WOW! BMBH Deluxe with Neoair All Season air Pad

Wow, Just got my new BMBH deluxe and using a Neoair All season 25" wide air pad in the sleeve, it is awesome. I lay completley flat, no squeeze at all, and nice views out and so comfy. I even just deflate the pad and just leave it in the sleeve and roll the whole thing up and fits right into the included BMBH stuff sack. Really excited to test it out next week on the Superior Hiking Trail for a few days.


The second photo is BMBH under the JRB 10 x 11 tarp in baker hut mode. Really like this pitch with a bridge. Picked up the tarp on a package deal with the hammock, great combo.

Thanks Jack's for the awesome bridge and tarp!

Wow looks like a lot of space, very nice.

Ya it really does have a lot of room. I can lay on my side and go into a full fetal postion with my knees up. I am pretty short at 5'7, so I am sure that helps.:)

Sleeping on your side? In a fetal position? Now you've got my attention!

With that NeoAir pad I am wondering if you will even need an underquilt. Is it the ThermaRest Pad? Because I use a Neoair ThermaRest Pad whenever I bust out the ol tent and it keeps me warm against the frozen ground.

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Originally Posted by XTrekker

With that NeoAir pad I am wondering if you will even need an underquilt. Is it the ThermaRest Pad? Because I use a Neoair ThermaRest Pad whenever I bust out the ol tent and it keeps me warm against the frozen ground.

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It is the neoair All season from Therm-a-rest, I think it has an r value of 4.7 and is 1 pound 9 oz. I picked up from Back country Gear last week, it was on sale for $110but it was 2nds, which had a slight cosmetic blemish, but fully functional and warrantied by Therm-a-Rest.

http://www.backcountrygear.com/neoai...large-2nd.html

It will be interesting to see how low I can go with this.

What I really like is that my feet do not get forced togather in the natural "u" shape of hammock cut, instead I can have them in a more natural position and my shoulders have no contact with the hammock wall. It is like a floating 25" by 77" pad, but softer than laying directly on the ground.

That looks like a pretty sweet setup! Any other pics?

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Originally Posted by AdventureMyk

That looks like a pretty sweet setup! Any other pics?

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Thanks. I added another picture under the tarp.

That looks so comfortable. I want to go climb in my BMBH right now ZZZZZZ

The other nice thing about that setup is if you end up in an area with out trees you can set it up right on the ground with the pad in the sleeve and tie your suspension off your hiking poles to make a bug shelter.

Wow, thanks for the info! How is the stability? I'm really tempted to keep an eye out for one of these for use with my BMBH.

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Originally Posted by BillyBob58

Wow, thanks for the info! How is the stability? I'm really tempted to keep an eye out for one of these for use with my BMBH.

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The center of gravity is higher but I do not feel like it is tippy. Really gives a nice view out the side bug nets.

OK, I went out and got the same model neo-air mattress based on the comments in this thread. What a difference! WOW!!! Yes, center of gravity is higher and it is slightly less stable, but not unmanageable. Best part is that there is NO repeat NO shoulder squeeze. I attribute the good points on this to the design of the neo-air with the air tubes going from side to side (unlike old inflateable airmattresses that go from head to toe. The mattress just fits the underside pocket, although the material of the mattress does not slide easily.

I'll be takeing this setup with me on my Hudson Valley bike ride this coming week (31 July - 5 August). I hope to find suitable sites to hammock. That is not always easy since the bike tours like to use schools or open parks where you can pitch lots of tents in limited space.

I hope to take photos and report back on my experiance. :)

VATriker

Practice pitching it on the ground. It's really easy once you get the hang of it and it you use trekking poles you should be able to pitch your tarp too.

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Originally Posted by VATriker

OK, I went out and got the same model neo-air mattress based on the comments in this thread. What a difference! WOW!!! Yes, center of gravity is higher and it is slightly less stable, but not unmanageable. Best part is that there is NO repeat NO shoulder squeeze. I attribute the good points on this to the design of the neo-air with the air tubes going from side to side (unlike old inflateable airmattresses that go from head to toe. The mattress just fits the underside pocket, although the material of the mattress does not slide easily.

I'll be takeing this setup with me on my Hudson Valley bike ride this coming week (31 July - 5 August). I hope to find suitable sites to hammock. That is not always easy since the bike tours like to use schools or open parks where you can pitch lots of tents in limited space.

I hope to take photos and report back on my experiance. :)

VATriker

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This has been a very enlightening thread. Do either of you guys so far notice any comfort decrease compared to using this hammock with no pad? I realize- as I already realized with my own pad/BMBH experiments, that some aspects of comfort ( shoulder room and overall width) can actually improve.

But have you noticed any negatives comfort wise compared to no pad at all? Have either of you slept over night with this pad/hammock combo yet? You know, some folks sweat terrible using pads in hammocks. Others feel a pad interferes with the way hammock fabric comtours to your body, decresing comfort even if still way better than a pad on the ground. Any problems with either of those areas?

Are you going to have any cold spots ( elbows maybe?) with this 25" wide pad?

One thing: however cold you might be able to go with this 4.7 R factor pad, if you needed more it would be a simple matter of adding a 1/8--- 1/4 to 1/2" piece of CCF under the Neoair. Probably just torso length and maybe only 20" wide would be needed. Doing that, I suspect you could take this hammock to just about any temperature that might be encountered. But, a good question is: how low will the 4.7R Neoair take a person?

EDIT: R value is 4.9

I too am really liking this thread .. keep the positives and negatives coming .. I was on the phone with Jack {PeterPan} discussing this hammock .. I plan on using this for a deep winter hike .. looking at temps as low as -40*F .. so I'll utilize a pad .. the Exped Downmat 9 with an R8 value coupled with an UQ. .. I want a pad for the possibility of a blizzard condition ..

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Originally Posted by Black Wolf

...looking at temps as low as -40*F .. so I'll utilize a pad .. the Exped Downmat 9 with an R8 value coupled with an UQ. .. I want a pad for the possibility of a blizzard condition ..

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My experience carrying that pad and using with an UQ (with a DL gathered end) is that there was essentially no benefit to using both together. Sounds to me that the bridge is perfect for that sort of pad. The Exped 9dlx pad is SO warm, you likely won't need, or want, anything else. The UQ could help cut down on wind convection, but that would probably work better with a light, thin closed cell on bottom. But, then, I don't know how much else you can get in the pad sleeve with that pad - which is thicker and wider than the Neo.

I just took a mid-morning nap in a bridge hammock. Good to see yours all rigged up and ready to go!

Sorry for taking so long to reply, I just got back from a few days up on the Superior Hiking Trail in Northern Minnesota and used this set up. It worked great, and had a nice 45 degree night on Friday - Saturday and was very warm under me using the Neo Air all season, and did not feel any hint of a cold spots. Could easily have gone lower, so it will be interesting to test in a few months. As for comparing it using it with or without a the pad I think it very subjective and will vary by user. The BMBH is comfortable both ways, and is completely flat, but for me, using the pad is the only way to go. I just like the room it gives and softness of the air pad. The way the neoair is built with the horizontal air baffles like VATriker mentioned and being 2.5" thick filled with air all combined with the design of the BMBH makes for the perfect set up for me at least. It is really fool proof, the pad stays in one spot, and if I have to go to the ground, there is no problems.

I attached a few photos of my hang on my trip, and one of the BMBH in it's bag. Keep in mind that the neoair never leaves the pad pocket, I just deflate and roll it all back up and still fits into the original BMBH bag (the tree straps are also in the bag).

Like Billybob mentioned, one may have issue with there arms bumping into the sidewalls above the pad at night if it is real cold since the pad is only bellow you. It all would depend on how wide ones shoulders are. The walls are held out the width of the pad (25"), so if you can stay within that width, and do not bump the sides, it should work. I think you could easily have some small CCF wings at the arm locations if it became an issue. I will report back this fall as temps start dropping here in Minnesota and update with my results.


thanks,
Chewy

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Originally Posted by chewbacca

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I attached a few photos of my hang on my trip, and one of the BMBH in it's bag. Keep in mind that the neoair never leaves the pad pocket, I just deflate and roll it all back up and still fits into the original BMBH bag (the tree straps are also in the bag).

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Pretty amazing!

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Like Billybob mentioned, one may have issue with there arms bumping into the sidewalls above the pad at night if it is real cold since the pad is only bellow you. It all would depend on how wide ones shoulders are. The walls are held out the width of the pad (25"), so if you can stay within that width, and do not bump the sides, it should work. I think you could easily have some small CCF wings at the arm locations if it became an issue. ......

thanks,
Chewy

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And maybe CCF would only be needed for one side(if at all), you could just scrunch up against the one side and most likely the other side would never make contact except for the really broad shouldered.

You know, I think I am about ready to order one of these. Definitely if I see a good price somewhere.

Just got back from 6 day trip in bwca using this setup. Believe I suggested this pad to the OP. For me I can go both ways. If its warm enough I like to go padless and like the way the hammock conforms around me. But it's equally comfortable in a different manner with the pad in. Definitely like the versatility a pad offers and I've been down to low 20s with out issue in it. Could go lower but I haven't tested that.

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Originally Posted by cfi on the fly

Just got back from 6 day trip in bwca using this setup. Believe I suggested this pad to the OP. For me I can go both ways. If its warm enough I like to go padless and like the way the hammock conforms around me. But it's equally comfortable in a different manner with the pad in. Definitely like the versatility a pad offers and I've been down to low 20s with out issue in it. Could go lower but I haven't tested that.

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At 25 oz and low volume even in full length, good to at least low 20s and maybe lower. All set for the ground. Much less worry ( zero worries? ) about keeping rain/spray/fog from hitting your hammock bottom, and fewer issues with wind I suspect. Sounds better by the minute!

But I can see some possible pros and cons. You mention liking the way the hammock conforms around you. I often, while sleeping on my side, lean my back into the sides of the BMBH. When I use my JRB MWUQs, my back is well insulated. This position probably would not be as well covered with a pad. Also, I have recently been claiming I suspected it might be easier to avoid drafts using a TQ in the BMBH. The shape and that infamous narrowness in the shoulders actually seems to be of help with keeping the TQ tucked. Gaining more shoulder room due to the pad might interfere with this benefit. Or not!

I just spent a week using my BMBHing a bicycle tour of the Hudson Valley (Albany NY to NYC). I found suitable sites to hang the hammock for all but one night. The Therm-a-rest NEOAIR makes a big difference in flattening the sleeping surface but does have drawbacks. The NEOAIR is just too warm for hot summer nights! Also, stability decreases when you pump-up the neo-air. Very manageable but you have to really be aware of what you are doing.

I wonder if a bridge hammock could be designed specifically for use with a NEOAIR (or similar pad)? If so, it would need to be deeper and the sidewalls would need some sort of wind block/insulation.

Tree straps turned out to be my biggest problem (stretch). JRB's Tri-glides work well but are not as easy to use as I Like. At least J RB's straps don't stretch and so wound up being my go-to straps for this outing.

Whoopee slings are one modification I made to the BMBH and they really improved ease of use. Highly recommend this solution.

I used a Chinook 12 x 9.6 tarp and it worked perfect for the BMBH and was within my budget. The seams on the tarp come presealed with some sort of tape. I was lucky, it did not rain on the ride so I did not really experience the full use of the tarp.

One item that worked out well was a diver's changing mat. Divers use it on the beach when they are changing into/out of their scuba gear. It is woven plastic, keeps the dirt down and feet clean.

Overall, I am very happy with the BMBH and NEOAIR combination. Can't wait until it gets colder to see how well the combination works. :)

I have attached some photos of the hammock in use. You can also see in the photos my bike (a recumbent tricycle) and other gear including tarp and diver's mat.

VATriker (Stu)
Woodbridge, VA

Man that thing looks awesome!

Chewbacca .. would you know .. or possibly speculate ...if you used the jrb Medium speed sleeves [•When Filled: 6 inches diameter, 13 inches long]
would the BMBH Deluxe with the Neo-air mattress fit inside the sleeve .. as it does the supplied suff sack .. thanks Glenn in Phx.

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Originally Posted by gpshay

Chewbacca .. would you know .. or possibly speculate ...if you used the jrb Medium speed sleeves [•When Filled: 6 inches diameter, 13 inches long]
would the BMBH Deluxe with the Neo-air mattress fit inside the sleeve .. as it does the supplied suff sack .. thanks Glenn in Phx.

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Hey Glen,
No I do not think it would. The BMBH Bag is about 12" x18" (when empty and laid out flat) and it just fits the sack with leaving the 25" wide neo air all season in the pocket. Take a measurement of your speed sleeve laid flat and see how it compares in size.

I slept in my Bridge w/ my Large Neo Air last night and didn't care for it.

I don't like the Neo fully inflated so using it partially inflated allowed the pad to form a "V" length-wise. Just wasn't as comfy as the other way but not horrible, by any means.

On the plus side I had no shoulder squeeze!

Oh, there was one more thing about it - if it is cold out I'll definitely feel it when I touch the sides, vs my UQ which is warm as can be when I toss n turn.

I sure do like that hammock, though.

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Originally Posted by Funny Money

I slept in my Bridge w/ my Large Neo Air last night and didn't care for it.

I don't like the Neo fully inflated so using it partially inflated allowed the pad to form a "V" length-wise. Just wasn't as comfy as the other way but not horrible, by any means.

On the plus side I had no shoulder squeeze!

Oh, there was one more thing about it - if it is cold out I'll definitely feel it when I touch the sides, vs my UQ which is warm as can be when I toss n turn.

I sure do like that hammock, though.

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I use a BMBH Deluxe and also had the same "V" issue when my NeoAir pad was under inflated. Course, when it was over inflated the whole rig seemed a bit 'tippy'. It wasn't tippy, but seemed so...

Fortunately i have managed to find that "Goldilocks" inflation measure a few times too - and that provides a great night's sleep for me. No shoulder squeeze, no 'tippyness' -- Just Right! Next I have to figure how many breaths that takes for me.

As for the cold-sides issue ( probably exists in any hammock) well my TQ is wide and wraps me to avoid that - but I know what you speak of! Someday I'm going to use both the NeoAir AND a UQ -- ahhhh :)

I have typically filled the neoair all the way up and then just reach around while laying in it and just let a little air out to find that perfect inflation. I think I keep enough air to avoid the V effect. I have a fairly small shoulder girth so touching the sides has not been much of an issue. I am now getting an underquilt to handle the colder season here in Minnesota. I found at least for me, the All season started to bottom out just bellow freezing. The nice thing about the BMBH is that is comfortable both ways with or without a pad, and of course with a underquilt. The Jacks also make some great underquilts that fit like a glove to this hammock. Nice to have all the options.

Chewy

Have any of you tried this with the regular size 20" x 72" Neo Air? I wonder if that would allow you to lay a little lower in the hammock, but still reduce shoulder squeeze?

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Originally Posted by chewbacca

Wow, Just got my new BMBH deluxe and using a Neoair All season 25" wide air pad in the sleeve, it is awesome. I lay completley flat, no squeeze at all, and nice views out and so comfy. I even just deflate the pad and just leave it in the sleeve and roll the whole thing up and fits right into the included BMBH stuff sack.

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Where I'm going hiking, I have to go to ground every now and then, so this is a very interesting combination.
But carrying too much weight on my back doesn't appeal, so:
Chewbacca, how much does the BMBH deluxe/Neoair All season combo weigh?

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Originally Posted by markrvp

Have any of you tried this with the regular size 20" x 72" Neo Air? I wonder if that would allow you to lay a little lower in the hammock, but still reduce shoulder squeeze?

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I have used this idea, as I have a regular neo air and an xtherm (both 20" wide the xtherm is tapered). As for shoulder squeeze, it works perfect for me... No shouder squeeze at all. I have found that a great combo for fall so far (I just got my BMBH) is using the regular neo air (r value of around 2, help here?) And putting a grey lock 3 underneath. this combo works great as i found the xtherm to be way too hot. And the bonus is you have the insulation up the sides! For deep winter I may use the xtherm/mt. Washington combo, but I suspect it will be way too hot still, so I will probably still be using the old neo air still.

I typically sleep on my side with my legs extended, so I'm thinking the BMBH with the NeoAir pad may be just what I need.

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Originally Posted by markrvp

I typically sleep on my side with my legs extended, so I'm thinking the BMBH with the NeoAir pad may be just what I need.

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I use the wide Neo-Air pad (26"); but, Torso Length. Under that, I may, optionally, also supplement with a Full-length Thermarest Z-Fold or a wallyworld CCF pad.

Side sleeping and "4" works well...Ahhhh:)

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Originally Posted by Karl

Where I'm going hiking, I have to go to ground every now and then, so this is a very interesting combination.
But carrying too much weight on my back doesn't appeal, so:
Chewbacca, how much does the BMBH deluxe/Neoair All season combo weigh?

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Neo Air All Season 25" wide is 25 oz
BMBH Deluxe with Spreader bars 39 oz
Total....64oz or 4 Pounds

Those having and issue or concern with the sides getting a little chilly. Have you seen this from ENO. Its called HotSpot Hammock Sleeping Pad Wings. Should be fairly easy to make one cheap. Course you could also purchase them from REI Link.

http://www.rei.com/media/ll/feb0c7aa...f99813a157.jpg

I have one (ENO Hotspot). Works OK with a gathered end hammock and standard width (20 in) pad. Won't work with a BMBH deluxe unless you use the pad inside the hammock and you don't use the sleeve intended for use with pads. Also does not work with NEOAIR All Season because of the width of the All-Season pad.

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Originally Posted by chewbacca

Neo Air All Season 25" wide is 25 oz
BMBH Deluxe with Spreader bars 39 oz
Total....64oz or 4 Pounds

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Thanks chewbacca.

Hmmm, a tad heavy.
Have to think about that one.

VATriker, gotcha. I forgot the Deluxe has the pad pocket & you all where using it. Wonder if you could make something similar that would hang down from the walls on the inside of the hammock.

By the way, really like your setup, pretty darn sweet!

This is my current section hiking setup too - BMBH with full size All Season NeoAir in the pocket. I would say I have gone down to mid 30's with it so far. Just the pad and a Western Mountaineering Ultralite sleeping bag rated for 20 degrees. The bag is a full zip so i use it like a quilt. I start with the pad fully inflated and then let air out once in the hammock. The pad is a pain to get into the pocket because it has a slip resistent coating on it. So far the pad has been warm no matter how much air has been let out.

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Originally Posted by tdilf

This is my current section hiking setup too - BMBH with full size All Season NeoAir in the pocket. I would say I have gone down to mid 30's with it so far. Just the pad and a Western Mountaineering Ultralite sleeping bag rated for 20 degrees. The bag is a full zip so i use it like a quilt. I start with the pad fully inflated and then let air out once in the hammock. The pad is a pain to get into the pocket because it has a slip resistent coating on it. So far the pad has been warm no matter how much air has been let out.

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The neoair allseaon is a little sticky getting into the pocket. I just leave my in the bmbh and let the air out and stuff it all into the stuff sack. I started to get cool in the upper 20 s for me with the neoair allseason. I have been using my jrb MT Washington 3 uq with the lower temps and really like this set up too.

Chewy.

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Originally Posted by chewbacca

The neoair allseaon is a little sticky getting into the pocket. I just leave my in the bmbh and let the air out and stuff it all into the stuff sack. I started to get cool in the upper 20 s for me with the neoair allseason. I have been using my jrb MT Washington 3 uq with the lower temps and really like this set up too.

Chewy.

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An MW3 on a JRB bridge is a nice fit, don't you think? And my bet is has not failed to keep you warm at or above rated temps. None of that tricky business trying to get a particular quilt adjusted just right on a particular hammock, it just fits and works, least mine do.

But, I'm sure you don't have the abundant shoulder room that you had with the wide Neo Air. So how is that working out? If your at all like me, you have got to the point where you say " OK, it forces my shoulders into a curved position and I need my arms on my chest like Ed Sullivan ( any one know what I refer to? ), but who cares, I'm still comfy". Or then again, I just quickly turn on my side even if just a little.

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Originally Posted by BillyBob58

An MW3 on a JRB bridge is a nice fit, don't you think? And my bet is has not failed to keep you warm at or above rated temps. None of that tricky business trying to get a particular quilt adjusted just right on a particular hammock, it just fits and works, least mine do.

But, I'm sure you don't have the abundant shoulder room that you had with the wide Neo Air. So how is that working out? If your at all like me, you have got to the point where you say " OK, it forces my shoulders into a curved position and I need my arms on my chest like Ed Sullivan ( any one know what I refer to? ), but who cares, I'm still comfy". Or then again, I just quickly turn on my side even if just a little.

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Yep the underquiit fits like a glove. You are right, there is less shoulder space, but it is nice feeling being gently hugged by the BMBH and a down underquilt when temps start to drop. It is nice sleeping on your side as well, and kind of lean into one of the sides since the UQ come up high on each side. It is so flat, which I really like too. Both setup work well, and nice to have the two options. I do have to admit, I am really starting to like the way the uq feels with the BMBH.

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Originally Posted by chewbacca

I am really starting to like the way the uq feels with the BMBH.

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On the two night trip I did last winter [-15 deg F overnight low], I doubled up two UQs, an Old Rag Mountain with a Hudson River. The two quilts snugged up together perfectly without any compression of the baffles.

As a top quilt, I had a standard -20 F winter bag [MARMOT]. Along with a winter set-up of my JRB 10x11 tarp, I had plenty of remaining temperature margin.

One of the most underated aspects of the symmtrical design of the JRB BMBH, is the fact that with only a few pieces of gear I have enough insulation for a huge range of temps. Traditional sleeping bags work well as TQ in the BMBH. Traditional rectangular quilts [i.e. "non-differential cut"] can be used as either TQs or UQs. UQs can be doubled with ease.

Just a ton of flexibility and very little fiddle factor when it comes to suspending the UQ(s).

I mix and match the following:

• neoair all season pad
• mid weight fleece liner
• hudson river quilt
• old rag mountain quilt
• 3 season bag
• winter sleeping bag

Ever try and fit a lightweight partner in there with you?

Had mine out last Presidents Day weekend with this same set up in 7F weather and winds at 20mph. I have a 30F bag that I sleep inside the hammock. No problems except my nose. Warm without an UQ. It is doable.

Had to end our hike after two days because we could not keep water from freezing. But I was warm in my BMBH.

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Originally Posted by fullcount

Had mine out last Presidents Day weekend with this same set up in 7F weather and winds at 20mph. I have a 30F bag that I sleep inside the hammock. No problems except my nose. Warm without an UQ. It is doable.

Had to end our hike after two days because we could not keep water from freezing. But I was warm in my BMBH.

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OK, that's the way to do it! That is warmer than some have reported, very interesting. Was that with the Neoair all season pad mentioned in this thread? Or with the BA insulated pad or another?

Okay,

Now that you all have had a good cold winter to try out this setup I am wondering. How low did you go over the winter with just the Neoair pad in the BMBH? What did you do to go lower? I see several different suggestions and combinations listed in this thread so what worked? Have you encountered any new twists that might change your opinion about this combination?

This setup just sounds so cool and comfortable I am about positive that I need to purchase both :rolleyes:

Thanks again chewbacca for this great thread. :cool:

Stayed warm down to mid 30s with this setup. haven't yet tried anything lower yet. Used a high sierra TQ

I was getting cool bellow 30. I am a cold sleeper so others may be able to take it lower. This is a comfortable set up, and would recommended it. I ended up finding the bmbh with a 3/4 underquilt to be my set up choice now. With the Neo air it is like sleeping on a floating air mattress, but for me being a colder sleeper I found that the underquilt provided more warmth on all sides. They both have their pros and cons. Nice to have the options.

Thanks Chewy.