo allowed me to vent it as I choose. Very nice.
I do note that, really, I cannot use the tie outs with the UQ. That is ok. It still worked just fine. I am really looking forward to using this set up.

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This last picture is my daughter Envy, still in the bag.
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[CoreyR]

I will say this, with an enclosed hammock, you will not be able to reach out and adjust your UQ easily. Just a note if you, like, have never used and enclosed hammock before.

[hutzelbein]

I haven't used a Hammeck, yet, but I believe the general construction is very similar to Dream Hammock (which I have used). As jwright said, hammocks feel different to each user. I prefer my WB Blackbird to any other hammock, but others never manage to get comfortable in it (the calf ridge issue comes up frequently). I could list the differences in construction, but I doubt that this would mean anything to you - unless you had tried out similar hammocks before.

With regards to the footbox, to my knowledge there is only one other manufacturer who has a "footbox" that is comparable to what Warbonnet does. UK Hammocks doesn't use fabric but a piece of string to create the footbox. Here is a review (http://theultimatehang.com/2013/09/woodsman-x-hammock-review/) that shows how it works. The main feature of the footbox is, that it pulls the edge of the hammock fabric together in the foot-area by adding a triangular piece of fabric (or a string that carries the weight and bug net as fabric). I have described the effect in this post (https://www.hammockforums.net/forum/showthread.php/101215-Footbox-on-both-sides?p=1350778&viewfull=1#post1350778). You won't achieve something similar by using a tie-out.

Honestly, the best thing to do would be to buy both and use them for a couple of nights - and then sell the one you don't like as much. Or keep it as a back-up :) Second best would be to borrow both hammocks and spend at least one night in it. A lot of hammocks feel super comfortable for a nap. Spending a full night in it is a different issue.

If you can't do either, throw a coin - or pick the hammock that on paper appeals most to you.

[The Tree Frog]

IMO, is that you should take jwright up on his offer and go lay in a few hammocks, nothing beats trying before buying.and Tree frog - the xlc has the top cover ,the shelf and the footbox, you dont lose anything, from the original bb you get the ft box and shelf, with the xlc you get the ft box the shelf and another foot of hammock.

Thanks Zilla. I was told that when you switch from mosquito net to top cover, you lose the shelf. It was said that the cut is below the shelf. Is that wrong?

[joker421]

Thanks Zilla. I was told that when you switch from mosquito net to top cover, you lose the shelf. It was said that the cut is below the shelf. Is that wrong?

Yep, that's incorrect. The winter top over on my XLC just replaces the bugnet and is the same size and shape - the shelf is the same either way

[Zilla]

Yep, that's incorrect. The winter top over on my XLC just replaces the bugnet and is the same size and shape - the shelf is the same either way

What he said,!

[The Tree Frog]

Yep, that's incorrect. The winter top over on my XLC just replaces the bugnet and is the same size and shape - the shelf is the same either way

Ok. Thanks for the correction. Unfortunately, that was one of the reasons I didn't buy an XLC. I pity the fool who told me that! Anyway, I am happy so far with the Envy with top cover and peekaboo. And it saved me some money as they had a sale when I ordered the Envy.

To the OP, as said before, you can't go wrong either way.

[joker421]

To the OP, as said before, you can't go wrong either way.

Totally agree with this. You'll be hard pressed to find a single review of either citing poor quality or design. For most it's just a matter of choosing between the different features offered by each. If you aren't able to hang in both to test before your purchase, I would recommend buying both. You will easily be able to sell the one you don't want to keep for around $10 less than you paid, and that $10 will be your peace of mind for making the right choice.

[CoreyR]

I work with a limited budget and had to choose one or the other. I already had seen the quality from Hammeck since I had a Breezy I had picked up on clearance. I do look forward to someone doing a side by side comparison though. Should be interesting as I have never heard anything but good about the XLC.

[ccolclou]

Tree frog, on the link Meckelangelo provided to Derek's XLC review I believe it says you lose the shelf when the bugnet is removed (although he doesn't mention that it is rebuilt when the overcover is on). Perhaps that's where that rumor started.

[Countrybois]

Yes, you lose both the shelf and footbox when the covers are removed. Both covers have the shelf and footbox incorporated into them.

[The Tree Frog]

Tree frog, on the link Meckelangelo provided to Derek's XLC review I believe it says you lose the shelf when the bugnet is removed (although he doesn't mention that it is rebuilt when the overcover is on). Perhaps that's where that rumor started.


Yes, you lose both the shelf and footbox when the covers are removed. Both covers have the shelf and footbox incorporated into them.

Ok, there we have it, I guess. So you do lose them, but gain them back if you use either net or top cover. Otherwise you have an 11 foot Traveler without them.