View Full Version : Garlington Insulator to augment Super Shelter pad
BillyBob58
09-10-2009, 08:34
I just want to remind folks of something that worked super for me back in the day when I only used the SS. But I kind of forgot about it until recently. I never fully explored it's capabilities as I got side tracked into the Pea Pod and JRB MWUQ. Both of which work great, plus I was experimenting with non HH hammocks, so I kind of abandoned more research on the SS, even though I always thought it was a pretty good approach.
But lately I have played around some more with the Garlington Insulator(GI). Of course, it is still too hot to experiment with it. None the less, it is obvious it has great potential for the HHSS, or really any sort of UC, or even down in a Pea Pod.
The original GIs I experimented with consisted of a crinkled up, loosely folded space blanket "sealed" inside a garbage bag of various sizes. It adds very little weight or cost, maybe even zero if you rig it up from items you have with you any way.
What is the main problem with insulation in the UC of a SS, other than potential condensation? It is the elastics in the SS UC, which tend to conpress the insulation, particularly if down is used, as it holds the insulation against your back. In some spots, it may compress it down to almost zero. The SS was one of the 1st "snug" type designs: it holds everything just lightly against your back. That is fine with the HH pad or things like fleece, it is not enough tension to compress them much. But if you go stuffing fluffy stuff down in the UC or on top of the pad, they tend to loose a lot of their loft.
Why is the GI potentially great in a SS? First, the sealed bag is hard to compress. The light pressure caused by UC elastics will usually not cause any leak/compression. So, whatever you put in there to cause some loft ( a down jacket or vest or the original space blanket), whether 1/2" or 3", it will pretty much stay that way through the night. All though I think I remember that as the night grows colder, the air volume will shrink a bit.
Second, depending on how much insulation, it is light enough not to cause any sag in the UC. For ex, with just the space blanket, there will be zero UC sag.
Third, especially if using down, there is no concern with condensation for those that have issues with that despite using the space blanket on top of the pad, as everything is in a water proof bag.
I think Cannibal once said he puts one of those x-large zip lock bags in his pack as a liner. Yesterday, I took some of the Climashield insulation from my WB Torso UQ and put it in first a large garbage bag and later in a x-large zip lock storage bag. This gave me some significant additional loft under the pad, snugged up firm against my back. It would be easier to use with a zip mod or net free HH, so that you could position it after getting in. Flexibility might be a concern, with the garbage bag seeming more flexible than the zip lock. But I think it will be flexible enought o help, if you don't have too much air in there.
You might have to rig up something to keep it where you want it, though it has a tendency to sink to the lowest, and coldest, point.
Any way, some of us HHSS users might want to experiment with this this winter. I remember a pretty good boost just using the space blanket in a garbage bag, and I think it might also work great with more substantial forms of insulation. Folks ( including me) have successfully used insulation in the UC without bothering with putting it in a bag, but that compression does have to be accounted for. As well as condensation.
Interesting.
How do you seal the large garbage bags and do you use more than one?
BillyBob58
09-10-2009, 15:14
Interesting.
How do you seal the large garbage bags and do you use more than one? You could use more than one, and I think I did once. But, one large bag should cover the major areas that need a boost.
Twisting and then folding the garbage bag open end over several times and then wrapping tightly in a thick rubber band seems to get the job done. But this uses up a lot of bag and the more times you fold it over the more the bag gets smaller. So you might need to make up for this by starting with the largest leaf bag you can find, or at least pretty big. So that enough bag would be left over to cover your upper back to butt. But considering the phenomenon of CBS (cold butt syndrome) just having that area well covered might be enough to save the day- or night.
Obviously none of this is a problem with the zip lock bags.
http://www.hammockcamping.com/Garlington%20Insulator/GIversion2.htm
Some GI experiments of using the GI by itself, as opposed to using it to beef up the SS pad/UC as I have been suggesting:
http://www.hammockcamping.com/Garlington%20Insulator/GIoriginal.htm
None of this does away with the need for the original space blanket on top of the HH pad. SBs discussed above are crinkled up inside the garbage bag. And don't forget the possibilities of leaves, even wet one if not too heavy, in the sealed up bags.
BillyBob58
09-10-2009, 15:42
Here are some pics to make the point- this is about 12 oz( way more than I have been discussing) of Climashield Combat stuffed carelessly inside a large zip bag. It looks to be around 22" wide by about a yard long. One question is will this type of bag(or any other) flex well enough to surround your entire back. I think it will depending on how much air is in there. Also, this is an old zip bag, and if I push on it hard the air slowly leaks. But, the only pressure on it in the SS would be whatever pressure the UC elastics supply. Which I don't think will be enough to cause a leak even in this old bag.
So the order from top down is...SB, OCF, GI, SS-UC?
BillyBob58
09-10-2009, 17:09
So the order from top down is...SB, OCF, GI, SS-UC?
Yep. Of course, you can do with out the GI and just put insulation in the UC ( down jacket whatever) like Kwpapke did at -26F. But like I said, the challenge there is not compressing and keeping dry, 2 problems this approach probably solve. Other ways are having enough weight down there ( I think kwpapke had a pad down there under the down) to overcome the UC elastic just enough to allow the down to loft BUT not so much as to have a gap. And or hanging the UC super loose, to decrease compression. Some one here did that with a Pea Pod down there, and it worked for them.
Lots of things to experiment with! ( aka play time) ;) Especially for those who already have a SS and want to stick with it.
Don't have anything to add, but I'm following this with much interest. Thanks for the discussion, guys!
I just made a Wallysil* GI shell and checked it out by itself. It turned a comfortable hang into a noticably hot one in a very few minutes. I'll check it out in earnest when I'm back in VA in a few days; I plan on spending several nights hanging in the back yard. Night time lows there seem to be touching the upper 50s, so I'll get a chance to try the leaf bag / space blanket insulation idea.
As a bonus, it looks like the Wallysil GI shell will serve as a weather shield to complement my smallish (5 x 10) tarp. I seem to be backtracking on the evolutionary tree here, where Risk and Ray Garlington were a few years back. Should be educational.
*Wallysil - Walmart 'bargain' fabric that seems to be silnylon
BillyBob58
09-22-2009, 10:36
I just made a Wallysil* GI shell and checked it out by itself. It turned a comfortable hang into a noticably hot one in a very few minutes. I'll check it out in earnest when I'm back in VA in a few days; I plan on spending several nights hanging in the back yard. Night time lows there seem to be touching the upper 50s, so I'll get a chance to try the leaf bag / space blanket insulation idea.
As a bonus, it looks like the Wallysil GI shell will serve as a weather shield to complement my smallish (5 x 10) tarp. I seem to be backtracking on the evolutionary tree here, where Risk and Ray Garlington were a few years back. Should be educational.
*Wallysil - Walmart 'bargain' fabric that seems to be silnylon
Looking forward to your results!
One thing different about the pure GI approach is no warm and tight against the body HH OCF pad and space blanket above the sil shell and GI. So obviously you will need additional insulation in the GI to make up that. Not a problem of course, but a consideration. And I also wonder how the lack of these will effect over all condensation.
But I'm glad you are about to find out for us! :) After a promising start, I sort of dropped out of the test to see how well a GI could be made to work. Does your wally-sil shell have any kind of elastic suspension to allow it to adjust some what, allow it to have some "give" after your body weight sags down into it?
One thing different about the pure GI approach is no warm and tight against the body HH OCF pad and space blanket above the sil shell and GI. So obviously you will need additional insulation in the GI to make up that. Not a problem of course, but a consideration. I plan on replicating what Ray described - crumpled newspapers, as well as a crumpled space blanket or two inside of some leaf bags. Heck, I may even have a ton of leaves available when I get back home; my lawn seems to be the neighborhood leaf catcher! :laugh:
And I also wonder how the lack of these will effect over all condensation. I could tell just from this morning that condensation will probably be a concern, if not an issue. I was getting that CCF against my back kind of feel after a little while, the feeling that would be clammy if it were cooler outside. It was pushing 80* when I did the trial fit this AM.
But I'm glad you are about to find out for us! :) After a promising start, I sort of dropped out of the test to see how well a GI could be made to work. I noticed on Ray's 'silk hammock' page (http://www.garlington.biz/Ray/SilkHammock/) his observation that the idea hadn't seemed to catch on, but I haven't seen any discussion that sheds light on why. I'm also curious what happened to his unbaffled 'bag of feathers' idea. I'm guessing that baffles have proved to be the only reasonable way to maintain consistent loft and avoid cold spots.
Does your wally-sil shell have any kind of elastic suspension to allow it to adjust some what, allow it to have some "give" after your body weight sags down into it? Not yet. As it is right now I just have draw cord channels on all the edges; I iteratively adjusted the end ties this morning, but I have some elastic I can put through the channels to test that approach.
It did occur to me to try some draw cord holes in the middle of the long edges. If you follow the link to Ray's "Previous Information" (http://www.garlington.biz/Ray/HammockInsulator/Insulator.htm), he routed a draw cord pull from the foot up along the ridge line. That didn't appeal to me, so I want to see if a center - accessible draw cord would be workable and convenient.
I'll keep y'all posted.
Edit: Think I'll go ahead and add corner tabs while I'm at it...
BillyBob58
09-22-2009, 13:36
..............
I noticed on Ray's 'silk hammock' page (http://www.garlington.biz/Ray/SilkHammock/) his observation that the idea hadn't seemed to catch on, but I haven't seen any discussion that sheds light on why. ..........
It didn't catch on with me because I was using it to augment a SS and then I got side tracked with top loading hammocks and a PeaPod and then a JRB BMBH with MWUQ. But, I thought it was working pretty darn good in the SS and had originally planned on testing at much colder temps than the high teens, which is the lowest I used it. I just didn't have enough cold temps to test my down gear and HHSS with GI.
Not yet. As it is right now I just have draw cord channels on all the edges; I iteratively adjusted the end ties this morning, but I have some elastic I can put through the channels to test that approach.
It did occur to me to try some draw cord holes in the middle of the long edges. If you follow the link to Ray's "Previous Information" (http://www.garlington.biz/Ray/HammockInsulator/Insulator.htm), he routed a draw cord pull from the foot up along the ridge line. That didn't appeal to me, so I want to see if a center - accessible draw cord would be workable and convenient.
I'll keep y'all posted.
Edit: Think I'll go ahead and add corner tabs while I'm at it...
Please do keep us posted. If not using a HHSS, how about something that you could adjust after you got in the hammock, or is that what you have already, or are planning? That way you could get in and then pull the insulation snug against your back. Just a thought.
... But, I thought it was working pretty darn good in the SS and had originally planned on testing at much colder temps than the high teens, which is the lowest I used it. I just didn't have enough cold temps to test my down gear and HHSS with GI. That's encouraging to hear! I'll also be heading back to Virginia at year's end, so that should give me some lower temps also. And you may not get the really low temps there in Tupelo, but from what recall of Biloxi the combination of February cold and humidity cut through me like a knife! I imagine the sil could help a bit with that.
If not using a HHSS, how about something that you could adjust after you got in the hammock, or is that what you have already, or are planning? That way you could get in and then pull the insulation snug against your back. Just a thought. Yeah, I was planning on ultimately being able to make final adjustments from inside the hammock, which is what had me thinking about drawstring pull points at the center of the long edges, i.e., near mid-hammock. I'm using a two-layer DIY top loader, btw.
Two other things occur to me as I do this -- I could perhaps put darts at the head and foot of the shell to get rid of some of the extra fabric that the draw cord snugs up at each end; not all of it, of course, but there is quite a bit of apparently unnecessary 'taco' on the ends. Alternatively, the size of this thing might make it workable as a poncho. But that's a rabbit trail I'll leave for another day.
Cheers! :D
ok so a few questions:
-is this just a ghetto thermarest? basically a pad filled with air?
-along those lines, if you don't fill it w/ something (insulation of some sort) then the air inside the bag will simply get cold every time you move (same principle as the big agnes clearview)... a sleeping pad is only as good as the insulation inside it.
-any worries about sideways rain blowing into the bottom of the taco and filling it up?
BillyBob58
09-22-2009, 20:21
ok so a few questions:
-is this just a ghetto thermarest? basically a pad filled with air?
Yep, pretty much!
-along those lines, if you don't fill it w/ something (insulation of some sort) then the air inside the bag will simply get cold every time you move (same principle as the big agnes clearview)... a sleeping pad is only as good as the insulation inside it.
An air mattress is probably better than nothing, and in my case I was just using it to add a few degrees or more to the already warm HH Super Shelter. However, the way to go is to definitely add some insulation into the sack/bag to make the contained air more dead. Any number of things can work quite well, from a down or synthetic garment you are not wearing to bed, a 2 oz space blanket, some Climashield insulation, some leaves, or a mixture of things. 800 FP down would probably work better than most of those items, but they will still help a good bit more than just air will work. Also, seems to me, one of the main advantages of adding insulation into the sealed bag is that it can not be easily compressed by your body weight on top of it.
-any worries about sideways rain blowing into the bottom of the taco and filling it up?
Well, maybe. But the SS under cover won't hold but a little water without draining out the opening. I suppose you could add some drainage to a taco. And the insulation in the sealed bag won't be hurt by the water, another advantage. But if that much rain is blowing over the edge of the undercover, you are probably already in serious trouble any way. And in most conditions, the under cover will just give you a good bit of extra protection against wind and blowing rain/snow.
Quickie field report. Slept out last night inside a silnylon taco and a large lawn leaf bag stuffed with a pair of folded, crinkled space blankets held up against my torso. I left the bag open on the end, just for grins.
Also added a kludged pseudo UQ made of cheap fleece & SP sewed inside a breathable ripstop, except that I used it like a pad under my lower extremities. I inserted it inside the double layered hammock.
Also used a crude top quilt I'd made from a single layer of (1" ?) synthetic fiber batting from Joanne's, sewn inside a breathable ripstop case.
Temp only got down to about 63* F last night, so it wasn't much of a test. As expected, I stayed toasty warm. It was also rather breezy at times, but the taco kept the breezes at bay all night. In the wee hours before dawn I did notice the beginnigs of a warm clammy feeling like you get with a CCF pad.
Edit: I was just wearing some UA running shorts and a short sleeve synthetic shirt; no socks or head gear.
Tonight's lows are projected for the upper 40s, so it should be a good test.
More later...
Temp got down to 51* F last night. I added a second leaf bag with crumpled newspaper, blew some air into it and tied the end off. All else was the same except that I added an athletic warm-up suit and a watch cap to my clothing. I slept okay, but a bit on the cool side. I never got uncomfortable, and even slept better than the previous night. I think I put too few newspapers and too much air in that second bag. I'll forgo the newspaper-filled bag tonight and add a small amount of air to the bag with the space blankets. It's projected to be slightly warmer the next couple of nights, before dropping to the mid 40s with rain over the weekend. That should prove interesting... ;)
BillyBob58
10-08-2009, 15:27
Temp got down to 51* F last night. I added a second leaf bag with crumpled newspaper, blew some air into it and tied the end off. All else was the same except that I added an athletic warm-up suit and a watch cap to my clothing. I slept okay, but a bit on the cool side. I never got uncomfortable, and even slept better than the previous night. I think I put too few newspapers and too much air in that second bag. I'll forgo the newspaper-filled bag tonight and add a small amount of air to the bag with the space blankets. It's projected to be slightly warmer the next couple of nights, before dropping to the mid 40s with rain over the weekend. That should prove interesting... ;)
Interesting results! And you are testing the pure GI approach. Unlike me, who was using it to beef up the already pretty warm HHSS with OCF pads and space blanket. But if a hammock is approaching "cool on the backside" for many folks below 75*F( and most folks below 70) then it sounds like you are getting 20-25*F worth of insulation from you GI. That is a pretty good amount to be added to the SS or, say,a Pea Pod.
Have you got any other interesting items to use as insulation inside the leaf bags? Like a down or PG jacket/parks/vest? A spare piece of raw insulation, like a sheet of Climashield or Polarguard? Or how about some dry leaves? Those could be really warm when available.
Have you got any other interesting items to use as insulation inside the leaf bags? Like a down or PG jacket/parks/vest? A spare piece of raw insulation, like a sheet of Climashield or Polarguard? Or how about some dry leaves? Those could be really warm when available.
I was hoping to use dry leaves, but in my neighborhood only the dogwoods seem to be just turning color here. The oaks are still green. My wife may have some synthetic batting hidden away in her craft stuff, and I think we have a couple of old pillows that may have cheap feather stuffing. ... hmm, we even had a couple of old quilts somewhere and some old sleeping bags as well. I'll see what's on hand and negotiate a sacrifice or two for tonight. ;)
So far, I favor the crinkled space blanket stuffing -- cheap, lightweight, easy to pack down and relatively effective. Only problem I have is that I don't care for the marginally clammy feeling I get toward morning.
More later... :)
BillyBob58
10-08-2009, 17:11
So far, I favor the crinkled space blanket stuffing -- cheap, lightweight, easy to pack down and relatively effective. Only problem I have is that I don't care for the marginally clammy feeling I get toward morning.
More later... :)
Yeah, that is something to consider. Most of us( but not all) who use a space blanket on top of the HH OCF pad have little or no condensation problems, and I have never been aware of a "clammy" feeling. Whether I added a GI below the pad or not. But, the pad holds the space blanket close to the body, so it is probably always pretty close to skin temp, no matter how cold outside. So that may make a dif as far as condensation on the space blanket or a clammy feeling from high humidity drifting up from below. Plus the space blanket, widely spread out, seems to keep most moisture/condensation out of the under cover. So there is not much down there to drift upwards and cause a clammy feeling, and the space blanket(vapor barrier) would probably keep most of it out of the hammock if there was.
So I'm thinking that your GIs are maybe not as wide as the HH pad/space blanket, which also somewhat wraps around me. So, they may be allowing more insensible perspiration to reach the under cover and condense? Or at least allow a bunch of humidity to build up in the UC?
Whatever, still not bad for the money, and pretty low weight and bulk.
Good thoughts, BillyBob...
My thought was that the clamminess was from my perspiration, with the leaf bag acting as a vapor barrier since that's the part that's held closest to my backside by the silnylon taco. The space blanket in this setup is actually folded a couple of times, after pre-crinkling,to fit inside the (clear) leaf bag. The leaf bag lays out flat and it's 30" x 39", give or take a smidge. I've been positioning it like you would a short UQ, but I may make a second one and rotate them for an effective size of 39" x 60". Actually, the dimensions will shrink in the 39" side since I'll be tying the bags off tonight. I had left the one open, previously.
Tonight's low will be relatively gentle so I'll use the leaf bag(s) again. When it gets cooler over the weekend I'll check out whatever 'exotic' materials I can liberate from storage here.
Interesting stuff, and I'm slowly but surely getting my act together. I also have come to appreciate more and more the contributions of those who've gone before. Don't know what happened to Steve, but Risk is still somewhat active on the Yahoo hammock group.
Cheers!
BillyBob58
10-08-2009, 20:02
Good thoughts, BillyBob...
My thought was that the clamminess was from my perspiration, with the leaf bag acting as a vapor barrier since that's the part that's held closest to my backside by the silnylon taco. The space blanket in this setup is actually folded a couple of times, after pre-crinkling,to fit inside the (clear) leaf bag.
Right, and that's how I used it in my trials. Only difference being that I had an OCF pad AND an additional space blanket on top of the GIs. So I had full length and width space blanket/vapor barrior that was more or less curved around my whole body and close against me, keeping it warm. And theoretically keeping body moisture out of the under cover, maybe.
I'm not really sure if that would make that much difference from what you are doing, since the VBs(leaf bags) apparently are still tight up against you and should be kept warm. I'm just grasping at straws trying to figure out why the clamminess when I don't really have that trouble in the SS, though a few folks do.
I hope I have time this winter to test this set up using the Climashield. That just has to have some great potential, I think. A sealed bag to resist compression from the HHSS's elastic tension, with from 4 to 12 oz of insulation giving from 1 to 3 " of synthetic loft. If it will mold well to the shape of my body, that has just got to be way warm. I'll have to make myself test it though, as I am prone these days to just use the MWUQ4 or PeaPod. But, this same set up has great potential inside the Pea Pod.
Right, and that's how I used it in my trials. Only difference being that I had an OCF pad AND an additional space blanket on top of the GIs. So I had full length and width space blanket/vapor barrior that was more or less curved around my whole body and close against me, keeping it warm. And theoretically keeping body moisture out of the under cover, maybe.[/lquote]
Ah... I didn't catch that you were using a second space blanket. Sounds like a pretty effective setup.
[quote]I'm not really sure if that would make that much difference from what you are doing, since the VBs(leaf bags) apparently are still tight up against you and should be kept warm.
Yeah, I guess I'm trying to do what you just described. You put it into words more clearly than I was thinking about it. :D
I'm just grasping at straws trying to figure out why the clamminess when I don't really have that trouble in the SS, though a few folks do. It may well just be a perception issue on my part. Then again, I might just sweat like a pig... I dunno. :laugh: I am a bit sensitive to cold, in general, and when I move around with this kind of setup, the air movement tends to evaporate moisture from my skin and I instantly sense both the coolness and the humidity. Probably faulty genetics on my part. :mellow:
I hope I have time this winter to test this set up using the Climashield. That just has to have some great potential, I think. A sealed bag to resist compression from the HHSS's elastic tension, with from 4 to 12 oz of insulation giving from 1 to 3 " of synthetic loft. If it will mold well to the shape of my body, that has just got to be way warm. I'll have to make myself test it though, as I am prone these days to just use the MWUQ4 or PeaPod. But, this same set up has great potential inside the Pea Pod.
You are miles ahead of me in this, so I hope to learn from your experience. :) I'm just easing into it step by step, from summer to autumn to winter temps.
The beat goes on... :D
Well, curiosity got the better of me. Found an old pillow that should have been discarded long ago so I gutted it for the polyester batting inside. Pillows are packed pretty densely, obviously, so I pulled the batting apart in small clumps, placing the clumps into a clear leaf bag, kind of like R.G.'s 'bag-o-feathers (http://www.garlington.biz/Ray/SilkHammock/)' (scroll about halfway down the page) but smaller.
Last night's low temp was in the high 50s, so it really wasn't needed but I tried it in the taco, under my torso. The space blanket insulator was positioned under my legs. Spent another comfy night with this setup. The clammy feeling was less noticeable for some reason, but I don't think the different insulator choice had anything to do with it. My feet get the same feeling any time I sleep with socks on. Who knows!
Tonight should be interesting with the taco and my 5' x 10' tarp - lows will be in the low 60s, but there's a 70% chance of rain / thunderstorm with winds at 10 to 15 mph. Guess I need to put on the Grizz beak and see how the taco serves as a weather shield.
Tomorrow night will approach 40* lows, and R.G. had reported his taco + S.B. insulator was good down to 40*, so tomorrow should be a good test.
Just a quick final comment on my recent hanging experience. I had two more overnight hangs, Saturday and Sunday night, and the temps dropped to about 48.5*F both nights. On both nights I used both insulators, one at each end. Saturday night I had the polyester batting filled bag under my torso, and the SB filled one under my legs. Sunday night I reversed the two. Both configurations worked well at the temps I encountered. I am encouraged to follow up with more testing with a SB only configuration, since it obviously can compress much more for packing than the polyester batting version. I'll test it here in FL as weather provides opportunity, but will test more at year's end on my next trip to VA. ..._._
BillyBob58
10-14-2009, 13:10
Just a quick final comment on my recent hanging experience. I had two more overnight hangs, Saturday and Sunday night, and the temps dropped to about 48.5*F both nights. On both nights I used both insulators, one at each end. Saturday night I had the polyester batting filled bag under my torso, and the SB filled one under my legs. Sunday night I reversed the two. Both configurations worked well at the temps I encountered. I am encouraged to follow up with more testing with a SB only configuration, since it obviously can compress much more for packing than the polyester batting version. I'll test it here in FL as weather provides opportunity, but will test more at year's end on my next trip to VA. ..._._
Good info. So, it sounds like you are getting at least 20-25*F worth of warmth from just a trash bag plus space blanket held in an UC. Not bad at all, IMO. Plus, I think the probabilities are that the polyester would prove even warmer, once you have the temps to test. But time will tell!
The above 20 plus degree boost sounds like a fine, light, cheap, low bulk helper for the already pretty warm HHSS.
Good info. So, it sounds like you are getting at least 20-25*F worth of warmth from just a trash bag plus space blanket held in an UC. Not bad at all, IMO.
Yeah, I was originally skeptical about the setup but it worked (to me) surprisingly well.
Plus, I think the probabilities are that the polyester would prove even warmer, once you have the temps to test. But time will tell! I left the polyester filled bag back in VA and will definitely give it a go on the next trip. Plus, I'll do some more 'taffy pulling' of the batting to make the bits more fluffy.
The above 20 plus degree boost sounds like a fine, light, cheap, low bulk helper for the already pretty warm HHSS.I'm liking it. BTW, I'll post any follow-up testing on this under a new forum / thread since my input has really had nothing to do with pads. ;)
Side note, I'm thinking the silnylon UC/taco could be doubled over to serve as a reasonably decent rain cover for my Molly Mac Pack! :jj:
Cheers! :)
Just a quick final comment
I lied. ;)
I'll test it here in FL as weather provides opportunity, ...
Opportunity knocked. Got down to 48.5*F here last night. Used UC with a single SB-stuffed leaf bag under my torso, and the same top quilt as earlier
Slept well with the usual night time breaks. My back was a bit cool, but I was still able to sleep. I'm thinking 50*F is a good target low temp for me with this setup.
Side note - still had the clamminess in the morning; felt under the hammock and noted a small amount of condensation had formed between the leaf bag and the hammock. I guess I must sweat a bit more than most, or else I have the UC pulled too tight against the hammock.
Also noted that I'm treading an old path that was well traveled back in 2003-04, with nothing really new* added (except to me) so I'll give this topic a rest. Now I appreciate the genesis of the SS. Many thanks to those who blazed and documented this trail. :)
* well, just one thing new -- you can stuff a leaf bag with leftover wrappers from the Publix / Walmart house brand "frosted toaster pastries" (Pop-Tarts) in place of a space blanket. :jj:
..._._
MacEntyre
10-18-2009, 12:41
I'm thinking 50*F is a good target low temp for me with this setup.
That's about what I decided with my Thermadrape KAQ. At 45*F I needed real insulation.
- MacEntyre
Wentworth
10-18-2009, 17:31
I've enjoyed reading about the G.I again. I played around with this stuff about 5 years a little. I'm sure there's room for innovation. Anyone else made up Garlington's bag-o-feathers?
I've enjoyed reading about the G.I again. I played around with this stuff about 5 years a little. I'm sure there's room for innovation. Anyone else made up Garlington's bag-o-feathers?
Not yet, but I'm flirting with the idea. I've been researching the old posts on the different forums, but have yet to see why it didn't catch on.
KerMegan
10-22-2009, 09:15
Bulkiness?
MacEntyre
10-22-2009, 09:35
...t'ain't tacti-cool?
I think i'm going to try this out...but i'm going to fill the bags with leaves off the ground...should work good i think...
If the weather agrees i'm heading out next weekend i wanted to go this weekend...but it has rained 5 out of the last 6...
and i don't like to take new gear out in the rain for it's first run...rather wait till all the kinks are worked out