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So I wanted to use the Garda Hitch on my HH, and I wanted the rings to be underneath the tarp, and I didn't want to make any permanent mods to the hammock, and I wanted everything to be in one piece so I wouldn't leave anything at the campsite...and I figured out one way to do it.
http://www.tothewoods.net/HomemadeGearHHGarda.html
Might have to test this one out in the field!
Comments? Improvements?
There were no pics at all. Just thought I'd let you know.
Hrm...the website seems to be running slow, but they both showed up for me. Try refreshing, or right-click and "show picture" and see if that helps.
That is a great way of keeping the rings under the tarp and not cutting the stock line. It would be easy to transfer the rings to the biner if the distance between trees was too long to double the line up.
Looks good. I've had my eye on that Garda Hitch every since it was first posted. I like it! Think I will use it on my sons hammock...
i'll have to come back to this (interesting). i can't get jeff's site at all right now.
THAT'S EXACTLY THE KIND OF SYSTEM I'VE BEEN LOOKING FOR!!!!!
I wanted to set my hammock up knot free, but was skeptical about hitchcraft and didn't want to have to make the jump to strapping. I'll give this a try for sure.
Could you simply clip the rings into the carabiner -- or connect them to the biner with a short length of cord -- and then use the hammock suspension cord to tie the garda hitch into the rings? Or am I missing something fundamental?Quote:
Originally Posted by Just Jeff
Also, what do you do in the case where the tree hugger straps are not long enough to circle the tree? With the standard Hennessy lashing I can simply span the gap with the suspension line.
Finally, how do you release the Garda hitch? Do you leave the line through the loops and simply loosen it or do you unthread it entirely.
No, the rings have to be held tightly together on the opposite side of the Garda hitch. Using the short cord would work though.
You don't even need the carabiner, you could leave that off if the straps don't reach all the way around. Then loop the suspension rope through both ends and back down to the rings.
With the carabiner you don't have to undo the garda hitch, just release the carabiner and remove the straps from the tree.
That would be true with Just Jeff's method where the rings are tied to the end of the hammock line. The possible issue I see with this is that doubling the hammock line back on itself means you reduce by approximately half the amount you can shorten the line, giving less flexibility in the spacing between trees when hanging the hammock.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrprez
The modification I was thinking about, connecting the rings to the biner with a short line and using the hammock line to tie the garda hitch, would eliminate that issue, but removes the flexibility of being able to run the cord through the tree huggers in the case where the tree hugger doesn't circle the entire tree.
Maybe this is all obvious but I am trying to work this all out in my head.
Also, I know nothing about climbing gear. What would I need to buy for the rings and the carabiners?
you could cut the line of the hh past 8" or so(i know jeff's point was to keep it stock) you could attach the rings to this short 8" piece, then you can tie the remaining line (or replacement) permanently to one tree strap loop so you have one long strap/line suspension piece. put a biner in the free end of the tree strap and thread the rings with the free end of the line. this enables the rings to be under the tarp, you can use a single strand of line and eliminates the the worry of a short tree strap, and since there's a biner on the end, you just unclip from the tree and leave the line in the rings. still all one piece. this is the exact method most people use with ring/cinch buckles. it does require you cut the line though, which you might not want to do until you were sure you liked the garda hitch. it would be easy to try jeffs way to see if you like the garda, that way if you don't, you still have the stock susp.
http://www.rei.com/product/471123
http://www.rei.com/product/764094
There are other ways to do it. Jeff's method is really for those hesitant to cut the stock suspension line. What you could do is to cut that line and tie the rings directly to that and then make new straps that run from the tree down to the hammock. You'd just need a loop in one end. Hook the biner in that, go around the tree once or twice and back through the biner and then down to the rings. Tie the garda hitch and finish off with a half hitch for safety.
WBG beat me to it....
This is what I am thinking now, which I can do without cutting the stock cord:
I can attach two rings to a biner with a short piece of cord, then use the hammock cord to make the Garda hitch in the rings. To set up I would wrap the tree hugger around the tree, thread one end through the opposite loop to snug the tree hugger against the tree, clip the biner onto the hanging loop and tighten the Garda hitch.
In the event I have to hang from a tree too large for the tree hugger to go completely around, I could simply undo the Garda hitch and run the hammock cord through the two loops and tie the standard Hennessy lashing.
Both of these choices would keep the biner away from the tree and remove any chance of it damaging the tree.
When I look at the choices of cord on the REI site it rates them all in kN. What rating would I need for the cord tying the rings to the biner?
I've gone back to a simple set up. Eliminate the rings and if you want to eliminate the carabiner. Just use a slipped buntline knot hitched directly through your tree hugger loops or carabiner. Does require retying a knot for adjustment. But the knot is quick and easy to tie. No more effort than a Garda hitch to tie. With the rings (44gm total weight) and CampNano (46gm total weight) the suspension package had gained a few ounces. Choice either for the slick quick adjustablity of the Garda hitch on rings or a save few ounces.
I went back to a non Garda hitch due to some concern regarding flattening of and the slippery nature of the suspension line on the Blackbird. AmSteel blue. Not sure if this flattening is of any importance regarding long term structural integrity of the line.
afreeman, that will work well too.
koaloah, don't think the flattening of the line is really bad for it, it will not stay that way permanently in my experience. the buntline is pretty darn fast, good point about being able to tie it directly to a webbing loop too, i've not used it that way yet.
Glad to see the Garda Hitch getting some press! Works well with stock HH suspension lines in any number of configurations. Simple, easy. I'm a fan!:D
Bump - just updated the page with a couple other methods.
http://www.tothewoods.net/HomemadeGearHHGarda.html
affreeman - sorry I didn't see your questions when you posted them but it looks like they were answered. One note, though - the prussik adaptor slides up and down the spectra, so the line doesn't have to be doubled up for its entire length. If the tree are really far apart, just slide the prussik closer to the end...this should take a lot less cord than using the Figure-8 lash so you'll still be ahead of the stock system. But the stock system is still intact so you're no worse off than when you started.
Same deal for the clove hitch system that's on the page now.
One strength I like about these systems is that I don't remove any pieces during setup or teardown. It's all one piece...no threading, no looping, etc - just one click of the biner on each end, then pull to adjust. Of course, the cost for this convenience is weight.
And there are obviously other ways to do it...your cord method is one. I'd use a double larkshead on the rings to keep them stable rather than just tying them on, though. And then if you want to cut the spectra, it gets even lighter.
My first post in 2009...Happy New Year!!
my first post too---HNY---about that garda setup....what i'm trying is even simplier--camp biner ,loose smc rings on small end,strap loop on bigger end---then i can use HH cord stock, or speer strap stock with same strap and biner ...
I saw a pic of someone doing that once. Does it work well? No slippage? Do you have pics?
maybe have pics in a few days---waiting for the descending rings to show up--have a few nanos around since they came out--real nice little biner, and the small end looks like it will pressure the rin gs together under tension....if not, then plan B is just clamp the rings together w/a little spec. cord on the inside...big thing is i can hitch w/strap or cord and not alter stock hammock in case i need the length...sounds like it will work anyway.
What would you do if you were using the SS and needed to clip the UC to the support line? I can't remember how far out it clips on, I'll have to set it up and measure it. I thought if there was a way to add a clip to the rings so the UC could clip to that it would be pretty handy.
This doesn't interfere with JRB-style underquilt suspension.
Hello...first post here, though I've been lurking for quite a while. I've been hanging now for almost a year, and I really don't want to ever camp again without a hammock! This is an awesome site and I've learned a lot here.
Anyway, I've been wanting to simplify and speed up my setup. I noticed the garda hitch with ring buckle technique, and read completely through the ring buckle thread (whew...) along with several others. I just used this system (biner on one end of the tree hugger, rings on the other end, suspension line in garda hitch to rings) while I slept in the back yard this weekend, and noticed that the garda hitch was pretty hard to release from the buckles. I use a HH Explorer deluxe with some pretty thick support cord which pinched pretty flat between the rings, making loosening even more difficult. I was able to work it apart eventually, but I'm thinking that this significantly reduces the "simple and quick" advantages of this system.
I've been unable to find any solutions to the above problem except Grizz's block-and-tackle idea which would also affect the "simple and quick" goals. I may be setting up too tightly, but if I don't, the ridge line and bug netting sags quite a bit. I tried to pull a bight through like was mentioned with webbing on the ring buckle thread, but the cord tended to twist and kink, making it impossible to pull through the buckles. I haven't tried to simply unclip the biner from the hugger yet--is that a realistic option, or does anyone have any other ideas?
Thanks in advance!
Welcome to HF! You could change out that thick rope for another type that would be lighter and easier to use with the rings. Why are you taking the rope off the rings? I leave mine on there all the time. I just undo the biner and pack it all up and off I go.
The only things I have ever lost are tree huggers, when they were not tied to the hammock!
I stuff my hammock separate from the tarp and the huggers. If things are wet, I don't want to put a wet tree hugger in the bag with your dry hammock. So, before I leave a site, I double check to see if I've left one of my huggers.
I use the stock HH suspension line with rings, and I've yet to see the line get flattened. When I suspend the hammock, I haul it up until the ridgeline lifts the bugnet and starts to tighten up. You want it there, not too much tighter.
If you do that, you will be able to pull slack in the hammock to take the load off the rings, and untie the garda hitch.
That's the only time I take mine off as well, when they are wet or dirty. I can't tell you how many times I started to walk off with the huggers still hanging on a tree. Now, when I started to walk off, I stop and turn around and scan my whole campsite to make sure I didn't leave anything behind.Quote:
Originally Posted by MacEntyre
Thanks for the replies.
I do plan on leaving the rope in the rings so everything is one piece--that's one of the reasons I liked this system so much. I'd even thought of taking a ziplock or small stuff sack to put wet or dirty straps into, so I wouldn't have to remove them.
My problem was how to loosen the ring buckles, either for take down (still thinking I'd need to do this to be able to unhook the biner, but maybe not), or for adjustment one way or the other (moving the hammock more toward the foot end or head end), for changing direction of wind-driven rain for instance. I'd rather not be struggling with the rings while everything is getting soaked. :scared:
I did try to lighten up on the tension when I set up this time, but the bug net and ridge line hung much lower--not sure yet if that was all bad; I may have laid a bit flatter that way. One thing I didn't like was that I dropped down much more than usual, and with the strong, cold wind we had that night I wanted to be more up into the tarp.
I also thought about trading out the suspension rope, but I'm not sure what I should switch to. I'm 6'4" and 250#, so whatever it is, it should be pretty strong...:eek:
Thanks again for the help!
I am a big fan of Garda Hitch with rings. Use it exclusively with three (3) HH models. I sing its praises whenever I can.
I echo MacEntyre on how to take it down or adjust, and I pull my hammock as tight as it can get between the trees. I just had ZQ remove the velcro and sew up the bottom slit to make my hammock softer feeling under my legs. I have her Mod #2 so now I only top-load.
This is how I use the Garda Hitch:
1. Estimate distance between trees and get both ends of the stock suspension rope Garda Hitched into the ring buckles. Use a bight (sp) in the line for easier release later. FYI, I use SMC descending rings. Bought them online from someplace in Seattle. I have girth hitched two rings to the end of each tree-hugger, which I wrap around the tree and clip through a lightweight 'biner. Each tree has a tree-hugger, lightweight 'biner and two SMC descending rings.
2. Start tightening the hammock from one end, then walk across to the other end. Make sure its pretty centered, then tighten up, back and forth until you like the spacing between the trees. I make sure to fuss around as much as possible to satisfy my inner OCD gremlins!
3. Sit in the hammock as a lounger/chair to stretch the suspension some. Maybe 1 minute of sitting.
4. Tighten lines again.
5. If happy with suspension, confirm tightness, finish with a half-hitch and continue on to tarp and load gear. Sweet dreams! If not happy, adjust using this method . . .
6. To loosen the Garda Hitch, I pull the hammock with my right hand towards the tree. I grasp the hammock on the material between the zip-tie and where the rope goes into the end material. It's basically the material that covers the end whipping. This gives me enough "purchase" on the horizontal hammock suspension to create some slack in the suspension and takes some tension off the Garda Hitch. I can then grasp the end of the bight line with my left hand and more easily pull the bight through the rings and loosen the Garda Hitch. This is very difficult to do without taking tension off the rings. I don't always get the entire bight out through the rings with the pull, but by then I have so much slack that I can open the rings with my fingers and remove the rope.
7. Voila, Garda Hitch undone!
Good luck and welcome to HF! :)
Thanks for the welcome, everyone. Kinda weird, though--I've been reading this forum for almost a year and I feel like I know you all pretty well already!:blush:
Anyway, thanks, Javaman, for that description. Makes a lot of sense. I think, though, for your technique to work for me I'd need to move the rings onto the hammock suspension rope, instead of the treehuggers they are currently mounted on, but maybe I wouldn't need to do that--I have a pretty long reach. I went that way mainly to have as much adjustability as possible. I also tried to pull a bight through the rings, but the line twisted as I pulled and the kinks that formed would not go through the rings no matter what I did.
I'll have to hang it again and try it out. Won't get to do that again until Saturday, though. :(
There's been a lot written on HF about that. With a structural ridgeline, the hammock is going to be no flatter for making the ridgeline tighter. It just makes the ridgeline, you know, tighter.Quote:
Originally Posted by Javaman
I do the opposite, hanging the hammock loose and low initially. I raise the hammock by tightening the suspension through the rings, until the ridgeline just becomes tight. Then I adjust the height of each end of the hammock (I like it slightly head-end low) by moving the huggers up or down on the trees.
I find that when I suspend the hammock this way, it tends to stay where I put it, so there is no need to sit in it, then adjust again.
Good input. Thanks. I have often thought I am not getting the best comfort or most natural position in the hammock due to how tight I have the suspension. That's one reason I has ZQ pull out the velcro. That, and I don't use the bottom entrance anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by MacEntyre
I'll try your suggestions next time out and see how it goes!
Thanks again.
The rope does twist around sometimes. That's why I don't always pull that bight all the way through. I'll get it most of the way pulled through and then just open up the rings and take it out.Quote:
Originally Posted by bonsaihiker
Try it out and see if it works any better for you. Let us know what you learn! :)
Awesome thread, JJ!
I've now updated my HH rig using this method. :cool:
Ok, I'll play with the hang a bit. I'm sure that will make a big difference. I may have been expecting a bit too much from this system, though it is indeed a very nice system...
I just got back from Harbor Freight with some ratchet straps that will be soon cannibalized for the webbing, and while I was there I noticed the "Big" Figure 9's. I had no idea that they came that "Big." 300 pound capacity--now THAT might hold me. I picked up a couple, and might experiment with that as well. There would be no difficulty undoing that suspension, that's for sure. But, I would not be able to keep everything together as one piece.
Thanks again, everyone, for your time.
Be careful! I used those big Figure-9's exactly ONE (1) time and had to send my hammock back to Hennessey to have the ropes replaces. The teeth chewed right through my main suspension ropes. :scared: That's how I came to the garda hitch with rings. There are plenty of big threads here on modifying the figure-9's to not have teeth, but it became easier for me to just do the garda hitch.Quote:
Originally Posted by bonsaihiker
Wow, that's good to know, thanks for the heads-up. I did read the Figure 9 thread--well, most of it--and I saw all the modifications. FWIW, what I picture is attaching the ring to the HH suspension rope, and using another line of some kind from the tree hugger to the "teeth." I was going to experiment with it, but I'm really hoping to get the rings/garda hitch working for me. I may consider going with webbing to the rings, however. That sounds easier to remove.
So . . . what line would be good for me to use with the Garda hitch? I would attach the rings to the hammock support, and run the line from the huggers to the rings. I'm 250 lbs, BTW. Any suggestions? I've seen lots of names thrown around, but I'm not sure what would be best. Would there be a good line to use with the fig. 9? A good one that would work for either?
Thanks!
I have not tested any other suspension ropes than those that came with my HH. I tried webbing but it was heavier and bulkier for me. I know there are some threads about different suspension ropes . . .some about amsteel blue. Try a broad search for that or maybe another member will chime in. Also check the JRB site, and the Speer site for some other ideas.Quote:
Originally Posted by bonsaihiker
I've tried unsheathed woven cord (Vectran 12 and Amsteel Blue) through the garda hitch. In both cases the pinching of the rings flattens the cord. Really flattens it. I don't like the looks of it when applied in the same spot time after time (back yard hang), although I don't know that it necessarily weakens the cord. So I use instead a sheathed core cord---Spyderline---in the 3.8mm diameter size. It is heavier than the woven braids I listed, but does not appear to be damaged by the pinching.Quote:
Originally Posted by bonsaihiker
Grizz
Cool--thanks for the replies. I'll probably check into the spyderline. Maybe it would be easier to deal with.
I got a chance to hang the hammock again last night, and tried different configurations, and different techniques. The Hennessey cord is definitely hard to undo, even before sitting in the hammock, with any bit of tension at all, and I just can't figure out the knack for loosening with one hand while I pull on the hammock with the other. The main frustration is the lack of the ability to easily readjust the position of the hammock while setting up.
I also tried using the Harbor Freight webbing from tree to rings (rings attached to hammock support line with anchor hitch) and this seemed much simpler, and easier to release, though still harder to undo than the hammock cord. I tried pulling the webbing 90 deg. and still couldn't release it easily, but it was definitely easier. I haven't weighed the different systems, but that webbing seems pretty light weight.
Anyway, I really appreciate the help, everyone. What a great forum!
Hey folks, new guy here. Thought I would bump this thread as I would like to use this supension method as my main setup.
Are folks still using this setup? Is this ring setup better than running the webbing through the rings, in terms of slippage? Does the rope slip at all in the rings?
Thanks all.
brief hammock bio: A month ago I bought a Byer Amazonas at REI to camp with after my last trip where I got like 6 hours of sleep over two nights sleeping on the ground....I like the hammock, the fabric is nice and comfy. Immediately started looking into how to stay warm/dry, and then entered the DIY world by just making some simple whipped end hammocks out of 1.9 oz. ripstop. Have made two hammocks so far, the kids can't get enough of them.
Much thanks to Just Jeff and Risk, their webpages are stuffed with great info.
Looking forward to the forum...thanks.
What's your recommendation for a descending ring? There were quite a few options... and we don't have a REI here. The one from Whoopiesling.com is out of stock... Your advice would greatly appreciated.
I've used this with my HH for the last 3+ years, including during my 6-month AT thru-hike. I have a loop of Amsteel Blue larks-headed to the descender rings and then clipped into a carabiner. The biner is clipped onto the tree-hugger. I used the stock cord on the HH to make the garda hitch through the descender rings. When I first started using it I used to tie a slippery half-hitch in the cord as a safety, but soon quit doing that. They have never slipped for me.Quote:
Originally Posted by priller
Great, thanks for the intel...Quote:
Originally Posted by affreeman