So I hit the ground last night.

[m0244]

My third time using the current suspension set-up; HH Hyperlite, with DIY whoops attached, dutch hooked to DIY tree straps by a thin amsteel loop.

The knot in the loop was something I got from here I don't recall the name but it was a intricate knot that created a ball shape that was supposed to be self-tightening and bomb proof. About 4 am I woke to the sound of a snap I thought a tree limb had broken or there was someone walking nearby, no sooner than the thought crossed my mind I hit the ground and had the wind knocked out of me.

Luckily, we were hung in a dry sandy creek bed and there wasn't anything around to really hurt a person. I'm going to replace the thin loop with a larger continuous loop.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/Slayer-LongShot/10622741_848658615169899_1667240799530648185_n_zps vhz4ulj5.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/Slayer-LongShot/media/10622741_848658615169899_1667240799530648185_n_zps vhz4ulj5.jpg.html)


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/Slayer-LongShot/10177934_848658661836561_7612292754367861274_n_zps rsqsg7c3.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/Slayer-LongShot/media/10177934_848658661836561_7612292754367861274_n_zps rsqsg7c3.jpg.html)

[Ratdog]

Glad you're ok.
Glad you didn't hang over anything you weren't willing to land on or higher than you were willing to fall.

Pics of the failure would be interesting.

Sounds like you are talking about a diamond knot perhaps?

The bury part of any splicing is critical but the "snap" sounds is more likely indicative of an actual failure rather than a bury sliding out.

I have loaded up spliced 7/64ths amsteel, including soft shackles using diamond knots, with 400+ lbs for months.

Bottom line, live and learn. If yiu get a chance, post some pics of the failed knot/splice/line. Curious to see what happened.

[Nodust]

You couldn't have had a better place to fall on. Those surprises at 4am will get your heart pumping.

[m0244]

I was so tired and peeved that I went back to sleep were I landed but the thud woke up my wife and she came to check on me. We stoked the fire a bit and I retied the knot with a double fisherman's and two half hitches.

Diamond knot looks right, I don't recall the am steel size but it's not 7/64th it's much thinner like 2-3mm i've used it for my tarp ridge line with burry and no issues. From inspection of the rope the knot slipped out it didn't break, the ends were pulled apart through the knot I'll have to admit I was a bit nervous about getting back in but it was much more comfortable than the ground.

Did well with a 30* UGQ quilt and a XS ridgerest pad, but kind of wish I had my under quilt there was a short bit of cold last night.

[m0244]

The one of the left is the same knot that slipped, the one of the right is how I retied it to get back in the air. I have some 7/64th am steel to replace them with, I was trying to save grams once upon a time when I chose those cords. That and after buying the expensive hammock I wanted a single point of failure that would be predictable and wouldn't be my hammock since I knew it wasn't going to be a tree strap or a whoopie sling that failed. For the record I'm just under 180lbs.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/Slayer-LongShot/IMG_5555_zpsidv7cljc.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/Slayer-LongShot/media/IMG_5555_zpsidv7cljc.jpg.html)

[Ratdog]

Yep, get some 7/64ths or 1/8" amsteel and carry on.

[WaffleBox]

Also consider splicing instead of knots.

[njsurfer]

If you prefer to tie a knot rather than splice join them with a blood knot and be done with it, it wont go anywhere.

Jon
+

[SilvrSurfr]

Not much point in using Amsteel or any Dyneema-based ropes with knots. They don't hold knots well. Time to splice!

[IRONFISH45]

Wow, glad you were not injured. I can't think of a better place to fall if you are going have a oops.

I guess your accident will serve as a reminder and warning to other members. Thank you for posting.

[Theosus]

Ouch! I always sit carefully at first and gradually put a load on my stuff. I had a toggle pop loose one evening as I was just sitting down. Nothing like winding up on your butt to make you check your toggles twice.

I looked at a youtube video on how to make a diamond knot last night for a soft shackle. It looked very complex, even though the guy was using two different colored ropes for clarity. I have four knots I use. The butterfly knot, the taught line hitch (or is it the prussic?), the fisherman's knot, and the clove hitch (this last one falling out of favor since I don't bear bag hang any more, but have an ursack).

Some of these knots get really intricate! I used to use the hennessy lashing too, and can still do it in a pinch, but I have whoopies now, so I just use the marlin spike hitch or if the tree is too big, I just pass the whoopie through the end of the strap and slide the toggle in place - which, incidentally is how I wound up on my butt.

[UrsaMajor1887]

Good reminder to check and test suspension components. I have replaced a couple of 7/16 Amsteel continuous loops lately that were looking a little ratty to me. Makes me feel better.

Learn to splice! It is a fun and relaxing hobby. There is a learning curve and I wouldn't start with Zing-It. Dutch has some spicing aids on his site for the DYIer that really help.

[Poseidon]

When I was in the field there was a week where I spent some time back at the main camp where there were these shelters over concrete. I had my hammock hung up about 3 feet off the ground over the concrete and man did I worry about falling. I know the 18 inches rule, but I did what I could. Eventually lowered it a couple days in at a different spot.

[davidrip]

The double fisherman's should be plenty sufficient for your future hangs. That knot should be solid in any kind of rope, even kinds not known for knots.

Did I interpret your pics and description correctly that you have the continuous loop hanging off the webbing loop? I have heard from some people that it's no bid deal and from other people that it's unsafe because the rope can dig through the webbing over time. Derek Hansen has at least said that a becket hitch from webbing onto rope is ok, though. I personally don't know about the different safety things with rope on webbing, just what I've heard, but after seeing a youtube video of rope slicing right through webbing just from a lot of rubbing and friction, I'm afraid to suspend myself that way.

[T- Minus]

Sometimes we take for granted the gear we carry and forget about maintenance and inspections of gear before and after each use. Glad your ok. One of the things in a seamanship course in Coast Guard bootcamp we learned is to inspect a line before each use, along with the wise words that a knot is made to be untied and tied again not cut. I guess my point is Maybe It was more human error than line/knot error.

[m0244]

Well since I do check my gear and since I did sit down before hopping in the sack and did sleep in it for about 5 hours before the knot slipped lose I would disagree with you on human error it just happened, time and pressure like physics and a lack of friction.

Yes, the knot was left in place the thin rope and knot was meant to never be untied and never slip, needless to say I don't trust that particular knot for that purpose anymore. I'm increasing the size of the amsteel, and making a continuous loop (with stitches) from 7/64 to replace that piece of amsteel.

My only intention when first using the thin amsteel that way with dutch hooks, was shorter and lighter rope for weight savings, but going big isn't that much of a difference and it makes it easier to detect any defects in the rope or knot.

The tree strap is also a DIY tubular 1" with double box stitching (heavier and stronger than the factory HH 1" web straps). And in case anyone is unfamiliar with Henessey suspension the whoopie is set-up reverse from most due to hammock design. The loop is on the webbing rather than the whoopee on the webbing and the loop on the hammock, from what I've seen the webbing bunches up and hasn't cut or frayed yet.

[ylnfrt]

If it was my suspension I'd be changing that other loop. The diamond knot is considered a fancy/ terminal knot for drawstring style sea-bags and such sacks. It is not recommended for load bearing when the load is going in opposite directions, ie; a loop. Splicing is fun and easy (you learn) and will not slip when done properly. Glad you were not hurt and HLFL.


The one of the left is the same knot that slipped, the one of the right is how I retied it to get back in the air. I have some 7/64th am steel to replace them with, I was trying to save grams once upon a time when I chose those cords. That and after buying the expensive hammock I wanted a single point of failure that would be predictable and wouldn't be my hammock since I knew it wasn't going to be a tree strap or a whoopie sling that failed. For the record I'm just under 180lbs.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/Slayer-LongShot/IMG_5555_zpsidv7cljc.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/Slayer-LongShot/media/IMG_5555_zpsidv7cljc.jpg.html)

[Humneso]

I agree with all those that have already encouraged you to splice the line. It's addicting, cathartic, and looks great. And I'd definitely stick with 7/64" Amsteel for anything involving suspension.

[m0244]

It's funny that you say that because I went camping again this weekend, and did a test sit on those same ropes after hanging everything but before replacing them; the other knot failed too.

I replaced them with repurposed loops from my ENO Sub7 hammock that I put Woopies on. I was going to make continuous loops while sitting around out there but misplaced my burry wire. I also had a hell of a time setting up a superfly in the wind, eventually got it up but i'm during for my next dutch order to come in so I can re do the guiltiness with tarp worms.

My wife was in the ENO Sub7 and my friend was in out Double Nest, while I had the HH.

I also learned that my continuous ridgeline was about 5-6' too short for that hang I had to tie on a additional length of rope, we also lengthened an Atlas strap larks heading into a ratchet strap because we were about 1.5' too short to hang everything with the trees we had available.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/Slayer-LongShot/IMG_5610_zpsoldztwff.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/Slayer-LongShot/media/IMG_5610_zpsoldztwff.jpg.html)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/Slayer-LongShot/IMG_5609_zpskv3iflms.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/Slayer-LongShot/media/IMG_5609_zpskv3iflms.jpg.html)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/Slayer-LongShot/IMG_5607_zpsabahomdf.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/Slayer-LongShot/media/IMG_5607_zpsabahomdf.jpg.html)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/Slayer-LongShot/IMG_5608_zpsllro1ohz.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/Slayer-LongShot/media/IMG_5608_zpsllro1ohz.jpg.html)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/Slayer-LongShot/IMG_5601_zps2nv5x4k5.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/Slayer-LongShot/media/IMG_5601_zps2nv5x4k5.jpg.html)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/Slayer-LongShot/IMG_5605_zpsyvhuaisn.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/Slayer-LongShot/media/IMG_5605_zpsyvhuaisn.jpg.html)

[Bikerguy]

those are some cool pics and i found them very enlightening into how i could improve my own camp

[geneaut]

Two of my hammocks have 7/64 Amsteel loops tied with double fisherman's knots. I'm a fairly big guy and so far I've had no trouble.

I think I will:

1. Inspect the loops
2. Learn to splice
3. Keep hanging low

[rustyshack11]

So the knot came undone?

[rustyshack11]

Makes me feel better about using whoopies!