Material suggestions

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03-14-2012, 19:15
SGT Rock

Material suggestions

I'm looking for something durable similar to Tyvek that would weigh less than tyvek @1.85 ounces per square yard.

Cuben fiber is susceptible to abrasion so I don't know that I would want to use it.

I've got a chance to possibly go out west and do some hiking and I want to make something that can either serve as a ground cloth for a tarp if I cannot hang or a cover for the hammock for a little extra warmth if I can. I currently have a tyvek cover that weighs about 6.28 ounces with suspension that makes a cover that is about 6' x 4' when used as a ground cloth. It weighs more than the hammock!

I'd like to get that down to about ~4.5 ounces, so most likely it will require some material that is around 1.2 ounces or less per square yard. Any good ideas?
03-14-2012, 19:38
necaver

Quote:

Originally Posted by SGT Rock

I'm looking for something durable similar to Tyvek that would weigh less than tyvek @1.85 ounces per square yard.

Cuben fiber is susceptible to abrasion so I don't know that I would want to use it.

So you want a material as durable as Tyvek and as light as Cuben? You don't ask for much, do you...
03-14-2012, 20:11
DemostiX

There's lighter Tyvek made, lighter by 0.25oz or more per yd2.
Fuss for a <1oz saving when you could pare off excess boot sole and heel before you start instead? (Bootlaces ARE dyneema, aren't they?)

You're at the limit of evolutionary pressure on nylon development, if you are intolerant of punctures breaching water proofness.
03-14-2012, 20:35
ExPXGUY

Might look into polycro...1.6 oz for 40"x96"

http://gossamergear.com/shelters/pol...th-medium.html
03-14-2012, 20:43
SGT Rock

Quote:

Originally Posted by ExPXGUY

Might look into polycro...1.6 oz for 40"x96"

http://gossamergear.com/shelters/pol...th-medium.html

I have a sheet of that stuff somewhere.
03-14-2012, 20:46
SGT Rock

Quote:

Originally Posted by bootleg

So you want a material as durable as Tyvek and as light as Cuben? You don't ask for much, do you...

It's how we push the envelope of light gear.

I imagine the first guy to make a cuben tarp got told that stuff would never work.

I remember back in the day the occasional forecast of doom for people using the highly flammable, ultralight substance known as sil-nylon for tarps!:scared: Now such things are considered the normal stuff.
03-14-2012, 20:58
DemostiX

There's nothing hard to appreciate about the properties of cuben. Strong and light fibers reinforce a film. The spectra / dyneema /uhmwpe fiber with 2/3 the density of Aramid fiber, has been around for over 20 years.

But, reinforcement of the film doesn't confer abrasion resistance. For that you need unaffordable straight uhmwpe fabric. Or compromise with 1.1oz cuben, which some makers are using for footprints of tents.
03-14-2012, 21:00
SGT Rock

I have looked at 1.0 cuben as a fall back. I would love to find someone making tyvek in a slightly thinner level.
03-14-2012, 21:23
exup

Hey Sarhe, how about a 55 gal drum liner. Cheap, durable enough, and repairable with tape. I've used one a million times as a ground cloth for the hammock. And even stepping on it no holes noticed yet.
03-14-2012, 21:38
SGT Rock

I'm interested. I've not seen one before, anything you can point me to?
03-14-2012, 21:40
Acer

6 mil black plastic,,55 gal drum trash bags,,PM me Sgt. Rock and I will send you one,,I pick em up,,and have a few from the State of Indiana,,lol,
03-14-2012, 21:41
Acer

I would think tho,,tyvex would be better than plastic,,more durable,,however,,when building my house,,tyvex does eventually when your walking on bits and pieces,,shows alot of wear,,but still hangs together,
03-14-2012, 21:47
SGT Rock

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acer

6 mil black plastic,,55 gal drum trash bags,,PM me Sgt. Rock and I will send you one,,I pick em up,,and have a few from the State of Indiana,,lol,

So it is 6mil plastic. I think you can get that in sheets at Lowes. http://www.lowes.com/pd_16964-18632-...mil&facetInfo=
03-14-2012, 21:54
Acer

Yes,,6 mil plastic,,Indiana State Fair uses them in their 55 gal drum and box trash containers,,and I occasionally get a few,,they charge the shows a buck a piece for them..they also let the outdoor clean up crews wear them for rain gear,,cut holes for the arms and head and work great! :lol: But,,in my opinion,,tyvec is more durable, I keep one in the trunk of my car and constantly throw tools etc on it to keep trunk clean so it does hold up pretty good, not sure of how much your wanting to abuse it.
03-14-2012, 22:20
exup

Just go to a walmart or something of the likes and they should be in the trash bag section. They're just normal trash bags, just plenty thicker and tougher, but still seem light.

I've heard of people making bivies with these things.
03-14-2012, 22:33
SGT Rock

I just did some checking on 6mil plastic and it looks like it is 2.3 oz per square yard.
03-14-2012, 22:45
jbrianb

Dumb, perhaps, but what about .8 oz. ripstop coated with a blend of mineral spirits and silicone (should be a recipe for that somewhere...)? I have NO idea how much the coating would bring the total weight to, and I know 1.1 coated is fairly thin. Just an idea...
03-14-2012, 23:11
RootCause

Or, stick with your piece of Tyvek. Just cut a bunch of holes in it to lighten it up! :D

(and now we return you to your serious discussion.....)

What about 1.1 ripstop with a DWR coating? It also would show wear, but would be able to handle your multi-purpose needs.
03-14-2012, 23:14
SGT Rock

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbrianb

Dumb, perhaps, but what about .8 oz. ripstop coated with a blend of mineral spirits and silicone (should be a recipe for that somewhere...)? I have NO idea how much the coating would bring the total weight to, and I know 1.1 coated is fairly thin. Just an idea...

Quote:

Originally Posted by RootCause

Or, stick with your piece of Tyvek. Just cut a bunch of holes in it to lighten it up! :D

(and now we return you to your serious discussion.....)

What about 1.1 ripstop with a DWR coating? It also would show wear, but would be able to handle your multi-purpose needs.

I've thought of that too. Maybe I can iron some tyvek and stretch it out by 1/3 then trim it. That would bring the weight down to about 1.2 ounces per yard LOL.:lol:
03-15-2012, 14:15
DemostiX

Quote:

Originally Posted by SGT Rock

<snip> Maybe I can iron some tyvek and stretch it out by 1/3 then trim it. That would bring the weight down to about 1.2 ounces per yard LOL.:lol:

Laughs aside, Tyvek is olefin, heat-sensitive, and should not see a hot iron. Temps should not exceed 175F.

1.20oz / yd2 is the lightest Tyvek. Nylon would have to have a basis weight of 1oz before silicon treatment to be that light. No comparison in cost.
03-15-2012, 14:20
SGT Rock

Quote:

Originally Posted by DemostiX

Laughs aside, Tyvek is olefin, heat-sensitive, and should not see a hot iron. Temps should not exceed 175F.

1.20oz / yd2 is the lightest Tyvek. Nylon would have to have a basis weight of 1oz before silicon treatment to be that light. No comparison in cost.

So someone does make lighter tyvek?
03-15-2012, 15:58
Violent Green

Quote:

Originally Posted by SGT Rock

So someone does make lighter tyvek?

Yes - Tyvek 1443r. It's the clothes grade version of tyvek. Think clothing for a lab. 1.25/oz per yard. Not quite as durable or waterproof as the standard Housewrap, but I have used it as a ground cloth before.

Ryan
03-15-2012, 16:05
SGT Rock

I just pulled the trigger on 2 yards of it. Thanks!
03-15-2012, 16:24
DivaB

Quote:

Originally Posted by SGT Rock

I just pulled the trigger on 2 yards of it. Thanks!

where did you find it by the yard?
03-15-2012, 16:28
dukedante

2 questions for you:
Where are you going?
What was wrong with the polycryo or window film? It is lighter than cuben, no?
Ok, that was 3 questions.
03-15-2012, 16:36
SGT Rock

Quote:

Originally Posted by DivaB

where did you find it by the yard?

Quest

I'm tapatalkin' ya'll
03-15-2012, 16:40
SGT Rock

Well what I have found, and it could be wrong, is polycro is basically the same stuff that is used for the laminate in cuben fiber - so like cuben fiber without the weave. My concern was it would wear out too quickly.

I'm tapatalkin' ya'll
03-20-2012, 21:40
KenDen

Would the polyester ripstop like at kitebuilders.com work for you?
03-23-2012, 15:34
SGT Rock

Does it repell water and is it durable?

I made a cover out of 1.25 tyvek and it came in at 122 grams which is in the range I was looking for. Now I need to trail test it.

I'm tapatalkin' ya'll
03-23-2012, 16:52
krugd

Quote:

Originally Posted by SGT Rock

Well what I have found, and it could be wrong, is polycro is basically the same stuff that is used for the laminate in cuben fiber - so like cuben fiber without the weave. My concern was it would wear out too quickly.

I'm told hikers have completed thru hikes with a single polycro ground cloth. Except for the thorny desert polycro ground cloths reportedly hold up very well. I'm experimenting with some for a light tarp in good weather.
03-23-2012, 17:21
SGT Rock

Quote:

Originally Posted by krugd

I'm told hikers have completed thru hikes with a single polycro ground cloth. Except for the thorny desert polycro ground cloths reportedly hold up very well. I'm experimenting with some for a light tarp in good weather.

I'm sure some have. Some folks have also hiked the entire trail with a cuben fiber pack, but I've seen the abrasion on mine and don't think I would accept that in a ground cloth.

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