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I will start by saying hello cuz this is my first post on here but i have been reading the forum for quite a while now . I am an outdoorsman so to speak but have never messed with hammocks until now.
Just wondering what are the negatives of using para cord as suspension lines? I am brand new to hammocking but i have used a paracord prusik to make my hammock adjustable 2 times now and it seems to hold me fine. So i am wondering if maybe it doesnt hold up well or something like that?
it's not nearly strong enough and since it's nylon it will stretch alot more than polyester which is similar strength per weight but with alot less stretch
you'd want something with a tensile strength of over 1000 LBS, probably something closer to 1500 especially if you plan on tying knots in it
your best choices will be braided dyneema for cord (something like 7/64" amsteel blue) and polyester for webbing (1500-2000 LBS tensile for webbing)
I've been victim to the stretch of the paracord, especially when the stuff gets wet. I'm converting all my gear from paracord to amsteel. I never had any issues with the paracord failing, just needed more adjustments.
Welcome aboard, prepare for a new addiction.
Listen to Warbonnetguy he knows what he's talking about.
Plus, it really soaks up a lot of water when it rains.
I'm glad to see this asked because I was wondering the same thing. Thanks for the answers. Now time to make the wife mad and order some amsteel, lol.
Here's a good place to get amsteel.
http://www.reddenmarine.com/amsteel-blue
or dynaglide...
http://www.bishco.com/shop/Bishop/en...BOJk17cTDUK0dq
A higher strength rating is also safer because there are also dynamic forces at work, not just static forces. Getting in and out and moving around in the hammock can exert more than your weight on the suspension.
Count yourself lucky.Quote:
Originally Posted by CheeZe
There are numerous factors that degrade the supposed strength of lines AND increase the actual effective weight force. Together, these cause deaths and injuries in riggings. Professional riggers use rules of thumb for safety factors, such as 5-to-1 for this and 10-to-1 for that. Line strength-to-load weight.
Knots, bends, gear, splices, sharp angles, even wear-and-tear, and the like take strength out of a line. It can be reduced in strength up to 80%. Your 1,000 line is suddenly good for 200 lbs and you didn't realize it.
Amsteel seems to be one company that rates its line strength taking into account splices. I say good for them!
Hanging at anything other than straight down, with the line being vertical, increases the effective weight on the line due to the laws of physics and geometry. If you hang with your suspension lines at 30% down from horizontal (recommended) your weight is DOUBLED, but with half on each line. Thus if you are 200 lbs, you are putting 200 lbs of force on EACH of the two suspension lines. Actually, if you weigh 200 lbs, the total will be more due to your sleeping pad, bag, and whatever else you put in the hammock.
However, that's only if you don't so much as breath. Otherwise, you start to create dynamic weight, not just static weight. Think what a bathroom scale does when you step on it. You have to stand still for it to settle DOWN to your true weight. If you toss and turn in your hammock, you create shock (dynamic) weight for an instant or two. Suddenly, your 200 lbs of "actual" weight becomes 300 lbs, let's say.
Now, in this example, your 1,000 line is down to 200 lbs of strength and your 200 lb body is putting 300 lbs of effective force on the line.
Are you willing to risk your backbone over those roots and rocks you had to hang over? :scared:
It's your choice. Knowledge is power. :D
Rain Man
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The stretch of para cord is part of the strength. If it was solid line and it did not stretch under a sudden load it would snap and we would be raining men all over the drop zone. There is a lot of nock off para cord that ain't fit to lace your boots with. I trust good old five fifty cord to hold me to my canopeee. And I trust amsteel to hold my two hundred and too many pounds off the ground in my night owl. If it can pull a jeep out of the vacum mud its good for me.
Hi & welcome. My 2 cents worth, for a prusik or klemheist I think it would be fine. For longer uses like ridge lines I've found that nylon stretches to much, especially if it gets wet. :):beer:
I think everyone covered the issues associated with using paracord pretty well.
However, it's worth noting that paracord is not bad stuff; actually, it works very well in its intended use. Since it stretches quite a bit, it absorbs the shock of going from freefall to chute deployed, keeping the person hanging from it from having a rough time with his or her harness.
Thing is, that stretch that's desirable for a skydiver? Not so much in our particular use: you don't want to wake up on the ground overnight when your suspension stretches under load.
And that's not even considering the weight limit and dynamic forces, which others have covered very well.
2nd that. 550 cord also makes a great cat o nine tails :DQuote:
Originally Posted by FLRider
also keep in mind that a person hanging from a parachute is held up by many different strands of paracord working together, they're not trusting a single strand of it to do that.
Thanks for the replies, I use some cheap 1\2 in poly rope from home depot as my main line with a paracord loop wrapped around it with a double prusik.
I was expecting to end up on the ground so I hung it low but to my suprise it didn't budge an inch when I sat down ,thats why I was questioning the use of other ropes.
Not to hijack my own thread but how well would amsteel work with the prusik setup ? I am sure I can make a whoopie sling no problem but I have read that they slip and like I said my prusik didn't slide down at all.
Maybe used 1\8 in main line and smaller 7\64 prusik loop so it has more "bite" on the main line?
I think you have been misinformed. There is little chance of a properly constructed and used whoopie slipping. They would not be so popular if there was a problem.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CheeZe
Never seen one slip... I have seen tree straps stretch... But never seen a whoopie budge... I'm told it MAY if you forget to tighten up the bury after adjusting it... But I slept 7-8 nights before anyone told me to do that and I never had a problem...
Regarding Prusik vs. whoopie, the Prusik won't hold quite as well with Amsteel. Amsteel is pretty slick stuff (same material as most arborist throw lines, where low friction is a plus), so the lower surface area of a Prusik doesn't do as well as a properly constructed constrictor knot (whoopies, UCRs, etc.).Quote:
Originally Posted by CheeZe
I've been using whoopies for the last ~10 nights I've spent in an hammock, and have yet to have them slip. But...I also make sure that I milk the bury (pull on it like I'm tightening a Chinese finger trap) before lying in the hammock.
Hope it helps!
I have to admit the same. I have forgotten to "milk" the bury (before I got into the habit), and had no noticeable slippage.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brute1100
I also agree with those mentioning that lines designed to absorb shock are very different from those designed not to stretch. Two different applications, two different safety features.
There's a reason mountain climbing rope stretches and caving rope does not. You don't want to use one for the other (wrong) purpose. It could kill you.
When human life and limb are at risk, it's wise to know a bit about ropes and to use them properly. Lots of good information about just that here in HammockForums!
Rain Man
ex-caver
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I had almost rather risk some slippage and have to say I need to readjust my prusik than to have to say I need to milk my bury :cool: , with that being said I am ordering some amsteel blu in a couple sizes to see what I can make work.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rain Man
At the moment my girlfriend and I are planning on double stacking our hammocks while backpacking to use one tarp so I really don't want either of our suspensions to break , that would suck.
I do appreciate the info and do need to learn more about rope types and their uses for hammock camping and weight loads , we had a bunch of paracord and poly rope around already is the only reason we even tried it on test runs.
We also have walmart hammocks :scared: so the rope may be the least of our worries lol.
Not a problem...I find it works just as well if I say nothing at all.:thumbup1:Quote:
Originally Posted by CheeZe
Try a klemheist knot. In my experience it is easier to tie and holds better than the prusik
+1 on the Klemheist, it seems to have more holding power and is easier to tieQuote:
Originally Posted by ibgary
Para chord streches to
I'm looking into doing the same, but to be honest I'm more than confident in 7/64th Amsteel. Make sure to keep approximately 30* of hang angle (hangle :lol: ) and you're fine.Quote:
Originally Posted by CheeZe
At first my thought was to have her hammock on top, so if for whatever reason she were to fall I'd stop her (that's how confident I am in Amsteel) but then I realized she won't be able to get in a hammock that high up. I think I'll just do a demonstration for her and swing around in the hammock for a while until she's as confident as I am. :lol:
Edit: Or hang hers above you, with para cord... By the morning she'll be in your lap. :laugh:
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldRagFreeze
I was already thinking about hanging her above me incase she did fall or something like that. I asked her about it and she told me " oh hell no I wanted to be on the bottom" then she looked at me and thought about it for a second and decided she had rather be on top lol. I was like good call baby. she is long and lean 140lb and im 5'11 250lb, I would pyle drive her into the ground if my hammock let loose.
I am getting both of us setup with amsteel so we dont have any bad situations in the middle of the night hopefully.
I am hoping if I play my cards right and keep her warm, comfy and fed well I wont need paracord to get her in my lap. Fingers crossed! lol
What about Paracord as a Ridge line???
is that doable?
To answer that, you would need to establish the intended purpose of your ridge line(RL). If you want to put it on your hammy, you would need to prestretch the Paracord to its fullest and ensure it doesn't rebound. That way your hammy will be dialed in and have the proper length RL and sag intended for the hammock. Or, you can make an adjustable RL from your Paracord and keep fiddling with it until desired result is achieved. That's why most use zing-it, lash-it or other non stretchy type lines.Quote:
Originally Posted by Athens-m50
If you want a RL for a tarp, see previous posts above that give info on stretching.
Good luck in your quest.
I would not use paracord for the main ridge line for a tarp. I tried to span about 15 feet and could not get near enough tension on it the way I had it rigged around the tree and if you did get it tensioned it would have really been rough on the paracord. Also it would tear the tree up pretty bad if you were somewhere that it mattered.Quote:
Originally Posted by Athens-m50
r.m. the total weight applyed to EACH line is the same...not halved. in the example you offered a person (plus hammock n gear) weighting 200lbs,hang angle of 30degrees-yeilds 400lbs on each suspention line ...hope this helps
I grabbed these from other threads, though neither is the one I wanted. Still, for what they're worth ....
Rain Man
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Glad this question has been asked a couple times. I have a ton of 550 paracord here but did not realize how much it could stretch. Thanks for all the great info and now have am steel on order.
I concur. Great information. I appreciate you sharing your knowledge.
oops..r.m. right you are! 200lbs at a 30degree hang is 200lbs on each line. i got work mixed up with play . sorry for the confusion
I used paracord to hang my hammock quite often. It works for me (I'm 175lbs), you just need to be careful not to cut into the bark of the tree, as this can harm or even kill the tree, the best way Ive found to avoid this is to use plastic tubing slipped onto the line. Also be careful not to use knots that will seize and realize that knots which don't typical seize will seize in paracord if it gets wet.
It looks like you have some great advice from a lot of members. I noticed that it was not mentioned one way or another if you are not planning on using the paracord to wrap around trees. The term "suspension line" can mean different things to people and if it was meant as "I'm gonna wrap this bad boy around a tree, tie a prusik knot and hop in" (figuratively of course) then consider the damage the tree will suffer. Most use straps to preserve trees and again I am not saying that was your intent, just that if it occurred to anybody please rethink it.
New to this stuff and would like to say that you guys are great with the advice that you give. Learn alot just reading this thread. Thanks