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Boondock
06-02-2007, 20:44
Hello, I am new to this forum (this is my first post). A few weeks ago, I got interested in hammocks for a long distance bike ride.

When I started reading the forums here, I found so many folks doing the DIY thing, that I figured I'd give it a try.

I purchased the nylon, hemmed and gathered and whipped the ends. I did a test hang, and it worked fine, but it just seemed to be a little "under-engineered".

I read a couple of people's posts where they mention a failure, so I started brain-storming a different way to tie off the hammock to the suspension

I used a small section of PVC pipe (1'' diameter) and wrapped the gathered end around it, then whipped it. I am not sure if this configuration is stronger, but it "looks" stronger.

After I made it, and then was hanging in it, I was thinking that it might also reduce a rain soaked suspension line from bringing water to the hammock bed (the nylon).

I've tested the hammock for a couple of hours, and there was no slipping.

Here's a picture... What do you think?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v245/Boondockflyfish/Boondock_hitch.jpg

slowhike
06-02-2007, 21:03
that looks great boondock (& welcome to the group), but the few times people that have had a failure where the hammock support attaches to the hammock, i believe they have been able to figure out the cause.
most of us haven't had a problem there.
the two most popular ways to make that attachment seem to be
1)...a larks head attaching the support to the hammock
2)...a sheep bend in the end of the hammock fabric w/ the support passing through.
i believe as you continue to experiment, you'll find that the pipe is heavier, bulkier, & just not necessary.
but i can tell you've got the DIY bug & you'll be coming up w/ plenty of good ideas. ...tim

angrysparrow
06-02-2007, 22:12
Here's a picture... What do you think?


I think that's really quite clever, Boondock! I like new solutions that are 'outside the box'.

If you should want to try yet another idea, Mobiltoy's post here (http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/showpost.php?p=15905&postcount=5) about the grommet method is another way that is quite clean looking, and strong.

Just Jeff
06-02-2007, 23:22
Looks like it will work, as long as you keep an eye on the webbing to make sure the PVC isn't abrading it.

One note, though - you're relying entirely on the whipping for supporting your load, and whipping isn't really designed for supporting loads. Whipping is usually used to hold things together, for example a gathered hammock or to keep a line from unraveling. The larkshead, by contrast, tightens itself around the hammock as you load it...so it's not likely to fail.

Not everyone prefers the larkshead, but I don't think anyone has had one fail. Someone used a rope that was too small and it started abrading the fabric...don't remember who that was, but I think they noticed it and changed ropes before it actually failed.

That's a clever design, but I agree with slowhike - I think you'll find it unnecessary in the end. Might be another good application for it, though...

Boondock
06-02-2007, 23:58
Thanks guys, I really appreciate your thoughts.

I'm not sure I will keep this design. I really just wanted to share the idea.


One note, though - you're relying entirely on the whipping for supporting your load, and whipping isn't really designed for supporting loads. Whipping is usually used to hold things together, for example a gathered hammock or to keep a line from unraveling. The larkshead, by contrast, tightens itself around the hammock as you load it...so it's not likely to fail.


hmmm, this really got me thinking. I'm not sure that the whipping is supporting the weight here. To me it seems that the whipping does not "see" any of the weight. If the hammock has 200 pounds in it or empty, it the same to the whipping. I might be wrong however.

The weight is felt by the nylon hammock bed around the pvc. The whipping is soley to anchor the two side of the gathered fabric.

The whipping cannot slip off the end (because of the PVC pipe. The only way for it to fail, is for the end of the nylon to slip under the whipping. But that will be difficult because I folded the end of the nylon about 6 times and then hemmed it, to provide bulk, so it would not slip under the whipping.

When I was whipping, I made a "toggle" or "handle" from a piece of PVC and put a loop in the whipping cord, so that I could really apply some torque. The knot I used to secure the whipping is double-blind (exact same knot used in making fishing rods, to secure a guide to a fishing rod blank)

here's another question, since Just Jeff mentioned that it "Might be another good application"

Is the PVC in a good position to make a ridgeline?

Grinder
06-03-2007, 08:37
the knot referred to as "Sheeps bend" is, I believe, actually a Sheet Bend.

The how to is here
http://www.tollesburysc.co.uk/Knots/Sheet_bend.htm

I love it for hammock ends.

But, I am a minority on this forum. Most prefer Whipping

Tom

Yaqui Hiker
06-03-2007, 11:00
Very interesting, neat tie, but I have to agree with Slowhiker in that you're fixing something that's not broken. I made myself a Speer type hammock, with $1.00 yard Wally nylon, and the knots at the end haven't slipped a bit. I weigh 210 lbs, and I'm not particularly gentle with the hammock, but haven't had any slippage problems.

You can see the end knots in the (hopefully) attached picture, taken last week in Aravaipa Canyon, AZ. I used poly webbing (from Ed Speer) sewn up to the hammock end knot, with two descender rings in the strap for easy adjustment. Works great for me.

FanaticFringer
06-03-2007, 11:31
Very interesting, neat tie, but I have to agree with Slowhiker in that you're fixing something that's not broken. I made myself a Speer type hammock, with $1.00 yard Wally nylon, and the knots at the end haven't slipped a bit. I weigh 210 lbs, and I'm not particularly gentle with the hammock, but haven't had any slippage problems.

You can see the end knots in the (hopefully) attached picture, taken last week in Aravaipa Canyon, AZ. I used poly webbing (from Ed Speer) sewn up to the hammock end knot, with two descender rings in the strap for easy adjustment. Works great for me.

Welcome to the forum Yaqui Hiker.
That's a cool looking spot your hanging from.:cool: Man that's one huge rock cliff in the background.

Miguel
06-03-2007, 11:56
Welcome to the forum Yaqui Hiker.
That's a cool looking spot your hanging from.:cool: Man that's one huge rock cliff in the background.

I agree and don't hesitate to post more pics in the album section. We love checking out other people's rigs.

Miguel

Boondock
06-03-2007, 13:26
wow Yaqui_Hiker, that is a fantastic place. It's so different from the landscape where I live (in western Washington state). I do love Arizona, particularly the North Rim Grand Canyon.

Right now my hammock has one end with a traditional whipped ends and suspended with a lark's head, and the other end has the PVC pipe. I will keep it like that for a while.

I'm not trying to reinvent the wheel, but I do like to experiment.

Just Jeff
06-03-2007, 13:37
I'm not sure that the whipping is supporting the weight here. To me it seems that the whipping does not "see" any of the weight.

Try replacing the whipping with a single loose wrap around the hammock, tied by a shoe-string knot. Sit in it and see if the hammock slides out of the string. Then tell me what supports the weight in the hammock. :D

You could probably get the whipping tight enough to hold well enough for this application...just isn't the best knot for this purpose, IMO.

As far as the ridgeline, I think it's the same issue - it'll work, but you're replacing a simple and functional solution with a more complicated one that doesn't offer any advantage.

But seriously - this kind of thinking outside the box is what leads to solutions to other problems. That's the beauty of forums...even if no one uses this idea for the purpose you posted, you still shared it and it might spur someone's creativity into finding another good use for it. So please don't take my comments (or anyone's above, if I can speak for them) as criticism, and please don't be hesitant to post other ideas even if it's just a half-baked idea. Everything contributes.

And if you find that this system works for you, then by all means ignore us and keep using it!

slowhike
06-03-2007, 15:16
the knot referred to as "Sheeps bend" is, I believe, actually a Sheet Bend.

The how to is here
http://www.tollesburysc.co.uk/Knots/Sheet_bend.htm

I love it for hammock ends.

But, I am a minority on this forum. Most prefer Whipping

Tom

you're right tom... i'm always mispronouncing stuff:o that's why i say i'm going to "warsh up" or "brush my teefh":rolleyes:

slowhike
06-03-2007, 15:36
.You can see the end knots in the (hopefully) attached picture, taken last week in Aravaipa Canyon, AZ. ..

yaqui hiker... are you part of the arizona hiking group? i've never been there but used to read posts & check out a few pictures from others out that way (like hikingrl) from another group.
fascinating place! a hammocker would probably need to be more creative out there to keep off the ground though.
welcome to the group. ...tim

Yaqui Hiker
06-03-2007, 16:41
Slowhike,
Not sure what hiking group you are referring to, but I'm not a member, in any case. Do most of my hiking solo ultralight, mostly because I'm not a member of any group....(circular humor).

I've got a HH, and have used it in buggy places like the Boundary Waters in northern Minnesota, but here in AZ all the bugs crawl on the ground, so you don't usually need a net, and I prefer the open access you don't get with a HH. Mine's also lighter and a bit more compact, plus I have the satisfaction of using something I made myself.

Since a few members liked the background, I've attached a couple of other landscapes from Aravaipa Canyon--not hammock shots though. Sorry if it's too off topic. I'd throw in more, but I don't know how to post them to a web site---any suggestions, other than attachments?

slowhike
06-03-2007, 17:45
yep, i would rather not use a net either.
as beautiful as those places are, they try to keep us pretty tightly focused on hammocks here. other wise we would end up having to wade through a lot of other stuff to find what we wanted to find here... hammock info;)
if you have pictures stored somewhere like photobucket, a link to there should be fine.

rptinker
06-03-2007, 19:03
Welcome Boondock!:)
Nice to have you here. Dont you know that the word boondock originated from "bondok" a Filipino word for jungle or wilderness. Anyway, Im sure you love the outdoors as your username suggests.

The picture you posted looksnice and is very similar to my original method of whipping and tying the hammock ends (minus the tube). I've abandoned that method however because it ate up some precious inches off the hammock length. As of this moment my prefered method is a simple W gathering and whipping. A lark's head knot secures the hammock ends to the suspension rope and a drip line prevents rain water from running down my hammock. I find your method unique but bulky though. Does it really stop the rainwater from running into your hammock?:confused:

Boondock
06-03-2007, 21:03
Salamat rptinker, yes I did. The Tagalog word "bundok" came into the American lexicon after WW2 from US military personel. Its a rare example of a common slang word with Filipino origins.

In the US, the work boondock means - a remote, inaccessible place.

rptinker
06-04-2007, 19:22
Salamat rptinker, yes I did. The Tagalog word "bundok" came into the American lexicon after WW2 from US military personel. Its a rare example of a common slang word with Filipino origins.

In the US, the work boondock means - a remote, inaccessible place.

Nice to have you in the Forum Boondock!:D