View Full Version : Hammock??!! Well I never.....
Off Trail
11-14-2020, 19:33
Hi all, I am interested in the hammock idea, but have never ever even came close to one... I have been a tent camper/backpacker and am I intrigued at the idea reading the posts here; the past several trips have been not good sleep wise in my Big Agnes copper spur with the AXL Air insulated pad, as of last Few months I’ve been sleeping cold and really not sleeping at all, where previously even in the Alps I have slept well even in Zermatt Switzerland at altitude. I am 5’4 and 112 pounds; since I have zero chance of seeing a hammock up close I ordered one off amazon which is made in the US; a ridge outdoor pinnacle 180 hammock and should get it next week, just to lie in one and check out if it is comfy; my question is, is this a reliable comparison to the equipment I would logically take on a backpacking trip in the Midwest? Should I have gone for the warbonnet right off the bat? Will my choice of a budget hammock ruin me to hammock camping if I don’t like it? I have a top quilt I’ve been using which is 20 degrees and not warm either. I am wondering 1. If hammock sleeping will be warm enough and 2. If hammock sleeping will be more comfy than the tent. I value privacy since I hike as a solo female. So I would need to eventually get a full length tarp if I persist.
Greenman
11-14-2020, 20:22
Welcome to the Hammock World././/. First thing a would recommend is watch some of Shugs's video's,,,,,, He is great..... Have fun...
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FLTurtle
11-14-2020, 21:12
A buddy of mine has one. It's decent, definitely better than a lot of the ENOs and Amazon hammocks you see. That Pinnacle 180 is similar in size (11' length/58" width) and features to my Dutchware Half Zipped (zipper on one side). The Pinnacle is a symmetrical hammock (left or right lay), where my Half Zipped is the older model that is asym/right lay (head left, feet right). Looking at their website, it appears they've done some upgrades. The stuff sack is double ended and not sewn to the hammock body. Also, the ridgeline is now UHMWPE. IIRC, the one my buddy has was paracord. He swapped it out with a 110" fixed ridgeline from Dutchware, along with replacing the stock continuous loops with Amsteel loops. I think it also had pack hooks, so it should work with shock cord suspension underquilts. Honestly, for $50 it ticks all the boxes for a camping hammock.
As far as your questions go:
1. Depends on the temperatures you camp in. You say you have a 20F rated TQ and "not warm either"...is that comfort or survival rated? Down or synthetic? What brand? Also, you a cold or warm sleeper? You're gonna need something to keep your back warm...maybe start with a pad, but you'll find an underquilt much more comfortable.
2. I find it way more comfy. I can't sleep on the ground anymore, but that's me.
If you find that the hammock might work out for you, when it comes to tarps and privacy...look for tarps with full doors, such as the Warbonnet Superfly, the SLD Winter Haven, the Dutchware Winter Tarp, et. al.
Welcome to the Hammock World././/. First thing a would recommend is watch some of Shugs's video's,,,,,, He is great..... Have fun...
183215
Link to Shug on Youtube. Prepare.....you can spend hours watching him have fun in hammocks, have fun with toys, have fun with music...have fun
https://www.youtube.com/user/shugemery
Off Trail
11-14-2020, 21:58
A buddy of mine has one. It's decent, definitely better than a lot of the ENOs and Amazon hammocks you see. That Pinnacle 180 is similar in size (11' length/58" width) and features to my Dutchware Half Zipped (zipper on one side). The Pinnacle is a symmetrical hammock (left or right lay), where my Half Zipped is the older model that is asym/right lay (head left, feet right). Looking at their website, it appears they've done some upgrades. The stuff sack is double ended and not sewn to the hammock body. Also, the ridgeline is now UHMWPE. IIRC, the one my buddy has was paracord. He swapped it out with a 110" fixed ridgeline from Dutchware, along with replacing the stock continuous loops with Amsteel loops. I think it also had pack hooks, so it should work with shock cord suspension underquilts. Honestly, for $50 it ticks all the boxes for a camping hammock.
As far as your questions go:
1. Depends on the temperatures you camp in. You say you have a 20F rated TQ and "not warm either"...is that comfort or survival rated? Down or synthetic? What brand? Also, you a cold or warm sleeper? You're gonna need something to keep your back warm...maybe start with a pad, but you'll find an underquilt much more comfortable.
2. I find it way more comfy. I can't sleep on the ground anymore, but that's me.
If you find that the hammock might work out for you, when it comes to tarps and privacy...look for tarps with full doors, such as the Warbonnet Superfly, the SLD Winter Haven, the Dutchware Winter Tarp, et. al.
I have an enlightened equipment enigma 20 degree; previously I used a western mountaineering 20 dew green bag which was warm enough. I don’t want to yet invest in an under quilt until I know if the hammock is something that will work out. And I don’t do knots by the way, so there’s that.
I don’t have a 180, but have slept in their 360 which is basically the same body with more zippers and some line updates. It’s a comfortable hammock in my opinion that will give you a great experience.
The only adjustment I made was to shorten the ridgeline on mine a bit. I don’t think they stretch them and it seemed a bit long after it had been used a fair amount. I tied a few knots in it and it was right back to 110 or so.
The cottage hammocks are amazing - my Darien blew me away with the stitching quality and attention to design detail. Everyone on it is just too notch and it’s so big and comfortable inside. Best $120 or so Ive spent in a long time! Those hammocks will be there for you when you feel its time for another.
You made a great choice of hammock. I started with a $20 Walmart "Camping Hammock with bug net" from the clearance bin that I used a thermarest pad in for exactly one night before I went to Costco and bought a couple of down throws to make into top and underquilts. They are fine down to about 45-50 degrees.
I won a 20 degree underquilt at a raffle at a group hang from Jacks R Better. Great guys and a fantastic quilt. I bought a 20 degree Econ Burrow from Hammock Gear. between the two sets, I can camp three seasons.
Tarps. Just bite the bullet and get a tarp with doors. Unless you're an ultralight person, get silpoly not silnylon. Silpoly doesn't stretch as much.
Suspension. Tree straps are a must. The last thing you want to do is hurt the trees. Since you don't like knots, I use Beetle Buckles on dyneema straps from Dutchware.
I hope you enjoy the ride. I, too will not go to ground. I camp out of my kayak and bring a Tensa 4 stand so I always can sleep in comfort off the ground.
Off Trail
11-14-2020, 23:07
Welcome to the Hammock World././/. First thing a would recommend is watch some of Shugs's video's,,,,,, He is great..... Have fun...
183215
I tried doing a google search but the results kept coming up with a k- pop band. My iPhone auto corrects to “suga”....
I tried doing a google search but the results kept coming up with a k- pop band. My iPhone auto corrects to “suga”....
try shug merry.
Off Trail
11-14-2020, 23:36
Suspension. Tree straps are a must. The last thing you want to do is hurt the trees. Since you don't like knots, I use Beetle Buckles on dyneema straps from Dutchware.
I hope you enjoy the ride. I, too will not go to ground. I camp out of my kayak and bring a Tensa 4 stand so I always can sleep in comfort off the ground.
The hammock should come with straps, it was listed on the item site. It looks like they are the “daisy chain” type. Also it looks to have the dyneema type ridge line, if I’m saying that correctly. I have no idea what it is like to lay in a hammock, I’m looking forward to setting it up. For some reason lately I’ve been sleeping colder than usual. My trip this past summer to the PNW mt rainier and the north cascades were really cold. Had to wear all my clothes plus rain gear to bed. The high divide trail especially. I’d like to try off the ground, just not with fabric all up in my face though.
FLTurtle
11-14-2020, 23:44
Shug's channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/shugemery
Take a look at his beginners playlist: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLB8752777861C2AA8
There is a learning curve in setting up a hammock...it's gonna take some time, so be patient. At least you're starting off with a decent hammock. You got some trees about 13-17' feet apart in your yard? Without an underquilt or pad, you're not going to get much use out of it but at least you can practice with setting up and working out any issues (calf ridge and/or shoulder squeeze).
SilvrSurfr
11-15-2020, 00:09
I tried doing a google search but the results kept coming up with a k- pop band. My iPhone auto corrects to “suga”....
https://www.youtube.com/user/shugemery
sidneyhornblower
11-15-2020, 06:35
Hi all, I am interested in the hammock idea...
In addition to watching Shug's videos, pick up a copy of Derek Hansen's book, "The Ultimate Hang." I'll link to his page below, where you can check out his Hammocking 101 posts as well.
http://theultimatehang.com/
Off Trail
11-15-2020, 10:46
There is a learning curve in setting up a hammock...it's gonna take some time, so be patient. At least you're starting off with a decent hammock. You got some trees about 13-17' feet apart in your yard? Without an underquilt or pad, you're not going to get much use out of it but at least you can practice with setting up and working out any issues (calf ridge and/or shoulder squeeze).
I have lots of trees, just most of them are western cedars. But there are some maples spaces out enough I believe. What is this shoulder squeeze? Sounds very unpleasant. Right now I’m mostly going to figure out if I am comfortable laying in a hammock as opposed to the ground, and can maybe work out the warmth issues second. I might end of feeling too squished or closed in, idk. That’s why I was wondering if the initial hammock would give me the correct impression so I wouldn’t give up because I had a bad product to start with; it seems it will be a good starting point though.
I’m a side sleeper in bed, but I regularly fall asleep in the recliner (usually after a long shift and with a cat on my chest) and find myself not wanting to get up, so maybe back sleeping in a hammock could work...
Rustykfd
11-15-2020, 10:50
If you want to love your hammock, don’t wait to get an underquilt. It will make a huge difference in my opinion.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I have lots of trees, just most of them are western cedars. But there are some maples spaces out enough I believe. What is this shoulder squeeze? Sounds very unpleasant. Right now I’m mostly going to figure out if I am comfortable laying in a hammock as opposed to the ground, and can maybe work out the warmth issues second. I might end of feeling too squished or closed in, idk. That’s why I was wondering if the initial hammock would give me the correct impression so I wouldn’t give up because I had a bad product to start with; it seems it will be a good starting point though.
I’m a side sleeper in bed, but I regularly fall asleep in the recliner (usually after a long shift and with a cat on my chest) and find myself not wanting to get up, so maybe back sleeping in a hammock could work...
Side Sleeping is easy enough I think. But everyone differs.
Shug
https://youtu.be/7HTX4E23LQw
FLTurtle
11-15-2020, 11:44
What is this shoulder squeeze? Sounds very unpleasant.
If you hang the hammock too tightly (not enough sag), you can run into it. Also, if the hammock is undersized (which yours is not) it can be a problem. Basically, the hammock material on the sides of your shoulders is pulling in towards your body, squeezing you.
The solution is to have more sag (that 30 degree hang angle for the suspension) and laying diagonally across the hammock. The only times I had issues with shoulder squeeze were on shorter (10' or less) and narrower (couldn't really get diagonal) hammocks....the ENO and Amazon and Walmart hammocks.
cougarmeat
11-15-2020, 14:35
If possible - kinda difficult in winter, I know - find a place to hang in/around the house (mine is just outside the front door). You can use it for short naps and reading. Your body will learn it can relax more because there aren’t as many pressure point issues. Even though I’ve slept days and days in a hammock, if I’ve been out of one for a while, that first night is usually a little weird. But that’s true for all first nights - even in a fancy hotel room.
As far as privacy, the key word is not “full length”; it’s “doors”. The doors are extra fabric at the ends of the hammock that stake out perpendicular to the walls so they close the ends. With the sides of the tarp down low, and the ends closed (plus the blockage from the trees) only your feet/ankles, if that, might show. Transparency of the tarp fabric, especially if you have a light inside, might be an issue - depends on the tarp color and fabric.
My camping experience is, people understand privacy and if they know someone is getting dressed, they aren’t going to come over and start a conversation or try to peek.
That is the hammock that I first purchased that started my addiction. Read through the forum and watch as many hanging videos as you can about hanging. If possible, hang it in your yard and start playing with the hang angles, ridge line and position. I jury rigged an old sleeping bag under it with bungee cords and netting because I wasn’t sure if I would like it and didn’t want to spend money on an UQ (nighttime temps were in the upper 20’s). The first night I slept better than I ever have on the ground. I played with the hang angle (had the straps a little tight) and shortened the ridge line about an inch and the second night I slept better than I do in my bed.
binfordw
11-15-2020, 16:23
If you hang a decent hammock and nap in it, you'll likely be super comfy. Staying comfortable for an entire night is where practice and knowledge really shines. Some nights, you just mess it up, and you notice it when you try to sleep. Knowing what you did wrong is key, and you eventually stop messing up. Once you get a few good, warm night sleeps under your belt, you understand the goal better and are able to work through future issues as they arise.
Off Trail
11-15-2020, 16:56
Thanks for all the good advice! I’m looking forward to setting it up after I get it this week in my day off, weather is supposed to be in the 70’s.
The reason I don’t do knots is because 1. I suck at them and 2. My hands are getting the early beginnings of what I think might be arthritis and I’m finding it harder to undo knots or have really fine motor stuff, especially when cold. And forget about sewing or making homemade stuff, that’s a recipe for disaster, I’ve never been an artsy crafts type.
Keep in mind that there is a learning curve to hammocks. Be patient and enjoy the hammock quest.
Shug
https://youtu.be/WI0B20DwLPU
Experience is the best teacher. Bring your new hammock with you wherever you go and practice setting it up on a variety of terrain and trees. Then stretch out, even for 5 minutes, to see how distance between trees, ground slope etc can impact the hang. This will also give you the opportunity to practice with your knots or hardware and build muscle memory for when you go camping. But make it fun: it’s a hammock not the window washing rigging on a high rise building! Don’t over think it.
You’ll eventually want an UQ. Took me 2 trips to realize that and I don’t regret spending the money. You can take your time with everything else. Watch the aforementioned videos. You might also learn how to play the mandolin and build a backyard smoker!!
FLTurtle
11-15-2020, 18:48
Thanks for all the good advice! I’m looking forward to setting it up after I get it this week in my day off, weather is supposed to be in the 70’s.
The reason I don’t do knots is because 1. I suck at them and 2. My hands are getting the early beginnings of what I think might be arthritis and I’m finding it harder to undo knots or have really fine motor stuff, especially when cold. And forget about sewing or making homemade stuff, that’s a recipe for disaster, I’ve never been an artsy crafts type.
No knots? You need Dutch Bling:
https://dutchwaregear.com/product-category/hammock-gear/hammock-suspensions/hammock-hardware/
https://dutchwaregear.com/product-category/tarp-shelter/tarp-hardware/
Off Trail
11-15-2020, 20:10
You’ll eventually want an UQ. Took me 2 trips to realize that and I don’t regret spending the money. You can take your time with everything else. Watch the aforementioned videos. You might also learn how to play the mandolin and build a backyard smoker!!
Is there any reason why I couldn’t (on a temporary basis just to try it out) attach my regular quilt on the underside of the hammock and use a sleeping bag inside the hammoack?
Latherdome
11-15-2020, 21:02
Is there any reason why I couldn’t (on a temporary basis just to try it out) attach my regular quilt on the underside of the hammock and use a sleeping bag inside the hammoack?
Yes, you can. It may be challenging to rig it so there are no gaps/drafts, though. Discusses the issues: http://www.leiavoia.net/pages/hammock/levquilt.html
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
poor_jalopy
11-15-2020, 21:06
One thing I've learned about the hammocking world .... there's almost nothing that can't be done, but that includes ways to mess up. I've found myself doing some of the dumbest things that still make me shake my head.
And I've seen some of the simplest and most amazing solutions work out (i.e. tensa stands) that have just blown my mind.
Is there any reason why I couldn’t (on a temporary basis just to try it out) attach my regular quilt on the underside of the hammock and use a sleeping bag inside the hammoack?
For sure use your bag~~~
Shug
https://youtu.be/qUq01fUeRbs
Off Trail
11-16-2020, 09:00
Thanks for that; and here I would have just thrown the dang thing in there and got in it who knew there was more than one way to get into a sleeping bag?!
Why don’t hammock makers have attachment points for top quilts? My quilt has straps that attach to the sleeping pad (as I believe they all do) so why not make use of them? Would having loops of fabric inside the hammock be scratchy or some other annoying property? Like the Princess and the Pea, do you notice every projection and attachment digging in to you while you sleep?
poor_jalopy
11-16-2020, 09:10
My opinion against attachment points for topquilts (take it for what it's worth, which isn't much):
A hammock is almost the ultimate personalized customizable camping option. I will lay in my hammock completely differently than the next person. Some of us are left lay sleepers, some right lay sleepers (heck, my son is a right down the middle banana sleeper), and almost everyone lays at some personal, different angle. Often, that angle differs slightly with each hang, as I surely don't get the exact same hang angle and height every time out. My topquilt lays with me on the same angle that I find that I like on each camping trip.
There's definitely a large fiddle factor at first. However, once you get the hang of it (see what I did there), you'll want it no other way, and be able to get the perfect lay each time with little to no fuss. However, finding how to reach that sweet spot every time is the fun part of the journey for many on here. I love hammocking because I never really get to know it all, and there's always something new to try out, learn, and improve upon. Then again, my nature is to fiddle with things and figure them out all the time.
FLTurtle
11-16-2020, 09:22
Thanks for that; and here I would have just thrown the dang thing in there and got in it who knew there was more than one way to get into a sleeping bag?!
Why don’t hammock makers have attachment points for top quilts? My quilt has straps that attach to the sleeping pad (as I believe they all do) so why not make use of them? Would having loops of fabric inside the hammock be scratchy or some other annoying property? Like the Princess and the Pea, do you notice every projection and attachment digging in to you while you sleep?
This is where the underquilt comes into play. The underquilt will come up the sides of the hammock. The top quilt just needs to be on top of you at that point, but you can tuck it in if you get cold. In my normal Florida hammock camping, I just drape the top quilt on me. If I get cold, I'll snap the neck end and tighten up the draft collar and tuck it in.
With the quilt straps, I always ran them under my sleeping pad so I wasn't laying directly on them. In a hammock, you'd just be on them. I probably wouldn't notice them. I lose my corded headphones all the time and find I'm usually laying on them. The lowest point in the hammock is around your butt so stuff tends to slide down to there.
Off Trail
11-16-2020, 09:31
Another question about the sleeping bag in the quilt which I thought of after watching the video. Wouldn’t you tend to slide off the hammock if enclosed in the sleeping bag? At the hospital, one strategy to move patients around the beds is to put a slippery material between them and the bed and they slide around quite easily. It kinda looks like the slippery outer material of the sleeping bag would do the same, thus dumping the user into the ground (or rolling the hammock over) in the middle of the night....is this a thing?
Another question about the sleeping bag in the quilt which I thought of after watching the video. Wouldn’t you tend to slide off the hammock if enclosed in the sleeping bag? At the hospital, one strategy to move patients around the beds is to put a slippery material between them and the bed and they slide around quite easily. It kinda looks like the slippery outer material of the sleeping bag would do the same, thus dumping the user into the ground (or rolling the hammock over) in the middle of the night....is this a thing?
Don't over-think it until you try.
Just don't hang your foot end low or you will slide that way.
Shug
https://youtu.be/-Cvj0ISjzl8
poor_jalopy
11-16-2020, 16:45
If it makes you feel any safer .... I've only ever seen one person fall out of a hammock, and I'm a boy scout leader in a troop full of hammock users.
The scout that fell out of his hammock has also performed famous feats such as losing a single shoe on a hike (yes, one of the ones he was wearing, and no, he did not know he lost it until some time after it was lost), breaking a camping fork, and losing his dinner plate immediately after washing it.
You almost have to try to fall out once you're in one.
cougarmeat
11-17-2020, 10:51
OffTrail, A “fall” that may eventually happen - a rite of passage so to say - is, you’ll go to sit down in your hammock, but only grab your Underquilt and/or under quit protector.
As your leg muscles are controlling the descent to sitting, and those “supporting” items have some bungee stretch (albeit light), the descent leans towards the slow/gentle/embarrassing side fo the scale.
But once in the hammock, you are IN the hammock.
Unless you are Lucy demonstrating why you always hold the front and rear edges of a bridge hammock when entering/exiting:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8fJ05SSSDA
Off Trail
11-17-2020, 15:13
That’s hysterical! Thanks for the video.
It might be - strike that, it is, then again I'm in Canada - a bit late in the year to try things out without an actual UQ but you definitely don't _need_ one just to try things in general. My first hammock experiences were in summer and I fell asleep in the hammock by accident in the evening. No top quilt or anything and definitely no underquilt. Woke up at like 4am feeling a bit chilly from below :)
Used a simple blanket underneath me in the hammock after that. As temps got lower added a blanket on top. At some point used my 6C rated sleeping bag. Then rigged that as a UQ.
All that just to say: sure there are the standard and established proper accessories but if you really just want to try if it's for you go with what you already have. All of the above I did with a cheap Amazon hammock the wife got for chilling in the yard.
That said I'm hooked and I have a WBBB XLC now. Hammock gear Incubator UQ will be delivered by Santa and I'm writing this from my hammock that is strung up in the basement on a DIY Tensahedron stand (EMC conduit).
Good luck in your journey and keep watching Shug's videos. You will learn a lot and personally I just find them soothing. I found myself just watching Shug for hours the past couple of days instead of my Netflix shows :lol:
davem835
11-19-2020, 13:26
I used to camp in tents, and while the sleeping comfort of a hammock can't be beat, I really missed having the privacy and space of a tent.
So, I bought a kelty 16ft tarp that basically makes an A-frame tent that my hammock floats inside of. I usually have an end open or the side in porch mode, but it can be all closed up for winter. The tarp is a little big and heavy for backpacking, but it's also a fair bit cheaper than most. If you're not as tall (I'm 6ft), or as worried about winter (I'm in canada) than the 12ft might be a better option.
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cougarmeat
11-19-2020, 13:55
That sucker is HUGE, ay. I bought one after I saw some kayak guides use a Noah 16 to create a gathering/social area (pre-COVID) during a rainy day. No problem carrying it in a kayak. On your back - a bit of a commitment. I have some of the larger REI collapsible poles and figure if I run two guy lines off each pole, they will support the tarp over a picnic table if one or both trees are missing. Being outside, in the clean, sweet rain, and not getting wet, is pretty dreamy.