View Full Version : Wiggys bottom insulation
I just ordered a bottom insulation system from wiggys. If it is anything like my sleeping bag I have from there I am sure I will be pleased. I can't call it an underquilt since he doesn't use quilting but I'm hopeful it will keep me nice and warm. Will report with pics when it comes in.
BillyBob58
10-13-2010, 10:53
I just ordered a bottom insulation system from wiggys. If it us anything like my sleeping bag I have from there I am sure I will be pleased. I can't call it an underquilt since he doesn't use quilting but I'm hopeful it will keep me nice and warm. Will report with pics when it comes in.
Looking forward to that report. I am well familiar with Wiggy, but not this product.
MacEntyre
10-13-2010, 11:42
I checked the Wiggy's web site and could find nothing like that... got a link?
He does not have them listed on his site. I had to call to place the order. I will post specs when I receive it.
He uses the Lamilite insulation just like his sleeping bags. And the bags are AWESOME!
MacEntyre
10-13-2010, 14:27
How did you learn about it?
Just Jeff
10-13-2010, 14:52
There are some other threads here about Wiggys. One of the cottage quilt makers sent him a design, and in true Wiggys fashion, he thought that he knew better and sent back a prototype that looked nothing like the design. That deal fell thru, and now Wiggy makes a flat, shaped UQ from his Lamilite insulation...which is pretty awesome. He claims Lamillite can can compressed forever and not lose its loft, which is why they're sold vacuum-packed in aviator's survival kits to be stored that way until needed.
Dude's very confident of his products and not shy about telling you. Quality of his bags stand up to it in my experience, so the confidence seems to be well placed.
as you seem to know much about the industry you may be able to answer my question: Is the Wiggy's insulation system "evolved" from the old Olam bags from 20 or 30 years ago? I used to sell them when I was in retailing.
Jim
mtbikernate
10-13-2010, 15:29
:rolleyes: oh no...not wiggy again
Wiggy's is the Kifaru of sleeping bags...
That will mean different things to different people (and probably nothing to lots of people) ;)
Jamie - nfa
I have been using Wiggy's gear for a while. I feel it is the best investment I have made in insulated gear, hands down! I to ordered an insulating blanket for my hammock at the end of last week. Even though I live in Florida, I will be using it. I am eagerly awaiting it's arrival. As for ordering one, I found out while talking with him about something else. I also ordered a compression sack for it. I'll post more about it when it arrives.
If it is even half as good as the sleeping bag I will be more than happy. My 20 degree hooded rectangular bag weighs 5 pounds. I would think this UQ would be around 2 pounds or less. I can live with that knowing I won't have to worry about it like you would a down quilt.
He is very opinionated for sure, but I don't have a problem with that.
Just Jeff
10-13-2010, 19:21
...and now Wiggy makes a flat, shaped UQ from his Lamilite insulation...which is pretty awesome.
Just to clarify, I meant that his insulation is awesome for synthetics...not that his underquilt is awesome. I don't have any experience with the UQ, except that it isn't the design that was sent to him.
as you seem to know much about the industry you may be able to answer my question: Is the Wiggy's insulation system "evolved" from the old Olam bags from 20 or 30 years ago? I used to sell them when I was in retailing.
Jim
No idea...sorry I couldn't help!
He told me it fits all the popular hammocks. Guess we will know pretty soon I hope.
dkperdue
10-13-2010, 20:39
Was looking around for some down booties for winter sleeping in the hammock and found his.
He seemed confident that his XL would fit my size 14 Wide Sasquatch feet.
I'll let you know when I get them.
DKPerdue
Funny story, I have that prototype (Not going into details). It works pretty good, has gotten me down to 30. I was cold but not miserable. I think 35 is the lower limit for "Comfort" for ME.
My prototype is pretty thin, as best I can measure its 1",,, maybe 1.25" but no more.
I never could get out of him why the "Designer" didn't like it, but I suspect it is the thinness of the insulation. Ive seen His work (before & after the Wiggy's experiment), & it's at least 50% thicker than what I have.
One modification I did was MUCH thicker bungee cords. With the supplied ones, it started out snug, but slowly would sag as the night progressed, so I progressively got colder. Wiggy's may have changed cords, but it's something to think about!
Just Jeff
10-13-2010, 22:19
The design was much more intricate than what Wiggy produced...and Wiggy wasn't willing to produce the more effective design. That simple. The thickness of the insulation would have been customizable.
I had a prototype of the original design that was sent to Wiggy...it got me very comfortably down to 30F and could have gone lower. I haven't heard any temp estimates of Wiggy's design.
BillyBob58
10-13-2010, 22:20
There are some other threads here about Wiggys. One of the cottage quilt makers sent him a design, and in true Wiggys fashion, he thought that he knew better and sent back a prototype that looked nothing like the design. That deal fell thru, and now Wiggy makes a flat, shaped UQ from his Lamilite insulation...which is pretty awesome. He claims Lamillite can can compressed forever and not lose its loft, which is why they're sold vacuum-packed in aviator's survival kits to be stored that way until needed.
Dude's very confident of his products and not shy about telling you. Quality of his bags stand up to it in my experience, so the confidence seems to be well placed.
He is a most unusual person, for sure. A couple of years ago, I was very interested in his products, despite the weight. Mainly based on customer raves. But while trying to research things, I ended up having a most bizarre interaction with him. One such as I have never had with any other manufacturer. So because of that bit of weirdness, I never ended up pulling the trigger on one of his products, probably because I was concerned how it would go if I ever had trouble or complaint with the product.
The one thing that I was researching and trying to figure out had to do with, at the time, a supposed silicone coating of the insulation. That, and the lamination to the shell, is what supposedly made the insulation so superior. But on the one hand he seemed to be telling me that he just got raw material- Polarguard at the time- and used that in his product. He claimed that he didn't treat or change the raw material in any way, other than maybe the lamination process. So my question was: how did it become silicon coated, if he didn't do it, which he said he didn't. But it was my understanding that PG, unlike Primaloft (which he trashes) is NOT silicone coated.
I never did get that question answered. And I still have that question about his current models, which I think are using Climashield, or at least I read that one time. But I'm not sure.
warbonnetguy
10-14-2010, 00:55
interesting BB58, he told me that hios insulation was the same as climashield.
what's also interesting is that i remember reading a thread online that explained the lamalite has the properties it does (doesn't compress as much as other synthetics, but doesn't break down after repeated stuffings) because the fibers are solid, like the really old school synthetic insulation all used to be. that would make sense, but it's interesting he says it's the same as PG and climashield (both of which are different from eachother and neither of which is solid fiber but rather hollow filament) i honestly feel like he was just saying whatever he thought would convince me to buy the product.
MacEntyre
10-14-2010, 05:51
...solid fibers would be expensive and very heavy!
Come to think of it, one manufacturer having any kind of insulation that is custom made, just for him, would be expensive.
Yes, mtbikernate, Wiggy's again!
oldgringo
10-14-2010, 06:35
interesting BB58, he told me that hios insulation was the same as climashield.
what's also interesting is that i remember reading a thread online that explained the lamalite has the properties it does (doesn't compress as much as other synthetics, but doesn't break down after repeated stuffings) because the fibers are solid, like the really old school synthetic insulation all used to be. that would make sense, but it's interesting he says it's the same as PG and climashield (both of which are different from eachother and neither of which is solid fiber but rather hollow filament) i honestly feel like he was just saying whatever he thought would convince me to buy the product.
Or deliberate obfuscation. I'm a cynical old b******.:cool:
warbonnetguy
10-14-2010, 12:44
...solid fibers would be expensive and very heavy!
Come to think of it, one manufacturer having any kind of insulation that is custom made, just for him, would be expensive.
Yes, mtbikernate, Wiggy's again!
i would think solid fibers would be cheaper actually, i think alot of the cheap poly fill from walmart is solid fiber for instance. heavy is right though, and i assume that's why wiggy's bags are heavier than other synthetic bags.
MacEntyre
10-14-2010, 12:58
I could be wrong, but hollow fibers are trivially simple to make... they can be pulled out of a beaker. I believe solid fibers have to be extruded.
Nothing is inexpensive these days. :(
warbonnetguy
10-14-2010, 13:00
I could be wrong, but hollow fibers are trivially simple to make... they can be pulled out of a beaker. I believe solid fibers have to be extruded.
Nothing is inexpensive these days. :(
you might be right, i know nothing of the process, it just seems like synthetic insulation has gotten more expensive as things shifted to hollow fibers and such, and the cheap stuff from WM that doesn't compress has gotta be solid fiber otherwise it would be more compressible (that's my reasoning anyway)
MacEntyre
10-14-2010, 13:06
On second thought, solid fiber would not be extruded, but more probably spun the way they make synthetic thread. It's also pulled out of a beaker.
Kinda fun to watch. I have a friend who used to work for a textile mill. He bought a couple of huge machines real cheap, and for years made net bags for hams. Recently, he sold the business lock, stock and barrel to another fellow. Anyway, to keep those huge machines going, he had a little reciprocating rig on a bench, that pulled thread out of a beaker all day long, completely unattended.
warbonnetguy
10-14-2010, 13:08
that would be interesting to watch
Buffalo Skipper
10-14-2010, 15:00
I have been on a field trip (10 years ago?) to the local Monsanto Plant (now Solutia, I think), and watched them making nylon thread, mainly used in the carpet industry. Very intersting. I have several friends who are retired from there and others work there still.
kykcamper
10-14-2010, 15:22
I'm definately curious to see the Wiggy's bottom insulation. Make sure you post pics.
BillyBob58
10-14-2010, 15:30
Or deliberate obfuscation. I'm a cynical old b******.:cool:
Obfuscation? I thought this was supposed to be a family friendly forum? Such language! ;) :rolleyes:
Take-a-knee
10-14-2010, 22:03
Wiggy's is the Kifaru of sleeping bags...
That will mean different things to different people (and probably nothing to lots of people) ;)
Jamie - nfa
I know what it means.
My blanket from Wiggys shipped today. Will measure and take pics when it arrives.
I have been on a field trip (10 years ago?) to the local Monsanto Plant (now Solutia, I think), and watched them making nylon thread, mainly used in the carpet industry. Very intersting. I have several friends who are retired from there and others work there still.
I have made nylon strands in a chemistry lab. If you have the chems it is not hard to do. Getting the correct diameter and shape is the tough part of it.
We made an ugly looking piece about 15 feet long out of a beaker the size of a coke can.
hikinghombre
11-02-2010, 09:09
May i ask how his pricing compares to others? Since he doesn't make them and this was special order I'm curious cause I tried a Wiggys bag and absolutely LOVED IT. Getting my own Wiggys has been on my radar but if his quilt is more affordable I'm already thinking about going that direction...
$125 was the price on this under-blanket. He won't call it a quilt since he does not use quilting.
I have a Wiggys bag and it is great! If this blanket is half as good as the bag I will be pleased. I just hope his design fits well with the shape of the hammock.
hikinghombre
11-03-2010, 20:49
Not a bad price! Wonder if he would make a top 'quilt'? When do you expect it to arrive? I borrowed a Wiggy's sleep bag once and loved it too. Slept like a baby in some pretty cold weather.
Pics, Pics.....
What's the suspension look like? I too like wiggy's bags but the zippers and other hardware are way, way overkill. Since this has no zipper that should save some weight right there.
I was kicking around turning my desert bag into a summer underquilt. I've also got one of the "Ecotat" bags he produced that would probably make a pair of 3-season quilts. I can't wait to see how this new product turns out.
It is supposed to be here on Friday.
Mine is scheduled to arrive on Friday. I will get all the specs and photos posted as soon as I can. I'm looking forward to trying it out. We are supposed to get down in to the
30's this weekend.
hikinghombre
11-04-2010, 16:10
Mine is scheduled to arrive on Friday. I will get all the specs and photos posted as soon as I can. I'm looking forward to trying it out. We are supposed to get down in to the
30's this weekend.
Where in the world is "east of coon bottom"??!! lol
MacEntyre
11-04-2010, 17:06
I think it's in Florida (http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Coon+Bottom+Rd,+Holmes,+Florida&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=36.178967,79.013672&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Coon+Bottom+Rd,+Ponce+de+Leon,+Holmes,+Flori da&ll=30.703468,-85.836697&spn=0.076751,0.154324&z=13)...
...it's north of Tallahassee.
@itsandy...Did Jerry give you any specs on yours? It was like pulling teeth when I called and still didnt get any.
BillyBob58
11-04-2010, 21:17
@itsandy...Did Jerry give you any specs on yours? It was like pulling teeth when I called and still didnt get any.
I am not surprised at the difficulty of getting specs! :rolleyes:
I really didn't ask. I have been so impressed with the other Wiggy's items I have, I'm confident it will be all that I expect. When it does arrive, I'll weigh it, measure it and pack it (compressed and uncompressed). I try to get some photos posted as well. All of the camping that I do is by kayak so weight and size are not all that critical. Important but not a deal breaker, water tolerant/proof are most important.
I guess we will find out today. Mine is listed as out for delivery by FedEx.
Here is a quick product report;
15 oz. An oval shape, 70" X 33". About 1/2" thick. With bungie cords.
It fits in a Sea To Summit, 4L dry bag with three turns of the top.
It's too dark to get outside photos so I will hang tomorrow and take photos.
FYI: I also ordered the medium compression bag. It will easily fit in a small!
I hope once I have it hanging on the hammock that I like mine better. At first glance I am not real thrilled with it. Will test tomorrow and report back.
I had hoped that if I didnt work for the hammock I would have a really nice recliner blanket, but the shape of this wont work for that even.
The very bottom is 15 inches wide. I don't see how the feet will be warm laying diagonal
I actually live in Coonbottom! Howdy, neighbor! :)
I may not be real impressed with the hammock blanket but I sure am liking my Wiggys sleeping bag right now! Gonna be below freezing tonight here in SC and I have no worries about staying warm at camp.
I will be interested to see how itsandy rigs his blanket. I just tried mine and it didn't work out too well. Looking forward to the pics.
GrizzlyAdams
11-06-2010, 08:22
Looks like B'r Wiggy is thinking straight line lay. For a bit for fun why don't you try educating him on diagonal lay and what an appropriate shape would be for that. :laugh:
Should work fine with a bridge hammock though. Let me know if you want to sell...
BillyBob58
11-06-2010, 08:42
Looks like B'r Wiggy is thinking straight line lay. For a bit for fun why don't you try educating him on diagonal lay and what an appropriate shape would be for that. :laugh:
Should work fine with a bridge hammock though. Let me know if you want to sell...
:lol: That would be an interesting conversation all right, in my experience! If you want bomb proof water resistant insulation regardless of weight, Wiggy products may well be at the top. But trying to interact with the manufacturer, with any questions about the why or how, can be quite the experience. Again, just based on my experience.
However, I do remember, he is willing to talk at length with no apparent time limits.With out apparent concern for his time.
Law Dawg (ret)
11-06-2010, 10:19
Looks like B'r Wiggy is thinking straight line lay. For a bit for fun why don't you try educating him on diagonal lay and what an appropriate shape would be for that. :laugh:
Want to wager he knows more about it than anyone here? :rolleyes:;)
questtrek
11-06-2010, 10:48
Get Wiggy with it ... Sorry couldn't resist!
Keep in mind that I have no other experience with a bottom quilt/under cover...
I added it to my HH Explorer Deluxe.
So far this is fantastic. After a bit of adjusting, I got it to fit rather well. I added two coat hooks to each of the bungie ties. One of them just floats on the line and the other is tied at the end. I connected the floating hook to the suspension line and the other to the loop on the Wiggy's blanket. I did this on both ends. There are shorter ties on opposite sides just a little ways off the end. I connected those to the tie outs on each side of the hammock. It was slightly aligned off center. It took a bit of effort to climb in. Once I was in, I wiggled around a bit and everything seemd to be in place. I felt warmth under all of me. There was a little cooler area on my left leg. I climbed out (which took a minute to move things out of the way), made an adjustment to that end. Climbed in (much easier this time) and all was better. I stayed in the hammock for about fifteen minutes and was very warm. I was able to climb out much easier this time. I think it was because I knew what to expect upon exit.
This is not huge or an entire enclosure like some that I have seen. It pretty much only insulates the area you lay in. I do believe that it will more than compensate for the areas that gets cold with a sleeping bag alone.
This is the first time I have set this configuration up and it ws only 47 degrees. If I make any adjustments to the kit, I will poost my changes for all to share.
So far I think it was a good choice for me. I'll have more to compare it to and actually get to use it during the First Annual Florida Hang, this Jan.
Matt: if you are not satisfied with your blanket and Wiggy's is unwilling to accept a return, I would be willing to buy it from you for what you paid for it. I have done business with Wiggy's a few times and have never had a bad experience. I know he will make anything you want custom. If you do not make any special requests, you will get an off the shelf (so to speak) product.
(The bottom entry is to the right in the second photo)
It is definitely a warm product. I have nothing to attach the side loops to on my ENO. What I have done is run a bungee strap over the hammock and to the loops on the small end to bring it up closer to the hammock.
I put a carabiner in the last loop of my tree strap on each end and ran the shock cord to it.
Now I just need a way to make the shoulder side fit tighter to the hammock and me.
Just 'round the corner from CoonBottom myself!
We gotta hit the trail together!