DD Hammock size - Is it still too small.? What about these

[nicholson]

(This one's for Neo - among others!)

OK (Neo) got me thinking with his negative critique of the DD hammock design regarding size.

I think he may have a point regarding squeeze issues at the head and feet.
There may also be an issue about the 140cm width which though quite generous for single hammock sizes could still restrict the body when it comes to turning the body onto the side in sleep due to the DD design.

I'm a hammock noob seeking my starter hammock & i like the price of the DD Camping hammock as well as the overall approach to design. However Neo's internet presence alerted me to the size issue.

I found these other 2 (UK - where i live) types of (what i believe to be starter) hammocks.

1. http://www.paradisehammocks.co.uk/shop/single-hammock-in-dark-green-silver-green-p-17.html?zenid=08b2a662ccf0d7cacbe1f15b9141e26a

length : 3.5M (0.70M longer than the DD camping hammock)
width : 1.64M (0.24M wider than the DD camping hammock)
weight : 550g (0.75g lighter than DD camping hammock)
colour : A fairly acceptable dark green with silver edging
Price : currently £20

This first version is basically the DD 2.70M length design blown up to 3.5M plus an extra 0.24M in the width. A DD 3x3M tarp hung at an angle would easily cover the 3.5M length. However no double layered material zip cocoon design for a pad - just a layer of single parachute silk. (Good for summer hanging ?)

2. http://www.hammockheaven.co.uk/
Go to >left side menus >travel hammock
Silk forest hammock
total length - 3.50M (0.70M longer than the DD camping hammock)
sleeping area length - 2.10M (0.60M shorter than the DD camping hammock)
width 1.40M (same as DD camping hammock)
weight 350g (325g lighter than DD camping hammock)
Colour - 2 - colour light and dark green (could be dyed to olive green?)
price - £23

A more beachbum style model which may or may not be suitable for cross country hanging though i dont see why not with a good tarp.(opinion welcome)

The 2nd version alerted me to the fact that, even though the sleeping area length is only 2.10M (A whole 0.60M shorter than DD Camping hammock ) the 0.70M splay of hanging cords at each end actually makes the total length 3.5M and this design allows both the head and feet space to utilise a full 1.40M width at each end of the sleeping area. The design of the DD means you loose that space quite drastically.

Putting aside the whole hammock machismo thing for a minute and the usual HH vs DD square-off and looking at the logic of the maths and design - what do people think ?

Does Neo have a point about the DD being too small due to design?
Objectively would the 2 above designs which are the same price, do the same job (with a bit of customisation) - but provide that extra space DD doesn't ?

What do folks think ?

thnxs
nicholson

[buzzard]

hi. been lurking for a while. now; i have this DD ravel hammock & let me say first, i'm very satisfied with my product. i did read some posts in here (esp. about quality control) fortunately this does not affect me.

with regards to this topic, i'm 5'11, & although i'm happy with it i feel it could do with a little modification. you do need to keep the net open with some light elastic, taking into accunt sag when you're in it (hence long elastic for the net). i also feel i should incorporate some kind of spreader bar at each end so my legs / feet don't feel so confined.

something like, hollow tent pole sections inside the hammock sleeve ends. into which you pass the webbing, knotting it at the pole ends to stop the webbing from moving. obviously the tent poles must be strong enough / right diameter.

or just two strong wooden spreader bars outside the hammock, each with holes drilled near the ends for the webbing to pass. i wouldn't mind the extra weight for this as it would mean extra comfort. you could roll the whole thing up afterwards like a scroll, i guess.

[nicholson]

Hi
You're 5'11" which is 1M 55.7 cm. That means you have about 57cm for the foot end and also the same for the head in the DD hammock. That seems generous enough as a statistic. But you say you are still experiencing confinement at the feet end ? How long were the support bars you were intending on adding? Would inserting a full length thermrest pad in the hammock also achieve the same effect , where a stiff pad's width would keep the hammock ends stretched apart ?

The DD hammock should cover people up to 6'5'' which is 1M.98cm. Their calculations allow for a min. of 36cm at the feet end and also the same for the head end which seems pretty tight considering the sharp tappering off created by the design.

Seems to me you are going to loose about 15-20 cm at each end due to sharp hammock tappering. That means the actual max. sleeping area of the DD is about 2M.40cm - 2M.30cm in length. But the width even at these figures still has a good 50% reduction which means the hammock end widths are around 70cm. Even that is reduced by the effect of hammock tappering.

Most people hang a hammock with a slight concave curve and alot of online images of the DD also show a concave hang. The DD info does say you need to keep the webbing on all DD hamocks at a horizontal tention not a sloping angle. I'm wondering if that is actually possible in reality and if so, if that goes anyway to resolving confinement issues ? Maybe someone with a DD could give some feedback.

The Claytor Jungle is 9' 9" by 4' or 3M by 1M.25cm and is advertised as being comfortable for a person up to 7' 5" or 2M 28cm. We know that Neo sleeped better in this model than the DD and it is 30cm longer despite the loss of 15cm in the width which seems to me very small. So it seems that extra 30cm in length to 3M can make the difference.

The info on the Hennessy Hammock site is badly conveyed. For example, the Expedition Asym has three sets of hammock length stats given in various parts of the website. They also makes a distinction between 'hammock length' and 'fabric length' where the precise definition is not given and therefore confusing. (This does not refer to the 'fly fabric length' which is given elsewhere.)
10" or 3M.5cm
9' or 2M.74cm
8'33" or 2M.54cm
Says it is suitable for people up to 6' or 1M.82cm. Seems the sleep issue is different in the Hennesy Asym models because the material is cut in a patented design to allow for diagnal sleeping. It also has a 'comfort curve' feature which is a design aid to support he sleeper's back.
http://hennessyhammock.com/features.html
So despite similar stats to the DD the Asym design results in an altogether different product and it would not be fair to conceive of them as equivalent.

Seems to me the DD is fine for the body-bag or pea-pod style sleep experience. Maybe best suited to people 5'7" or 1M.73cm and under but could cause issues for people 5'10" or 1m.52.5cm upwards who don't sleep like a statue or a dead body.

The over-all excellent DD emphasis on low impact, low visability, short stay, cross country design has over looked how the body behaves when it sleeps in a space. Is this a correct conclusion i'm wondering ?

The relationship between body length, perosnal sleep behaviour and hammock design is far from standardised within the hammock making industry and requires a lot of guess work and trial and error on behalf of the buyer.

However alot of the latest developments in hammock design do focus on improving swiftness of setting up, lowering environemental impact, increasing protection from the elements and ease of transportation with Hennesy patenting various designs which seek to address the sleep issues disscussed in this thread. Seems like you pay for what you get but even then you have to try it out and see if it really works for you.

n

[buzzard]

yeah i found it best to keep the tension taught & flat as you suggested, partly because someone has already mentioned webbing stretch - though i did not experience this myself. probably because my trees were fairly close together & fairly small in circumference so i could wrap lot's of webbing around them!*

i haven't tried the poles yet, though i do intend using this in conjunction with a sturdy enough pad (or just a cheapo one) though i think this is more for personal comfort / sleeping style than anything. hammock length is fine for me but i'd like to give my legs a little more width space (i have roving-leg syndrome :laugh:).

dd hammock seems versatile enough for me & i can adapt it in the manner i've described without changing anything that's already there (that may even be the point with this hammock, as they even suggest using a twig to spread the bug net open!) you're probably right in thinking it could cause issues for some people though to be fair it does seem to be like a military issue thing (see pictures on website).

i think i should clarify, i bought this primarily because they're in the uk (no shipping) & great price. i've seen much cheaper, with or without bugnet, & obviously some more expensive. this'll suit me for the night or two out, & personally camping for me is not all about highest comfort - if it was, i'd just book a hotel... i just saw an opportunity in this design for user adaptation.


*reagarding webbing around trees: i might get some more just for the tree so i could attatch the hammock webbing to the front of the tree with that - possibly even a karibiner mod like those i've read about in here :)

[bod]

Hi all,

New boy here, been lurking for some time. Having finally bought a DD Travel Hammock thought it was time to participate.

My initial impression is that there no problem with sleeping on my back, or side. I'm a rather restless sleeper so width was a factor in selecting this hammock. For the record I am 6' tall and weigh 165lbs. However, I do wonder how may 6'5'' hangers are using a DD Travel Hammock. Length wise for me, its a fairly close fit.

The body of the hammock is well made but the suspension webbing soaks up rain water every quickly. From the hammock channel ends there's 4 x 8' of webbing which is in my humble opinion a little short. Does anyone have a clue, what the breaking load is for this webbing?



You're 5'11" which is 1M 55.7 cm.




Not that it matters, but my online calculator puts 5'11" at 180cm, rounded down. Wouldn’t have noticed but was attempting to convert my own height to metric equivalent and noticed the disparity.


Jim

[buzzard]

i also bring with me the free netted hammock in case i feel the need for a sit-down on route. bringing this allows me the use of the webbing that comes with it, as spare rope.

[nicholson]

Hi all,

Does anyone have a clue, what the breaking load is for this webbing?

Not that it matters, but my online calculator puts 5'11" at 180cm, rounded down. Wouldn’t have noticed but was attempting to convert my own height to metric equivalent and noticed the disparity.


Jim

1. From what ive read most people have ditched the DD webbing that comes with the hammocks and opted for other set ups recommended here in these forums and other hammock communities. At the least you need to introduce a karib or similar to break the rain flow from getting down to the hammock.
See other solutions and rec. webbings in these forums.

2. which just goes to show that you cant necc. trust an online calculator as in my case ! 180.5 is the right figure - you are right.

[neo]

(This one's for Neo - among others!)

OK (Neo) got me thinking with his negative critique of the DD hammock design regarding size.

I think he may have a point regarding squeeze issues at the head and feet.
There may also be an issue about the 140cm width which though quite generous for single hammock sizes could still restrict the body when it comes to turning the body onto the side in sleep due to the DD design.

I'm a hammock noob seeking my starter hammock & i like the price of the DD Camping hammock as well as the overall approach to design. However Neo's internet presence alerted me to the size issue.

I found these other 2 (UK - where i live) types of (what i believe to be starter) hammocks.

1. http://www.paradisehammocks.co.uk/shop/single-hammock-in-dark-green-silver-green-p-17.html?zenid=08b2a662ccf0d7cacbe1f15b9141e26a

length : 3.5M (0.70M longer than the DD camping hammock)
width : 1.64M (0.24M wider than the DD camping hammock)
weight : 550g (0.75g lighter than DD camping hammock)
colour : A fairly acceptable dark green with silver edging
Price : currently £20

This first version is basically the DD 2.70M length design blown up to 3.5M plus an extra 0.24M in the width. A DD 3x3M tarp hung at an angle would easily cover the 3.5M length. However no double layered material zip cocoon design for a pad - just a layer of single parachute silk. (Good for summer hanging ?)

2. http://www.hammockheaven.co.uk/
Go to >left side menus >travel hammock
Silk forest hammock
total length - 3.50M (0.70M longer than the DD camping hammock)
sleeping area length - 2.10M (0.60M shorter than the DD camping hammock)
width 1.40M (same as DD camping hammock)
weight 350g (325g lighter than DD camping hammock)
Colour - 2 - colour light and dark green (could be dyed to olive green?)
price - £23

A more beachbum style model which may or may not be suitable for cross country hanging though i dont see why not with a good tarp.(opinion welcome)

The 2nd version alerted me to the fact that, even though the sleeping area length is only 2.10M (A whole 0.60M shorter than DD Camping hammock ) the 0.70M splay of hanging cords at each end actually makes the total length 3.5M and this design allows both the head and feet space to utilise a full 1.40M width at each end of the sleeping area. The design of the DD means you loose that space quite drastically.

Putting aside the whole hammock machismo thing for a minute and the usual HH vs DD square-off and looking at the logic of the maths and design - what do people think ?

Does Neo have a point about the DD being too small due to design?
Objectively would the 2 above designs which are the same price, do the same job (with a bit of customisation) - but provide that extra space DD doesn't ?

What do folks think ?

thnxs
nicholson

:)i love my 2 dd hammocks:cool:neo

[neo]

:)i love my 2 dd hammocks:cool:neo

:)the dd tarp is great also:cool:neo

[nicholson]

:)i love my 2 dd hammocks:cool:neo

hello neo

i know you love.;) (speicifically / generally)..however as we all find faults in the things we love most,:( i took your comments about dd hammock smallnes of size to heart......

I too love :boggle: dd but i thought maybe it was a valid point you made....so raised it to see if others thought so too. If so maybe dd might get to add an extra inch or two in future models....:shades:

[Festus Hagen]

I just thought I'd toss my hat in the ring.

I'm 6'-2 1/2" tall (about 189 cm?), my weight fluctuates but these days varies between 220 and 230 lbs. The DD Travel Hammock is the only hammock I've ever used, I've had it since March of '09 and have used it at LEAST monthly since then.

My feeling is that, it's all in what you're used to. I'm extremely comfortable in my DD Hammock... but I've never been in anything else! I hang this hammock pretty much as taut as I can- a fellow hanger at a recent campout remarked that he'd never seen a tarp hung higher on the tree than the suspension of a hammock- but I wouldn't be able to get in if I didn't do that! Also, I don't try to get "diagonal" very much, maybe a little but I spend a lot of time either on my back or "half-back, half-side" position and honestly unless there are extreme weather conditions I tend to sleep until somebody wakes me.

YMMV but I've got no problems with my DD traveler at almost 6'-3" tall. Someone coming from a BB or HH might have a whole other experience though, I really couldn't say. My secret has been, to stay out of those other hammocks!

[turnerminator]

I have had much the same experience as Festus. I am 183 cm and weigh 110kg. I have only had slight discomfort due to cramped feet-usually due to a bit of lazy tieing. Tight lines mean I wake up on my front occasionally.
I love the waterproof material-it only leaves my back feeling slightly damp in the hottest of weather and i got out dry and warm last week sleeping at 10f-proper cold for England. I sometimes have to ground dwell and the webbing and material seems ideal for the flexibility needed to tie to hiking sticks, roots etc and keep me isolated from the damp floor.I woke up in may after a flood to find i was in 2" deep water all around me- I was completely dry! I waded out and left dry and happy. I will replace the webbing with 5mm dyneema core and krabs when the webbing is worn out.
I did have problems keeping warm in winter due to compression of insulation, so i put 2 thin ccf pads side by side and covered the split with a windscreen shade-this took me down to 20f with no sleeping bag and I was toasty and still dry. I have no experience of other 2 ply hammocks-a breathable model would up my pack weight, get wet and would not breathe due to ccf pads. DD Travel hammock-big enough for my Hugh Jass !!

[Shewie]

I'll throw a couple more options in just to confuse matters :)

During winter I use the Nomad Land XXL ..
http://www.hammock-nsl.com/hammocks-xxl.php
Available from www.lakelandbushcraft.co.uk

It's only a single skin so I pair it up with a winter rated underblanket. They're made from parachute silk and are huge, very soft and comfy. Definitely woth a look anyway.

For Spring and Summer I prefer to go a bit lighter and ditch the underblanket for a 3/4 Thermarest so I need two layers under me again.
I use a Nomad Travel XL which is basically the same as the DDs but a bit more generous in the sizing. I was recommended them by a few bushcraft instructors and I've found it to be a great bit of kit.
http://www.nomadtravel.co.uk/catalog/browse/sleeping-mats-hammocks/travelproof-tropical-hammock-xlong

It's all personal choice though and it makes sense to try as many as you can, maybe get to meet up with some fellow hangers over here and see if you can try a few.

BUT having said all that, I then went and found this place a few months ago and now there's so much choice. Really liking the Blackbird and I'll be treating myself in a couple of months.

[turnerminator]

Thanks Shewie, i didnt know these were in existence. Looks as if they would give a slightly strighter lie than my dd. The site says they are 2.67 m long- is this incorrect? Are they waterproof?

[Shewie]

Thanks Shewie, i didnt know these were in existence. Looks as if they would give a slightly strighter lie than my dd. The site says they are 2.67 m long- is this incorrect? Are they waterproof?


The size is right at 2.67m

They're not waterproof as far as I know, just treated against bugs.

Your tarp should keep the rain off though ;)

[turnerminator]

I use my hammock on the ground when needed as a bathtub groundsheet, on top of my ccf to keep out every last bit of damp-hence my interest in waterproof material.

I guess I could use a seperate groundsheet though and save some weight.

[Repelsteel]

Hi all, (first post, so I am a big noob to this)

I bought a DD Hammock Frontline 4 weeks ago (to be more precise, I bought the DDpack, including tarp etc).

I am reading about these hammocks as they are to small.
I am 1,98m or 6'-5" and 120kg and I sleep like a baby in it! OK, I it's my first hammock so what do I know, but still...
I believe I even have some room to spare at the head and feet aria.
Shoulder sqeese is present, but OK. I got a bit chilly because of insulation compression, so I just bought their underquilt as well. Will be arriving in a few days I gues. Get back on that one.

Resuming; beiing large AND sleeping in a DDH, it can be done!

Regards, Repelsteel

[drewdunnrespect]

well people i am a six foot tall ten and a half stone racing snake and find the DD camping hammock luxury and sleep better in that than at home in bed
drew