why are synthetic under quilts warmer than down.my 30 jarbrige river work well down to 30.my 20 degree phoniex with 2 oz over fill.leaves me cold and very dissapointed in the upper 20's.:cool:neo
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why are synthetic under quilts warmer than down.my 30 jarbrige river work well down to 30.my 20 degree phoniex with 2 oz over fill.leaves me cold and very dissapointed in the upper 20's.:cool:neo
My take on it, down has the ability to shift and move within a baffle where synthetic does not because its a continuous fabric unlike down clusters. Down also takes a little more to set up, shake out, etc which could cause voids in coverage. The other thing that could happen is compressing the down due to suspension set ups. Food for thought i guess.
One mans opinion, YMMV.
Different conditions (humidity, wind, quilt adjustment) could be factors as we can't do side-by-side testing in identical conditions.
If a particular material / make / model works for you consistantly, count your blessings.
I am rapidly beginning to hate this quilt.but I love my hammock gear top quilt.I wish I got the 0 degree phoniex now.:cool:neoQuote:
Originally Posted by neo
Not sure dude. I have a 20 deg Pheonix with 1 oz over and I have slept with it and my 20 deg Burrow to 15 and was quite toasty. I am a furnace when I sleep so may that comes in too but I could not be happier. Good luck.
I think, like most things, it is more about quality. Good quality synthetic can be better than poor quality down and vice versa. The main strength of down is its compressibility though. I think most consider synthetic to be an all around better insulator, but it will not compress nearly as much. Synthetic also tends to be a bit heavier.
I believe that should be worded....For you..:)Quote:
Originally Posted by neo
I have found my uqs to be spot on with their rating.. Everyone is different though.. I have also found that for me.. A warmer uq lets me get away with a lighter tq..
Down quilts, synthetic quilts, pads doesn't matter as long as you are out there enjoying it! You can even use a tent if you want:D I will still hang out with you.
Well, if you hate the down uq, feel free to send it to me. I'll give it a good home... :)
:Di hate tents lol.i been hammock camping since may 2002.been 4 season hammocking since 2004.i have never gotten cold till last month using an under quilt.i wasted good money lol:cool:neo
I'm not sure, but I would guess that you don't have something tweaked right. I've not had any trouble with my down keeping me warm as long as it's dialed in.
Other than that, I can't imagine what could be wrong.
:Dif i get cold one more night i am throwing it in the campfire and using my pad lol:cool:neo
It really sounds like you have an air gap or some issue. I've used a Phoenix with it improperly hung, and I was cold. Once I got a better feel for the suspension, it works fine to it stated temp range.
:Di hope i can get it right becausing:lol: i am not kidding about through it in the campfire lol.:cool:neoQuote:
Originally Posted by wisenber
Do you plan to use it this weekend at the hang?! If so, I'll come down, do some late-night stealthy sabotage, then stand by the fire the next morning and grab anything you throw toward the fire!!! :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by neo
Rain Man
P.S. Truly, I might consider trying it out and maybe taking it off your hands for a fair price. I've ordered fabric to make an UQ or two, but wouldn't reject buying a good used one.
.
Got the right side up?
Have someone adjust the suspension with you in it to make sure there's no compression or gaps etc.
my first night in my UQ was cold until I got it hanging right. Since then it is very nice. It's hard to feel the fit while you're in it.
Not the underquilt, you! :lol:
Listen to Rainman.
I'm pretty sure it's defective. My 35 with an extra ounce has been toasty down to 23. Send it my way and I'll dispose of it properly. I don't want to see you suffer.
Send it to me (I'll pay for shipping) I've got a buddy that I am 'converting' and that would be a big help in that effort...I'm serious.Quote:
Originally Posted by neo
I have a 20-deg phoenix, 2 20-deg incubators and a 0-deg incubator. I have used the 20-degree gear down to the mid-teens with really good results. (Caveat, like previous poster to this thread, I sleep WARM). That said, it seems that something is not right in your setup.
But if you are getting the results that you want from your synthetic UQ(s), then by all means, keep on keepin' on with them.
My $0.02...
my first UQ was/is synthetic and, i think, they're more forgiving in how tightly they can be suspended.
synthetic insulation doesn't like to compress as easily or as compactly as down.
i can draw the shock cords tight with my synth. and it really doesn't matter how tight,
against the hammock/body, it hangs it will hold it's loft more evenly.
with down, too tight = CBS or too loose = CBS ? with synth. too loose = CBS and too tight is alright.
it took me several coldish nights to learn how to better suspend my down UQ.
there is also the "migration" issue that is more pronounced with down.
i hope that makes since?
__bob__
another operator error thread :rolleyes:
I say use it for kindling at the hang this weekend. But I'm gonna stand in front of Rainman.:lol: I made my first one this past weekend with this hang being my tester. I may have the opposite problem as you, I miss counted with my daughter helping me and waaaayyyyyy over stuffed this thing.
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Originally Posted by neo
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Originally Posted by neo
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Originally Posted by neo
No need to kill it, Neo.Quote:
Originally Posted by neo
If synthetic is your preference, send it back and I will find a home for it. I certainly do not want you to be cold and unhappy. :eek: Shoot me a pm and I will take care of it.
~Stormcrow
I just wished I got the 0 degree Phoenix.the 0 degree Phoenix would probably work down to 20 for me.:cool:neoQuote:
Originally Posted by stormcrow
Is there a Hammock Gear rescue group out there, finding new homes for unwanted quilts? That is a cause I could get behind...or between...
swank
lol...........Quote:
Originally Posted by swankfly
I sent you a pm, Neo.Quote:
Originally Posted by neo
~sc
:)thanks adam i replied to your pm:cool:neoQuote:
Originally Posted by stormcrow
I'm glad that I will be there to catch it before it gets burned.Quote:
Originally Posted by neo
:)i am not burning it lol.i am sending it back and getting a zero degree phoniex lol:cool:neoQuote:
Originally Posted by Crowell392
Darn, I would have adopted the quilt :D But in all seriousness having someone help you get it dialed in probably would have saved a couple of headaches. I have the New River and the first couple of nights that I used it, I cold back side. A hiking buddy helped dial the quilt in and no more cbs.Quote:
Originally Posted by neo
if you can't get it adjusted right then you can start another thread :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by neo
stand by, I think there will be a 0 deg up for grabs... ;-)
OTOH Neo might get somebody to help dial it in.
Hmmm...my experience with the same underquilt (20* Phoenix with 2 oz. overstuff) - kept me warm at the NJ Winter hang for 3 successive nights at low temps from 9* to 3*. You might want to have someone look at the quilt when you're in the hammock to see if you have any gaps or other issues.
I did cheat a bit and start off the night with a Nalgene full of hot water to warm things up :)
:Da hot nalgene bottle would make me want pee.plus i hate nalgene bottles lol:cool:neoQuote:
Originally Posted by Black Foot
Nalgene is not going to upgrade you like stromcrow did so don't even try:DQuote:
Originally Posted by neo
:lol: :lol: :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Ewker
Neo, I seriously don't think it is down vs synthetic, and I don't think you have to go to to a zero rated HG down UQ to be warm at 20. Seriously, I think it is just some undiagnosed fit/adjustment issue. Since you have always seemed to be a warm sleeper, taking fairly thin pads to very low temps, you really ought to be warm in that 20F HG at least to 20 if not below, like several other folks have been.
Now, as to why you are fine to the rated temp in the AHE Climashield UQ to it's rated temp and not so in the HG is a mystery to be solved. But, I don't think it's because one is down and the other is CS synthetic. For one thing, you are fine with your down HG TQ, right?
There might be something to what Flatline said about the CS being less sensitive to being pulled snug and tight compared to the more compressible down. Still, most of the down UQs used by HF users are diff cut models that are supposed to be pretty resistant to down compression when pulled tight. I certainly have my JRB MWs plenty snug against my back, and they are warm as toast used that way.
Does that HG have a "perimeter" style suspension like my older CS Yeti does? Those things are way convenient but can be tricky. Here are a couple of things that can happen and which you need to know to watch for, and how to avoid and maybe even to do a mod for:
1: My Yeti can move ( or I can move ) along that perimeter suspension so that the head end edge of the quilt is too far towards the top of my head, or even too far towards my feet ( less likely ). Either one will open a ventilating gap right down the middle. This is handy in warmer weather, but will freeze my butt when it is cold. I MUST keep the head end edge of the UQ right about at my neckline if I hope to be as warm as possible.
2: I can have it perfectly positioned at my neck, but it can move along that perimeter suspension and not towards the head or feet, but both ends towards the middle! IOW, it can bunch up so that it is not as long as it should be, the head end edge moving down and the foot end moving up. If it does this even a very small amount, a gap can develop and it just won't be as warm as possible. I have learned to make sure it is both very snug against my back and stretched out length wise as far as possible. I just grab the edges with my hands and move it or stretch it, after I am in, to make sure this is all adjusted well. The old style end attached suspensions on my JRB are way less adjustable but less prone to have those problems.
And once I am in the hammock, I like to cross my arms over my chest and grab the left edge of the UQ with my right hand, and the right edge with my left hand, and pull up. If I can move the quilt closer to my back even a millimeter, I tighten the suspension up some more. I want it really snug against my back and butt. I can tell the difference when it is not! And that includes my synthetic Yeti: it will not be warm enough unless perfectly adjusted! Which comes in handy when the weather is warmer.
None of that may apply to the HG, as I don't know what kind of suspension it has. But if it is a perimeter style, watch for these problems and maybe even make some minor mods to correct if needed. That 20F HG ought to keep you warm even below 20F if adjusted correctly, seems to me!
I wish you would try your synthetic UQ below 30 someday. It has 6 oz/sq.yd of CS. I have used 2.5 oz/sq.yd into the 40s and been warm, seems to me like 2 1/2 times the insulation ought to be good ( for me ) lower than 30F!
I second that!!!! For the cost of the down uq i'ed almost have to make it work.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jrprince
my claytor jungle hammock and my hammock gear 20 degree top and bottom quilts were both stolen last thursday at the mid tn hangout at meriwether lewis.i have been camping there 15 years with no problems.the ranger said there have only been 4 or 5 thefts the 22 years he has been there.:cool:neo
Holy crap, that sucks. Sorry to hear about that. Some people really just suck at life so they have to do stuff like that to other people.Quote:
Originally Posted by neo
Sorry to hear that Neo. It really sucks when its all top gear that costs a bunch. I feel for ya.
good info,
Wow, that's terrible news, sorry to hear that....