View Full Version : ridgeline snapped
Hi
I've had my HH expedition for about three years, used it probably twenty/twenty five times. I weigh about 83 kg ( 180 lbs? ) so well within design limits for the HH exped. Put it up as usual yesterday, nice and taut, climbed in, ridgeline snapped. A split second waiting for my bum to make contact with the concrete below, but of course I didn't drop down very far. Spent the night with a sloppy mozzie net over my face, but otherwise no ill effects.
So, the question(s) is: Why should this happen? Has this happened to anyone else? Does it happen often? Is the ridgeline necessary structurally( I know it's a useful clothesline, makes the HH easier to set up, holds up mozzie net etc )? What strength cord should I use to replace the snapped item? Is it possible to access the attachment points for the ridgeline in order to replace it, or am I obliged to attach a new cord to the remains of the original ridgeline?
I would ask HH for a new hammock but for a three year old model I don't imagine it's going to work...
I haven't heard of that happening before. You could repair it with by adding a new ridgeline cord. Give hh a call or email. What could it hurt. Let us know what you find out.
GrizzlyAdams
07-08-2007, 15:58
Hi
I've had my HH expedition for about three years, used it probably twenty/twenty five times. I weigh about 83 kg ( 180 lbs? ) so well within design limits for the HH exped. Put it up as usual yesterday, nice and taut, climbed in, ridgeline snapped. A split second waiting for my bum to make contact with the concrete below, but of course I didn't drop down very far. Spent the night with a sloppy mozzie net over my face, but otherwise no ill effects.
Is it possible to access the attachment points for the ridgeline in order to replace it, or am I obliged to attach a new cord to the remains of the original ridgeline?
Some of us have cracked the HH knot cover for a look-see; at least two guys have made HH clones. I have a picture of the knot (http://www.hammockforums.net/gallery/files/4/2/3/knots-2.jpg), I think there are others in the gallery but aren't sure whose they are or how to find them.
I undid the knot in the course of swapping in a ring-buckle system, and tied in a new one (http://www.hammockforums.net/gallery/files/4/2/3/knots-4.jpg). The black cord you see photos is the ridgeline. There is a loop at each end, the loop is large enough so that the beginning of the loop is on the inside of the hammock, and the body of the loop passes through the folds. On the outside the loop is passed through the suspension cord, at the top of the wrapping knot.
If you are lucky, you can use the piece of ridgeline that passes through the folds to pull the end of a new ridgeline through.
Just understand the HH knot (some wraps, tied off with a bowline), and you're good to go, once you've got a new ridgeline made.
I'll leave it to others to comment on the type of cord you might use.
Grizz
Second everytign Grizz wrote.
You can easily replace the ridge line yourself. You could also call or email Hennessy to see what they offer.
If you decide to do it yourself, it is very easy once you get over the hesitation of working on an expensive piece of equipment.
The socks over the end of the hammock are simply secured with one of those plastic ties used to secure electrical cable, usually called a zip tie or something similar. Use a pair of diagonal cutters to cut the ties securing the socks on both ends of the hammock. The socks come right off. You will see the ends current ridge line coming out the top end of the hammock and then tied to the suspension rope. Simply loosen the suspension rope, you don't even really need to untie the knot, simply push the excess rope towards the ends of the broken ridge line. Once you have the suspension loose, but not untied, untie the ridge line ends and tie to the cord you are using for a replacement. and then grab the ends inside the hammock and pull the replacement through. Tie the new ridge line where the old ridge line was. On the other end of the hammock you will have to tie the new ridge line cord to the old cord inside the hammock and pull through from the inside to the end. Then tie the new.
Takes longer to describe and understand than to simply do it.
After you have the new ridge line installed, simply slide the socks back in place and secure with new zip ties.
I would recommend a cord with a raeing of at least 250 lbs to 300 lbs minimum.
I have started using the BPL dyneema (http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/aircore_pro_dyneema_spectra_guyline_cord_50_ft.htm l) guy line cord for all of my ridge lines. I have found it to work well.
FanaticFringer
07-08-2007, 17:50
I'm using this stuff for my ridgeline on my first homemade hammock. At $1.68 plus shipping for 12' and a rating of around 1200lbs, it's a pretty good deal:
www.reddenmarine.com/site/new-detail.cfm?id=AMRAMSTL764
cameronjreed
07-09-2007, 15:07
It couldn't hurt to ask Tom at HH about getting it repaired. They have good customer service...(At least I have been happy with it when ordering my hammock and asking several questions after my purchase)
C
I would say repair it yourself, only because who wants to wait or such a simple repair. I am sure HH will hook you up. Tom is really cool, but I think it would be a waste of your time and his time. It is real easy to fix oneself.
headchange4u
07-09-2007, 16:25
Some people cut the ridge line on the HH on purpose to be able to have a removable ridge line. I bet you could just tie some knots on each end of the break and use a biner to reconnect the ridge line. You wouldn't even have to mess with trying to rewhip the ridge line.
The ridgeline on my DIY hammock snapped just yesterday.
Does anyone know what strength cord HH uses. I'm thinking of upgrading to 2.8mm Spyderwire.
Thanks for the replies. I think i'm going to use this as an opportunity to replace the ridgeline with a carabiner-mounted version, clipped into the loops that are left from the original ridgeline, and maybe fit a bigger gearloft. I'll also be sending an email to HH to see if they have any ideas why it snapped.
2Questions
07-10-2007, 21:00
Another ridgeline bites the dust... HH Expedition...Lucky no one was in it...Just leaning on it. I think HH has a issue here with the strength of the ridgeline. We'll see what Tom has to say about it. I'm curious on how the length of the ridgeline is determined, too short = more stress on the ridgeline?? Stay tuned.
headchange4u
07-11-2007, 08:49
That's weird. I have never heard anything about HH ridge lines breaking and now there are 3 in a few days.
That's weird. I have never heard anything about HH ridge lines breaking and now there are 3 in a few days.
I wonder if jumping into the hammock more would add enough force to break them?
I wonder if jumping into the hammock more would add enough force to break them?One way to find out. :eek:
mine broke the second time i used it ..but it was mostly my fault...i was trying to use a cheap clip link to hang gear up in the head area...i think the abrasion from the link scored or cut my line...i made a field repair ..it held just fine... that was 2 yrs ago... from this i warned everyone that i know who have a HH to be certain what ever yo uare linking over your ridge line has no sharp edge..or anything that could abrade the line
warbonnetguy
07-13-2007, 23:30
what is the hh ridgeline material? is it nylon? i think i remembered it being a little stretchy, which would point to nylon,
i've got it somewhere, so i'll check and see, but its old and may be different now. anybody know?
headchange4u
07-14-2007, 07:58
I thought the ridge line was made from a Spectra-like line like the supports, only smaller diameter. I'm not really sure though.
FanaticFringer
07-14-2007, 15:17
I thought the ridge line was made from a Spectra-like line like the supports, only smaller diameter. I'm not really sure though.
That's what I'm thinking also....but not sure.
I thought the ridge line was made from a Spectra-like line like the supports, only smaller diameter. I'm not really sure though.
Definitely not spectra on my HH ULBA.
warbonnetguy
07-14-2007, 20:07
dug up my old one (about 5 years old), and it seems to be nylon. (cut it out and tested its stretch, lots of stretch, gotta be nylon)
Mine just snapped too... Lounging the backyard reading a book and POP!
Has anyone talked to Tom about this yet? what'd he say?
Thanks!
terceiro
09-15-2007, 18:43
I was playing with a ridgeline on my home-made TerceiroVisionSupraCloneMax and, just for kicks, intentionally cut my own ridgeline while laying in it. It was under a lot of pressure, but except for a jolt, nothing much happened.
Except for the surprise (and potential whip across the face) has anyone had any actual damage from their ridgeline breaking? Is it protecting the stretch in your bug net?
TiredFeet
09-15-2007, 18:54
I cut my ridgeline myself. After reading where others did that in order to detach the ridge line, I decided to cut mine.
I used one of these (http://www.giftsforprofessionals.com/92599936-k3032.html) separating key rings to reconnect the ridge line. Works great. I can disconnect and reconnect in a snap.
Haven't had any problems with it yet. Pretty light also.
I called Hennessy today after mine snapped but got Voicemail, left a message.
I'll let you know what they recommend as soon as I get the callback.
In the mean time, I ran down to the local marine supply shop and grabbed a length of some braided line they sold and retied my ridgeline.. I just tied to the loops formed in the original line for the time being, but I know that I'll always be wondering when the loops will fail again.
Frolicking Dino
09-16-2007, 06:19
The fellow from my church that bought one last year as his first hammock had a problem with his ridgeline breaking as well after less than a year of use (he camps maybe two weekends a month). I helped him replace his with an adjustable ridgeline. He is much happier with that.
He is seriously considering giving the HH to his son and going with a top-loader because he doesn't like the entry system and not being able to do away with the bugnet when he doesn't need it.
warbonnetguy
09-16-2007, 12:20
i can't imagine those breaking so often if they were indeed spectra.
MacEntyre
10-17-2007, 13:47
One thing will surely cause that line to break: chafe. A careful inspection should reveal whether that's the cause.
Looking at the picture provided earlier, that knot does have one place where it will chafe itself under load.
http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l257/MacEntyre/HHKnotChafe.jpg
ouachita hiker
02-29-2008, 10:59
Hello,
Ouachita Hiker here. I am new to the forums but this is a subject that I am well familiar with. About three years ago i bought two HH EX. Asyms. One for my wife and I. I strung one up and set down on, like a seat, and the ridge line broke. Bought it from REI and they replaced it. The second ones ridge line broke back in Nov. on a Bping trip. This time my wife was in it and the ridge line slaped her face and left a welp. I think the cause, at least in my case, was that they were strung up to taunt. I sent the second one back to REI and they gave me credit.
BillyBob58
02-29-2008, 13:43
On the two times that your ridgeline snapped:Were you using any kind of tightening devices, such as a hitch craft or cinch buckle, etc.? Or did you just hang the Hennessy hammock in the manufacturer's suggested method, using all of the stock tree huggers and rope and such?
[QUOTE=ouachita hiker;51484]Hello,
. This time my wife was in it and the ridge line slaped her face and left a welp.
What did you do with the puppy?
ouachita hiker
02-29-2008, 14:27
Both times the hammocks were hung to specs. The only thing that might have been done was that I had strung them up to tight. By a welp I ment a lump on the wifes head! It did give here a head ache!! In other words the ridge line that snapped back in Nov. My wife was in it at the time. It did go down some but not all of the way to the ground. She was not to happy about the situation!
Where are most of these breaks occuring?
I would like to "beef" my HH up. Are the breaks in the covered knot area or are they occuring on the visible part of the ridge line (between the end loops in the sleeping area).
I use 550 paracord for everything, do you think this would be a good replacement? It is fairly stretchy. I use it for the tarp with a cinch knot and stretch the snot out of it.
I also tend to like a tightly hung hammock. This is why I am curious about replacing my ridge line.
Why are people using a clip? What is the advantage to not having a ridge line?
angrysparrow
02-29-2008, 14:48
I use 550 paracord for everything, do you think this would be a good replacement? It is fairly stretchy. I use it for the tarp with a cinch knot and stretch the snot out of it.
Why are people using a clip? What is the advantage to not having a ridge line?
When you have a removable ridgeline in a HH, it is much easier to use it as a lounger/chair without the bugnet being in the way.
550 is not a suitable replacement for a ridgeline. The forces that are placed on a loaded structural ridgeline can far exceed 550's strength. Several people on the forum have had 550 break in this application. Also, a ridgeline should not 'stretch'. A suitable diameter of Spectra cord is a much better choice, because of it's strength/diameter and it's lack of stretch.
ouachita hiker
02-29-2008, 16:13
My ridgeline snaped, best as I can remember, the first one at the foot end inside near the knot, the second one in Nov. was at the head in also inside.
Hope this helps.
BillyBob58
03-01-2008, 00:03
post moved to "Dual RL thread" where it belongs, posted here in error.
Bugzee Malone
03-01-2008, 09:53
Reading this thread I see that there are 2 schools of thought on the ridgeline.
1 group views the ridgeline as a supporting member of the hammock system and therefore has a loading.
The other group views the ridgeline as something that holds the net off your face and gives you somewhere to hang stuff on.
Which is right? How much tension should be on the ridgeline?:confused:
beamarshall
03-01-2008, 11:06
I would break it down as: enough tension to pull the support line to an angle with the hammock, it is becoming structural; a ridgeline that has a bit of slack would be non-structural. HTH, Betsy
When you have a removable ridgeline in a HH, it is much easier to use it as a lounger/chair without the bugnet being in the way.
550 is not a suitable replacement for a ridgeline. The forces that are placed on a loaded structural ridgeline can far exceed 550's strength. Several people on the forum have had 550 break in this application. Also, a ridgeline should not 'stretch'. A suitable diameter of Spectra cord is a much better choice, because of it's strength/diameter and it's lack of stretch.
I agree, 550 cord is not a very good RL. I have used it in the past, several times in fact, and never had a break. I does stretch a lot tho. Like hang hammock, get in and in the morning your bum is touching the ground, a lot of stretch. I kept a 550 cord RL on one of my DIY hammocks for a year and never got a the stretch out of it. It wasn't until I read Youngbloods post about RL that I experimented a little and now I go without. Makes everything simpler anyway.
What ever happened with the HH ridgelines?
BillyBob58
03-01-2008, 13:34
What ever happened with the HH ridgelines?
Well, so far, my almost 2 year old one has not snapped. Even the time I clearly overtightened it using the hitchcraft device. But last night I cut it, attached enough (much thicker) cord to make up for cord used up adding bowline for the screw connectors. I connected HH RL cord to thicker cord with a double sheet bend. We will see how long things go without snapping after all of that.
( although, I may soon just replace the entire RL with some stronger spectra).
angrysparrow
03-01-2008, 19:43
Reading this thread I see that there are 2 schools of thought on the ridgeline.
That's because there are two distinct types of ridgelines. One is actually a structural part of the hammock suspension and affects the sag of the hammock, and the other is simply an accessory for holding up netting, hanging items, etc.
Bugzee Malone
03-01-2008, 21:32
Thanks for clearing that point up Angrysparrow. I didn't know there were 2 systems.
And now for dumb question #2:o
In a HH, is the ridgeline structual? Is that ridgeline spectra?
I am guessing not...
I have only once hung mine so tight that the RL was under tension.
I thought I might damage it so since then have always left it a little slack.
angrysparrow
03-01-2008, 21:50
In a HH, is the ridgeline structual?
Yes, it is. Note how that the ridgeline is permanently connected (knots) to the larger suspension cord, and is shorter than the fabric of the hammock itself. That means that when the suspension is loaded (strung with tautness), the ridgeline limits the stretch, so that the hammock body still has sag regardless of how tightly you pull the suspension. Thus the term 'structural ridgeline'.
Is that ridgeline spectra? I am guessing not...
I'm not entirely sure what the HH ridge cord is made from. There has been speculation that it may be a very thin type of spectra, but I cannot confirm that. Whatever it is made from, it does seem able to carry quite a bit of force. It does have a limit, though, as has been proven by a number of people on the forum having their ridgelines snap under load.
At any rate, even if there is a failure, it's really not difficult to replace the ridgeline with a stronger spectra cord.
I have only once hung mine so tight that the RL was under tension. I thought I might damage it so since then have always left it a little slack.
That's probably wise. If you are satisfied with the comfort of the hammock suspension when not loaded tightly, then there's no need to make it tighter.
I guess I am at high risk of snapping my ridge line. I like to tighten the snot out of the HH when I pitch it. I use the cinch knot and reef on it. I feel like I sleep more horizontal (when sleeping skewed asymmetrically) when I tighten it. What specific line has people used and was it adequate?
Thanks,
Lone Wolf
03-13-2008, 21:26
I broke mine after the 2nd time I used it.Operator error-grabbed it trying to reposition myself. I swapped it out very easily. there was loops at each end to thread the new line through. I added enough line to double back 1/2 way to the middle of the hammock with a loop on the ridgeline and a small biner on the piece the double back to the center. I added loops near the foot end and when I want to use the hammock as a lounger. I clip it to a loop closer to the foot end to loosen up the ridgeline. This makes the chair option of the hammock much more comfy. I have been using it this way for over 5yrs and prefer the option to adjust the tension of the ridge line. NOTE- I dont really back pack. My primary use is kayak camping or short distance backpack/scout camping. Weight is not a priority for me as it is for the LD backpacker.
mataharihiker
03-20-2008, 10:13
The Hennessy ridgeline is part of the hammock structure so I didn't mess with mine when I owned a Hennessy. That said, on my other hammocks I utilize a mesh pocket which clips to each end of the ridgeline using an elastic cord...this prevents over extension and stops the risk of the ridgeline pulling out the loops at either end to which it is attached.
http://inlinethumb13.webshots.com/7244/2377769320046140551S425x425Q85.jpg
That's a nice idea... I'm going to make one of those.
That's a nice idea... I'm going to make one of those.
Agreed! I've got some scraps that I will be making into one of these.
Wayne Kraft
04-04-2008, 16:03
The ridgeline on my HH Ultralight Asym broke after a couple of years' use. I was close to or slightly over the specified weight limit, used the tautest hang I could with the HH recommended knot system and, when it broke, I was in the hammock tugging on the ridge line to reposition myself. I figured the break was more or less my fault. I sent it back to HH and they fixed it for ten bucks plus shipping as I recall. I plan to avoid this problem in the future by losing some weight, not hanging the HH quite so tight and keeping my mitts off the ridgeline.
Jim Bowie
04-05-2008, 11:47
Or in this case, Jim's ridgeline.
I had just installed the cinch buckle suspension on my HH UL and really cranked on it. I've always done the same when using the stock huggers. I didn't understand at first why it seemed really tough to get into the hammock. As I tried to squeeze in, I saw the stock clips that were on the ridgeline on the ground.
I got in anyway and was squeezed like never before. Does the structural ridgeline mitigate hammock squeeze?
I was feeling pretty proud of myself, too, after my first major mod. Guess that'll teach me!
Edit for further clarification:
It looks as though the line snapped at one of the knots. Excuse my non-technical explanation, but my ridgeline appears to be in three parts: two ends that go through the whipping (and are looped through what was stock rope and was modified by me this morning thusly: http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/showpost.php?p=49465&postcount=4) and one piece that is knotted to both ends and runs the length of the hammock. It appears that the end is intact and it was the long piece that shredded at the knot.
My question now is this: what, in anyone's opinion, is my best option to reattach? would this be a could spot to put in a 'biner, and if so how?
Thanks in advance for the brilliant replies that are sure to follow!
GREEN THERAPY
04-05-2008, 13:06
With the failure rate of the ridge line as high as it seems shouldn't the patent read non structural ridge line and void the patent? Just an off the wall thought.:D
Youngblood
04-05-2008, 14:41
After you repair your ridgeline with some low stretch cord with a breaking strength of several hundred pounds, try tying it higher at a height that is proportional to the separation between the trees with some initial sag in the hammock suspension lines.
Often, it is the method of not tying the hammock initially high enough and putting some slack in the hammock suspension lines that contributes to the ridgeline failure. Tying the hammock lower, pulling the suspension lines taut and retightening as necessary to raise the hammock to the height you desire is putting more force on your hammock's suspension system. There are a few posts about that in this thread (http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/showthread.php?t=3017&highlight=structural+ridgeline) describing the additional forces created when you do that.
Wayne Kraft
04-05-2008, 23:30
Youngblood, in my case, at least, I doubt that hang height was an issue. I don't recall exactly how high I strung the HH when the ridgeline broke, but generally I like to string it as high as I can and still get into it. I usually have to push up on my toes to get my butt high enough to sit down into the hammock. On level ground this means the tree hugger webbing is at eye level or a little higher. I'm 68" tall.
twointheface
04-06-2008, 00:29
I just climbed in mine the first time after two weeks of no soda
298lbs on the button.......
The ridge line on mine was a tight as my g string on my bass!!
Thought for sure it was going to be a flop and drop but it held my fat ***
so i guees the rating system they use is working.
As i was playing "pride and joy" on my ridge line i was thinking i should find out how to replace it just in case .....
Youngblood
04-06-2008, 06:47
used the tautest hang I could with the HH recommended knot system
Youngblood, in my case, at least, I doubt that hang height was an issue. I don't recall exactly how high I strung the HH when the ridgeline broke, but generally I like to string it as high as I can and still get into it. I usually have to push up on my toes to get my butt high enough to sit down into the hammock. On level ground this means the tree hugger webbing is at eye level or a little higher. I'm 68" tall.
Wayne... the comment you made about using the tautest hang you could means you aren't hanging it high in the way I talk about hanging them high. The goal for how high the hammock itself ends up off the ground is the same, it is the supports that I talk about hanging higher up on the trees.
I mean that you tie the hammock off higher on the supports without the suspension taut... the without the suspension taut is key in all this. You initially have sag in the suspension, a good bit actually. When you do that there is not as much force on the hammock suspension when you initially get in the hammock and it doesn't drop as far from where you initial placed it. This technique is less stressful on everything involved, the hammock suspension, the ridgeline, the tree huggers, and the supports.
The ridgeline material that Hennessy uses right now is polyester but I can't speak for what was used years ago. It stretches a lot less than nylon so it works better in its structural role.
I think the most common cause of ridgeline breakage is being tied a lot more tightly then it needs to be. It really just needs to be tied tight enough that it doesn't droop.
BillyBob58
04-22-2008, 21:18
I have found that Youngblood's advice on this is excellent. My hammocks sag a bunch less sense I started tying up higher on the tree and not tightening so much. It seems I end up at about the same height, but with the tighter, straighter suspension and Ridge lines I get there after a lot of sag.
Ramblinrev
04-30-2008, 09:09
Reading about trying to reposition yourself by hanging on the ridgeline has somewhat spooked me because I have been concered about that. That got me to thinking, but before I do anything stupid I thought I would run it past others.
I am thinking of putting some haul ropes at the head end of my HH Safari. I thought of lashing them to the ridgeline but that seemed like it would defeat the purpose. I am not quite sure how to describe what I have in mind so I'll just give it a try. I have a large plastic button about 1.25" dia. I am planning to press that into the hammock from the outside and whip it off making a "knob" for lack of another word on the inside. (This is the idea behind the grommet-less guidelines on things like sil-nylon tarps if you follow the idea.) The haul line would then be tied to that knob and I can pull myself in easier... or so it would seem. There is substantial fullness of fabric at that point so I don't see the mod adding fabric stress.
Any feed back on this idea... either "go for it it might work".... "Been there done that... it works (or doesn't)" ... or "That's the dumbest idea I've ever read and here's why."
warbonnetguy
04-30-2008, 21:02
ever tried just reaching up in that same area and just grabbing some hammock fabric to pull on, thats what i do.
Ramblinrev
04-30-2008, 21:33
Yes I have done that. Just wasn't sure it was the best idea. But it makes sense and is certainly simpler.
Thanks.
mataharihiker
05-01-2008, 10:20
I used to grab the hammock material...I certainly wouldn't use the ridgeline...