Why do we use dutch clips, carabiners, soft shackles etc...

Hello all

First note: I'm a complete noob at all this hammock stuff and have slept in my WBBB a grand total of 2 nights.

First time with the stock strap suspension with carabiners.
Second time with dynaglide whoopies, tree straps and soft shackles.

I'm just wondering why we need to use an additional attachment thingy on the tree straps.
I have the whoopie website 6' tree straps and they have a loop sewn into each end.
Can you just run the strap back through one eye after looping it around the tree and then marlin hitch it for the whoopie attachment at an appropriate point on the remainding strap.
The way I see it is the carabiner, dutch clip or soft shackle from the end eye in the strap back onto the strap mid way does the same thing.

I could be missing some very obvious point or safety reason for using an additional attachment method like dutch clips etc.

Maybe it would slip if run through the eye or something.

It seamed to make sense in the garage, but then again most things do...:confused:

I'd appreciate anyone with more experience to comment.

Ease of setup. On the webbing setup it is required since passing the entire hammock through the the eyes isn't practical. On whoopie setups etc it seems to be more of a personal preference. They look cool too...

it's all in how your setup...is set up
;)

everyone sets up there suspension different...and they are just some of the options out there to make setup easy ....

check out Shugs videos ...he has some good videos that will help clear the air for ya :D

with me my setup is 4 foot whoopie slings on the hammock,Dutch biners,12 inch continuous loop then my tree straps....

this way i just wrap my tree straps to the tree.....and hook the whoopies on...takes 1 min

I do it because my son dosnt like it when I play with his Legos.

For me if I pass the strap through the loop the webbing will kind of fuse/weld together from the heat build up caused by friction. Using a biener or Dutch clip eliminates this problem.

So it's not a safety thing? I was under the impression that the stitching that makes the loops wasn't strong enough to hang from. Hence the reason why I use Dutch Clips.

I pass the strap through the eye... no biners or clips. Straps haven't melted or fused... yet.

The fusing/friction issue can be observed with some nylon webbing, when it is passed back through a fixed eye. I've never seen it with either polypro or polyester webbing, though.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by pig.slayer

Can you just run the strap back through one eye after looping it around the tree and then marlin hitch it for the whoopie attachment at an appropriate point on the remainding strap.

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That's what I do currently and it works perfectly. I do have some Dutch Biners for other uses, though.

My straps see a bit more tension than the average hanger would put on them. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sherpa

So it's not a safety thing? I was under the impression that the stitching that makes the loops wasn't strong enough to hang from. Hence the reason why I use Dutch Clips.

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The stitches in the loops are tensioned no matter what attachment you use. But a well stitched loop can withstand any forces you will put on it with a hammock. There are lots of threads bout the various ways to stitch a loop into webbing. But if you already have loops in them you don't need to reinvent the wjeel.

Since you use a MSH it may not seem easier to you but some leave their entire suspension connected to their hammocks (like those that use the all in one system for example) and so being able to attach the webbing without having to feed it through a loop is necessary. Also if you have a lot of webbing (I use 15 feet per end) then it is a quicker and easier set up to simply put the end around the tree and hook it on with the Dutch clip vs feeding and unfeeding all 15 feet through the end loop.

When I use webbing, I just pull a short bight through the eye. Just enough to tie a Marlin Spike hitch and then hang the whoopie on the marlin spike hitch.

For me the short bight is as convenient as a biner and less to lose and pack. The short bight is about as fast as a biner - a little longer to pull, but faster to undo.

A long time ago (2009) before whoopie slings we only really had 2 choices. Either rope to huggers or all webbing suspensions. With the rope to hugger suspension it was a pain to adjust each side. I generally don't get it right on the first try and I would have to tie one side the see where the other side winds up and tie it, then untie and retie the first side. The second chioce was all webbing and generally used rings or buckles. Then you either had to take your webbing out of the device and refeed it or you used a carabiner. I liked the adjustable webbing but hated the big climbing rated carabiner on the end. I in comes the Dutch clip and 2Q saw it at an hang and insisted we make them for the members. The Dutch Clip work perfectly to replace the Carabiner and was about half the weight. This is still a great suspension with buckle, webbing, and Dutch clip. Then came the whoopie sling and there was an adjustable rope setup. It needed to be connected to the webbing by either Marlin spike hitch or the "all in one" suspensions. The MSH uses typically about 6' of webbing and that was almost what I was using with the buckles. The bulk and weight was negating the whoopie savings. The "all in one" is great but you still need to hook the webbing once you get around the tree. The Dutch clip works perfectly for this or you could employ the nacra-biner. I wanted to reduce the hugger length of the Marlin spike hitch also the hassle of it turning and falling off while adjusting. That limits your trees. I see you use dynaglide with 6' webbing. If you reduce it to 4' or 3' hugger and added a Dutch Biner or a nacra-biner you can reduce the weight while having the security and convenience of a biner. Here is how you can use the whoopie to make up the difference of a shorter hugger.
In the end use what you like the best and it is great to have choices out there. So far the suspension methods have been evolving very quickly and I bet it will be different in the near future. I have several hammocks and it mostly the type of suspension depends what year I put it on. I'm still a big fan of webbing and buckles. It's a little heavier, but not that much. You probably like the dyna whoopies and that is a great suspension also. It's great to have a big menu to choose from.

Edit; I should mention there are other suspension systems and I just hit on the most popular ones

For me, before I left my straps behind & then decided to permanently attach them to the whoopies, it was a speed thing. If I took my time it was about 2.5 seconds each strap to thread em through the eye. If I hurried: about 8 seconds each :D With the Dutch clips: it's about 1.2 seconds each no matter how much I hurry. Not much of a savings on a nice day, BUT, when tired & there is a T-storm on you, every second counts, at least mentally.

Now that I have the straps sewn (in a loop) to the Whoopies, I can't thread the eye, so really don't have a choice. And still I think that for me at least it is mostly a speed / ease of set up choice. And as both Dutch clips weigh less than ONE of my Biners, I am saving weight, sort of.

This weekend in the Black Hills I tried using my CampNano biners to attach my tree straps to the Whoopies. I like this better than toggles because when adjusting the whoopie you don't have to worry about the amsteel loop falling off the toggle/knot which I find extremely annoying. I think I'm going to have to order some Dutch Biners now to save some weight:laugh:.
I tried this biner/whoopie thing in two ways. One night I had trees that I was able to wrap my tree huggers around twice so I just ran one loop of the hugger through the other one and then attached the biner to the free end loop. This worked great and is a pretty typical way of doing it from what I've gathered. The only thing I always liked about using the toggles/marlin spike was the ability for extra adjustment in length on the tree straps by placing the knot/toggle wherever you want it. So... I tied a marlin spike in my tree straps but instead of the toggle inserted to hold the knot I used one end of my biner instead. This works great and holds just fine with no slippage whatsoever. I'm sure the marlin spike/biner method has been discussed before but I don't recall seeing it so thought I'd share.

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Originally Posted by Ramblinrev

The stitches in the loops are tensioned no matter what attachment you use. But a well stitched loop can withstand any forces you will put on it with a hammock. There are lots of threads bout the various ways to stitch a loop into webbing. But if you already have loops in them you don't need to reinvent the wjeel.

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Very good to know! Another way to save almost 2oz!