View Full Version : Anyone using a rectangular tarp?
Tom Claytor is offering a rectangular tarp for his Jungle Hammock. I like the idea of the extra coverage in bad weather. I'm not concerned with the extra weight. Any opinions/experiences with rectangular tarps? Here's a link to his smaller one. The actual size of the new/larger one is 13' * 9'9".
http://www.mosquitohammock.com/rainfly.html
Miguel
Arkwater
12-13-2006, 16:15
I have this one (http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=12166&memberId=12500226&storeId=226&catalogId=40000000226&langId=-1). About the same coverage as Tom's tarp, about $20 less, and you would get it a lot sooner.
I don't know if this counts, buy my MacCat Delux wold be a rectangle if not for the catenary cut. I've been through really light snow, light rain, hard down pour, wind, and can't complain. I like having the option of more coverage and if it's nice, I can skin it or flip one side over.
Perkolady
12-13-2006, 17:36
During one of my backyard experiments recently, I tried a rectangular tarp.
I will tell you, we had some MAJOR wind that night here in NE GA, and one thing I learned is that rectangulars make great winds SAILS :eek:
I bailed on that night's experiment, and it took me a good half hour to locate ALL 4 stakes the next day :(
Shortly after, I ordered a JRB tarp for Santa to give me...
I would say to go either with a MacCat type, or diamond shape or at least hang yours on the diagonal if it's very windy :o
Perkolady
slowhike
12-13-2006, 18:16
i like a rectangle for the extra coverage. but taking the wind serious is important.
Well just out of curiosity could you have it both ways by getting a square tartp and changing the orientation depending on the expected weather? Campmor has a 10x10 that is 5 oz lighter than the 10x12. While not an exact square it is pretty darn close. Your staked ends would just be a little off kilter. Opinions?
slowhike
12-13-2006, 19:40
seems like it would work. but you`d have a pretty long ridge line when you used it diagonally.
i guess the only potential problem w/ that would be that your trees would have to be far enough apart for it.
Let's see,
8x8 (JRB style) = 11.3137 ridge line
10x10 (campmor) = 14.1421 ridge line
12x12 (Neo style) = 16.9706
This doesn't look to bad. There is only about a six foot difference from 8 foot to 12 foot hung diagonally. If you hung these out in rectangular fashion there would be a 4 foot difference.
slowhike
12-13-2006, 20:14
the only problem i would imagine is that sometimes when i find that perfect campsite, there may only be a couple or three good choices on trees to hang from.
i like a ridge line that`s longer than my hammock of course, but the longer it is, the more likely i`ll run into a situation where the "perfect trees" are just a little to close to accommodate the length of mt tarp.
but then if that`s the case, i guess you could just use the tarp a-frame style, giving you the shorter ridge line option.
stoikurt
12-13-2006, 22:16
the only problem i would imagine is that sometimes when i find that perfect campsite, there may only be a couple or three good choices on trees to hang from.
i like a ridge line that`s longer than my hammock of course, but the longer it is, the more likely i`ll run into a situation where the "perfect trees" are just a little to close to accommodate the length of mt tarp.
but then if that`s the case, i guess you could just use the tarp a-frame style, giving you the shorter ridge line option.
That's kind of the problem I've had with the 9X9 GG on diagonal. It has a length of almost 13 feet. That's what has me thinking about making a McCat style with 11 foot ridge.
I don't think the MacCat is long enough for the Claytor Jungle hammock. You need about 13 feet for good coverage. That's the length on his regular diamond shaped tarp.
Is the wind really that big of a factor with a rectangular tarp compared to a diamond tarp. Does it make a difference if you stake it tight along side the hammock?
Miguel
I have been through some rain, wind, and snow in my McCat too. Jeff has something on his website about serviving a hurricane of snow in the McCat. I faired ok with the HH standard tarp, but don't have the skills needed to use it in a lot of rain.
Correct me if I am wrong, but I think the tarp orientation has more to do with wind resistance than the shape. I think that as long as you are perpendicular to the wind, most tarps will work. Provided they are made well. I think if pitched right the square on diagonal, rectangle, and cat cut tarp will perform similar.
The Speer Hammocks come standard with a rectanglar tarp. After talking with Ed at a Campout this fall I don't think he would sell anything that he didn't think would work.
slowhike
12-14-2006, 07:02
i believe you`r right about the rectangle tarps HH. the first thing to remember when choosing a camp site, especially when much wind is involved, is location. and then orientation of the two trees you choose.
Peter_pan
12-14-2006, 08:51
I don't think the MacCat is long enough for the Claytor Jungle hammock. You need about 13 feet for good coverage. That's the length on his regular diamond shaped tarp.
Is the wind really that big of a factor with a rectangular tarp compared to a diamond tarp. Does it make a difference if you stake it tight along side the hammock?
Miguel
I'm not sure that I buy the length arguement on the TC JH.... Sure it comes with a 13 footer, but real narrow on the ends as it is a diamond not a square....you could easily get the same coverage, actually more , with a standard 8x10 hung asym or 1/2 asym.
Pan
i've got a homemade 8 x 10 that i use occassionally. i try to hang the hammock north/south, with the long side of the tarp perpendicular to the wind, as mentioned. i've got longer tie outs on one side (away from the wind, so i can prop that end up with a stick) and shorter ones on the other side, so i can just tie them closer to the ground. this makes sort of a lean-to shape, and seems to work pretty well.
oh. my hammock is a HH ULB-Asym. i don't know the exact length, but the 10' tarp overlaps its ends by a foot or so. that's plenty. if the wind shifts and rain comes more from the north or south than due west, you just shift the tarp toward that direction a few inches. that's one of the things i love about the stock hammock being tied right to the tie outs.... you just slide it. no re-tying involved. someone mentioned that they use a similar system of prussick knots on what amounts to a ridgeline cord, and they can easily slide their 8 x 10 tarp back and forth. this would allow you to tie the tarp independently, below the hammock tie-outs, so when you got in, the tarp wouldn't sag, and still maintain the ability to slide it.
headchange4u
12-14-2006, 11:51
I have some silnylon from Walmarts's $1 bin. It's 64 inches wide. I have been thinking about joining 2 ~12 foot pieces together to make a 10X12 tarp. Right now my Gear Guide tarp is one of the heaviest components of my sleep system. I had been wondering how well a 10X12 retangular would work. I think I will go ahead and make one now.
Anybody know about what a 10x12 silnylon tarp would weigh?
I have used a homemade 10x10 pitched as a A-frame in some pretty high winds. Under those conditions I use all the staking points on the tarp to help distribute the load (sticks as stakes work fine), and if necessary put rocks or deadfall branches on top of the stakes. Obviously a taut pitch and a sheltered location are key.
headchange4u
12-14-2006, 13:06
I am now leaning toward making a 10x10 tarp with the silnylon I mentioned above, basically joining 2 5x10 pieces. The seam would be parallel to the sides instead of running diagonally like on most tarps. This would be fine if I were pitching it as a square tarp, with the seam as the ridge line. I'm not sure if 10' will give me enough coverage on the ends of my hammock.
If I pitched it diagonally the seam would be running across the tarp, not on the ridgeline. Will this cause problems? Should a tarp be pitched so that the seam runs across the ridge line?
"i've got longer tie outs on one side (away from the wind, so i can prop that end up with a stick) and shorter ones on the other side, so i can just tie them closer to the ground. this makes sort of a lean-to shape"
That makes sense. I'm going to test my tarp the next time the winds come up. It seems like that for all practical purposes if you're hanging in the woods or a grove of trees, you're going to be fairly sheltered from the wind anyway. I suppose it's a much greater issue for a thru hiker who's odds of experiencing high winds and other nasty weather are much greater than a weekend warrior such as myself.
Having said that....I once had a tent demolished in high winds while camping in the Great Plains of the mid west. It was flat as a pancake with nary a tree in site. Speaking of flat as a pancake.....so was the tent! I'm sure a hammock would have fared better...really.
Miguel
I like having my tarp about 2-3 feet longer than my hammock, but I am weird about getting wet.
I like having my tarp about 2-3 feet longer than my hammock, but I am weird about getting wet.
I agree. That's why Claytor's rectangular tarp is 13' long. The hammock is about 9.5....you wouldn't want it any shorter. I'm thinking about ordering one. At least then I'd have a choice depending on the weather forecast. The rectangular tarp with it's extra coverage sure would be nice on a rainy weekend.
Miguel
Peter_pan
12-15-2006, 11:58
Chezrad,
What is the weight of that Campmor 10x10 ? That Neo 9x9 was something like 1 lb 10 oz or so.... Campmor used to make an uncoated tarp with tabs for 16 oz about 10 years ago (I still have mine in the "old gear" locker)...but everything I've seen over there is now coated, in this size, and way heavier...
Also.... all this discussion on tarps rigged at 13+ feet limits/ eliminates the use of trees spaced 11-14 feet apart... plus longer space hangs, all other things equal, means higher tie points for the suspension for any given preferred "hang" height of the hammock...
Not saying this is not a good idea... just saying there is more to size than just coverage...
Pan
Also.... all this discussion on tarps rigged at 13+ feet limits/ eliminates the use of trees spaced 11-14 feet apart... plus longer space hangs, all other things equal, means higher tie points for the suspension for any given preferred "hang" height of the hammock...
Not saying this is not a good idea... just saying there is more to size than just coverage...
Pan
how much space are you suppose to have between the tarp and a tree. I don't see any reason you couldn't have the tarp within a few inches of a tree.
Peter_pan
12-15-2006, 17:10
how much space are you suppose to have between the tarp and a tree. I don't see any reason you couldn't have the tarp within a few inches of a tree.
It is nice to have a couple of inches, at least, to tie your knot of preference (I use a silp knot for tarps).
Pan
Also.... all this discussion on tarps rigged at 13+ feet limits/ eliminates the use of trees spaced 11-14 feet apart... plus longer space hangs, all other things equal, means higher tie points for the suspension for any given preferred "hang" height of the hammock...
Not saying this is not a good idea... just saying there is more to size than just coverage...
Pan
Good point Pan. I hadn't thought of it that way.
Ogri the trog
12-16-2006, 06:00
Also.... all this discussion on tarps rigged at 13+ feet limits/ eliminates the use of trees spaced 11-14 feet apart...
Pan
Peter Pan,
I hope you won't mind a new guy bursting into this conversation.
You can always fold or roll the end of an over-length tarp to shorten it. Tie a small pebble into the material to create a temporary but serviceable tie-out point.
A buddy of mine recently bought a 3 x 4 meter (10' X 13') tarp and I think I'll get one similar - the range of available pitches with a bigger tarp outweighs the weight penalty for me. A dry area for cooking, dressing, or just to have somewhere to stand during a torrential downpour is well worth it.
I've been using two Ex Brit Army "Basha's" (about 6' 6" x 8') up to now, they have pop-studs to join together and work OK on the diagonal when I'm certain there'll be no rain, other than that, its both together or the new bigger one when I get it.
ATB
Ogri the trog
Peter_pan
12-16-2006, 07:44
Ogri the trog, et al,
Welcome to the discussions... new guys are always welcome.... they often bring a new perspective...or even if an old point, we all rethink the issue together...which is good IMHO.
Good point on shorting a tarp with a pebble and a loop hitch... Personally I try to use gear within its design parameters.... very light gear, silnyl, spinnyl etc are prone to damage if not careful.... additionally, if shortening by the method you suggested, the sides may not tension well and you may have to put up with a bit of noise/flapping... extra tie outs may help.... but it is a technique worth remembering if one really wants to use a couple trees that are too close.
Pan
Pan,
The campmor 10x10 is listed at 32 oz. I did a quick look and they also have a 9x9 that weighs 23 oz. I'm a little suspicious that a foot off two sides equates to 9 oz. (Especially when a 7x9 weighs 20 oz. and that's about another 2 foot hacked off.)
Does anyone have one of these?
Ogri the trog
12-16-2006, 09:21
very light gear, silnyl, spinnyl etc are prone to damage if not careful.... Pan
I think this is the major factor in my shyness of the "Ultralight" principle. I prefer my camping equipment to be more rugged than anything in the home - its when I depend on it the most!
Sorry everybody
Ogri the trog
slowhike
12-16-2006, 10:30
i understand the concerns about depending on gear that you have to be careful with.
it`s taken me a while to learn to have confidence in the stuff i`m using now.
a person really shouldn't just jump into lightweight gear all at once. it`s a learning process that takes time. you have to adjust your thinking.
as you come familiar w/ using light weight material, you become familiar w/ it's limitations & begin to keep that in mind. ...tim
Peter_pan
12-16-2006, 11:15
All this discussion made me dig out my old 10x10... it actually weigh 25.5 oz....still better than the coated ones, but not as light as my memories... guess I was a "little light headed" in post 22.. :o
Pan
Porkbutter
12-16-2006, 22:20
I think this is the major factor in my shyness of the "Ultralight" principle. I prefer my camping equipment to be more rugged than anything in the home - its when I depend on it the most!
Ogri the trog,
I started hiking with exactly the same idea that you have. I bought a bunch of really good, heavy duty stuff for the trial. After a bit of experience, I found that I was killing myself with my fat heavy pack. I am not a gram weenie yet, but I like to think that I am at least an ounce weenie. I probably still carry too much, but knocking maybe 1/3 off of my pack weight, I find hiking very much more enjoyable. And, I have found that the lighter weight stuff HAS held up in the woods just fine. On the other hand, switching to a hammock added a little bit of weight over what I had with a tent, but is very much worth it in comfort.
I am not a gram weenie yet, but I like to think that I am at least an ounce weenie.
Well put PB. I think I am the same way. I think I could easily drop a pound or so in pack weight, but I am not going to give up a few things.
Ogri the trog
12-17-2006, 17:39
Thanks for the words of wisdom folks - its is an avenue I'd like to explore but there are things that I can't fathom for now. For instance, do you forego things like a First Aid Kit or spare set of clothing; these are things that I seldom use, but take along always. eg, What happens if your primary gear gets soaked?
Please take my questions in the manner in which they are intended, I'm not knocking the lightweight principle, but shaving grams for the sake of comfort and safety are alien concepts to me at this time.
Yours
Ogri the trog
FanaticFringer
12-17-2006, 18:22
Well prepared gram weanies::D
www.jacksrbetter.com/index_files/Gear%20List.htm
slowhike
12-17-2006, 19:02
Thanks for the words of wisdom folks - its is an avenue I'd like to explore but there are things that I can't fathom for now. For instance, do you forego things like a First Aid Kit or spare set of clothing; these are things that I seldom use, but take along always. eg, What happens if your primary gear gets soaked?
Please take my questions in the manner in which they are intended, I'm not knocking the lightweight principle, but shaving grams for the sake of comfort and safety are alien concepts to me at this time.
Yours
Ogri the trog
those are really good questions. more people should ask them before taking off w/ all new light weight gear.
i`m no expert, i`m still learning all the time & hope i don`t quit learning. but i could share the opinions i`ve developed at this point.
with out going into great detail, i think most lightweight & ultralights carry a first aid kit, it`s just a lot smaller than what some traditionalist carry. the more your willing to learn about first aid, the more you can improvise.
some people do w/o a lot of stuff because you rarely need it & if that rare occasion ever arises, you just deal w/ it the best way you can until you get to help.
i have reduced my first aid kit considerably, but i still carry more than a lot of lightweight folks.
my FA kit weighs about 1 lb, but may weigh less by summer.
there are some great books on learning to go light, like "lighten up" by don ladgin, & "lightweight backpacking & camping" (authors may show up as jordan or cole).
also there`s a website, backpackinglight.com that is has more answers than you may want<g>. a lot of it can be viewed just by going to the site, but to read all the articles & get the reduced members cost on gear & supplies they offer, you have to pay a yearly $25.00 membership fee. in my opinion it`s well worth it.
then of course you can find most of your questions answered w/ varying opinions on whiteblaze for free.
Porkbutter
12-17-2006, 19:37
For instance, do you forego things like a First Aid Kit or spare set of clothing; these are things that I seldom use, but take along always
It is hard to say no to first aid. Bring that always. I carry lots more than most, but I have extra needs in that department. As for clothing, how much more do you need than what you can wear at once? They will get dirty , of course, but will function just fine. I do like extra socks, though. Dry feet are a good thing, particularly if you need then to sleep in cold weather.
One easy rule to follow is if you don't use it, don't bring it. The extra "just in case" crap adds up up no end.
"lightweight backpacking & camping"
I'll second the recommendation for this book. Every backpacker should own a copy of this.
Thanks for the words of wisdom folks - its is an avenue I'd like to explore but there are things that I can't fathom for now. For instance, do you forego things like a First Aid Kit or spare set of clothing; these are things that I seldom use, but take along always. eg, What happens if your primary gear gets soaked?
Please take my questions in the manner in which they are intended, I'm not knocking the lightweight principle, but shaving grams for the sake of comfort and safety are alien concepts to me at this time.
Yours
Ogri the trog
There is a lot of personal decisions here. I also am still learning and think I will always to tweaking something.
All of my clothes dry out pretty fast (only cotton I carry is my bandanna), so I am not very worried about getting what I am wearing wet. Wet clothes underneath my rain gear will still keep me warm when hiking. I have a synethic jacket and I am going to add syn pants. These insulate very well when wet. I do keep sleeping only clothes. This way I can sleep dry.
For first aid I carry Sodium Naperson, Tylenol, first aid cream, goss pad, stomach medicine of some kind, and mole skin. I can also see my TP and duct tape when needed. I figure anything that this can not treat I am going to have to go to the hospital anyways. This is a very personal decision.
Check out www.whiteblaze.net . A lot of us pst there, and I have learned a ton there.
Tom Claytor is offering a rectangular tarp for his Jungle Hammock. I like the idea of the extra coverage in bad weather. I'm not concerned with the extra weight. Any opinions/experiences with rectangular tarps? Here's a link to his smaller one. The actual size of the new/larger one is 13' * 9'9".
http://www.mosquitohammock.com/rainfly.html
Miguel
i use the guide gear 12 x 12 camo it has around 16 ft ridge line
i was not comfortable with the guide gear 9 x 9 camo tarp
because the tom claytor jungle hammock is almost 10 ft long.:cool: neo
I have an 8x10 Sil tarp for Equinox thats haging over my ENO single nest right now. It works real well. Here around Hagerstown we've had some strong winds here, and although I woke up because of the noise, the tarp kept me pretty well protected. Although during the summer Im thinking of going to my JRB 8x8.