View Full Version : 3 Season or Winter UQ?
Hey Everyone
I have recently ordered a Switchback and a Mac cat ultra tarp. I now have to decide on the UQ. At first I was going to get one of the baby orcas but it only has a rating of 40. I think I could get by with that most of the time during the summer but I wouldn't mind having the peace of mind I can get down to at least the 30's with out any additional pieces except for the UQ.
This is where I am leaning towards the hammock gear UQ. I have read great reviews and they do look great. Because of the cost I will probably only own one UQ in the near future and will do some winter camping. Nothing to extreme.
If I were to get a 3 season and than put a thermarest between the layers of the hammock during the winter how low could you go?
What I really trying to figure out is would I be able use a winter UQ in the summer or would it be to much of a hassle?
My second question. I am only 5' 10". during the summer I would rather not carry any sort of pad for my feet, would I be able to get away with that on a 3/4? Or would the full length be the best bet?
Thanks again. Many of you have already provided a lot of sound advice over the last couple of weeks and I am very grateful!
I can't help you with the 3/4 length - i don't have enough experience with them. But regarding 3 season or winter quilt: I use a winter incubator up temps where an UQ is not needed. I also use it indoors(i sleep in a hammock full time) with no problems what so ever(except it's so darn comfy, that i have a hard time getting out of the hammock in the morning ;):D)
The only major concern in my view, is if you are willing to carry the extra weight in the summer....
Beast 71
06-22-2011, 20:32
I have a Jack-R-Better Mount Washington 3 Convertible (MW3C) and I find it VERY versatile. I use it in 2/3rds mode during the heat of the summer. Then I can use it in full mode down to about 10F. Below that I put a thermarest pad in it and it's kept me warm nicely below zero. The MW3C allows me to have one under quilt (UQ) for all conditions and has saved me from having to buy several UQs. But of course ymmv. Also some people just hate pads ;).
I have both a winter incubator and 3S incubator. If you are only buying one UQ, get the winter incubator. You can vent the ends of the winter incubator to allow air flow on warmer nights, but you can't add down to the 3S incubator when you are butt cold.
You will be happy with your HG quilt, no matter which way you go. They make great gear.
I am really starting to think the winter incubator will be the one to go with. Although at 28 ounces its pretty much the weight of the hammock but to be warm for pretty much any weather I am ok with that. However how small would the winter incubator pack down to?
I was thinking no matter which one I get I would get a dry sac to keep it in so there is very little chance the down gets wet. Is this what most of you do?
I was thinking no matter which one I get I would get a dry sac to keep it in so there is very little chance the down gets wet. Is this what most of you do?
Yes. Wet down=>:(
The Winter Incubator is probably your best bet. I am thinking of selling my 3S and getting a Winter Incubator as well. It would be quite hot in the summer but you can always vent.
I wouldn't keep my down items in a true dry bag, I would keep them in something that is water resistant and breathable. You want it to breathe so that any moisture in the down can escape. There are many ways moisture can get into the down, your perspiration is one of them. You definitely don't want that moisture trapped inside a dry bag. I think that's why Adam and Jenny don't ship them with silnylon stuff sacks but I could definitely be wrong.:) My 2 cents, HYOY, YMMV.
it all depends on you... are you a warm sleeper?
and are you going to be doing alot of hanging in the winter ?
or most of the time 3 season?
i say get the 3 season .... the HG 3 season if i remember can go down to 20F
20F should get you into winter ... and if you add a 2QZQ underquilt protector or even a driducks poncho with mod you can get another 5-10F out of your quilt add an extra layer and i don't see why you can get down to 10-15F
you can always get a winter UQ down the line... or even make one
i'm a warm sleeper and i took a 3 season yeti down to 17F ....
so everyone will be different but like i said if your going to be doing more hanging in 3 season get the 3 season ... do you really want to lug around a winter UQ in the summer?
How often do you really go out in winter temps (less than 25-30 deg)? If you do the majority of your camping warmer than that, and you backpack and have to carry the weight and stuff it into a pack, I'd get the 3-season. You can add a pretty thin pad to get yourself down to winter temps, and you won't have to do it so often. But if you get the winter incubator, every trip you'll be carrying that weight and volume. Plus, it is more expensive.
As you can guess from the responses, either choice might be right for you! Good luck and happy hanging.
MedicineMan
06-22-2011, 22:06
one cheap(er) option is to get a 3season, add a 1/4 inch ccf pad when you are going to push the limits and go deeper down the cold avenue.
The ccf pad doesn't have to be huge either, torso length is plenty-shoulders to hips.
Ask yourself how many times you'll be out at 10F, how many at 20F and how many above freezing...then see how much you want to spend.
The 1/4 inch ccf can add a min. of 15 degrees to your warmth factor.
Also remember that the warmer you are on the bottom the less you'll need on top-funny how that works :)
i think jayo gave you very good advice.
I recently did a video on UQs.... full and 3/4...down and a synthetic.
It may not answer all of your queries but will let you see some set-ups and may give you some ideas.
Shug
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It also depends on where you live/going to use your quilt. On the last hang 3 out of 4 was still using winter gear - and we have midsummer:D
Where i live we, have night temps around the mid 40's at the moment, so if you're tired or it's windy it gets cold real quick.
Wentworth
06-23-2011, 07:37
I always keep my down gear in a drybag. I don't understand how a wateproof/breathable bag could help dry gear, as there is no heat source to push the moisture out. I line my dry bag with a light garbage bag, no wet gear even when swimming with a pack.
As people have pointed out, you basically have two options:
1. 3-season for added versatility in the summer, reduced cost, reduced weight, and a small space savings.
2. Winter for added simplicity (only 1 tarp and no pads), peace of mind in border temps, ability to push it into true winter weather (15-0F).
You just need to decide which set of benefits appeals to you more. You can't go wrong here. It's just a matter of which good quilt is the best for you.
P.S. I'm in the exact same boat and I opted for the winter Incubator. I have used it in the high 50s without being overheated. Properly vented, it shouldn't be a problem if you don't mind carrying the weight.
cataraftgirl
06-23-2011, 21:35
+1 on what Wakozacho said above. Figure out which option you'll get the most mileage out of and go with that. I was in a similar spot, only I don't do winter camping. My decision was between the 3- Season or Summer Incubator. Adam advised me to go 3-Season to cover all my bases from spring to fall. I'm only 5'6", but I didn't want to use any pads in my hammock. The Incubator kept me plenty warm from head to toe at 30 degrees recently. I started with a 3/4 UQ, and I'm glad I switched to a full length.
KJ
I always keep my down gear in a drybag. I don't understand how a wateproof/breathable bag could help dry gear, as there is no heat source to push the moisture out. I line my dry bag with a light garbage bag, no wet gear even when swimming with a pack.
HYOY, YMMV
phatpacker
06-24-2011, 00:42
I opted for the full. The foot pad thing did not sound comfortable to me. Comfort is why I switched to the hammock in the first place. 3 season or winter. Ask your self this what type of b ag do you prefer when you were a tenter and simulate the same for hammocks. I dont mind 15 * but lower than that I dont think so but look where I live california where every day is like you were watching baywatch JK. But seriously what bag would you keep if you could only keep one and thats your answer.
Thanks everyone for your input! It has been very helpful. However I still can't decide haha. You all make really valid point on which would be the right one to get.
Is there anyone in Ontario and speak from experience what they would prefer to have when they are out throughout the seasons.
I have both a winter incubator and 3S incubator. If you are only buying one UQ, get the winter incubator. You can vent the ends of the winter incubator to allow air flow on warmer nights, but you can't add down to the 3S incubator when you are butt cold.
You will be happy with your HG quilt, no matter which way you go. They make great gear.
How does the Winter incubator pack down in comparison to the the 3S incubator? Would you happen to have any picture of both of them in a stuff sack for comparison next to a nalgene or something?
The Weight is not really an issue to me. I believe the winter one is about 8 ounces heavier. It is more the volume it takes up when packed.
As far as i know, they are delivered in the same size stuff sack. Of course the 3s incubator will be"softer" and have easier to conform to your pack.
As far as i know, they are delivered in the same size stuff sack. Of course the 3s incubator will be"softer" and have easier to conform to your pack.
Thanks for the picture Bomber!
So I have decided to go with the winter incubator. I don't mind carry the extra weight and have the flexibility the winter incubator will offer.
I was thinking that maybe the 3/4 would be a good choice, but I think comfort wise and convenience the full length will be the way to go. Especially if I am planning on going out in colder temps.
I am 98% sure I am going with the full length if anyone has any thoughts before I pull the trigger on the incubator I would be happy to hear them.
Thanks again.
Shug your videos are always entertaining and informative!
Everyone else you also provided me with a lot of information which is greatly appreciated!
This is probably the nicest forum I have come across on the internet!
This may be a stupid question. I am just deciding on the color. I was leaning towards black on the outside and silver on the inside. I remember hearing somewhere that mosquito are attracted to black. I don't know if it is true but should I be concerned about what color I get. I know it won't affect the performance but just wondering haha.
Stupid question I know.
This may be a stupid question. I am just deciding on the color. I was leaning towards black on the outside and silver on the inside. I remember hearing somewhere that mosquito are attracted to black. I don't know if it is true but should I be concerned about what color I get. I know it won't affect the performance but just wondering haha.
Stupid question I know.
i have a black & silver winter phoenix...great color combo!!
koaloha05
06-24-2011, 20:02
This may be a stupid question. I am just deciding on the color. I was leaning towards black on the outside and silver on the inside. I remember hearing somewhere that mosquito are attracted to black. I don't know if it is true but should I be concerned about what color I get. I know it won't affect the performance but just wondering haha.
Stupid question I know.
Color choice is important to many. Prefer black to allow for maybe a bit more rapid drying out of any moisture in and on the quilts from me or the air. One thing I discovered about going warmer than needed on the under quilt side is staying comfortable using a lighter tq. With the winter Yeti I'm more than toasty down into the lower 50*F with a +60*F top quilt. Too warm on the bottom. Just play around with venting the uq. Having a cool/cold bottom side makes even an overkill tq feel cold. If you pack any spare clothing, raingear just use it as a foot pad to keep the feet/calf warm. Otherwise a short chunk of ccf works fine under most conditions plus doubles up as a butt/sit pad.
Have used JRB MTW & WB Yeti. Full or partial is a personal choice based on needs. Personally I've moved towards the partials. For real winter camping would go with the full. But I'm a wimp and stay home once night time temps drop below the teens.
This may be a stupid question. I am just deciding on the color. I was leaning towards black on the outside and silver on the inside. I remember hearing somewhere that mosquito are attracted to black. I don't know if it is true but should I be concerned about what color I get. I know it won't affect the performance but just wondering haha.
Stupid question I know.
Even the bio-engineered, ginormous, and voracious mosquitos that are in fact the state "bird" of Georgia couldn't bite you thru 4+ inches of loft on a winter Incubator. If you're really worried, I'd get a bug net or a hammock with one built in like the Blackbird. I've never heard of color attracting mosquitos, but I don't know much about the behavior of the local scourge you have up in Ontario.
From the University of Wisconson...
Dark Colored Clothing
Clothing that does not reflect much light is usually more attractive than more reflective clothing.
In practical terms, black or dark-hued clothing of any color is often more attractive to many types of nuisance mosquitoes than light (white, khaki, green, or yellow) clothing.
Several studies indicate that mosquitoes belonging to the genera Aedes or Ochlerotatus prefer dark colors over light colors. These studies will be summarized below. Caution should be exercised in assuming these results apply to other genera, especially Anopheles, for which there is limited data suggesting that lighter colors (yellow and white) may be preferred (Ko, 1925).
Brett (1938), Brown (1951, 1954, 1955) and Gjullin (1947) established color preference in some mosquitoes by exposing them to different colored cloths, either as clothing on human volunteers, stretched over a box which enclosed a human hand, or in studies using temperature controlled robots. The general order of preference was black (most attractive); red (very attractive); blue (attractive to neutral), green, yellow, and white (less attractive).
Additional tidbits from them...
Eating garlic or taking vitamin B tablets don't work to reduce mosquito bites.
There is no evidence that wearing scented lotions or perfumes attracts mosquitoes.
Drinking alcohol may increase your attractiveness to mosquitoes.
There is no evidence that increasing the population of bats in an area will reduce the numbers of mosquitoes enough to affect human biting rates.
Purple Martins do not control mosquitoes.
Most adult frogs and tadpoles don't eat mosquitoes.
One type of turtle, the red-eared slider (Trachemys scripta) has been used for control of mosquito larvae.
Thanks guys. I am not to worried about mosiquotos. Especially because the switchback does come with a net. Haha I was more or less just curious what everyone thought of the different colour options. I am the worst at making decisions when it comes down to the little details.
I wish they still had the brown available but I think I am going to go with the black outside and silver inside.
Now I just have to decide the length. I am leaning towards the full length but I have not completely convinced myself that is the best choice.
Thanks agian for all your replys!
DiscoveryDiver
06-27-2011, 16:03
Thanks guys. I am not to worried about mosiquotos. Especially because the switchback does come with a net. Haha I was more or less just curious what everyone thought of the different colour options. I am the worst at making decisions when it comes down to the little details.
I wish they still had the brown available but I think I am going to go with the black outside and silver inside.
Now I just have to decide the length. I am leaning towards the full length but I have not completely convinced myself that is the best choice.
Thanks agian for all your replys!
HG has DWR Woodland Camo...that's what we went with for 3S and Winter inclubator...
Hey Everyone
Thanks for all your help. So the other day I placed an order for the winter incubator and a pillow.
I figured the extra few ounces will be worth it for now and in the future. After all the extra weight between the winter and 3 season is an ounce heavier than my cell phone. So very minimal.
However I could see myself in the future ordering a summer or a 3 season phoniex when weight is more of an issue but for now I am really excited for the incubate! All this time trying to decide looking on here and the hammock gear website I know want to buy a burrow haha.
Thanks again everyone.
You won't be sorry. I love :boggle: my winter Incubator, but I'm currently planning a huge DIY project to make a summer partial uq, summer tq, and 3 season tq to complete the quilt gambit. I figure the winter Incubator can handle any cold the south can throw at it (and then some), but the summer partial uq will cover the rest of the time when it's warm/hot. The two tq's should cover cool-warm weather and I can always use both if I ever encounter truley frigid temperature (not too likely). Now, I just need to order some Momentum!