Hammock Hiking and Bears :eek:

[Preacha Man]

So, besides the bear bags and bear containers. What is the best way to deal with a bear if one wanders into your campsite at night?

I have never had to deal with one yet. . . but I am going deeper into the woods soon, and we had a frost mid-spring that killed all our berries and nuts. Because of the lack of food I have heard reports of bears going places and doing things that they usually do not. Our bears are usually small black bears, but a bear is still a bear.

I have heard of people using whistles, lights, alarms, etc.., but what have ya'll encountered, tried, tested?

Thanks

P.S. I always use a lot of prayer :)

[angrysparrow]

I've never had a bear encouter in camp either, but this (http://www.the-ultralight-site.com/black-bears.html) seems like good knowledge to have.

[Preacha Man]

Wow Sparrow, that is an awesome page. I was always told to "play dead", but I never really wanted to. Thanks for the info.

[slowhike]

I've never had a bear encouter in camp either, but this (http://www.the-ultralight-site.com/black-bears.html) seems like good knowledge to have.

most of that seems to be accurate info, but i have to question at least a couple things, like the emphasis the writer (i didn't see the writer's name) put on black bears stalking people as food. i've only herd reference to that one time & that was what our friend billybob had read in a book. but i've never herd it discussed in listening & reading from those who study bear behavior.
i'm not saying that it couldn't in some remote cases be true, but i i'd like to hear a little more about it from the experts & how often that behavior has been documented.

and about bears having trouble running down hill.... those who research black bears will tell you that when a black bear needs to run down hill, it can still out run any human.

the thing is that people love to pass along what they have herd when it seems to confirm their own fears.

i'm in no way, shape, or from an expert on bear behavior, but i have tried to pay attention to what's being said & who's saying it over the years, & i'd much rather separate fact from fiction.
there's a very real need to know what to do & what not to do in bear country, but it's important to separate fact from fiction. when we do those two things, we can go into the woods & be at peace.

i've many times discouraged people from telling "ghost stories" around the camp fire because even though it can be fun to get the old adrenalin going, i'd much rather teach people to be realistic & not sit around at night wondering what might be lurking out there, or go to bed & have nightmares.

if i'm wrong about any of the things i say about the black bears of eastern north america, then i'll gladly admit it & correct my thinking, but i really hope we can find the best information available on our black bears & put to rest any unnecessary fears.
and of course we can discuss our different views w/o getting overly defensive & offensive i hope:rolleyes:

[FanaticFringer]

Wow Sparrow, that is an awesome page. I was always told to "play dead", but I never really wanted to. Thanks for the info.

You were told to "play dead"? Wow, never heard that one before.

[RockStar]

I ahve also heard to play dead but then, most people tell you to play dead for any animal attack around here. lol Funny Story:

For a friends B-day when I was younger, we all went to ride horses. My friends mom was a bit larger and was worried her horse would give out. In the middle of our trail ride we hear her yell "AHHHH" looked back and she was laying on the ground motionless. I turned my horse around and high tailed it back there assuming she had been knocked out by the fall or something. Everyone elses horse wouldn't budge, knowing that when it ended the trail it would be back in the barn with food and no human on its back. So while Im trying to get a response, her horse is just standing there. Finally she whispers "Is it gone?". I was confused and said "No, are you okay?". She replied "Yeah, it threw me off so I was playing dead in case it tried to attack me." BWAHAHAHAHAHA WHAT! She said she thought you were suppose to play dead so horses wouldn't attack. Attack horses!?! I love Alabama. *still laughing*

[angrysparrow]

most of that seems to be accurate info, but i have to question at least a couple things, like the emphasis the writer (i didn't see the writer's name) put on black bears stalking people as food. i've only herd reference to that one time & that was what our friend billybob had read in a book. but i've never herd it discussed in listening & reading from those who study bear behavior.
i'm not saying that it couldn't in some remote cases be true, but i i'd like to hear a little more about it from the experts & how often that behavior has been documented.

and about bears having trouble running down hill.... those who research black bears will tell you that when a black bear needs to run down hill, it can still out run any human.

I'm also not a bear behavior expert, and I posted the link above because I'd read it recently, and it seemed to be written from a common sense perspective. I can't vouch for the specific validity of any of the writer's views.


i'm in no way, shape, or from an expert on bear behavior, but i have tried to pay attention to what's being said & who's saying it over the years, & i'd much rather separate fact from fiction.
there's a very real need to know what to do & what not to do in bear country, but it's important to separate fact from fiction. when we do those two things, we can go into the woods & be at peace.

That's a good way to say it.

Here's another link (http://www.patc.net/resources/florafauna/bear_man.html) with some good information, IMO.

[Just Jeff]

You're supposed to play dead for brown bears...go fetal and cover your ears. Sometimes they'll bat you around for a while and walk away. But if they start eating you, fight back. If you fight a brown bear from the start, they won't back down and you're probably not gonna win.

Black bears are smaller and more timid, and will often run away if you make yourself appear bigger, louder, and more aggressive. That's why whistles work for them.

But you have to know how to tell the difference b/c some black bears have brown fur! It's really not hard for most folks b/c brown bears have a pretty small range in the US. The easiest way to tell is the big hump over the front shoulders on a brown bear.

I had a blackie come right next to my camp at Delaware Water Gap a while back. I just crawled out of my HH and heard a snarl...looked up and a big ole black bear was about 100' away. Poor guy had a hurt front paw...we were on the side of a steep ridge and he was going down, so he'd take a few steps, then sit back on his haunches and look around sniffing the air...looking right at me every time. I just stood there watching him. Then I realized that if he's hurt, he might not be eating well, and I drew a straight line between him and my food bag...and I was right in the middle of it! No worries, though...he went on down the ridge. Saw a mama with two cubs the day before, too.

Here's what works for me...know if you're in brown or black bear country. If you don't have brown bears, don't worry about it. I only hang my food when I'm in heavily used areas where the bears have come to associate people with food. Other than that, I don't worry about it.

Brown bear country is different...you should read up on details if you're going there.

If you're not sure if brown bears are in your area, learn how to identify bear poo. Black bear poo usually has berries and bits of fur in it, like from a rabbit. Brown bear poo has little bells in it and smells faintly of pepper spray.

[CoyoteWhips]

Playing dead is what you tell they guy you're hiking with. Gives you more time for running away.

I don't believe there is one recorded case in history of a bear attacking anybody in a hammock.

You know what'd be cool would be a pocket sized bundle that auto inflates into a 20-foot Macy's parade bear. Maybe with integrated compressed air horn. If you're threatened by a bear, just pull the string.

[RockStar]

lol thats cute! Then everyone would think hangers are crazy!

[slowhike]

Finally she whispers "Is it gone?". I was confused and said "No, are you okay?". She replied "Yeah, it threw me off so I was playing dead in case it tried to attack me." BWAHAHAHAHAHA WHAT! She said she thought you were suppose to play dead so horses wouldn't attack. Attack horses!?! I love Alabama. *still laughing*

now that's a classic<GGG>!!!

[slowhike]

.
You know what'd be cool would be a pocket sized bundle that auto inflates into a 20-foot Macy's parade bear. Maybe with integrated compressed air horn. If you're threatened by a bear, just pull the string.

now there ya go LOL. that ought to work<g>.

angrysparrow i liked that second article you linked. the over all tone was that in black bear only country, it's highly unlikely that you'll run into a serious problem w/ one... especially if you follow a few guide lines.
if i'm not mistaken, the only black bear attacks in the east involved either a bear that had learned to depend on careless food handling by people (like in the "Great Smokies Nat Park") or a bear w/ an abnormal physical or mental condition.

i like to relive fears by looking at the statistics (& i need to find a source to share here). but you're far less likely to be attacked by a bear in the eastern U.S. than you are to be struck by lightening. i'm pretty sure that way more people die from bee stings each year than snake bites... much less bear attacks.

on a recent two night stay in the mount rogers area, Va., i talked to a ranger about the blacks in that area. i had herd that they were there, but have never once seen one.
he said that actually there's a healthy population of black bears there... prime habitat w/ all the blue berry's, etc, but they have a healthy fear of humans... partly because of the hunting season each year.

[slowhike]

here are more links that some of you may want to take a look at.
http://www.bear.org/Black/Articles/How_Dangerous_are_Black_Bears.html
they do indeed talk about deaths by black bears in the last decade being predatory, but you have to look at the whole picture.

"But why approximately one black bear in 600,000 becomes a killer is a mystery. None of the killers had rabies. Some had common physical problems. There is no consistent explanation."

http://www.bear.org/Black/Articles/Watchable_Wildlife.html
Full-blown attacks by black bears are rare. Black bears attacks are usually not at campgrounds and are usually not by black bears that are familiar with people. The campground killings that have so widely publicized have been almost exclusively by grizzly bears. Recorded killings by black bears this century total only 28 across North America. Most of these killings were unprovoked acts of predation. How likely is a black bear to be a killer? The 500,000 black bears in North America kill fewer than one person per 3 years, on the average, despite hundreds of thousands of encounters. To put this in perspective, for each death from a black bear across North America, there are approximately 17 deaths from spiders, 25 deaths from snakes, 67 deaths from dogs, 150 deaths from tornadoes, 180 deaths from bees and wasps, 374 deaths from lightning, and 90,000 homicides in the United States alone (data from the National Center for Health Statistics, 1980-1983). In the rare event of one of these attacks, the best defense is to fight with fists, feet, rocks, or anything hard. Playing dead is usually not the best action with black bears.

[RockStar]

Hey, I'd be up for a cool scar and a good story. :D hehe I'd rather die by bear attack than sleeping in bed at 92. Ask me again post bear attack.

[slowhike]

Hey, I'd be up for a cool scar and a good story. :D hehe I'd rather die by bear attack than sleeping in bed at 92. Ask me again post bear attack.

well that would be a story to tell the grand kids<g>.

[Preacha Man]

Thanks guys! I was never really worried about it, but it is good info to know and have. I know that in Western Arkansas/Eastern Oklahoma there is a good population of Blacks, but all I have ever seen is traces (prints, poo, and clawed up trees). It would be kind of cool to see one at a distance, but I have no desire to just come across one :eek:

[TDunc]

.... Then everyone would think hangers are crazy!

WAIT!!!! Are we not?

[Otterkin]

I have grown up in Black Bear county and the only attacks I have every heard about of when some one gets between a sow and her cubs and even then if you back out slowly keeping your eye on them you will be fine. I have come face to face with bears many times and the only time they have not run was when one was eating a hunters kill that had been left. With that one I just gave it a wide berth and it never took a step away from its dinner. It comes down to being aware of what around you at all time and taking a couple extra steps to keep safe. (hanging your food, bear canisters) When walking in a known bear area I do make sure that I make noise (cup smacking BP frame, bells, off key singing) at those time I really ever see them.

[BillyBob58]

most of that seems to be accurate info, but i have to question at least a couple things, like the emphasis the writer (i didn't see the writer's name) put on black bears stalking people as food. i've only herd reference to that one time & that was what our friend billybob had read in a book. but i've never herd it discussed in listening & reading from those who study bear behavior.
i'm not saying that it couldn't in some remote cases be true, but i i'd like to hear a little more about it from the experts & how often that behavior has been documented.

Tim, I just saw it again somewhere on the web at a site about bears, but darn it, I can't remember where. I started to provide the link, but I decided I had said enough on the subject for a while. It was a knowlegeable site, and it seemed to emphasize the fact of black bear being relatively more likely to stalk a human for food compared to a Griz. I remember thinking "Aha, there it is again- another bear 'expert' saying the black bear is the one more likely to stalk a human for food!".

However, it seems somewhat obvious that the most recent events in the lower 48 that I am aware of (the lady on the trail in SNP as her husband fished in the creek, the lady with her children at the swimming hole in western NC, and the 11 year old dragged out of his tent/killed in Utah last month) were all black bears in predatory mode, killing people for food.

Also, I saw at least one site claiming the black bear was UNLIKELY to attack because of cubs, at least compared to Griz.

Preacha Man, do a search- there was a recent thread on this subject.

[BillyBob58]

http://www.bear.org/Black/Articles/Watchable_Wildlife.html
Full-blown attacks by black bears are rare. Black bears attacks are usually not at campgrounds and are usually not by black bears that are familiar with people. The campground killings that have so widely publicized have been almost exclusively by grizzly bears. Recorded killings by black bears this century total only 28 across North America. Most of these killings were unprovoked acts of predation. ..................................In the rare event of one of these attacks, the best defense is to fight with fists, feet, rocks, or anything hard. Playing dead is usually not the best action with black bears.

I think that pretty well confirms the idea that if a black bear drags you out of your tent or sneaks behind and follows you on the trail, you are intended for dinner, and that this is relatively more likely to happen with a black than with Griz. Hence the usual advice to play dead with a Griz attack, but to fight for your life with a black bear attack. Play dead and you are dinner.

Of course, if the Griz has you on the menu, it's all the same. But apparently the majority of Griz attacks are due to surprise or rage or cubs, and maybe not so wih black bears.

[Just Jeff]

Probably true. But I think a bigger reason is b/c blackies tend to be more timid and easier to scare away...yelling at them or blowing a whistle is often enough. Not so with a griz.

Either way, hammockers are in no greater danger than someone in a tent. It's very unlikely that any species of bear would bother a hammocker unless they've become habituated or you cooked near your hammock in griz country...JMHO. But then, if you look hard enough for a bogeyman, you can always find enough stats to convince yourself he's out there. :D

[BillyBob58]

I sometimes wonder about the usefulness of raw statistics. Take the statement from one of the links: You are 90,000 times more likely to be murdered" by another human than to be killed by a bear. That statement would seem to make it ridiculous to even give a second thought to bear safety in the woods. After all, what are the odds of any of us being murdered, and then it is 90,000 times LESS likely to be killed by a bear? Why even bother to take bear precautions with those kinds of odds?

But then one might ask: how many of the 300 million folks in the USA ( plus more in "North America") live, work or play within a short distance of another human capable of murder, near a human predator? I'd say that's most of us. Therefore, most of us lock our doors, or have security systems and/or have some form of self defence available. On the other hand, how many of us find out what part of the big city has a murder or assault every night, and then go to this place at midnight and walk around with gold and diamonds hanging off of us? Or if a pretty woman, go there and walk around with a lot of jewelry and very little clothing? Is there anybody here who would do such a thing and not give it a 2nd thought?

Conversely, how do those first numbers in the first part of the above paragraphs compare to the numbers of humans who walk alone in deep wilderness, among hungry animal predators nearby, people hiking with food on their back ( gold and diamond and mini-skirt human equivalent), without any means of self defence? I'd say the latter number is relatively quite small, while the first number is over 300 million. And if that's not bad enough for causing a flawed statistical comparison, of those who walk alone in the wilderness with bear attractant on their backs, most do so only for a few days a year, or a few weeks at the most. But when in "civilization" the rest of the year, these same hikers always go to sleep every night with a murderer or soon to be murderer/robber/rapist somewhere within a few miles of them. Somewhere in their county or city, depending on size and locale, somebody will be assaulted, raped or murdered. They will read about it in the newspaper.

So it seems to me, no wonder we are 90,000 times more likely to be murdered near home than killed by a bear! The average north American is probably 90,000 times more likely to be within striking distance of a murderer than a bear on any average day or hour. But not so when they go to sleep in the woods in bear country with the smell of food all around their camp. So I suspect such statistics give at least a somewhat false impression of relative danger. Although, I think I can easily agree that if I never go hiking deep into bear country alone ( just like the average American doesn't ), then I am probably even MORE than 90000 times more likely to be murdered while walking in my neighborhood or sitting in my recliner, like I am right now, than killed by a bear! In fact, if I never hike in bear country, the odds are probably almost infinitely greater of being killed by a human than a bear. Unless- have these statistics somehow been adjusted for these differences in proximity to the potential killer?

Here would be a good study: In the period during which records have been kept in North America, how many backpackers/hikers have been assaulted/murdered on the trail by a human compared to how many have been mauled/killed by a bear or other predator ( Mountain lion, etc?). That would be interesting figures to see.

That said, nothing has ever kept me from hiking deep into even mixed Griz/black bear country. Even all alone. And I have never even seen a bear unless I was on a back-country road in a vehicle. Though I have seen plenty of sign. But as for me, if the law allows, I USUALLY, but not always, take protection. Bear spray, magnum pistols or both, depending on if I'm alone or in a group. The odds may be against it, but I don't ever want to find myself or one of my friends/loved ones, in the jaws of a hungry or angry bear with only my fists for defence.

When that black bear walked out of the west NC woods a year or two back, and walked down to the swimming hole and mauled a woman and one of her children, killing and dragging off the other child ( 3 injured or killed in one attack), how wonderful it would have been had somebody very close by had been armed. Actually, I believe a policeman camper back at the campground came running towards the screaming, and shot at the bear from a distance with his pistol. The bear dropped the child and ran off, but it was too late. Dead child.

BTW, from that same link about odds that Slowhike kindly provided, there was this:
http://www.bear.org/Black/Articles/How_Dangerous_are_Black_Bears.html

A big revelation to me was how seldom mothers attack people in defense of cubs. Defense of cubs is primarily a grizzly bear trait. Seventy percent of grizzly-caused deaths are by mothers with cubs, but I don't know of anyone being killed by a black bear mother.............................If mother black bears with cubs are no problem, what's the story behind the killings and injuries we've heard about? I put these events into two categories – offensive attacks, which are very rare, and defensive actions, which are easily avoided.

Offensive attacks include all the killings by black bears. These are generally unprovoked, predatory attacks. Most victims were eaten. Offensive, predatory attacks have almost always been in remote areas where the bears had little or no previous contact with people. ( BB says: obviuosly not in the predatory NC swimming hole or SMNP woman on the trail incidents) Black bears that raid campgrounds or garbage cans are almost never involved. The rarity of the killings goes along with the non-confrontational, timid disposition that's been bred into black bears. But why approximately one black bear in 600,000 becomes a killer is a mystery. None of the killers had rabies. Some had common physical problems. There is no consistent explanation.

What can you do in the rare case of being attacked by a black bear? Fight back.

[slowhike]

if we actually had a way of knowing, one thing that would be interesting is to know how many people have come with in a certain closeness to a black bear but never had a problem, or never even knew it.
but i still feel safer (& believe i am) when in the woods were the black bears live than i was driving on the hwy to get there:)

[BillyBob58]

if we actually had a way of knowing, one thing that would be interesting is to know how many people have come with in a certain closeness to a black bear but never had a problem, or never even knew it.
but i still feel safer (& believe i am) when in the woods were the black bears live than i was driving on the hwy to get there:)


And Tim, you may well be!

[Preacha Man]

The reason I asked was because my hiking partner's (14 year old neighbor) mom asked him what we would do if we saw, or was attacked by a bear. I told him that it is very unlikely to happen, but his mother is very citified :). I told him what I knew (play dead/cover neck), but I knew that there had to be more to know. Researching on the net is -ok-, but most of you men/women have more wisdom on this subject from experience.

[slowhike]

And Tim, you may well be!

i wasn't talking about my driving skills:rolleyes:
i believe anyone w/ a decent knowledge of living in the woods, is safer there than on our hwys. ...tim

[Shadowmoss]

Tim's driving skills are probably ok, it's his skill at exiting the vehicle that needs working on...

sorry, had to say it :p

[BillyBob58]

i wasn't talking about my driving skills:rolleyes:
i believe anyone w/ a decent knowledge of living in the woods, is safer there than on our hwys. ...tim

That's just what I thought you meant. :)

[TDunc]

Tim's driving skills are probably ok, it's his skill at exiting the vehicle that needs working on...

sorry, had to say it :p

Ouch! That made my back hurt.:cool:

[slowhike]

Tim's driving skills are probably ok, it's his skill at exiting the vehicle that needs working on...

sorry, had to say it :p

yeah, you're right:o
i'm going to drive the work truck tomorrow & let some young whipper-snapper do the hard work.
but since i'm going to have to get up into the back of the truck to show him where stuff is, i'm thinking i better wear my hiking boots for better traction:eek:

[whitefoot_hp]

i saw my first black bear on the trail just a few weeks ago, a few miles north of neels gap. the thing didn't know i was there until i was like 10-15 yards away. He took off like a race horse, scaring the heck out of me in the process. My first reaction was just stand and wait until I didn't hear footsteps anymore. However, it took off to the right, and the mountainside was rather close, and there was a steep bluff restricting his options of getting away from me. I could still hear the bear as I walked on by, the thing was young, and it sounding like it was yelping/crying, which made me hope the mother wasn't around!

[BillyBob58]

i saw my first black bear on the trail just a few weeks ago, a few miles north of neels gap. the thing didn't know i was there until i was like 10-15 yards away. He took off like a race horse, scaring the heck out of me in the process. My first reaction was just stand and wait until I didn't hear footsteps anymore. However, it took off to the right, and the mountainside was rather close, and there was a steep bluff restricting his options of getting away from me. I could still hear the bear as I walked on by, the thing was young, and it sounding like it was yelping/crying, which made me hope the mother wasn't around!


I would have been worried about that Mom also. But apparently, I've learned only recently, black bears are not super quick to attack because of their cubs, just the opposite of Griz, who are very likely to attack if there is any possibility of threat to their cubs. Apparently cubs are involved in 70% of Griz attacks, but it is only rarely a factor in black bear attacks. At least that's what some "experts" are saying recently.

[neo]

our scout troop is going to jacks river falls next week end,they are worried about me hammocking in this area,:D they believe i will be safer in a tent,
i am gona hang in my hammock any way:cool: neo

[Preacha Man]

How in the world would a tent be safer than a hammock? You are traped in a stinkin uncomfortable tent. Like what a bear can't rip open a tent? hahahahahahahahaha people :D

[wamyteipen]

Hey, you know what they call a hanger in bear country?



A: A pinnata!

hehe

[FanaticFringer]

our scout troop is going to jacks river falls next week end,they are worried about me hammocking in this area,:D they believe i will be safer in a tent,
i am gona hang in my hammock any way:cool: neo

I've been wanting to get up that way and camp. Very nice area.

[Iafte]

If a bear swats at you in a tent, you have no where to run and have to try and get by the bear to get away.

If awake and a bear swats at you in your hammock, you can bail out the other side(or bottem if in a HH) and get a head start while he trys to get past the tarp and hammock.

If asleep and a bear swats at you in a hammock, you either swing and get minor cuts or the bear breaks the straps, then your so pissed you take the bear down with your survival knife.

[OUT-N-ABOUT]

i have come up on bearsand had them come within twentyfive yards of me.if they see and know you are their they most all the time will turn around and leave. also lokk bigger than what you are. this works also.

[Someday_Rn]

This story does not involve a hammock, but if it happens again I will be in a hammock because I have given up my tent for one.


I had a black bear encounter once when I was on a bicycle tour across Canada 11 years ago and I will never forget it. It was the first week of May and I was just outside of Huntsville Ontario at Arrowhead Park. The park was not due to open for a few days, and it was raining, cold and miserable, so I did not expect to see anyone. The bonus was that I had the park all to myself and would not have to pay to stay the night.

I initially thought that I would keep my food in my tent because I did not think that bears would be a problem. I later decided against it and hung my food panier from a tree, that was a few hundred meters away. After a quick dehydrated dinner and a few beers I retire to my tent because it was starting to rain hard and it was dark.

While I am looking at a map to decide the next days route I hear a sound outside, I think to myself, “the woods are alive I and it is only natural to have animals lurking around.” A minute or two later I hear what sounds like a big animal, so I think to myself, “must be a deer lurking around, no big deal”. Then I hear the animal blowing snot out of its nose, I know exactly what that means, the animal wants to get a good smell of me. No sooner do I realise that then I see the imprint of the head of a bear pushing in my tent wall. Now I was deathly afraid, I did not move an inch. I also remembered that I had a knife in my pocket that I had eaten dinner with and did not clean it. I figured that I was going to die. The funny part is it was the only time that I wished I was at work rather than being on a bike tour. I could hear the bear roaming around my site but I did not move.

It has been a while now and I have to urinate because I had had a few beers. So I piss in my water bottle. No problem, except I have to piss again and my bottles are full and I could still hear the bear lurking around, so I unzipped my tent one tooth at a time. It must have taken 10 minutes to unzip the tent far enough to get the mouth of the bottle out. When I started to pour the urine onto the ground I heard the bear stop moving all of the sudden.

The next thing I remember is that it was morning time and I was dead tired and very shaken. When I went to grab my food pannier from the tree I could see that the bear had found the spot and had scratched the tree, but had not got my food. I rode into Huntsville and got a room and slept the rest of the day.

I learned that no matter what hang your food and cooking stuff in a tree far away from your site, and when it is rainy smells seem to carry further, so cook far away from your site as well.

[BillyBob58]

Now that is one scary story! :eek:

[slowhike]

good story.
welcome to hammocking & HF. ...tim

[Someday_Rn]

Even though it happened a while ago I remember it like it was yesterday, except I am not nearly as scared.

Thank you for the welcome.

[eflat7]

Well here is my bear story. Not an encounter but very close.

I live in central NC, west of Ft. Bragg, in the Sandhills region. We have a lake in town with a 2.2 mile trail around it that I run nearly every day, as do many other people in town. We are not close to the mountains at all, and the eastern black bears in NC are at least 3 hours away. Well, until one morning last August.

Two local retired military guys were running around the lake as usual. About a mile (half way) into the run they rounded the big bend in the trail and there sat a 400 lb (estimated by the Wildlife Officer) black bear. Needless to say the guys were startled and didnt know what to do so they yelled and shook their arms and the bear ran away. They reported the incident and the wildlife officers managed to track the bear for about 5 miles across town and lost it. The very next week some people right on the edge of town got pictures of the bear on their motion sensing deer cameras. It was published in the local paper as was this story. Apparently wildlife officers knew there was a small bear population in the county I have lived for 32 years, even though I never had a clue, nor anyone else you could have asked in this town.

The moral of the story is be prepared and know what to do in case of an encounter. You never know when and where it could happen. I still had trouble believing it until I saw the pictures... then it kinda creeped me out.

I live on the border of wildlife property and always get the creeps now when i sleep in my yard. I know I will probably never see one, but just knowing they are out there scares the bejesus out of me.

I still run there but I always have it in the back of my mind :)

If you want to read about it, here ya go.

http://www.thepilot.com/stories/20070823/news/local/20070823Bear.html

[NCPatrick]

motion sensing deer cameras

Very interesting bhancock. It would be very scary to run up on a bear. I tend to run early in the morning (still very dark).

I've scared a few deer out of yards (and myself in the process) and narrowly avoided running over a family of skunks, and been barked at in too close proximity by a huge (in the dark all dogs are huge) not-friendly dog, but seeing the bear would be way over the top for me.

(Now I have that School House Rock adjective song in my head... "it was a hairy bear, it was a scary bear" -- about adjectives)

What purpose do the motion sensing deer cameras have? I find it fascinating that such a thing exists.

[Rapt]

The motion sensing deer cameras are for hunters to scope an area for deer activity without having to sit and stake it out 24/7...

Running (if you're quiet) will bring up on more animals than walking as it doesn't give them time to react either. So you end up face to face with lots of startled animals... :D

[stoikurt]

What purpose do the motion sensing deer cameras have? I find it fascinating that such a thing exists.

They just let you know what kind of deer activity you have around your feeder, usually just during the dark hours. Maybe you can see if you have a trophy buck visiting your food plot. I don't have any, but I know some who do.

[NYC_Hiker]

http://www.nps.gov/grsm/naturescience/black-bears.htm

below are some great bear stories and advice by a park ranger

http://www.smokiesinformation.org/f/updates/05e_podcasts.htm

[eflat7]

There are alot of hunters in my area. Almost every season a friend or two will have pictures from their deer cameras with Bobcats, huge deer, etc. Thats exactly what they use em for. Seeing how big of deers are eating around your plot. You know, feed em and shoot em.. that sounded bad. I dont hunt but have nothing against those who do.

[NYC_Hiker]

part 1
http://www.smokiesinformation.org/podcast/14_why_bears_follow_part.mp3

part 2

http://www.smokiesinformation.org/podcast/15_2nd_why_follow.mp3

[NCPatrick]

There are alot of hunters in my area. Almost every season a friend or two will have pictures from their deer cameras with Bobcats, huge deer, etc. Thats exactly what they use em for. Seeing how big of deers are eating around your plot. You know, feed em and shoot em.. that sounded bad. I dont hunt but have nothing against those who do.

They should invent motion sensing rifles to go with it and take care of everything all at once! Hunting from your own living room! :D

(Obligatory disclaimer - I'm not a hunter. This was not said to offend hunters, so don't take offense, if you do I'm sorry.)

[NCPatrick]

Sorry for the hijack. I'll shut up so this thread can remain about hiking and bears.

[nogods]

In the ADK eastern high peaks area bear resistent cannisters are mandatory. Getting caught without one can cost you $250. I'm also packing bear spray now.

When I was backpacking in Denali Park 30 years ago the rangers said to "make noise when you hike, run down hill if chased, and fight like hell if grabbed." They also said I was more likely to be stepped on my a moose while sleeping than bitten by a bear.

[Preacha Man]

In Northwest Arkansas we have a healthy black bear population, but I have never come across one. I have seen many tracks/signs, but this spring after several weeks of warm weather we had a freeze that killed all the acorns and berries. Now we have several animals that are looking everywhere for food. That is why I started this thread not just so that I could get information, but that we all can learn. I would Love to see one, very, very, very far away :D

[nogods]

I just saw a commercial for a "security light" - it is apparently a very focused and bright led flashlight - supposedly used by law enforcement - to temporarily blind an attacker. I wonder if it would work on bears?

Or how about a high pitched ear piercing painful whistle that only the bears can hear?

[NCPatrick]

I've also wondered (Chuck Norris related thread aside) whether martial arts, such as Kung Fu or Judo would work on them. Or maybe Feng Shui? :D

I'm sure Chuck could take care of any stupid Bear or charging Moose.

[stoikurt]

I suppose if you were fast enough you could get in a few licks. But the bear probably wouldn't even feel them.

[turkeyboy]

This summer I took a group of boy scouts to hike for four days in Shenandoah National park. I took a hammock that I borrowed from my brother. About 1/4 mile from our destination our first night I spotted a bear about 100 yards off(first one I've seen in the wild). I was so busy trying to get the other boys to see it that I didn't even think about taking a photo. Thankfully, the bear seemed pretty surprised to see us, and took off pretty quickly. Needless to say, we had no trouble convincing the boys to hang all their food stuff far away from camp.

That night I couldn't get that bear out of my mind. I knew he was around. Next thing I remember, I could feel my hammock swaying, and I was freaked out because I knew that bear was pawing at my suspension system. I froze stiff -- then I woke up to realize that there was a breeze causing my hammock to sway and I had only been dreaming. So, needless to say, my first night in a hammock was long, but I was sure glad I was dreaming when I thought a bear was tinkering with my hammock (and glad to say I actually saw a bearfrom a distance the day before -- something I'd always wanted to see).

[nogods]

There are lots of backpacking areas that require hikers to use a bear resistant canister because the bears have become experts at getting hanging food. Now I'm thinking that if a bear finds the canister and gets frustrated trying to open it then two things will happen: (1) it will be hungrier than it was before it started playing with the canister; and (2) it will look for something hanging from a rope hoping there is food inside based on its past experiences.

[ZDP-189]

NEVER eat in your hammock!

This weekend I came back from my morning hike to find a human in my hammock already tucking into my porridge. Here I am having words with him before kicking him out on his sorry arse.

http://l2i.org/goldilocks.jpg

[mataharihiker]

ah-h-h...bears...sigh, pain in the butt...usually some adolescent male wanders through our yard every couple of years...here's the one from last spring:
http://inlinethumb24.webshots.com/27351/2263106840046140551S425x425Q85.jpg (http://outdoors.webshots.com/photo/2263106840046140551lxGejz)

Then there was the idiot one a couple of years ago:

http://inlinethumb22.webshots.com/26325/1356774375046140551S425x425Q85.jpg (http://outdoors.webshots.com/photo/1356774375046140551SAvDmQ)

I was almost rundown by a bear as I was bicycling in the Seney Wildlife refuge in the U.P.(Micihigan)...

Then there was the one that tried to sneak 10 feet behind me in Canada's Lake Superior Provincial Park...

We won't even count all the grizzlies I've seen, thankfully from quite far away, in the West...

The reason I replied to this thread is I have experienced a bear in camp while I was in a hammock...this happened on the north shore of Lake Michigan where I solo camping in my Hennessy not far from the lake shore...I had just returned to the hammock after a pre-sunrise morning pee when I heard a noise and looked to my left...15 feet from me was a black bear...he was on all fours but quickly stood up to get a better look at me, I sighed, bounced and he ran...I then went back to sleep...

In the Great Northwoods, 90% of your black bear encounters are with young, adolescent males who have just been kicked out by their moms and, like most young, adolescent males, hooligans inordinately fond of playing with themselves...I've seen this in my yard....

[bmike]

(2) it will look for something hanging from a rope hoping there is food inside based on its past experiences.

you'll need the bear resistant sleeping tube then... solid can of ABS plastic with breathing holes and stainless steel fitttings. lets you sleep anywhere - but carrying it around is a real pain. can be doubled as a flotation device if you plug the holes. ;)

[kohburn]

momma and 2 cubs from Oct 20th along the AT in VA. we'd been dodging bear scat all afternoon so I was keeping an eye out and spotted them a mere 40' off the trail. of course i had a handful of gorp when we encountered them which i quickly downed.

[nogods]

neat picture. But I'll bet if she charged it wouldn't have been over food. did you walk past them or wait until they left?

[nickelanddime]

While I was doing my AT hike this summer between hiawasse and albert mtn. several of us camped a quarter mile short of the shelter down by a creek. It was really nice out so we had a little fire and several people just crashed in their bivies and I decided to ditch the tarp for some ventilation. I woke up at about three in the morning feeling someone pushing on the side of my hammock and then I really woke up because I should have been able to see somebodies head and there was a smell that reminded me of a dirty wet dog... all I had was my normal belt knife and all that kept going through my head was that my girlfriend was going to kill me.
After a few more nudges as it tried to rock me to sleep one of the guy's sleeping alfresco let out a long whistling fart with a sort of tremelo at the end,(I would have laughed except I was too scared) and the thing took off across the creek and went crashing up the hill on the otherside. That woke everybody up and so we checked out the tracks all around the camp and the snot marks on my hammock. I did feel a lot safer though knowing that thru hiker flatulence was enough to scare off a bear :)

[kohburn]

neat picture. But I'll bet if she charged it wouldn't have been over food. did you walk past them or wait until they left?

i looked around carefully and they were all on one side of the trail so we slowly walked by keeping an eye on them. There were 7 of us so that probably helped.

[Sasquatch]

Hey, I'd be up for a cool scar and a good story. :D hehe I'd rather die by bear attack than sleeping in bed at 92. .

I don't know depends on the age of the lady in my bed at the time.

Back on Subject...I do recall hearing about one hiker who got the trail name of Bearbag because of a bear coming into camp and checking his butt hanging down in the hammock like it was a foodbag sniffing at it I guess when he nudged the hiker and the hiker began to move it suprised the bear and it made a bit of noise and ran off. Now out west in griz country this would most likely have ended very diffrently.

I saw where someone was talking about the hump being a good way to tell black bear from brown bear. This can be tough and a bit to close for my comfort. they say that wearing little bells on shoe laces whill help alert bears to your presence. I also believe that scat is one of the best ways to tell the diffrence. In black bear scat you will often see the seeds of berries that the bear has eaten. In brown bear scat you will often see little bells.:)

[FanaticFringer]

While I was doing my AT hike this summer between hiawasse and albert mtn. several of us camped a quarter mile short of the shelter down by a creek. It was really nice out so we had a little fire and several people just crashed in their bivies and I decided to ditch the tarp for some ventilation. I woke up at about three in the morning feeling someone pushing on the side of my hammock and then I really woke up because I should have been able to see somebodies head and there was a smell that reminded me of a dirty wet dog... all I had was my normal belt knife and all that kept going through my head was that my girlfriend was going to kill me.
After a few more nudges as it tried to rock me to sleep one of the guy's sleeping alfresco let out a long whistling fart with a sort of tremelo at the end,(I would have laughed except I was too scared) and the thing took off across the creek and went crashing up the hill on the otherside. That woke everybody up and so we checked out the tracks all around the camp and the snot marks on my hammock. I did feel a lot safer though knowing that thru hiker flatulence was enough to scare off a bear :)

Been trying to figure out your Avatar....what is it?

[andre66]

A bear tag can be helpful when it is in season, if worse case scenario happens.
Andre

[nickelanddime]

To Fanatic Fringer, the avatar is a flying monkey(or a close stuffed representation of one)

I've been thinking about hammocks and animal related trouble that I've had camping and I've got to say the more I think about it the more positives I come up with beyond simply comfort...
no more mice chewing holes in my shoes and gear
no more praying that wild pigs will just ignore me when I'm in/around the smokies I just hang a little higher
no more picking ticks and slugs off my tent before packing up
no more trying to decide if it's a mock watersnake or a real pitviper curled up close to the body of my tent those cool spring nights beside streams
So in the end if I have to put up with the small probability of being nudged or worse in the middle of the night by a black bear it doesn't seem nearly so bad. Now if I could just remember to buy some earplugs so that my buddie's talking and yelling in his sleep doesn't wake me up I'd be doing great

[kohburn]

Now if I could just remember to buy some earplugs so that my buddie's talking and yelling in his sleep doesn't wake me up I'd be doing great

i had a friend in college who I could hear yelling in his sleep through the concrete wall. i started using a rubber mallet to wake him up.

[nickelanddime]

hmm, the rubber mallet has merit... oh wait, you were probably using it on the wall and not him... that changes things a little :)

[kohburn]

hmm, the rubber mallet has merit... oh wait, you were probably using it on the wall and not him... that changes things a little :)

i like to leave that part up to peoples imagination ;)

[Coffee]

Just checking in. I will have to say that I am going to try to be more bear cautious. I wouldn't say I had an encounter, but I definitly heard one moving throught the trees within ear shot of where I was hanging last night in SNP. Luckily it didn't come in for a closer look. Must of been my smell.

[nogods]

Here is a 7 min video on bear encounter techniques by a park ranger for glaicer natl park:

http://www.nps.gov/archive/glac/resources/bears.htm

[nogods]

I got this from a transcript of a PBS special on black bears:

according to data from the National Center for Health Statistics, for every person killed by a black bear in North America, 60 are killed by domestic dogs, 180 by bees, and 350 by lightning.

From now on i'm sleeping with my bear spray at home just in case my dog decides to attack!

[kohburn]

I got this from a transcript of a PBS special on black bears:

according to data from the National Center for Health Statistics, for every person killed by a black bear in North America, 60 are killed by domestic dogs, 180 by bees, and 350 by lightning.

From now on i'm sleeping with my bear spray at home just in case my dog decides to attack!

that doesn't factor in the attacks per encounter.

how many people encounter a dog every day without being attacked.

how many people see a bee without dieing

raw data usage like that is very misleading, and it gives people a false sense of security.

[nogods]

that doesn't factor in the attacks per encounter.

how many people encounter a dog every day without being attacked.

how many people see a bee without dieing

raw data usage like that is very misleading, and it gives people a false sense of security.

well...consider this...2.5 million people per year walk by the bear exhibit each year at the National Zoo....multiply that by the total number of zoos and that adds up to a lot of bear encounters.

Actually, if you read the statement carefully it does not compare the deaths by encounter. It merely alerts the reader to the fact that deaths by bear attack are not the leading cause of death by animal attacks. "leading cause of death" is based on raw numbers, not per capita.

[kohburn]

Actually, if you read the statement carefully it does not compare the deaths by encounter. It merely alerts the reader to the fact that deaths by bear attack are not the leading cause of death by animal attacks. "leading cause of death" is based on raw numbers, not per capita.

yes I read the statement, and that is WHY I said that raw data like that can be very misleading.


if more people die in car accidents than from attempted suicide every year does that mean that driving a car is more dangerous? no it just means that more people participated in one group than the other.

[tnoisaw]

I spent about twelve years in Alaska and did a lot of backpacking and never had a problem with bears. If they know you're there they try to be elsewhere.

[slowhike]

welcome to HF tnoisaw. same here w/ the bears. ...tim

[Troglodyte]

Ok I have to tell my bear stories, even though they don't involve hammocks or hiking.

My family helps with a summer camp every year in the mountains of NM. One year there had been a late freeze and wildfires during the spring and summer. That meant a lot of wildlife was displaced.

That year we had two bears in camp. One was a local bear that never caused trouble. The other was a displaced bear that kept coming into camp.

Long story short. I shot a charging bear with a rubber slug. It turned tail and we never saw him again.

Fast forward to two years ago. A sow and her cub had been causing grief in the area. We found them taking a nap in a tree on the edge of our encampment. Just by the archery range where the kids where about to come after rest time. We held the kids inside and "escorted" the bear out of the camp fence line. At the very end of our encounter the momma got pretty agitated and started to make some aggressive posturing. At that point I used my best teacher voice and told her to settle down, she needed to go on her way, and to stay away (all backed up with a 12ga with more than rubber slugs if she took exception to my request). We had us a stand off at about 30 yards. She went on. I began breathing again.

Now I've come across a bear or two in the wild and they generally exit the vacinity but in the case of a camp full of kids I had to be a little more aggressive. To my knowledge I have never had a bear in my campsite. We are very careful with cooking and smellables.

On my own I generally have a canister of bear spray and a magnum. Came closer to using one or both on some rotties that looked determine to eat our humble party last summer in AZ. Thankfully they didn't know they could jump that three foot fence.

I'll shave oz. somewhere else but I'm carrying that chunk of steel for protection from 2-legged or 4-legged. I may never need or I may not have time to draw it but I want to have the option if it presents itself.

If nothing else I can shoot my hiking buddy...that's the only way I'll out run him...:D

[pure_mahem]

Remind me not to go hiking with you! Just a warning if we ever do we'd both be limping to get away, LOL!

[Eron]

for a few more ounces than pepper spray. go with something that gives you a real chance:

MILLENNIUM PRO PT145 .45 ACP POLYMER PISTOL

http://www.taurususa.com/products/product-details.cfm?id=39&category=Pistol

i watched the park ranger talk about how great it is in most encounters that the bear moves away and the people move away. that's great and agree completely. my advice would be, draw the 45 and point it at the bear while making lots of noise and clapping while yelling 'here bear' over and over. if the bear moves away, great. if not, you'll be feeling a lot better than filling his mouth with seasoning.

[nogods]

guns, pepper spray - are you guys sissies? Try learning bear karate:

http://www.spike.com/video/2694540

[thepreacherswife]

Going back to the main reason of this post.... we kid around saying we are bear pinatas, but that is one experience we would never want anyone from this forum or anywhere else for that matter, ever to be a part of.

This thread has a lot of valuable information on how to stay safe in the woods, in a hammock, without being paranoid, or carrying any extra weight. If we take this information with us and aply it, there is no reason why we cannot be safe. I would love to see a bear (a long way away), and I would love to see that bear walk away from me. It is good to know though what to do if that bear does not walk away from you, and if it charges you.

Dwight (sorry, I thought I was logged in not my wife :D)

[pure_mahem]

Very funny! You practice that and I will observe! Note the position the camera man shoots from, lol!

[Coffee]

I heard a couple funny after the fact involving bears and hammocks this year. One involved a woman who hung at a campground just off the AT. She put her food in a car of someone camping close to her. Laying in her hammock she heard someone yell bear and felt it rub up against her hammock.

Another one is a second hand story I heard about a northbounder who woke up to a bear pawing at his hammock.

I think bears are used to seeing tents but might not always know what to think of hammocks. This is just a guess though.

Another funny animal story I heard is from a guy who was tenting with someone who was hammocking. The guy in the hammock set it up right in an animal trail. He woke up to a doe ramming him not knowing he was in the trail.

[nogods]

I've said this before but I'll repeat it here. Many wilderness areas now require that hikers carry food in bear reisitent canisters because bears, especially black bears, have become very adapt at obtaining food from hanging food sacks.

So now, I hang in my hammock and place my bear canister 150 feet away. The bear finds the canister and gets frustrated because it can smell the food but can't open the canister. Then it notices something just 150 away - a sack hanging from a tree - and it remembers how easy it was to get food from such a sack before bear canisters become mandatory - what do you think its next move will be?

[joec]

I was hanging near Double Springs Shelter last fall and set up camp near the edge of a pasture. I did not cook anything and all food was sealed away in zip lock bags. While reading just before dark I heard something and looked up to see a black bear on its hind legs (about 75 yards off) trying to figure out what I was. I clapped my hands once and nothing happened, I clapped twice rapidly and the bear took off. Need less to say, it was somewhat unnerving as it was almost dark and I wondered what had attracted him. I was up early and gone the next morning. I wonder if the edge of fields/pastures would be a more likely spot to have an encounter?

[pure_mahem]

Just a thought here.....a drug dog can smell drugs in a ziploc baggy. A bear has a sense of smell 10x that of a hound dog, He knows what you got!

[Preacha Man]

Just a thought here.....a drug dog can smell drugs in a ziploc baggy. A bear has a sense of smell 10x that of a hound dog, He knows what you got!

WOW :eek: , Maybe I need to make a pack cover that says "I have 5 kids, I'm too tough to eat" :D

That sure makes me want to be extra cautious with my food, and the food of those who hike with me. One time a boy from Sweeden was hiking with me, and he left a bag of cheetoes out with out me knowing. At 2am he bumped my hammock, but didn't say anything. Then he bumped it again and said barely whispering "I think there is a bear in my Cheetoes!!!!!". I got my e-lite, and prepared to run, I turned it on at the sound of the rustling bag. When the light hit it, the Cheetoe bag was jiggling all over the place, but nothing was around. Thank God not a bear!!!!!!. When we finally changed our shorts, we looked in the bag, and it was a mouse!!!!! I nearly killed a Sweed right then and there, and at 2am he was emptying his bag and walking to my bear bag.

[pure_mahem]

That would work fine as long as you know how to write in "Bear", LOL!

[dbchamber]

I was hanging at Fort Mountain State Park. I woke up at 7 am (still quite dark). I swung my feet out of the hammock and there was a bear about twenty feet away. I grabbed my camera and took a couple of pictures and then grabbed a stick and did my best Braveheart imitation. The bear retreated about ten feet and then stopped. I grabbed a couple of small stones and chased the bear away.

I passed the info on to the ranger and he said that they were aware of the bear. A mountain biker had come down a trail and come across the bear earlier in the week. the biker picked up her hear to loo bigger but the bear was unimpressed. The biker ended up riding back up the hill.

I always heard that you challenge a black bear and act submissive to grizzlies. Hopefully, this bear will look at a campsite and think - "Is there food or is there a madman in this camp???"

My food was in an Ursack inside the odor proof bag. The food was about seven feet from the bear and he was paying no attention to the food but appeared to be scoping out the campsite.

Dave C

[slowhike]

dave, that sounds about like what i might have done, chasing the bear away, but only after i had taken pictures<g>.
they need to be helped to keep their fear of people.
and welcome to HF. ...tim

[NoBucks]

I was also wondering about bears and hammocks.

In areas that bears frequent, where people hang food in the trees, it seems that they might get the wrong idea with a hammock.

Although, I've read that bears will sometimes treat tents like big bean bag chairs and lounge on them.

Otherwise, I've also read to mark your territory by relieving yourself at various points around the perimeter of the campsite.

[slowhike]

seems to me that more people have reported bears & other animals ignoring hammocks, paying little or no attention to them.
of course it'd be best not to smell like sardines<g>.

[Oms]

After a day of hiking I'm sure a bear can smell the difference between me and food :)

[Mule]

I love nature as much as anyone else, but I would suggest a 357 or 45 caliber handgun. I'm tires of being pushed around by the good for nothing overgrown raccoons. JMHO Mule

[fin]

I was also wondering about bears and hammocks.

In areas that bears frequent, where people hang food in the trees, it seems that they might get the wrong idea with a hammock.

Although, I've read that bears will sometimes treat tents like big bean bag chairs and lounge on them.

Otherwise, I've also read to mark your territory by relieving yourself at various points around the perimeter of the campsite.

If you keep food in your hammock, a bear might just get the idea that that big thing hanging in the tree is something tasty to eat, but as soon as you move, a black bear will GENERALLY run away. I emphasize the word generally.

I do make a habit of marking :) my territory when I'm in the woods, and I have only had one encounter where a bear walked through the camp. I do a lot of camping in the same places where people do a lot of black bear hunting, so I'm used to always having them around. I've heard stories from close friends that claim they've been treed by black bears while bow hunting, but I can't vouch for them.

I have jumped in a black bear den while a bear was sleeping in it once and never saw an animal move so fast. Bears can definitely move fine downhill as that is where that bear went, and it had no problem whatsoever. I've reached in another den and stroked the fur of a sleeping black bear in early November in Wisconsin while tracking a wounded deer. And I've encountered them enough times (+20) to know that if you make sure they know you are there and they can see or hear you while they are still far enough to not be startled, they will generally just amble away. Or if you know they are there and they are far enough away, you can scare the bejeezus out of them. I have chased a couple of black bears in my life, and haven't had one turn yet. I wouldn't try that out west, though. Grizz scares me silly. But black bears are generally wusses.

My favorite encounter was Deer season 8 years ago. I was still-hunting a switchback near a trout stream in Northern Wisconsin, and I heard something coming up the ridgeline through the small pines. I couldn't see what it was, so I slowly backed off the deer trail I was following about 20 steps, and put a pine stump between me and the trail. About 2 minutes later, a very large black bear crested the ridge, right on the trail I just stepped off. He got within 15 feet of the stump I was on, then turned and walked down the ridge slope and up the hill side facing me. Then he sat down. I walked over to the trail, and whistled at him, and he just turned and looked at me like he knew I was there the whole time. I jumped up and down, whistling and yelling at him, and he never moved, just looked at me like I was some kind of crazy man. I eventually just turned and continued on down the river. You just never know how an animal will react. This one could care less that I was there.

[slowhike]

.
I have jumped in a black bear den while a bear was sleeping in it once and never saw an animal move so fast. Bears can definitely move fine downhill as that is where that bear went, and it had no problem whatsoever. I've reached in another den and stroked the fur of a sleeping black bear in early November in Wisconsin while tracking a wounded deer.

did you jump in knowing they the bear was there?
and reached in & stroked it's fur:confused: ...wow... and i thought i was crazy for running my hand in a hole in the side of a creek bank turtle graveling:eek:

[fin]

Yeah, my Dad, my brother and I walked up on the den and saw the bear sleeping there. My dad is deathly afraid of bears, and I never learned his healthy respect of things with claws. I jumped in to show him there was nothing to be afraid of - that black bears are basically wusses.

It's not as crazy as it sounds, as the bear had enough space to get around me. If I would have been totally blocking him off, THAT would have been crazy! :eek:

Reaching in and stroking a sleeping bear isn't that scary either - the trick is to make sure they are sleeping. ;)

[turk]

Had my first experience, hanging in Polar Bear country. It was definitely something I truly underestimated. Was hounded to the 9th degree by Inuit police for not having brought firearms. They were convinced I must have a criminal record. (apparently no sane person, would fail to carry a gun, up there, without good reason) To add tension to the matter, 2 bears had to be exterminated in the last year within a 3km arc of where we intended to camp on nights 3 and 4. We struck a bargain with authorities, kept daily satellite phone communication, and kept meticulous tabs on our exact location. Getting a good nights sleep was very shaky the first few nights. But exhaustion and the comfort of our hammocks eventually won over.

We never saw any polar bear, nor signs of them in the area. And quite frankly, that suits me just fine. My most valuable lesson has been that my cooking habits, and general food hygiene are nowhere near up to acceptable standards for an active polar bear region. This is a situation I plan to give much thought and work on over the next year.

I have also been an anti-gun advocate for a very long time. My latest trip has completely humbled me on gun usage, and safety concerning polar bears. Nobody in the north jokes about them. And its not well enough to just carry a firearm. But it needs to be loaded, and within arms reach.... always.

On our return trip, while waiting for the train, we were treated to many stories from local hunters about being stalked by bears out on the ice, and other scary events from locals and veterans of polar bear country.

I have sworn to my wife to not go back up there without an appropriate firearm, the acquisition of which my wife and mother are campaigning for loudly. Of all the birthday presents you never expect to receive from your mother, I think a high powered rifle, ranks pretty high on that list :D

[fin]

Of all the birthday presents you never expect to receive from your mother, I think a high powered rifle, ranks pretty high on that list :D
A high powered bullet from the mother-in-law would be more likely.:D

[BillyBob58]

............ My most valuable lesson has been that my cooking habits, and general food hygiene are nowhere near up to acceptable standards for an active polar bear region. This is a situation I plan to give much thought and work on over the next year.

I have also been an anti-gun advocate for a very long time. My latest trip has completely humbled me on gun usage, and safety concerning polar bears. Nobody in the north jokes about them. And its not well enough to just carry a firearm. But it needs to be loaded, and within arms reach.... always............ Of all the birthday presents you never expect to receive from your mother, I think a high powered rifle, ranks pretty high on that list :D

I have no experience in Polar bear country, but I have quite a bit in Griz country. Where I find that the logistics of trying to be safe as far as cooking and storage of attractants can all become a bit overwhelming. And I can only figure it is probably worse in Polar bear country. It's all a tremendous PIA, but better than increasing your odds of becoming bear food. As you improve your skills, please tell us how you are handling this. The smell of cooked food on clothing, tarps or your body is a major problem for me.

And I don't hesitate to carry firearms, but what about bear spray? Any good for Polar bears?

I just saw a report on TV about 2 guys mauled by a Griz. They had bear spray but, for some reason, could not get to it. So one guy makes it up a tree, the other guy is being devoured. The guy in the tree in yelling at the bear and throwing pine cones or whatever at the bear, trying to get the bear to drop his buddy and come after him, safe in the tree. So the Griz climbs the tree, bites him a couple of times and knocks him out of the tree. The guy gets to a pack where the bear spray is while the Griz is coming down out of the tree. The bear then charges him again, he sprays the bear, who reverses direction mid-charge and runs off. Worked good that time.

This was all part of another report of a Griz climbing a tree. The other was 3 women, one climbs 30 feet up a tree with the bear after her. This gives the other two the diversion needed to run away and get help, assuming their friend was safe. When they returned with help, they found the Griz had climbed the tree and pulled their friend out of it, killing her.

As we all know, Griz are not supposed to climb trees, unlike their black cousins who practically live in trees. But this showed that if they are pissed off or hungry enough, they will.

But it also showed that the spray was effective, at least in this case, with a very angry Griz who already had the taste of blood in his mouth and who was way beyond the "bluff" charge stage.

[Coffee]

I watched a show on bears on national geographic and I am starting to develop a new respect for them. Seeing onerun over 25 mph in from of a van I was riding in last fall without stressing helped as well.

The show said dogs have a nose that is something like 300 times more developed than people, and bears are something like 100 times more than dogs. They have a huge nose chamber that is hard wired into their brains. I don't see how pepper spray would not work on them. I read and saw a bunch of reports of people using pepper spray on bears. It seemed to always work. Some reports say it stopped them in mid charge.

I hadn't used it yet. I do carry a small pepper spray for dogs now though.

I think concerning a gun you need to have a well placed shot to stop one. That wouldn't stop me from carrying one in polar bear country. Maybe that and pepper spray would be in order.

[Mule]

What are bears good for? Answer me that if you can.

[Preacha Man]

I started this thread because in Northwest Arkansas we had a freeze in mid spring that ruined all the berries and tree nuts. All the animals were without food. There was some talk around here that hikers needed to be more careful because the black bears would be more aggressive. Still to date I have never seen a bear in the wild. I have seen numerous tracks, and signs, but never a bear. Some swear by taking handguns, which I have, but I have never seen the need. Thank you guys for your great advice!!!!!

Being alert, and pure common sense I think are anyones best bet for being safe. I want to keep a healthy respect of bears (I do not plan to scare the fool out of them by jumping into their den :D ). It does make me feel better to know that "black bears are wusses :D ". Again thanks for all the great advice.

Dwight

[photomankc]

I do carry a handgun when hiking alone but that has more to do with two legged problems than bears so that is always there as a last resort. The thing is, for any bear you need something in a large heavy caliber to be effective which is the exact opposite of what you want for comfort's sake while backpacking so I have no delusion that the little 9mm I carry is some kind of super-duper bear zapper but it beats trying to poke it's eyes or punch it if it's on top of you.

Like others have said, in Black Bear territory I'd just stick to common sense and be ready to convince the bear that you are the [email protected]# of the woods if an encounter does happen. I've been in NW Arkansas in the OHT a bit and all I have ever run into were some great looking deer and annoying raccoons.

[Coffee]

I think that unless you hit it just right, you can empty a whole clip into a bear and do nothing more than make it madder. I'm not going to turn this into a pro or anti gun argument other than I have read some convincing research, don't ask for the link it has been awhile, that bear spray is a lot more effective than a gun in defending yourself from bears.

[red devil]

I think people are a bigger threat on the trail than bears are. That's probably what drives most of the handgun carry. There are also hunters who purposely hunt with pistols and apparently bring down game that I would not have expected. "Shooter's preference" so to speak.

[traviso71]

This is a topic that I am sorta torn on. I am a better safe than sorry guy, & I would rather have the spray/pistol & not need it, than need it & not have it. After Meredith Emerson went missing, I was leaning towards a pistola, buit didnt want to invest in one in the heat of the moment. After a couple months have passed, I am leaning towards getting a good bear spray. I am not so much worried about crossing bears on the trail, that has happened to me once. I am however, paranoid of waking up to one in the camp. So I figure I will sew a pocket into my rig that will hold the spray, for easy access when I rack out.

[TiredFeet]

I think people are a bigger threat on the trail than bears are. That's probably what drives most of the handgun carry. There are also hunters who purposely hunt with pistols and apparently bring down game that I would not have expected. "Shooter's preference" so to speak.

Whether a pistol will do any good depends on how much you practice with the pistol, how cool you can remain under very stressful conditions and what kind of bear you are dealing with.

If a Grizzly, a pistol will do you about as much good as a water pistol. I have read first person accounts of Grizzly attacks. In one, the guy was carrying a 44 magnum and knew very well how to use it. His partner was attacked, he put at least 4 or five shots into the bear and the only thing he accomplished was to make the Grizzly madder. Rangers later took down the bear with high powered rifles at a very safe distance. They found 5 44 magnum bullets in the bear. He apparently suffered no ill effects from the pistol bullets. Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.44_Magnum) states that the 44 magnum is
suitable for game up to the size of black bear.

Maybe the water pistol filled with bear repellent would have been better :rolleyes:

Black bears are something else and not as aggressive.

[red devil]

To place my opinion in context, there are no grizzlies in OR to my knowledge. I'm more concerned with people or even mountain lions. After a few years in the Army I'd imagine I'm fairly capable of retaining my calm and executing my training. YMMV. I've said before and will say again that I will never encourage someone on the fence to carry a firearm. It's a lot of commitment and work for extremely limited utility. There is a use not filled by chemical restraints for some though.

[TiredFeet]

To place my opinion in context, there are no grizzlies in OR to my knowledge. I'm more concerned with people or even mountain lions. After a few years in the Army I'd imagine I'm fairly capable of retaining my calm and executing my training. YMMV. I've said before and will say again that I will never encourage someone on the fence to carry a firearm. It's a lot of commitment and work for extremely limited utility. There is a use not filled by chemical restraints for some though.

red devil - I should have said that my reply wasn't aimed directly at you, but more to the forums community. It seems I see this topic coming up on many forums under different titles and just thought I would throw my $0.02 worth in.

Sorry if I wasn't clear about that and no offense meant.

[red devil]

Sure, none taken. I sincerely hope nobody has to use spray or anything else. Safe hiking.

[photomankc]

Sure, none taken. I sincerely hope nobody has to use spray or anything else. Safe hiking.

Amen to that!

I agree with what some prior posters mentioned too. Grizzly Bears are all together different and in that case shotgun slugs or large caliber rifles are really the only effective firearms. If you aren't packing that along with you then bear spray is a better option than any handgun you are going to want to carry. I'm not evangelizing either in bringing it up. It's a strictly personal thing and like all tools and gear choices it involves trade-offs but I really think handguns are of limited usefulness in dealing with large North American predators as they are intended to deal with dangerous human beings.

Take bear spray if bears and pack weight are your concerns.

[nogods]

What about a taser gun? I saw one on an infomercial - it shoots out several yards like the ones the cops use. I wonder if it would give a griz the jiggles.

Can't buy it my state though.

[TiredFeet]

What about a taser gun? I saw one on an infomercial - it shoots out several yards like the ones the cops use. I wonder if it would give a griz the jiggles.

Can't buy it my state though.

I've either heard or read that all their fur is a definite problem with using tasers.

[riverkeeper]

Preacher--

I am a ranger and have seen hundreds of bears and 'encountered!' about a dozen.

The basic rule is STAND YOUR GROUND in virtually every encounter.... except a charging female grizz with cubs.

HOWEVER if you left your food out with a habituated aggressive bear ... it may now be the bear's food....no longer yours....behave accordingly....common sense rules.

The best thing is to know what the heck you are doing ... forget all the bear scare books. GET 'Backcountry Bear Basics'

Bears, like dogs and other animals, evolved behaviors and communication techniques ... you do not know what they are and why ... some are humanly counter intuitive but make perfect sense in the context of bear world.

Yelling and banging pans usually work BUT

silent simple non aggressive BEAR TALK has always IMMEDIATELY worked in close encounters with the aggressive confident bears I've met.. it's in the book.... cure bearanoia ... get the book .. interesting, useful and fun read.

[angrysparrow]

... forget all the bear scare books. GET 'Backcountry Bear Basics'... get the book .. interesting, useful and fun read.

I found several copies on Amazon for $0.27 + shipping, so I splurged and bought a copy. ;)

[Greg Dunlap]

There are basically only 3 types bears to worry about. We all agree that mothers with cubs are automatically excluded. You mess with them and it does not matter if it's Bears, Wolves, Skunks, or mice, your going to lose.

Grizzly (Ursus arctos horribilis), Kodiak (Ursus arctos horribilis on steroids) and Polar (Albino Ursus arctos horribilis on steroids) the Grizzly is only found in the North West, and the other two are in the far North. I doubt if anyone on the AT or almost anywhere other than the area's mentioned, are going to encounter any of these carnivors.

Sure you leave your food out and you will get visitors, I've seen deer, racoons, squirrels, and jays attack food when I was not watching and bears are no different. You offer them an easy meal and they are going to take advantage of it. Practice safe camping and there will be no problems.

[Annie]

I keep seeing posts where people take whistles "to scare off bears."

I've never heard of this before.

Are there any known facts about using this method?

Seems to me, a whistle might make them more curious, thinking it's a wounded animal, or something similar?:confused:

That said, the only place I've seen bears up close have been in camping grounds like Sequoia where silly people feed them, or where they can find food in dumpsters. Back in the 50's my grandfather chased 3 different bears on 3 different occasions, out of our camp and up trees.
This may not work with a Griz, but those little black/brown bears don't want to tangle with humans and are more likely to run away unless you surprise them, in my experience.

[riverkeeper]

There are basically only 3 types bears to worry about. We all agree that mothers with cubs are automatically excluded.

Sorry but this is incorrect but is the common conventional wisdom ... not true with black bears.

Get 'BACKCOUNTRY BEAR BASICS'

[nogods]

There are basically only 3 types bears to worry about. ... Grizzly (Ursus arctos horribilis), Kodiak (Ursus arctos horribilis on steroids) and Polar (Albino Ursus arctos horribilis on steroids) .

I guess all those people attacked by black bears over the last 100 years must have been dreaming.

check this list:

List of Bear Attacks (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_bear_attacks_in_North_America_by_dec ade)

[riverkeeper]

I guess all those people attacked by black bears over the last 100 years must have been dreaming.[/URL]

Predatory BLACK bears normally during an unprovoked attack on people do so to EAT THEM unless they decide otherwise during the attack. There are at times terratorial disputes but you can defuse them as they occur using BEAR TALK and/or usually yelling hollering etc. Food screw ups can be a problem too of course.

Human habituated BLACK bears have their own set of problems which can also be defused using BEAR TALK, Spray, Bear Bangers ... what ever.

As a ranger I've worked with BLACK bear scientists in the field, darting cubs with mothers in the immediate vicinity. I've been charged to <20ft 3 times .. once by a large habituated male BLACK bear. Devil Bear -- used to be on the net..google) and 2 other times by predatory male BLACK bears.

Aside -- you can usually tell by the charge whether it is predatory or a terratorial-dominance thing. get the book. In any case your response to a BLACK is always the basically same --> STAND YOUR GROUND and employ noise, yelling and waving, spray ...etc to stop the charge. BEAR TALK has alway immediately cleared the area but sometimes I let'em hang around for a minute to get to know them and they get to know me...before I gently tell them to leave. I know you do not believe this SO -- get the book.

Spouse and friends who've seen this think I'm a BLACK bear whisperer and in fact compared to virtually everyone but the experts ... I am. I just understand because I have knowledge .. some of you understand and therefore can easly handle dogs....same deal but different.

The fact is the Hook and Bullet press has exagerated bear-info to the extent it is virtually useless. The parks understandably are providing info to you to keep the BLACK bears from becoming habituated and then a real menace and to provide legal cover in the event of a situation.

BTW -- if you play dead in the face of a charge by a truly predatory BLACK bear or Grizz, you MAY be on the menu.

I can do it but I will not tell you how to dominate and train a dog (all but attack dogs anyway) -- the book is too big. While the book would be smaller I can tell you how to dominate (NOT TRAIN)
BLACK bears during an encounter. But I do not need to ---get the soft cover book....about 120 pages of fun info.

The most dangerous information are things which you think are true but in fact are not.

The PNW coastal Native Americans thought the gods put bears on the earth to keep humans humble.

[Annie]

I googled Bear Talk and came up with nothing.
Is that the name of a book?

[nogods]

The most dangerous information are things which you think are true but in fact are not.

Uh..you failed to address the statistics Napolean

[slowhike]

I googled Bear Talk and came up with nothing.
Is that the name of a book?

i believe the book title was 'Backcountry Bear Basics'

[riverkeeper]

EXACTLY WHAT ARE THE MENTIONED '''BLACK BEAR""" STATISTICS AND WHAT DO THEY SAY....provide some detail and background. I am not going to chase your stats ... you gotta provide them and all relevant info. I gave my source and it is backed years of bear behavior research. We all know that some books and theories are sensationalized as the result of choking numbers till they confess to what you want to sell a book.

Sure BLACK bears have killed and mauled some but very few people.... find out why and how to avoid? (Dogs in the us killed about 30 and mauled thousands last year!!)

And I am no fool .. carry pepper(this ain't brains-in-a-can BTW) and in and near some salmon streams in AK a 44 mag with 300+gr 'bear rounds'....and they ain't brains in a bullet.

BACK COUNTRY BEAR BASICS used to be 10-12 bucks and I do not personally know the author.

MY TERM for the slow non threatening movement that tells the bear I am the big kahuna is what I call BEAR TALK -- associated with that is overt postures demonstrating NO FEAR as BLACK BEARS exhibit exhibit confidence and superiority as bears do. I also know how to avoid showing anxiety as bears do. BTW -- the human tendency during a confrontation is to look directly at and face the bear or other people ... WRONG...this demonstrates in bear world either interest or fear or both. They are not human.

By now in this thread I could've explained the whole thing but am glad I did not, because I hope I've piqued your interest in these magnificent creatures which few understand.

Now for you flat earthist and geo-centrics who wish to retain your beliefs and delusions... be my guest. The information I briefly summarized has been understood by BLACK BEAR scientists for almost 2 decades but does not sell scare books.

Galielo

(The fallacy of the geo-centric solar system BTW was know by scientists for 10+ yrs or so before G)

[nogods]

I posted a link with that lists bear attacks by decade - including date and location and type of bear. If you looked at the link you would see that black bear attacks outnumber attacks by "brown" bears (which include grizzly, kodiack and brown together). Those are specific facts and figures. Do you have any to back up your statements?

[angrysparrow]

Now for you flat earthist and geo-centrics who wish to retain your beliefs and delusions... be my guest.

There's no need to be petulant or to use such a condescending manner. This forum is populated by many educated people who are MORE than capable of understanding reason and statistics.

I don't think you've 'piqued anyone's interest', aside from creating aggravation by your refusal to fully engage the topic.


....provide some detail and background. I am not going to chase your stats ... you gotta provide them and all relevant info.

Funny, that. A link to statistics was provided, but you refuse to address that info. It seems like you are the one who hasn't substantiated your statements.

I, for one, am getting the book you recommend. I will give it a read with an open mind. Perhaps you could use that same sort of open-mind in future replies before this thread devolves further?

[6 feet over]

Why are bears scarier at night? (It’s all in our heads)

On guns: I’ve never understood the anti-gun philosophy. A gun is merely a tool. Screw drivers are no good when you need a hammer, and bells are no help when you need a gun. Bear spray beats nothing, but when I had my last bear encounter, my first thought was to grab my camera, but I was happy I was cradling my rifle. For most (not all) bear encounters, just the sound of a round being fired will scare them off.


I posted a link with that lists bear attacks by decade - including date and location and type of bear. If you looked at the link you would see that black bear attacks outnumber attacks by "brown" bears (which include grizzly, kodiack and brown together). Those are specific facts and figures. Do you have any to back up your statements?

It seems riverkeeper attempted to provide a source of bear information that would make us all safer. Perhaps his terse reply had something to do with the unexpected antagonism he received. His ‘back up’ was his personal experience, which we are all entitled to accept or reject as we see fit.

Your bear statistics, while true, have the same flaw (as has been pointed out) many statistics have. Grizzly, Kodiak, and brown bears do not have the same total range as black bears. The odds of encountering a black bear are FAR higher in the USA than the other species, simply due to their being available to encounter in more of our states.

TTS

[BillyBob58]

Interesting discussion. Just going by nothing more than the nightly news, I can think of several examples in recent years of black bears killing and/or consuming humans just here in the SE US. And more if we include the west. Like the 11 year old snatched out of his tent by a Black Bear and dragged a few hundred yards and killed, within the last year, in Utah. Most of these are reported in the link NoGods provided.

But I always feel that statistics comparing numbers of dog attacks or murders to deaths by bear attack are possibly very misleading. Relatively very few people hike deep in wilderness, with food on their backs, where they will come into close contact with a large hungry predator. The percentage of the population doing this every day of the year is minuscule. I dare say that set of circumstances will not apply to 98 or 99% of the population on any given day. So naturally, there should be very few bear or lion attacks.

OTOH, what % of the population is in contact with dogs, or are in the same vicinity as violent criminals and other potential murderers, on any given day? No doubt, thousands ( millions?) of times as many people fall into this category on most days as the number of people who are deep in the woods, with food om their backs or in a tree near their beds and who also come within smelling distance of a hungry bear, or who startle a bear on the trail.

So I'm not sure that showing that many times more people are attacked by dogs than bears in any given year really tells us anything useful. Not without being able to adjust for frequency of contact.

[Coffee]

Bears are scarier at night because they are not naturally nocturnal. Only the ones that are using people as a source of food are active at night. They learn that is the time when people are sleeping and their food is easier to get.

[lurch]

I keep hearing how bears in heavilly used areas are getting to be experts at identifying and pulling down bear bags. Kinda makes you wonder what a large nylon sack hung low between two trees with a tasty smelling hammocker insider looks like to a bear, eh?

[Incacamper]

Bears are at more places then you think they are. I have met a ranger in Paulding county here in Georgia while fishing in a WMA here. He said that they have known of a bear population living in the rolling hills of the Paulding WMA near the yorkville area. This is about a 2 hour drive away from the N. Georgia mtns. where you typically think of black bears being. It is very remote though, and I could definitely see Black bears living there undisturbed. Only about 5 minutes away from my house a young black bear was found near 278, wandering around beside the road. I think animal control trapped him and moved him to wherever they thought he was originally from. And this is only about a 40 minute drive west of the heart of atlanta.

Also, one time I was hiking up a new trail built on Pine mountain right beside Allatoona lake, it over looks the lake. I got to the summit and was taking in the view and a man and his son walk up. I greeted them and we started talking. Turns out that the guy is a police officer who is in charge of search and Rescue for the Cartersville police force and they often are on the mountains around allatoona, scouting, finding best ways to get places, etc... sounds like a fun job.
Any how, he said that they have run into bear numerous times up there. There is a small population up there also, but you would never know it.

[koaloha05]

I've developed a bit of bear anxiety over the past couple decades. Reinforced by encounters and a bad event that occurred locally. The bad event was a kid on a group camping trip being pulled out of his tent by a black bear. The bear had the kid by his head. Rumors were he had food inside of his tent.

Many years ago while on a solo backpacking trip (Manitou River - George H. Crosby State Park) up along the Minnesota shoreline of Lake Superior it was me vs. bear. Even though I cooked and ate ~50feet from my tent site, stripped down to my baselayer before hitting the sack the bear showed up. I guess because he couldn't reach the pack he decided to check out the tent. A small tree between the bear, a baseball bat size branch and lots of yelling (screaming in fear) was enough to move the bear on.

I live in a rural area that has a very high black bear population. Multiple encounters while hiking, trail running, mtn biking and even sitting on my deck or working in the garden has not decreased my bear anxiety level. It's actually getting worse based on my impression that the blacks are become more and more acclimated to humans. Neighbor is a retired DNR Warden. He like most the people up here recommend fighting back when attacked by a black bear. It worked for me and for the kid. His Dad or another adult basically pounded on the bear with whatever until the bear let go.

[tight-wad]

At the checkout line in Academy sports today, next to the mace and pepper spray was a small canister "Screech" device, or something like that. Said high pitched sound would drive away attackers, including dogs, and summon help.

Would this be any good against bears? If so, it might work further than arms' length away, GOOD!, and you would not have to be a sure shot marksman, GOOD!

[BillyBob58]

Many years ago while on a solo backpacking trip (Manitou River - George H. Crosby State Park) up along the Minnesota shoreline of Lake Superior it was me vs. bear. Even though I cooked and ate ~50feet from my tent site, stripped down to my baselayer before hitting the sack the bear showed up. I guess because he couldn't reach the pack he decided to check out the tent. A small tree between the bear, a baseball bat size branch and lots of yelling (screaming in fear) was enough to move the bear on. ..........

Yep, it's probably good you fought back rather than just laying there. A black bear leaving the food bag in the tree and coming to an obviously occupied tent was definitely not a good sign, IMO. A firearm or pepper spray would have been mighty comforting to me if I were in that situation. Or even a real metal baseball bat or a very large combat knife. Anything other than just my fists, would be nice.

[Linus]

After you read the books and practicing bear talk-a good tactical shotgun with 3" magnum is not that heavy, packs neatly into a pack with riffle sleeve built in, and will quickly end the talking arguement with the bear decidedly in your favor.

Hate to half to shoot it if I don't have to but I think my wife and kids would prefer me coming home over the bear.

and then again......

[Train Wreck]

After you read the books and practicing bear talk-a good tactical shotgun with 3" magnum is not that heavy, packs neatly into a pack with riffle sleeve built in, and will quickly end the talking arguement with the bear decidedly in your favor.

Hate to half to shoot it if I don't have to but I think my wife and kids would prefer me coming home over the bear.

and then again......

A shotgun? Maybe on a day or weekend hike... but on the AT you may as well be the guy who hiked with a tuba.

I have had absolutely no problem with bears. I've seen them and whipped out my camera and they see me and start running away.

As a precaution I urinate on everything in the campsite, and sometimes I bear-bag.

I think bears are one of the most overly talked about topics on the AT. It's more likely that you would die from exhaustion, dehydration, or hypothermia than getting attacked by a bear.

Besides, going out in a bear fight is a cool story to tell all the warriors in Valhalla.

[fin]

After you read the books and practicing bear talk-a good tactical shotgun with 3" magnum is not that heavy, packs neatly into a pack with riffle sleeve built in, and will quickly end the talking arguement with the bear decidedly in your favor.

Hate to half to shoot it if I don't have to but I think my wife and kids would prefer me coming home over the bear.

and then again......

Welcome to the forums, Linus. Good to have another WI hanger.

Just don't let the WI DNR find out if you shoot one - you'll be living in your hammock by the time they get done with you, if they don't take that away as well! It might be preferable to not come home.

[koaloha05]

One of the Apostle Islands has been closed to human visitors due black bears finding easy eating at campgrounds. With increase bear-human contacts and bears being relatively intelligent creatures they seem to have figured out campgrounds = humans = food source. Another good reason for hanging in a hammock way far from "established" campgrounds.

When it comes to black bear IMO a passive aggressive attitude is the best way to deal with a bear encounter. Backing away slowly has usually worked. If necessary present an aggressive posture (big stick and loud angry shouts) and let the bear have what it wants (food bag, pack...). If Remington ever came out with a 870 that was 1/10th the weight and a shorter barrel was legal it would be a nice optional item to pack. But that won't every happen.

[nogods]

We have a bear in the high peaks area of the Adirondacks that has figured out how to open the new two-tabbed bear vault lids.

It turns the lid until it stops at the first tab and then bites into the lid at the location of the tab to break it. Then it turns the top again until it the second tab stops the lid and bites into the loction of the second tab to break it. Then it unscrews the lid and has itself a nice snack.

Bear vault has put out a warning about using its products in the area where this bear roams.

Pictures and story HERE (http://www.hikeadks.com/index.php?option=com_fireboard&Itemid=47&func=view&catid=7&id=1806#1806)

[Preacha Man]

Wow, even with a bear vault your stuff is not safe there. I am glad that here in Arkansas we only have small black bears, and I have never seen one. I have seen their tracks on the trail, but never have seen one. I always use a bear bag, but I have had kids leave cheetoes in their pack, and a mouse get in the cheetoes (BTW: a mouse can sound like a bear messing with a bag of chips at 3:00am :) ). Thanks for passing on the news about the cannisters in those areas.

Dwight

[LostCause]

About 10 years ago, I was on a road trip from CA to MI and had stopped in CO on the way back. We found a campsite right as it was getting dark and used my friend's truck headlights to finish setting up the tent. We didn't eat or cook anything. We just lit up the lantern and started getting our stuff ready for sleep. We had the lantern inside the tent while we set up our bags. I moved it right outside the tent when we were done and I climbed out to turn it off. I heard movement by a tree to my left. I looked over while my eyes adjusted from lantern light to to the lack thereof, and I saw what appeared to be a small bear coming towards our tent. I quickly zipped up the tent and tried to tell my friend what I saw, but the shock and fear kept my mouth from making any noise.
I quickly racked my brain on what to do in a bear-encounter-situation. I came up with "make lots of noise". I couldn't speak. I did the next best thing, I started clapping loudly.

My friend had no idea what was going on, only that I was sitting across the tent from him hopping up and down, clapping rapidly. (I still chuckle a bit when I think about it.) He thought I had lost it. Finally, I was able to vocalize "bear" and I stopped clapping. He told me I was nuts, imagined the whole thing and to go to sleep.

The next morning we were able to check out the site we had picked in the daylight. All the trees around our tent had long scratch marks on them. Evidently, the bears come through there often. I have no idea what kind of bear it was.

After experiencing this, I will most definitely get myself some pepper spray just in case. I remember in this thread that someone carries a gun because of two-legged threats more so than the four legged kind. Makes me wonder what kind of experiences they have had to warrant it.

But to keep on topic, what has been suggested is: buy the book, get some pepper spray, get a whistle, and possibly a gun. Are there any other options?

And what would be better? A bear canister or bear bagging?

[Ramblinrev]

Bear bagging is getting harder and harder to do effectively. So much so that some places rewquire cannisters. I have gone to an ursack (www.ursack.com) which I like very much. It is easier to deal with than the traditional bear bag. But then I don't usually camp in the restricted areas which require cannisters.

However it seems even cannisters are no longer safe from some of our more sophisticated ursine companions. From what I have heard, the best tactical response in an encounter is dependant on the species of the bear. Everything from make noise to back away to stand your ground to kiss your butt goodbye have been given lots of press. I have not had an encounter with one around here although they are here.

[BillyBob58]

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2008/08/12/father_son_injured_in_tenn_bear_attack/



* Home /
* News /
* Nation

The Associated Press
8-year-old boy mauled by bear in Smoky Mountains
Email|Print|Single Page| Text size – +
August 12, 2008

GATLINBURG, Tenn.—Officials at the Great Smoky Mountains National Park say a black bear mauled an 8-year-old Florida boy and the boy's father was injured while defending him.

Park rangers later killed a bear matching the description of the one in the attack.

Park spokesman Bob Miller says the bear approached Evan Pala of Boca Raton, Fla., while he was playing in a creek at about 7:30 p.m. Monday. Miller says the bear attacked the boy, was driven off and came back a second time.

Miller says the father was able to chase the bear away with rocks and sticks.

The boy suffered some puncture wounds that were serious but not believed to be life-threatening. The father, John Pala, suffered several cuts during the attack.

------

Information from: The Knoxville News Sentinel, http://www.knoxnews.com

This reminds me of the child that was killed a few years back at a swimming hole in NC, and the woman killed stream side in the Smokies while her husbamd was fishing in the stream. At least this one did not end tragically.

[TDunc]

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2008/08/12/father_son_injured_in_tenn_bear_attack/


GATLINBURG, Tenn.—Officials at the Great Smoky Mountains National Park say a black bear mauled an 8-year-old Florida boy and the boy's father was injured while defending him.

Park rangers later killed a bear matching the description of the one in the attack.

...

Really sad that this happened..

But I am puzzeled a little. How do you describe a bear so that it can be identified. Four legs, brownish black, two eyes.......... It would be very difficult for me unless it has some rather unique marking.

[Preacha Man]

I have always wondered how they describe bears too, it kinda reminds me of that movie The Great Outdoors :D.

Dwight

[NCPatrick]

"We hiked along without care.
Then we ran into a bear.
He was a hairy bear,
He was a scary bear,
We beat a hasty retreat from his lair.
And described him with adjectives (http://www.postdiluvian.org/~gilly/Schoolhouse_Rock/HTML/grammar/adjective.html)."

[oldsoldier]

Admittedly, I didnt read through every single post. That being said, I am going to comment on the first page, and the article linked there. First & foremost, bears have no issues running uphill, downhill, side hill, anywhere. You running away will only trigger its instinct to chase you. And, it will in all liklihood win that race.
Second, Black bears are found along the Appalachians. Brown bears are are found exclusively in the Rockies, and west. There arent any on the east coast. They are dealt with differently. Black bears, when deliberately attacking a human, is trying to kill it, and it is in your best interest to fight back. Additionally, they are ROUGHLY the same weight as an adult human male, making the fight a little more even. As opposed to a 400 lb bear that will have its way with you.
Black bears also have better eyesight than browns. Browns will often charge just to see what you are. A black bear usually doesnt bluff. If its charging, get the hell out of the way.
The person that said "if its eating you, fight back", hit it right on the head. There is a difference between a bear whacking you around, to ensure you arent a threat, and one that thinks you are tasty. Fight back for your life, cuz thats exactly whats on the line.
A few years back, I recall reading an article on bear attacks in the US. It stated that, in bear attacks, a black bear is more likely to kill you for food than a grizzly is. This is likely due to more human-bear interaction. Their bottom line was that, if a black bear attacks you, your far better off to fight than play possum. After all, possums are on a black bear's menu ;)

[Mule]

I asked a question a while back on this thread which no one cared to answer. I don't blame anyone for not answering the question: What are bears good for? It isn't an easy answer, but I am a pragmatist. I don't buy this philosophical thinking that the wilderness out to be wild just because it IS. I think we should respect the wild but when it is threatening human beings, I say open season on the little burgers. (Big Burgers). I see no difference between a raccoon and a bear when it comes to usefulness.
Yes you heard right. I think they are useless, but they are there. If it were open season on them, all the problems would dissolve pretty quick. Even if all you used were rubber bullets like Rangers do for Grizzlys in Glacier NP, it would quickly deter the bear from harassing humans. No matter how stupid the human is in his dealings with bear, the more idiotic thing to do is nothing. I am outraged at the way some of our national parks have protected the bear and turned him into problem that doesn't have to be there as such.
Shoot them every time we see them and they would end up wilder than they are now in places like Yosemite.
That's all I have to say about that.

[angrysparrow]

What are bears good for?

What are people good for?

[Preacha Man]

What are people good for?

Sleepin in hammocks :D

[rigidpsycho]

heard about this on a local radio station yesterday and just found this video of a woman whoo was attacked by a bear and survived. http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2008/08/02/sots.bear.attack.victim.kabc?123

[BillyBob58]

I asked a question a while back on this thread which no one cared to answer. I don't blame anyone for not answering the question: What are bears good for? It isn't an easy answer, but I am a pragmatist. I don't buy this philosophical thinking that the wilderness out to be wild just because it IS. I think we should respect the wild but when it is threatening human beings, I say open season on the little burgers. (Big Burgers). I see no difference between a raccoon and a bear when it comes to usefulness.
Yes you heard right. I think they are useless, but they are there. If it were open season on them, all the problems would dissolve pretty quick. Even if all you used were rubber bullets like Rangers do for Grizzlys in Glacier NP, it would quickly deter the bear from harassing humans. No matter how stupid the human is in his dealings with bear, the more idiotic thing to do is nothing. I am outraged at the way some of our national parks have protected the bear and turned him into problem that doesn't have to be there as such.
Shoot them every time we see them and they would end up wilder than they are now in places like Yosemite.
That's all I have to say about that.

I kid you not, I had this happen to me about 10 or 15 years back. Right in Smoky Mountain National Park. At one of the developed campgrounds, in the park but just outside of Cherokee.

We were just settling down to supper, as were many other people in the nearby vicinity, when a Ranger starts going through all of the campgrounds saying "the bear is coming -- everybody put their food up -- get your food in the vehicles or into campers".

Now can you imagine that? I thought that was about the craziest danged thing I ever heard. If there was a bear in the vicinity of the developed campgrounds, why wouldn't you shoot that bear with rubber bullets or spray it with pepper spray? Or trap it and haul it off somewhere? Could you be asking for more of a tragedy than the one you might get my allowing a bear to have the run of developed campgrounds -- with children close by?

Personally, I just think that will is really stupid. Bad for the bear and bad for the people. And this is how the Smoky Mountain National Park federal government employee Rangers ( supposedly professionals who have to deal with bears) were "managing" the campground and the wildlife. Maybe it was just one really unusual (to be polite) Ranger, with some weird ideas, but I suspect it was just normal policy for the park itself. Although, things certainly could have changed since then -- that was in the early 90s or possibly even a little further back.

I never did see the bear. But later that night our 14 year old son- in a near by tent( right next to us) by himself- heard some noise and looked out and saw a bear walk by very close. Scared him almost to death.

[amac]

Ok, I will apologize upfront if this has already been asked and answered (this thread is pretty long). Am wondering if there is any validity to the idea of urinating on trees around camp, marking ones territory. Does anyone know if this is a wives-tale?

[Doctari]

I may be WAY OFF!

But as most time I don't hang (well, try not to) anywhere near established campsites, & my theory is bears know where the food (established campsites, shelters) is, I'm mostly safe from them.

However, the term "Bear pinata" do come to mind every now & then. :scared:

[Buckeyebuck]

I may be WAY OFF!

But as most time I don't hang (well, try not to) anywhere near established campsites, & my theory is bears know where the food (established campsites, shelters) is, I'm mostly safe from them.

However, the term "Bear pinata" do come to mind every now & then. :scared:

I always try and hang between two other hammocks. I have a theory that the bears will go for one of the outside hammocks first . . . . ;)

[JaxHiker]

I really think avoiding established sites is key. While hiking the Ocala Natl Forest last month we didn't see any bears until we got back to the established sites. Coming out of the bathroom there was about a 6' tall black bear next to our site. Of course there was a dumpster across the road.

It scared the bejeezus out of two of the guys I was with. They both slept in their cars. We three hangers just climbed in our hammocks. :D I listened to my MP3 player. If I can't hear them they're not there.

Don't worry, though, tents aren't much better.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v386/fotomonkey/Bears_Like_Tents.jpg

[Peter_pan]

Ok, I will apologize upfront if this has already been asked and answered (this thread is pretty long). Am wondering if there is any validity to the idea of urinating on trees around camp, marking ones territory. Does anyone know if this is a wives-tale?

Hmmmm, you are aware that the deer will show up all through the night to lick the salt from your urine markings.... That can keep you aware until you learn to ignore it....

And then there was the time in the SNP that Smee and I jumped a 250 pound black bear that was chowing down on a dead deer 5 feet off the AT...

Hey, your in the woods.... so are the animals.... urination has issues beyound not hitting your ground sleeping buddies tent...outcomes are hard to predict.... lot of old Threads about bears over on WB...Check em out...and always remember with any animal YMMV...:eek:

Pan

[blprophoto]

Play Dead for a brown but if a black decides to take you on fight for you life with anything you can put in your hands. Most blacks will bluff charge you stand your ground and wave your arms make your self bigger then you are, DO NOT RUN the instinct the of the Bear is to chase.
We used to spend a lot of time in BC over the years and we have been bluffed Charged on two occasions and have had many wonder into the camp Thank god I have never been Charged by a Brown They usally do not bluff charge

[larry1947]

I carry bear pepper spray and a Glock 10mm for backup when camping...

[FanaticFringer]

And then there was the time in the SNP that Smee and I jumped a 250 pound black bear that was chowing down on a dead deer 5 feet off the AT...


You both jumped on a 250lb. bear? I like you guys even more now.:lol:

[slowhike]

You both jumped on a 250lb. bear? I like you guys even more now.:lol:

Aw that was nothin... together, they had him out weighed:laugh:

[randyg45]

Excellent thread. I'm an ex-paratrooper, an ex-cop, and I've collected the occasional (human) bounty. I've been hunting alone since I turned 12 years old in rural WV some 45 years ago. I took my first week-long solo hiking trip when I was 15. When my eldest daughter was 14 we did over 100 miles, unsupported, in Yellowstone NP. I've hiked alone, without support or resupply, from Jackson Wy to Lander, Wy. I not only hike deep in bear country, alone, but I fish a lot and eat fish a lot. The smell is hard to get rid of....
I have strong opinions about bears, hiking, and firearms.
First, I carry both a gun and bear spray. The gun is a NAA Black Widow in 22 Magnum. It- like at least virtually all handguns- is useless against grizzlies. With solid copper bullets the penetration is adequate for the skull of a black bear, though, and I keep solids in it while sleeping, just in case. I keep other ammo for different purposes. I keep snake shot in it while hiking, and have been known to kill/poach the occasional grouse, rabbit or snake. I carry hollowpoints in it if I have to hitchhike back to my vehicle. I'm from WV; I have a CCW; odds are I'm gonna carry a little sumpin-sumpin.
But the best defense by far against wild animals is oleo resin capsicum. I have never read or heard a credible account that held bear spray to be less than %100 effective against anything with eyeballs (this specifically includes crackheads and bears). You spray it, it's blind. Also, it evidently disrupts the olfactory glands of a predator as much as it does its eyesight. Bears get, I'm told, at least as much information from their noses as from their eyes, so they may well find this more disconcerting than blindness.
BUT like all weapons, it has limitations. Range isn't ordinarily an issue- but wind direction is. If the stuff blows back on you, you have blinded yourself. This may not make much of a difference with a predatory black bear, btw, since he will almost certainly attack from downwind. However, just as wind may be an issue, using bear spray in an enclosed area certainly is. You would almost never want to use it inside a carr, for example.
But I don't want to use it inside a tent, either. Which is why I think the safest way for a man alone to sleep is out in the absolute open- no tent, no tarp, preferably not even any mosquito netting. I sleep on my side. Before I go to sleep I wrap my ace bandage around my chest, outside my clothing, and velcro my bear spray to it (I have adhesive-backed velcro permanently attatched to the spray. I carry a strip of double-sided velcro which I latch under the ace bandage). It may sound awkward, but it's actually completely out of the way. And always there. Veterans will recognize this as being prepared to "fight your position".
If you can't sleep outside, a hammock with the tarp and netting spread way out surely beats totally enclosed singlewall tents. Need the mosquito netting zipped up? I've considered small swimming goggles, and may carry a pair if I go to Glacier alone.
Of course I mark my territory at night. If a bear gets as much info from urine as some people seem to think, it can learn I'm 6'3", 250#, armed and dangerous. If the bear decides to attack anyway.... well, I warned him :thumbup:

[*HangMan*]

Why are bears scarier at night? (It’s all in our heads)

On guns: I’ve never understood the anti-gun philosophy. A gun is merely a tool. Screw drivers are no good when you need a hammer, and bells are no help when you need a gun. Bear spray beats nothing, but when I had my last bear encounter, my first thought was to grab my camera, but I was happy I was cradling my rifle. For most (not all) bear encounters, just the sound of a round being fired will scare them off.


As an Ex-cop, I agree almost completely. A gun is a tool and not a weapon. Firing a random shot to scare it off, I disagree.What goes up, must come down and if you are firing at the horizontal, someone could get hurt. My grandfather who camped out alot in Canada taught me to carry firecrackers for bears and firearm for safety. I carry a firearm (mini 9) and it stays in my pack. Darn shame when you run into hikers that you have to be more concerned with moreso than a bear.

Oh, and please don't try to taze a bear. :D

[JaxHiker]

Don't taze me, bro!

[nogods]

Sooner or later some scientist is going to discover a smell that bears just hate.

For example, if you ever have a puppy that likes to eat its own turds, then they make a powder you can put on the turds and it taste so bad to the puppy it will never attempt to eat another one. Now what could possibly taste worse than a puppy turd? I don't know but they found it.

We need those same scientist to find a smell that bears hate so much they won't go near it.

[FanaticFringer]

Sooner or later some scientist is going to discover a smell that bears just hate.

For example, if you ever have a puppy that likes to eat its own turds, then they make a powder you can put on the turds and it taste so bad to the puppy it will never attempt to eat another one. Now what could possibly taste worse than a puppy turd? I don't know but they found it.

We need those same scientist to find a smell that bears hate so much they won't go near it.

Powdered bear turds of course.:lol:

[Greg H]

There are two points I did not see mentioned after 17 pages of this thread. One is that two rocks when banged together can also make a good noise if your whistle is not handy.

The second concerns hanging your food in a tree: If you are camped near water, hang your food further into the bush by at least 30 yards. If a bear does explore your stash at least it won't be trapped between you and the water if you awake and try to scare it away.

P.S. After years of throwing a rope over a branch to hang the food, with my wife pushing the pack up with a paddle while I hauled on the rope - we learned to first throw up a small block and tackle, lowering the b&t to thread another line through it before hauling the b&t up toward the branch (and tying off). Then when it was time to haul up the food (and the toothpaste!) it was easy.

[Cobaltblu]

So, besides the bear bags and bear containers. What is the best way to deal with a bear if one wanders into your campsite at night?

I have never had to deal with one yet. . . but I am going deeper into the woods soon, and we had a frost mid-spring that killed all our berries and nuts. Because of the lack of food I have heard reports of bears going places and doing things that they usually do not. Our bears are usually small black bears, but a bear is still a bear.

I have heard of people using whistles, lights, alarms, etc.., but what have ya'll encountered, tried, tested?

Thanks

P.S. I always use a lot of prayer :)

I live in upstate NY and am just south of the Adirondack park which is 6 million acres of wilderness. There are black bear which primarily are in the High Peaks Region. Out of all the bear species black bear are probably the least dangerous and least aggressive. As far as I know and have experienced black bear do NOT view humans themselves as a food source but over time will learn to rummage through campsites for food and even visually identify bear bags and learn to attack the ropes holding the bags in the air.

I would make lots of noise by whatever means you can such as banging pots, flashing lights, yelling and so on to make the bear aware that a human is in the area because most bears are naturally afraid of humans.

If the bear is in the campsite because you left a candy bar in your tent or a half-eaten plate of beef stew next to your sleeping bag I would throw the food as far away as possible and try to slowly back away from the campsite until the bear leaves while facing the bear so it doesn't get the idea it can run up behind you. Walk and don't run because if you run you may trigger the bear's instinct to chase prey.

If you are really worried about bears wandering through camp you can setup a tripwire air horn which consists of an air horn or noise device on a tensioned wire between trees and if anything walks into it the noise goes off. There are also portable electric fences which can be set up (they are used to keep horses in a grazing area but can keep wandering bears at bay also).

While it may be true that you are more likely to be murdered by a person in your life than killed by a bear...if you put yourself in an area populated by bears and likewise put yourself in an area populated by humans you are more likely to be murdered by the bear!

I ordered my first real camping hammock, a Clark NX-200 last night and I hope the bears don't mistake it for a horizontal bear bag, lol. I doubt they will because I won't keep food in it but I can just see the newspaper headlines now.

EDIT: On a side note I found this survival ball suit which potentially you could wear and hit the inflate button if attacked by a bear
http://theyesmen.org/agribusiness/halliburton/about/history.html

Regards,

CB

[Cannibal]

I saw a guy chase a fairly aggressive Black Bear out of a shelter with a "SureFire" flashlight...at dusk. People were throwing rocks, blowing whistles, and yelling but it only took the light about 5 seconds to make him go away.

The bear had been stealing food from hanging bear bags (poorly hung) for about a week, then started challenging hikers in the shelter. He's probably dead now. :(

[fin]

http://www.hammockforums.net/gallery/files/9/0/6/bear_attack_thumb.jpg (http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/%5Burl=http://www.hammockforums.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=4492&c=10%5D%5Bimg%5Dhttp://www.hammockforums.net/gallery/files/9/0/6/bear_attack_thumb.jpg%5B/img%5D%5B/url%5D)

[koaloha05]

We have a relatively high population of black bear up here. Generally the black bear are not aggressive. More curious than dangerous. Spring seems to be the season for bear-human conflict. Have yet to meet up with a nasty black bear. Bears and I have scared each other with a few unexpected close encounters on the trail. Have not even seen a bear after clipping on bear bells to me while hiking or trail running. Only once have I had a bear situation at my campsite(ground dwelling days). At camp I don't ever cook or eat under the tarp. Try not to cook or eat close to where I hang. No bear problems.

What scares me more than bear are mtn. lions/cougars that have been more and more sited up here.

Simple and I think effective bear bells are couple SMC/slingrings clipped to a biner attached to you or your pack. Same rings you can then use for a Garda/ring set up.

[FanaticFringer]

I saw a guy chase a fairly aggressive Black Bear out of a shelter with a "SureFire" flashlight...at dusk. People were throwing rocks, blowing whistles, and yelling but it only took the light about 5 seconds to make him go away.

The bear had been stealing food from hanging bear bags (poorly hung) for about a week, then started challenging hikers in the shelter. He's probably dead now. :(

The SureFire is on my need to buy list for sure. It's a great non-lethal tool to have. They have cheaper models but this is their best I believe.
Causes temporary nightvision blindness when shined in a bad guys eyes (always know your target) Also great for scanning your car in a questionable parking lot before you get in. Chasing off bears is a big bonus.:D Very pricey but well worth it IMO. Said to be around 6 times more powerful than a typical D battery flashlight and super small and lightweight.

http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-E2DL-LED-DEFENDER-SUREFIRE-FLASHLIGHT_W0QQitemZ270305447927QQcmdZViewItemQQpt ZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item270305447927&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C 240%3A1307%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50

[Cannibal]

The SureFire is on my need to buy list for sure.

Shhhh. I bought this one (http://www.surefire.com/E2DL) to put in my Xmas stocking. ;)

Just noticed it's the same one you posted.

[-leftfield-]

so i didnt read all the other posts in the 18 page discussion, but ill tell you what, when it comes to humans, remove one sense, and we get confused, remove a second, and we are pretty much useless. so i would say a really bright light (ie surefire) and a whistle might work. i was successful at removing a bear from my camp with aggressive shouting and thrown rocks. i also pissed a circle around my campsite if i was alone...this also repelled mice. i, for all intents and purposes, never hung my food, and it lived in my pack for most of my AT hike. my pack lived under my hammock, and so bears were NOT a savory option and i really hated the idea of it, but was totally ready to throw down with fists if my pack was in that much of danger. for me there were no big issues, though the wildlife wasnt as want of food as the opening post described. hope it helps somebody.

[whitefoot_hp]

I saw a guy chase a fairly aggressive Black Bear out of a shelter with a "SureFire" flashlight...at dusk. People were throwing rocks, blowing whistles, and yelling but it only took the light about 5 seconds to make him go away.

The bear had been stealing food from hanging bear bags (poorly hung) for about a week, then started challenging hikers in the shelter. He's probably dead now. :(

this is exactly why promoting bear bagging to ignorant fools is unethical. Bears are far more likely to steal food from a tree than from someone's shelter, and, in my case, from under my sleeping head.

IMO, if you are not bear bagging with a cable system or the PCT method, you are endangering yourself by basically begging something to come get your food (food fifteen feet in the air is like saying "ATTN all bears, come and get it) and leave you in a fasting situation, and endangering the bear by teaching him an easy way to get food: Follow novice hikers who have heard " we are like supposed to hang our food in a tree or something"

[whitefoot_hp]

Sooner or later some scientist is going to discover a smell that bears just hate.

For example, if you ever have a puppy that likes to eat its own turds, then they make a powder you can put on the turds and it taste so bad to the puppy it will never attempt to eat another one. Now what could possibly taste worse than a puppy turd? I don't know but they found it.

We need those same scientist to find a smell that bears hate so much they won't go near it.

if black bears were really that hard to coexist with, they would have found something like that.

[Cannibal]

endangering the bear by teaching him an easy way to get food

Yeah, I was pretty upset thinking about what would eventually happen to that bear. But, that's kind of our style as a species; very little respect for the other critters on the planet, as long as we're happy little else matters. :rolleyes:

[whitefoot_hp]

Yeah, I was pretty upset thinking about what would eventually happen to that bear. But, that's kind of our style as a species; very little respect for the other critters on the planet, as long as we're happy little else matters. :rolleyes:

but in this case, hanging the food doesn't make us any happier. so in this case we could still be our selfish selves and still not endanger the bears (and more importantly, ahem, ourselves).

[Cannibal]

but in this case, hanging the food doesn't make us any happier. so in this case we could still be our selfish selves and still not endanger the bears (and more importantly, ahem, ourselves).

Good point. Hanging a bag was never something that made me 'happy'; I was always worried by biner would join the dozens already stuck up there somehow.

[fin]

Yeah, I was pretty upset thinking about what would eventually happen to that bear. But, that's kind of our style as a species; very little respect for the other critters on the planet, as long as we're happy little else matters. :rolleyes:

Sad, but true for 99.5% of the world. And I may be giving too much credit here, it may be 99.995%. :confused:

[randyg45]

SKSKINNER said: "If it were open season on them, all the problems would dissolve pretty quick. Even if all you used were rubber bullets like Rangers do for Grizzlys in Glacier NP, it would quickly deter the bear from harassing humans."

If hammockers made a practice of using pepper spray on every bear that came within range of their hammocks, do you think it might change the concept of "bear pinata" to "oh ****, not again!"?

[MacEntyre]

...as long as we're happy little else matters. :rolleyes:
"Never appeal to a man's 'better nature,' he may not have one. Invoking his self-interest gives you more leverage." - Lazurus Long

[BillyBob58]

"Never appeal to a man's 'better nature,' he may not have one. Invoking his self-interest gives you more leverage." - Lazurus Long

Hey, isn't that Angrysparrow's signature? But, I think he credits it to Robert Heinlein.

[MacEntyre]

I think you are right... but I know it as a L. Long quote.

I don't like some of Long's quotes (http://www.gaia.com/quotes/Lazurus_Long).

[Ramblinrev]

Lazarus Long is a Heinlein character... thus both are correct... in a manner of speaking

[MacEntyre]

Lazarus Long is a Heinlein character...
How could I forget the Scot-like star of future history?

[T-BACK]

I had 9 bear encounters while hiking on the Florida Trail. It seems like a lot until you realize that I walked 1450 miles within one state! Eight of them either ran or were chased off by my "big bear with big claws" act as I approached them. One, near the Alabama state line surprised me by his quick appearence and bold actions. He came 3/4's of the way out of a thicket on a hilltop. He was grunting and wagging his head and then proceeded to hop up and down on his front legs. Finally, he clacked his teeth together (I can still clearly picture this scene in my mind:scared:). I felt that the only way this situation could be worse is if he charged and mauled me. No "big bear" tactics this time. I retained eye contact and slowly backed away. Once clear of the area I made a quarter mile detour before returning to the trail and checking my drawers.
In retrospect, I believe he was hiding a kill in that thicket and had no intention of surrendering it to anyone half his size.
Bears are beautiful animals and my encounters with them in FL, AL, and on the AT truely enriched my hiking experience.
(note: I have never been in the presence of brown bears)
The thing I found truely amazing was how fast these "lumbering oafs" could move. Many of the contacts I had were quick an close. I don't think any type of weapon or spray could have been used if the bear decided to attack unless carried at the ready. If I was going to do that, I would have remained a grunt in the army.
Bear bells: some people swear by them, some people swear... well you know. There has been research with results on both sides of the coin. Just like some bears have learned to associate gunshots with fresh meat...
They are just not for me. I would rather die doing something I loved IN A PEACEFUL SURROUNDING than kill myself because of the incessant noise. My ears ring loud enough on their own to be annoying. On the subject of making noise, Mokay and I heard a dog coming toward us on the trail one day from hundreds of yards away. It got closer and closer and then, just as we thought we would see it, a man appeared from around the bend. He explained that he had heard there was a bear in the area and so decided to bark like a dog to scare it away. He had a look of terror on his face and warned us to be careful. He took off yipping down the trail and we could hear him in the distance for at least 15 minutes. This was sad on two levels. 1st, he was terrified of an encounter that he should have felt blessed to have. I lost track of the number of times I smelled a bear in the immediate area but never got to see. We, as hikers, are in close proxemity to bears many times but don't get to see them. Bears have some of the best sniffers around. Only if conditions are just right can we arrive into an area unannounced. They choose not to interact with us most of the time. They should inspire wonder and respect, not fear.
2nd, he was not making the sound of a big dog, only the yap of a little one. I would think this might attract a bear to potential prey rather than scare it off.
Bear sightings should be welcomed and not dreaded. I stand in awe at their power and beauty no matter how many I see.

Sometimes I bagged my food, mostly not. Bears tend to be creatures of habit. Many will make their rounds at night checking the strength of cables and looking into the usual "hanging trees" (that didn't sound right). In many areas there are only certain trees that can be used to hang food. You can bet they are inspected almost every night. Many times they will check for hanging food and not even realize that people have food in their shelters, like I said, creatures of habit. If we want to be in a totally safe environment, we should all just stay home in bed, otherwise, enjoy the experience!
YSMV (Your Survivability May Vary);)

[Cannibal]

If hammockers made a practice of using pepper spray on every bear that came within range of their hammocks, do you think it might change the concept of "bear pinata" to "oh ****, not again!"?

Nope. There is some evidence that bears actually develop a tolerance to pepper spray after repeated encounters. In fact, they are actually attracted to the spray if sprayed on the ground. They will sniff in out. :scared:

[Ramblinrev]

and cockroaches will develop the ability to eat the poison that's supposed to kill them. Nature has an amazing ability to adapt. And we think we are in control... hehehehe

[BillyBob58]

Nope. There is some evidence that bears actually develop a tolerance to pepper spray after repeated encounters. In fact, they are actually attracted to the spray if sprayed on the ground. They will sniff in out. :scared:

Well, that is pretty sad news. especially in Grizz country, but also if encountering an aggressive black bear. Particularly one of the ones that kills and eats some one every few years, it seems.

So, where did you read or hear about this tolerance being developed? Of course, even if that is the case, I'm sure the odds of running into a bear that has developed a tolerance to bear spray would be exceedingly small. First of all, the odds ( most places- apparently not counting FLA of all places! :confused:) of even running into a bear is very small. Then the odds of this being a bear who would attack a human is even much smaller. Then to run into a bear who would attack a human and who had already been sprayed enough to develop a tolerance- well, seems unlikely.

But all of the above goes out the window if you are dealing with a problem bear who is no longer afraid of people, and who associates them with food. That category of bear might have been sprayed more than once, I suppose.

[Cannibal]

I have read that over the years from various sources; none that I can recall or find at the moment. I can't speak to the validity of it, but I do know that people can adapt to pepper and mace, so a large mammal developing a tolerance is no great surprise.

The sprayed pepper spray acting as an attractant was told to me by my Wildlife Biology Dean at CSU back in the 90s. He even showed us a video that showed park rangers spraying an area of a field then retreating to the tree line. Within 30 minutes there were 4 black bears rolling around in the area that was sprayed. The lecture ended with a warning to those who thought to spray a circle around their camp to 'protect' them from bears.

[BillyBob58]

http://books.google.com/books?id=gFlz6UKGqrcC&pg=PA127&lpg=PA127&dq=bear+spray+tolerance&source=web&ots=algvX2ZYPF&sig=qmD2ynlm2vfNFRvHrCn9YoNEngo&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=7&ct=result#PPA127,M1

pg 127 and 128

Spray is not at all 100% effective, particularly with black bears.

And I have heard before about the spray being an attractant, I just hadn't heard of tolerance. But even without tolerance, it does not always work.

[Cannibal]

Here (http://www.absc.usgs.gov/research/brownbears/pepperspray/pepperspray.htm) is another good article.

[Ewker]

http://www.outdooroddities.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/grizzly_bear_warning_sign.jpg

[Rushthezeppelin]

I ahve also heard to play dead but then, most people tell you to play dead for any animal attack around here. lol Funny Story:

For a friends B-day when I was younger, we all went to ride horses. My friends mom was a bit larger and was worried her horse would give out. In the middle of our trail ride we hear her yell "AHHHH" looked back and she was laying on the ground motionless. I turned my horse around and high tailed it back there assuming she had been knocked out by the fall or something. Everyone elses horse wouldn't budge, knowing that when it ended the trail it would be back in the barn with food and no human on its back. So while Im trying to get a response, her horse is just standing there. Finally she whispers "Is it gone?". I was confused and said "No, are you okay?". She replied "Yeah, it threw me off so I was playing dead in case it tried to attack me." BWAHAHAHAHAHA WHAT! She said she thought you were suppose to play dead so horses wouldn't attack. Attack horses!?! I love Alabama. *still laughing*

AHAHAHAHAH I can't stop laughing after reading this one : D ATTACK HORSES LMAO!!!!

[Rushthezeppelin]

http://www.outdooroddities.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/grizzly_bear_warning_sign.jpg

I didn't know you were allowed to put cuss words on state/national park signs ><

[randyg45]

"Nope. There is some evidence that bears actually develop a tolerance to pepper spray"

Unless you can back that up, including how many hundreds or thousands of exposures are required to produce said tolerance, I'm gonna round file it.
The medical fact is that it produces an autonomic response. The response is universal- ants to great whites. It hits eyeballs, the eyeballs close. Period.

[randyg45]

I do know that people can adapt to pepper and mace.

That may be true of mace, and is true of tear gas, which is often confused with pepper spray, but, again, that is totally contrdictory to everything I have read, heard, or experienced about pepper spray.

[Cannibal]

File it away.

Like I said, it is based on stories and reading; no hard evidence. Just keep in mind that "autonomic response" can be reduced by as much as 50% when preceded by a warning signal. Plenty of studies out there on that; google away.

[BillyBob58]

Here (http://www.absc.usgs.gov/research/brownbears/pepperspray/pepperspray.htm) is another good article.

Excellent article.

[T-BACK]

"Nope. There is some evidence that bears actually develop a tolerance to pepper spray"

Unless you can back that up, including how many hundreds or thousands of exposures are required to produce said tolerance, I'm gonna round file it.
The medical fact is that it produces an autonomic response. The response is universal- ants to great whites. It hits eyeballs, the eyeballs close. Period.

A good friend of mine is a deputy sherriff. He told me that they are told to always be prepared in case the capsian spray does not work on a suspect. Apparently there is a percentage of the population that is not debilitated by it. I can tell you first hand that it will not work on snakes (a hiking buddy of mine tried it.) I was surprised when I didn't even see it flinch. Also, from my meter reader days, I can atest to the fact that many dogs are either unaffected or are only momentarily detoured. I have seen it fail enough to not consider it worth the weight on my belt. YMMV.

[Ed Lobby]

I only hike solo. I usually try to talk to myself or sing to let the wildlife know that I'm there.

Something I'd forgotten about at least temporarily on a trail in September. I came w/in about 15 yards of a black bear feeding on some berry bushes. The bear saw me before I saw the bear. I didn't notice until I heard a big grunt to my right. I was on a ridgeline and the bear was just below me on the hill. It took off down the hill like a shot. I'll never believe any suggestion that bears have difficulty running down hill. Fortunately, this one was running away from me instead of toward me.

It spooked me enough to hike a couple of more miles than my original plan for that day and I tied my bear bag further away than normal. The next day, as I hiked out from my camp back to the trail, there was a giant pile of bear scat and a foot print at the trail intersection.

I'd rather not get that close again, but it was somewhat reassuring to know how easily they can be spooked.

[bristolview]

I've never encountered a Grizzly bear, so this does not apply to them. I have encountered both black and brown bears, and for the most part, they're not very interested in meeting you. There are many ways to reduce the likelyhood of meeting them, like making some noise or singing while you hike. For those times you do see them, there are a few things that you can easily do. Whistles are recommended, but I've tried them without any real sign that the bear cared. I also carry a small number of firecrackers with me, and the bears really really do not like those. One bang and the bears tend to vacate the area. Some people recommend pepper spray, which I guess is harder to build an immunity to than some other painful sprays, I don't know and I don't carry any. I've had many bears go through my camp or close while hiking (over the years) and usually they just check you out and leave. I've only had one that showed itself to be rather aggressive. He stood up (generally not a great sign) to show me how large he was, then proceeded to thrash a small bush next to him. I think the message he was sending to me was, "Beat it". The problem was that he was just off the trail, and ahead of where I was going, not behind. I was on a multiday hike, so wanted to continue. I didn't want to go bushwacking too far out of my way, so I slowly continued to walk forward. He did the bush thrash again, so I stopped and read my very dated and worn survival manual. Paraphrased, it said to stand up straight and hold your backpack at full arms extension making yourself look taller. It also states NOT TO make aggressive noises like grunts, growls or tones. It did however say to make loud, changing rising and falling noises like whoops and other sounds like you'd do while playing with a child. This will be disturbing to the bear, as you will appear very tall, bizarre and the tones will also be very unusual and out of the ordinary, but not really threatening. Put this all together, and most bears will just leave. I did this, making very silly noises and staying where I was. The bear thrashed the tree a bit, but then just walked away, clearing my path to continue. No big. People panic when they see a bear, don't. They aren't that scary really. A grizzly or polar bear, maybe, I've never met one of those (and that's just fine).

[Desert Reprobate]

I plan to carry OC on my AT hike. I've had some experience with it and I haven't found many people to develop a tolerance for it. I would think with their larger nasal passages, bears would be extra sensitive to the spray. When OC first came out it was only legal to use for bear spray. People would carry it in the city to defend against bears. When a mugger appeared they were able to justify using it to defend themselves against a mugger too.

[MacEntyre]

Last night I read about one of the original mountain men, Fitzgerald, and his solo trip from St. Louis back to the rendevous. He encountered and killed a grizzly, then ran across Blackfeet the next day. He escaped from them, but lost both of his horses. Then he made a raft to cross the river, but it was destroyed on rocks, and he lost all but his knife. He finally made it to rendevous nearly dead. Bears can really ruin a hike! :eek:

[BillyBob58]

Last night I read about one of the original mountain men, Fitzgerald, and his solo trip from St. Louis back to the rendevous. He encountered and killed a grizzly, then ran across Blackfeet the next day. He escaped from them, but lost both of his horses. Then he made a raft to cross the river, but it was destroyed on rocks, and he lost all but his knife. He finally made it to rendevous nearly dead. Bears can really ruin a hike! :eek:

Oh those wild Wind Rivers! Fitzgerald Wilderness in the Wind Rivers, and Rendezvous at what is now Pinedale, nearby(relatively) town to Wind River trailheads.

[Ghost Ranger]

In the Southern California national forest where I am a Volunteer Wilderness Ranger I spend a lot of time out on the trails on overnight trips alone and I encounter black bears. They have always run away fast when aware of me. They are hunted here and I suppose the less afraid ones are killed. My closest encounter was last spring on a very windy day at 6000 ft. I came around a cedar tree and saw a large 300 # red colored bear 40 ' away and because of the wind noise the bear was not aware of me. I yelled hey at the bear and no response, so yelled louder. It looked up at me, with a puzzled look while I thought, I hope this goes well. Then it ran off down the trail, exactly where I needed to go. I followed it's tracks about a mile where it turned off the trail. Hunted bears fear people and even avoid our scent, but black bears in national parks here are not hunted and are much more trouble. They steal food and will be very agressive if you try to get it back. They are not much interested in you, only your food. So use an approved bear canister properly and don't worry.

[MacEntyre]

...a very windy day at 6000 ft.
Lemme guess... that was in the Fall, when berries are still available at higher altitudes?

I noticed that you list your insulation as nothing more than a SB. Gotta love that aspect of southern California!

[NorseAmerican]

Hey, you know what they call a hanger in bear country?



A: A pinnata!

hehe
Bears know food hangs from tree's in nylon bags:-)

[bristolview]

Bears know food hangs from tree's in nylon bags:-)

Yeah, this thought has been in my head too. I'm in NYS, so we don't have the big Grizzly to deal with. Most of our bears are MUCH smaller, and generally not too scary to encounter. The good, they tend to be a bit more predictable than a Grizzly, and they tend to not eat you or your hiking party. The bad is that they are really good tree climbers. For this reason, hikers are asked NOT to hang food in bags like we've always done in many parts of the Adirondacks now. The bears know this trick very well, and have gotten really good at getting those bags.

From the bear's point of view, "Hmmm.... There's a little bag way over there, and way high. Then there's this much larger one closer to the ground. Question, Pinata or Burrito?"

[boarstone]

Get bear spray...carry it...keep in bed w/you...don't panic when you have to use it...aim carefully...preferably w/bear close!...don't miss!:lol:
You want to teach Mr. Bear that it's not cool to stick his nose so close...so make sure he is before you smack him! He'll only want to sniff 1st and then decide if he needs to taste you or not...that's the moment you let him have it...:D

[MacEntyre]

...aim carefully...don't miss!:lol:
Buy at least two cans. Carry one. Practice with the others.

It is not easy to aim a spray can, with no sights, that you have never used before, in the dark, half awake, with a menacing bear approaching.

Expect to miss, so learn to track the stream onto a bear's nose. Tape a flashlight to it. Buy large capacity.

[KMACK]

When praticing make sure you get a taste of it too. Not some thing you want to have to deal with in the dark and alone. Just like sitting next to a camp fire...the smoke always blows in your face. A face full of O.C. can be more scary than the bear.

[GOLFER]

sorry guys bear gets to close to me after yelling and other stuff dont work . last resort 357 smith & wesson . sorry if it offends anyone but its like someone out here says .get busy living or get busy dying. playing patty cake wont work.

[Cannibal]

I 'heard' a story about a .44 mag round deflecting off a Grizz's skull from a direct shot. Supposedly, the way their skull is shaped and the thickness of it, goes a long way towards protecting it from a gunshot. Better aim for an eyeball. By the same token, there was a news article last year about a bear that had isolated a small child from a group and was going in on him. A guy whacked the bear (black bear) with a log that was on the ground and snapped his neck; dead bear-safe child.

For the record, I love guns and have no issues (at all) about defending myself. That said, sometimes there are better alternatives.

[MacEntyre]

The thing to do is unload lots of whatever you have into the bear's face... any caliber will do. They won't like it, and will back off.

I have a special 45 acp bear load: 250 grain bullet and 6.0 grains of Unique.

[NCPatrick]

I have a special 45 acp bear load: 250 grain bullet and 6.0 grains of Unique.

I have no idea what any of that is. This is a sentence written in English, nicht wahr?

[angrysparrow]

I have a special 45 acp bear load: 250 grain bullet and 6.0 grains of Unique.


I have no idea what any of that is. This is a sentence written in English, nicht wahr?

:) It is in English, but contains gunspeak terminology.

45 acp - indicates the caliber and diameter of the projectile fired by his handgun
250 grain bullet - indicates the mass of the projectile
6.0 grains of Unique - indicates the amount and type of smokeless gunpowder used to push the projectile

[NCPatrick]

Ah, now was that so difficult? Thank you. :D

I still don't have any context for comparison, but at least I know what we're talking about.

[MacEntyre]

I still don't have any context for comparison...
Hmmm... it is about 10% heavier, with 20% more !bang! than a store-boughten round. That doesn't really put it in context for you, though, does it? How about this: 8% additional !bang! (0.5 grains more) might blow up the barrel. The idea is to hit very hard.

Anyway, the bear won't like it much at all, especially above the shoulders!

[NCPatrick]

Anyway, the bear won't like it much at all

I bet! Thanks for the explanation. :)

[MacEntyre]

I am wary of dogs, more than bears or boars. Unlike dogs, bears and boars are never good companions. Dogs can be like bad people. If you don't immediately assume they are dangerous, and wait until they demonstrate bad behavior, they can get too close before you realize they are trouble.

I found an HF post from Blackie (http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/member.php?u=248), describing the time he encountered a rabid dog. Scary stuff! (http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/showthread.php?p=23573&highlight=rabid+dog#post23573)

[BillyBob58]

:) It is in English, but contains gunspeak terminology.

45 acp - indicates the caliber and diameter of the projectile fired by his handgun
250 grain bullet - indicates the mass of the projectile
6.0 grains of Unique - indicates the amount and type of smokeless gunpowder used to push the projectile

Also, 45 cal = bore( inside barrel diameter) or possibly bullet diameter = .45". 22 Cal= .22". etc. If memory serves.

As opposed to 12 gauge shotgun. Which I think is the number of lead balls ( 12 ) equal to the diameter of the shotgun bore required to weigh 1 lb, and in the case of 12 gauge would also be a 72 caliber. Thus a 20 gauge is a smaller shotgun than a ( EDIT error typo) 12 gauge. The smallest shotgun I know of is commonly referred to as "410 gauge", but it is actually a 41 caliber barrel, not gauge. I think the actual "gauge" is 67.

Probably no one wanted to know this, but there it is! :rolleyes: Though all only as memory serves.

45ACP = 45 cal automatic Colt ( brand) pistol. I think.

[angrysparrow]

You're absolutely correct, BillyBob58. I should have been more specific. :D

For futher clarification about the 'grain' mass measurements -
1 grain= 1/7000 of a pound = 64.79891milligrams

[Ramblinrev]

will there be a test on this?

[boarstone]

The thing to do is unload lots of whatever you have into the bear's face... any caliber will do. They won't like it, and will back off.

I have a special 45 acp bear load: 250 grain bullet and 6.0 grains of Unique.

Yeah...your idea is a lot better than mine. I was thinking daylight more than after dark. Back spray not good...:lol:

[V8Mondo]

When I was staying in Alberta, Canada there was a news story of a guy mountain biking who came around a bend and crashed into a bear with her cubs. She chewed his face off and he played dead. He survived to tell the tale. Not sure I could do that...but who knows when it is the alternative to death!

This video is an info video by a ranger in Glacier NP. Good info to have. Course I am living back in England now and the only things in comparison are the 'ladies' on a Friday night...


http://www.joyofcamping.com/camping-tips/safety/bear-attack/

[BillyBob58]

When I was staying in Alberta, Canada there was a news story of a guy mountain biking who came around a bend and crashed into a bear with her cubs. She chewed his face off and he played dead. He survived to tell the tale. Not sure I could do that...but who knows when it is the alternative to death!

This video is an info video by a ranger in Glacier NP. Good info to have. Course I am living back in England now and the only things in comparison are the 'ladies' on a Friday night...


http://www.joyofcamping.com/camping-tips/safety/bear-attack/

:lol: .............................

[Genuine Draft]

Cannibal and I watched a show on animal planet the other night 'Human Prey" and it went thorugh several differant scenarios of bear attacks and how to react.

Here is what the experts from this show had to say:

If the bear is feeling that her cubs are in danger or threatened then playing dead is the best. Once they feel the threat is no longer they will walk away.

Now, if a bear is attacking you for you to be his dinner, then you fight!! Stick your arm down it's throat, dig into his eyes or nostrals, do whatever you can and fight. You can't out run a Bear so the best defense you have is a weapon (firearm, bear spray, knife) and a good fight. But this isn't always a guarantee that you will win.
If you carry bear spray, be sure you know how to use it. There have been attacks when the person being attacked could not operate the bear spray, which was useless at that point.

Obviously, if a bear wonders into your camp for your food bag, let him have it! It's not worth the fight.

My advise, research bear attacks on line as much as you can. Arming yourself with as much knowledge is the best course of action!

Did anyone else see that show? WOW!

My thoughts anyway!

Happy Hiking!

[Cannibal]

My girl is the greatest ain't she? :wuv::D

[bristolview]

In our area, we see bears all the time. Not Grizzly's mind you, but the smaller black bears. They generally aren't much of a threat unless their cubs are nearby. They sometimes let you know you aren't welcome, but nothing too scary. I think they're cute, not scary.