How to get lateral tension: MW3 + WBBB?

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12-30-2013, 11:09
kwpapke

How to get lateral tension: MW3 + WBBB?

Tried out my brand-spanking new MW3 + Sniveler this weekend @ 24F. I should note I am a quilt newbie - have been a pad and mummy bag guy for 6 years, and finally took the plunge to lighten/shrink my load.

No problems with the Sniveler - setup was easy, and it performed flawlessly. Used it as a Serape in the morning while having coffee and breakfast, really nice and toasty!

The problem was the MW3 setup. It took me a few tries to get the end drawcord tension just right: loose enough to maximize shoulder coverage, tight enough to not have any end air gaps, but I figured it out and next time should be a snap. The big problem: the side loops on the MW3 do not match the BB side tieout points. I ended up unzipping the bugnet and yanking the left side of the quilt all night long to keep from getting cold shoulders, and experienced CBS several times during the night due to bottom gaps in the quilt. The root cause of the problem appears to be maintaining lateral tension in the quilt and keeping it in position for a diagonal lay, particularly when tossing and turning during the night.

I did a little searching on HF and it seem like many folks find a way to clip the quilt sides to the hammock, e.g. Dutch quilt clips. Is this the only viable solution to the problem? One of the (probably stupid) ideas I thought of after I got back was to run a line between the quilt side loops up over the top of the ridgeline, maybe with some tensioners. This could be done with very little weight penalty as only a very lightweight line should be needed.

I am a little reluctant to have my wife sew clips or loops onto the hammock until I've optimized the position of the quilt on the long axis for maximum shoulder coverage. I've thought about maybe supergluing a loop on the hammock, then securing the quilt with an S-biner.

Am I missing something painfully obvious?

--Kurt
12-30-2013, 11:26
2eez4life

Yesir,
Shug shows the way.
12-30-2013, 12:07
kwpapke

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2eez4life

Yesir,
Shug shows the way.

Yep, I rewatched his video, and an asymmetric stringing of the suspension (tight on the side your head/feet are on, loose on the other) plus maybe a Dutch ridgeline quilt hook, or maybe just a short loop of line ("triangle thingy") to change the tension angle will solve the diagonal lay problem.

It would be nice if JRB gave more guidance/warning on tweaking their suspension system on their website. The product description gives a pretty rosy picture:

The Mt. Washington under quilt works on any hammock – including all gathered end hammocks such as: Clarks, Claytors, Eagles Nests, Hennessys, Warbonnets and the unique Jacks ‘R’ Better Bear Mountain Bridge Hammock. It attaches to a hammock in under a minute with the included JRB Suspension System.

They do not point out that the side loops only match a HH or TTTG hammock, nor do their suspension system instructions say anything about getting diagonal coverage.
01-12-2014, 15:47
kwpapke

Easier on non-Asym hammock

Below is a pic of the quilt on an 11' Streamliner hammock. If you look carefully at both ends I made an improvised "triangle thingy" out of a piece of cord, attached to one side of the suspension with a prussic, and the other side with a clip. That pulls the suspension away from center. Not shown is another cord going from the quilt side tieouts, but I don't think they were really necessary.
The bottom line for me is quilt placement is much easier on a narrow non-asym hammock with no side tieouts - the quilt wraps around you much more and doesn't want to creep away from the diagonal side.
https://www.hammockforums.net/galler...2526_thumb.jpg
--Kurt
01-12-2014, 16:48
BillyBob58

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwpapke

Am I missing something painfully obvious?

--Kurt

(forgive me in advance, but I can't resist) Yes, the fact that I never saw such a "fiddle factor" call for help(so to speak) from you when you used the HHSS? ;)

But seriously, I have rarely seen such threads with the JRB's "old fashioned" suspension. Maybe at least you are not getting the "accordion effect"? I have almost never had these issues with my JRBs ( and old style suspension) but then I mostly use them on JRB bridge hammocks, with which virtually all of the "fiddle factor" type issues are non-existent. I guess the diagonal is the problem, just as it is with calf pressure.

I did have trouble keeping my MW4 over the foot box of my WBBB. But I got it worked out by tricks with the foot end suspension, maybe like the ones you already mentioned, and had no trouble with the shoulder. But I never even tried to use the side loops, just let it curve up around me.

I have had a lot of trouble with the left shoulder of my Yeti with surround suspension and some with accordion effect. But I think I got the shoulder fixed by pulling that side's suspension tighter and/or by connecting that side suspension to something, can't quite remember. But I for sure have unzipped many times to readjust before I got it worked out. I figured out a trick for accordion effect but I really need to do a mod on the suspension.

I never have these issues with a TQ or UQ in a bridge hammock, or a Pea Pod, or even in a HHSS. Though I have seen rare issues when an UQ seemed too long for a given bridge set up and had to be fooled around with to avoid a side gap, but it's just a matter of getting the lengths matched. But there often can be some fiddle factor with your type set up.

Thing is, seems to me like you already know all the tricks, so I can't think of anything to offer. It was snugged tight enough, I'm sure?
01-12-2014, 17:03
kwpapke

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyBob58

(forgive me in advance, but I can't resist) Yes, the fact that I never saw such a "fiddle factor" call for help(so to speak) from you when you used the HHSS? ;)

I've been thinking the same thing. I think I've been spoiled by all these years of using pads. When you put the HHSS together, or insert a pad in a double-layered hammock there is simply no futzing with it. I had really high expectations that after taking out a second mortgage on my house to buy a set of quilts that I would immediately be wrapped in a cocoon of warmth...

If you look at my prior post, things went much better in a non-asym hammock. Strapped that quilt on, tied the suspensions together and my back was warm all night long. BUT, even at that I was not as warm as I thought I would be at 30 degrees last night. I think on a 11' hammock its easier to have the suspension too tight which compresses the down.

Jeezus, things were just a lot easier in the old days of the HHSS!
01-12-2014, 17:09
kwpapke

HH = Apple, UQ = PC

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwpapke

Jeezus, things were just a lot easier in the old days of the HHSS!

BTW, one can draw an interesting parallel: HH = Apple (closed system), UQ = PC (open system, you make it work). HH sells and tests all the components together. There is real value in this for the beginner or for someone whose life is not about tweaking the components.

OTOH, JRB has to make their quilts to work with ANY hammock. I expect my MW3 to work equally well with my HH Explorer UL, WBBB, and now my 11' Streamliner. That's a tall order.

--Kurt
01-25-2014, 13:28
jimmytheshirt

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwpapke

Tried out my brand-spanking new MW3 + Sniveler this weekend @ 24F. I should note I am a quilt newbie - have been a pad and mummy bag guy for 6 years, and finally took the plunge to lighten/shrink my load.

No problems with the Sniveler - setup was easy, and it performed flawlessly. Used it as a Serape in the morning while having coffee and breakfast, really nice and toasty!

The problem was the MW3 setup. It took me a few tries to get the end drawcord tension just right: loose enough to maximize shoulder coverage, tight enough to not have any end air gaps, but I figured it out and next time should be a snap. The big problem: the side loops on the MW3 do not match the BB side tieout points. I ended up unzipping the bugnet and yanking the left side of the quilt all night long to keep from getting cold shoulders, and experienced CBS several times during the night due to bottom gaps in the quilt. The root cause of the problem appears to be maintaining lateral tension in the quilt and keeping it in position for a diagonal lay, particularly when tossing and turning during the night.

I did a little searching on HF and it seem like many folks find a way to clip the quilt sides to the hammock, e.g. Dutch quilt clips. Is this the only viable solution to the problem? One of the (probably stupid) ideas I thought of after I got back was to run a line between the quilt side loops up over the top of the ridgeline, maybe with some tensioners. This could be done with very little weight penalty as only a very lightweight line should be needed.

I am a little reluctant to have my wife sew clips or loops onto the hammock until I've optimized the position of the quilt on the long axis for maximum shoulder coverage. I've thought about maybe supergluing a loop on the hammock, then securing the quilt with an S-biner.

Am I missing something painfully obvious?

--Kurt

Take a look at arrowhead equipment triangle thingies. They have helped my issues with uq gaps. Ymmv
01-25-2014, 19:34
kwpapke

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimmytheshirt

Take a look at arrowhead equipment triangle thingies. They have helped my issues with uq gaps. Ymmv

I bought a set of the Dutch ridgeline clips, but haven't made it out to the field with my WBBB and tried them yet.
02-01-2014, 00:08
heyyou

Also new to UQs, I'm using the JRB UQ Suspension bungee cords hung from the ridge line.
02-02-2014, 10:34
kwpapke

Might be a good idea for a 11' hammock too

Quote:

Originally Posted by heyyou

Also new to UQs, I'm using the JRB UQ Suspension bungee cords hung from the ridge line.

I was thinking of trying that on my 11' hammock. The JRB shock cords, if hung from the hammock suspension, is way too taut which flattens the down. Hanging from the ridgeline would decrease the tension and give more of a lateral pull as well. This of course all presupposes one has a ridgeline on the hammock...