Single vs. Double layered

[AlkaFeltser]

Hey everyone,

I'm new to the forum and new to hammock camping. Been a ground camper. On my last excursion, I took my girlfriend. She said she barely slept because sleeping on the ground killed her back. So the next night, we slept in my Roo that I carry just for lounging around camp. She woke up and had a great day. So that sold me.

I digress. My question concerns mosquitos. I know mosquitos can bite through a single layered hammock. But a double-layered one is heavier. Also, I mainly summer/autumn camp so would a double layered get too hot. Are these the only pros and cons? Also, is there anyway to overcome the cons of the two types of hammocks.

Also, are integrated bugnets or separate bugnets preferred?

Oh and also, If you have a ridgeline on a hammock - to get consistent sag - is it okay to hang a tarp on that?

Thanks everyone.

[SilvrSurfr]

The only reason for a double-layer hammock is if you are committed to pads. Underquilts are much better. However, if you are committed to pads, then permethrin will be infinitely better for summer camping.

It's been so long since I tried a hammock without a ridgeline that I don't remember what it's like. It's definitely not something I would encourage.

[Shug]

I only use single layer hammocks and live in Minnesota and have never been bitten through my hammock. Normally I have a UQ under it for insulation. In the infancy to hammocks used pads so be a tough skeeter to bite through that.
Spraying the hammock with permetharin has worked for me as well in high bug season up here.
Intergrated bugnet is my preference. My Warbonet XLC Blackbird has the bug netting well up and off my face which I just truly appreciate. Add on bugnets have your head pretty much pushed against them in most cases.
I have flopped my tarp over my hammock ridgline a couple of times but it was not ideal Less space and confining. And stale. Use a seperate ridgeline for tarps.
If you like, I made Hammock How To videos and Tarp Tutorials too. Check here...https://www.youtube.com/user/shugemery They are in my playlists.
Enjoy the hammock quest.
Shug

[Dochartaigh]

The only reason for a double-layer hammock is if you are committed to pads.

It also highly depends on how much weight you want to fit in the hammock as well. I'm a big guy, and like a firmer hammock, so a double layer hammock is good for me in those regards. My single layer 1.6's also feel ok (those I use for non-car camping), but I definitely notice them sagging more (even with fabrics that are advertised as having nearly no stretch).

Also, if you're going to make it a point to sleep two people in a hammock (which most people don't find comfortable YMMV) a double layer may be good in that regard as well.

[Kamper Kurt]

I just made my daughter a double layer and it is great with a pad. Using a pad with a single layer drove me nuts. However, for my next hammock I am going to make a single layer with an UQ.

[pgibson]

There is of course another reason for double layer hammocks.....They can look pretty cool :shades:

http://www.arrowhead-equipment.com/uploads/6/6/5/1/6651357/2296545_orig.jpg

http://www.arrowhead-equipment.com/uploads/6/6/5/1/6651357/s932653837630755068_p499_i4_w960.jpeg

http://www.arrowhead-equipment.com/uploads/6/6/5/1/6651357/s932653837630755068_p499_i5_w1500.jpeg

[Jake2c]

Double layer is a bit heavier but I went with a double as I will be doing an AT thru hike. I wanted the extra toughness, I use a heat reflector between the layers in the cold months. If I do have to go to ground I feel the double layer is better for that. Stands to reason that a double layer would be hotter than a single but I have never noticed it. I still get cool in the mornings. But, I went straight from tent camping to a hammock. Tent camping was hot in the summer.

[eviscerate3]

I use a pad in the 1.1DL hammock in warmer months and a 1.9 DL with an UQ in the winter months but I use a DL everytime. I find the double layer to be a firmer lay which I enjoy. They can be a bit warmer but I found by using the 1.1 DL it is completely comfortable even in warmer temps. I weigh about 220 these days and am never concerned about either hammock holding up to long term use and abuse. i used a single layer for a few years with much comfort until I found the world of Double layer hammocks. What a difference!

[sargevining]

Quote Originally Posted by SilvrSurfr View Post
The only reason for a double-layer hammock is if you are committed to pads.


It also highly depends on how much weight you want to fit in the hammock as well. I'm a big guy, and like a firmer hammock, so a double layer hammock is good for me in those regards. My single layer 1.6's also feel ok (those I use for non-car camping), but I definitely notice them sagging more (even with fabrics that are advertised as having nearly no stretch).

Also, if you're going to make it a point to sleep two people in a hammock (which most people don't find comfortable YMMV) a double layer may be good in that regard as well.

Yah, and some folks think a double layer keeps skeeters from biting through. Its one of the selling points of Hennessy Double layers.

[Rex Clifton]

I was unsure myself so I bought both a single layer (1.6) and a double layer (1.3) and returned the single layer. For me (6'1", 215) the single layer had too much stretch.

[Dashinator]

As you can probably tell, there are a myriad of factors and budgets to consider and personal preferences to discover. My first hammock was an Eno Double Nest, then a DIY (or 3), then a Dutch, then a... The quest continues. My recommendation is for a single layer with under quilt. There are several excellent cottage vendors here to support that have affordable hammocks to give a whirl to. The ones you don't want will resell easily at good prices.

Search these forums for boatloads of great advice and enjoy the quest :)

[Zilla]

Prefer a double layer due to how heavy i am, but even if i were lighter i would stay with the bouble anyway..,.. = just because = ,,, :tongueup::tongueup::tongueup::tongueup::tongueup: :tongueup::tongueup::tongueup::tongueup::tongueup: :tongueup::tongueup::tongueup::tongueup::tongueup: :tongueup::tongueup::tongueup::tongueup::tongueup: :tongueup::tongueup::tongueup:,,,

[IRONFISH45]

Well, I have been debating this issue about single vs double myself. My conclusion is: It Depends On The Hammock.

What I thought were mosquitoes bites on my backside, well guess what? I was getting hives. I rarely drink pop or anything un-natural. However, when hanging I was taking a bottle of flavored water into the hammock with me, to slurp down when I wake up thirsty in the middle of the night. Sure enough I am allergic to the "so called natural sweetener used in flavored water. The hives were all on my backside nowhere else. So now I know the single layer is fine for me the mosquitoes did not get their proboscis through the hammock.

I sound like a broken record, find a Hang and attend, you need to TRY OUT A VARIETY, EACH STYLE AND MFG IS A BIT DIFFERENT. TYPE OF FABRIC ALSO PLAYS A ROLE. You really need to try before you buy. Plus your taste in hammocks will change after you become accustom to HANGING.

[G Maurice]

I use a DL for two reasons. 1) a DL of 1.1 ripstop is more comfortable than SL 1.7 for my weight (230). 2), if I'm on a hike that has a mix of hanging on one night and going to ground the next, it just works better with a pad. Otherwise it's an UQ

[cougarmeat]

I started out with double layer because I figured I'd use a pad. But I quickly moved to under quilts. However. I got places where I might not have trees and if you have to go to ground, the double layer might be nice to keep the pad in place and a little ground protections - but I would always use some kind of ground cover (like a piece of black plastic sheet). The is a little more give to a single layer an some like it some don't. I don't think the DL will be too warm. I can feel convection heat loss under the hammock even on warm nights - granted, I don't live in the tropics. Others have posted there is no "bite through" mosquito concerns with either a single or double layer. Attached or non-attached bug net - another, it depends. If you live/camp where there are no bugs, it is nice to not have to use it - a vote for removable or separate net. But, for me, even just one tiny little bug can ruin a night's sleep. If I were using a separate net, I might run a line under my hammock (or run the ridge line under the hammock (another topic) and suspend the but net to that - lifts it off me a bit.

I can't imagine using the hammock ridge line for the tarp and as soon as you try it you may see why. It is just too low. You will be bushing against it all the time and if it is really raining, that contact will "pull" the water through. I like to put my tarp as high as practical given the weather conditions. I use a collapsible pole on one end, lifting it up for ease of entry/exit. When I do that, I check to see if any rain water will "puddle" on the tarp and were it will run off.

What raised my eyebrow in your post is when you said "we" used your Roo. I hope you didn't mean you were both in it. I mean that is cozy and all. Skipping the images of what it would be like sleeping while tied to another person (for those who find that interesting - this is not going in that direction), with two adults you can develop forces on your stitches and suspension that exceed their design parameters. If you are each in your own hammock, I think you will find actual sleeping for comfortable .

[CrappyfishRman]

Can't say if I'd prefer a double layer since I've only tried a single layer 1.9 but as far as attached bug net I definetly prefer to have it attached when camping. I have a full length zipper which makes it super easy to get my sleeping bag and stuff all in the hammock. But I do like my eno with no big net for just lounging around. happy hanging

[Salt Creek]

I like a double layer simply for using a pad. I've used double and single layer hammocks with a pad. It's no comparison. The double is much better with the pad! Someday, I'll buy an underquilt, but the pad works for now. As for the ridgeline, I wouldn't use a hammock for camping without one. Its pretty easy to add if the hammock doesn't come with one.

[kormi]

The only reason for a double-layer hammock is if you are committed to pads. Underquilts are much better. However, if you are committed to pads, then permethrin will be infinitely better for summer camping.

It's been so long since I tried a hammock without a ridgeline that I don't remember what it's like. It's definitely not something I would encourage.

Another reason is the kid. If you have a flat coat retriver @ 70-75 lbs. that loves to sleep in the hammock with you. U will want a double layer :)
Also in the California winters i use an UQ made by AHQ. During the summer time.. no quilt. But....I always use a Tarp ridgeline.

111548

[AlkaFeltser]

Yeah that "we" part wasn't clear. My girlfriend and I use it to lounge/nap in. And we don't meet the 400 lb limit so that's all good. She's hinted that she'd rather sleep in the same hammock together (she's a cuddler). I have other opinions. Napping and sleeping are different things. When I get a new hammock, I'l probably just give her my old GT double or Roo. Thanks for looking out haha.

And thank you everyone for the input. Is a Dutch hammock really THAT much better than a Roo or GT double? I'm not trying to belittle his craftsmanship but what makes a "good" hammock so much better. I don't know. A hammock is such a primitive design it seems strange to me that there's such a huge difference between them.

Cheers.

[Dashinator]

And thank you everyone for the input. Is a Dutch hammock really THAT much better than a Roo or GT double? I'm not trying to belittle his craftsmanship but what makes a "good" hammock so much better. I don't know. A hammock is such a primitive design it seems strange to me that there's such a huge difference between them.

I don't think it's so much that one hammock is vastly superior to another. It is (seriously) all about personal preference. With that said, Dutch puts out a very well made product. As a business owner, I appreciate good craftsmanship and prefer to support innovative cottage vendors that actively support the community. I find that Dutch is one of those vendors.

[Ridge_Dog]

Dutch puts out a great product at a low price. That is. ...if you have all the suspension items and bugnet. If you add all that together you are above 100.00 for the system. A Blackbird XLC is a great option for an all in one design. I have a double layer for friends to use with a pad. I made a double layer out of 1.0 oz calendered hyper D and it feels great. I liked how the material felt and needed 2 layers due to my weight.

[mrjaw14]

I went double layer for durability. I never use a pad. I found a lot of posts where single layer got stretch marks and runs and was afraid a single layer 1.1, which the fabric I wanted at the time only came in 1.1, would get damaged if I used a heal to push up in my hammock, or an elbow when I'm wiggling around. I got a hold of a 1.1 sample and it was pretty easy to make a run in it. I set a 1.7 inner layer against the 1.1 outer layer and I couldn't damage the fabric any more. I paid a lot for my hammock, I'll incure the weight penalty for it not to look stretched and worn. Looks good as new and I don't worry about being careful when I move around

[ClayTurner]

I use a double layer, with an underquilt. I like to have the option of adding a pad in the wintertime when hanging at lower temps.

[Ladylysis]

I'm a bigger gal (240, 5'5"). I tried an ENO Double (plenty of room on the weight limits) and hated several things: too much stretch, could not get a good lie, the skeeters bit me right through the material and my capris, and I was afraid that I'd step on the separate bug sack on exiting for middle-of-the-night calls of nature.

ENO got returned; research led me to want a structural ridgeline to help me with my hang, double layer for skeeter protection and feel of support, and integrated bug net. Went with the Blackbird and realized I didn't really spend that much more than for the ENO and its separate components.

This setup made me happy on my first trial hang - and +1 to Shug's remark about the bugnet being pulled away from my face. BIG bonus. Even on a night whose low temp was 70 degrees, I needed an underquilt even with full length (thought lightweight) PJ's and the double layer hammock. The little Travelon 3 battery-operated fan helped to move air early in the evening when things were still muggy (the bug net *does* trap heat and limit air movement).

re: Permethrin - I have extremely sensitive skin that doesn't like a lot of chemicals, so I'm reluctant to try it.

[Kamper Kurt]

I just made two hammocks. The first is a DL made from 1.0 HyperD. The second is a SL made from 1.9 NylonD. I do find the HyperD material to be nicer, softer, and more comfortable. I am not sure if it is because it is thinner or not, but I know that it tends to be sold as a thinner option. Might be another reason to go with a DL.

[NHWhites]

How much stretch is too much? Newbie here, fyi

[joe_guilbeau]

My thinking is that you should take into account your sleeping habits. Side sleeper, back, fetal, stomach or a combination of all of the above, in one night can impact your positioning on a pad inserted between the layers of a double hammock.

To my mind, using a mosquito repellent that does not degrade fabric is a viable option.

Picaridin

http://npic.orst.edu/factsheets/Picaridintech.html

[beenaround]

Double layer here. Hate pads, I can never seem to get them to stay in one place. I was out this weekend and the second layer was actually enough for me. No pad, and no UQ needed. No bites either - and the little guys were out in full force.

[CollieMan]

I put a lot of research in this when I was buying my WBBB XLC my conclusions were:

Double Layer:
Pros:
Pad won't move as much
Still works fine with UQ
Can comfortably support more weight

Cons:
Weighs More
Unnecessary weight if you buy an UQ

Single Layer:
Pros:
Weighs Less
Still works with pad
Won't regret getting single layer once you upgrade to UQ

Con:
Supports less weight comfortably

People claim bugs like mosquitos can get through single layer. I don't see it as a problem wearing clothes, being in a sleeping bag, or having an UQ.

[irondog]

...Is a Dutch hammock really THAT much better than a Roo or GT double? I'm not trying to belittle his craftsmanship but what makes a "good" hammock so much better. I don't know. A hammock is such a primitive design it seems strange to me that there's such a huge difference between them.
Cheers.

Is you out yo mind?!:lol: No. You ain't. You just seen & heard so much full-color, stereophonic hyperbole over distinctions without differences, your mind's jaded and your heart's cynical. That's natural and easily understood. That, plus you underestimate what's really going on, in a hammock. But, really, one might say just the same about women. Or, about men. Or even rifles. Sure, superficially, there might seem to be the same underlying "primitive design" to them all; and that there can be differences amongst and between them may seem at first "strange" to you. However, upon more intimate acquaintance with a variety of sample specimens, the differences become rapidly and acutely apparent; and that which makes a good one great will be known by you, in due course. But, as they say: "If ya hafta ask, ya won't understand.", and all the rest is merely salesmanship. So, get out there and test-lay as many as you need to. Eventually, you'll come to know, and you'll settle down into a type, and then narrow that down to a specimen. Only then can your real troubles truly begin.;) Life's a journey, not a hammock. Whatever that means.

[irondog]

Hey everyone,
I'm new to the forum and new to hammock camping. ...My question concerns mosquitos. I know mosquitos can bite through a single layered hammock. But a double-layered one is heavier. Also, I mainly summer/autumn camp so would a double layered get too hot. Are these the only pros and cons? Also, is there anyway to overcome the cons of the two types of hammocks.
Also, are integrated bugnets or separate bugnets preferred?
Oh and also, If you have a ridgeline on a hammock - to get consistent sag - is it okay to hang a tarp on that?
Thanks everyone.

Regarding mosquitos and double-layered hammocks: True, mosquitos may penetrate nearly any single layer of textile. Not likely to ever penetrate two layers of even very thin textile, if such are sufficiently tightly woven. - True, also, that two of a thing are heavier than one of the same thing. What if chemical/product-free, permanent, wear-and-weather-proof mosquito protection is worth the weight of two layers of textile is entirely subjective. I choose double-layered because, realistically, I'm going to strictly ration my chemical repelicide when traveling abroad, for myriad practical reasons. - Now, as concerns your concerns about double-layered over heating: It will greatly matter what textiles you compare the layers and hotness of. I've a Hennessy Deep Jungle XL, and a Hennessy Jungle Safari. Both double-layered, each of vastly different textiles. I will most certainly NOT be enjoying the Jungle Safari in any jungle I'll be hanging in, in this or any other year. The Deep Jungle XL benefits me the double-layered strength and protection I expect, with all the breathey, breezey comfort I'll always want in a jungle. Durability was not sacrificed, nor even compromised, by the Deep Jungle's amazing (To me. Y.M.M.V.) fabric, while yet thwarting mosquitos and breathing/cooling as required.

Regarding bugnets: My vote is for integrated but removable/stowable bugnets. These are trimly tailored to the hammock they're made for, and are instantly deployable/stowable FROM THE RECLINING COMFORT OF ONE'S HAMMOCK; all without the (I.M.O.) hassle, aggravation and fiddly-fingers busy-busy sweatwork of the after-market/afterthought nets. I'm talking here of long-time, real jungles. Not the average, temperate woodlands wherein most Americans will be hammocking for the typical -3weeks/year.

Regarding hammock ridgelines and tarps: I seen it done uncountable times, proving that it can be done; and I presume it was "okay" with the dudes doing it. I don't like the feeling of sealing myself into a sandwich bag with all my juices:thumbdown:, gasses:thumbdown:, and exhalations:thumbdown:, so, I don't do it. Most Americans wouldn't do it. The only things I allow to touch my S.R.L. are my mesh small-gear organizer and my bugnet. My tarps get slung above my hammock, almost always from my suspension. You may prefer a separate tarp line, either above, or below, your tarps.