UQ sewn direct to hammock body

[Just Bill]

Sorry, this likely exists here somewhere but...

Experience, cautions, concerns about directly attaching an underquilt to the hammock body of a bridge?
I'm thinking Apex 2.5 as I know it is fairly durable/packable in my ground dwelling setups and gets me close to 40 degrees easily.
Down seems too risky, Primaloft- too many cold spots with quilting.
The outer shell would likely be Argon .67 (because I have some) although M50 may have a better DWR?
I would likely cut the UQ shell and insulation 1"- 1.5" wider than the bridge body to ensure no compression of the insulation.

Point is to save weight in cutting out one layer of shell fabric and attachments- the bridge seems to be the only hammock I would call this compatible with and seems like a good call. In cooler weather a second UQ could be added, in hot summer- just top with an uninsulated Argon quilt and be a bit warm underneath.

Seems like a no brainer- am I missing something?

[goober]

Thinking of the future of hammocks......I think integrating hammocks and underquilts makes a lot of sense. You buy a 20 degree hammock, a summer hammock, a zero degree hammock, whatever.
This would make the package a lot more affordable---It's crazy the way underquilts are so much more than hammocks.

As far as how it's actually done-- I don't exactly have mad skills in that department. Good luck on your project.

[pgibson]

There are at least 2 manufactures now on the forum that are building hammocks with integrated underquilts. Both of them are gathered end style hammocks. I can't say that it makes it more affordable though. UQ's tend to run a good bit as they take a lot of work, a lot of materils and a good bit of labor to assemble a quility quilt. Hammocks run the gambet of everything from a sheet on up. Yes there are options from $30 but there are also options for hammocks over $300. I don't think that gernaralizing that quilts are so much more the the hammock is quite true when you look at the spectrum of what you get as you move through the range, same is true with quilts though.

The main reason that I don't like an integrated quilt is that there are times when I want absolutly no insulation at one point in the day but need it later. On my last trip I hung out in my hammock during the hot afternoon and was still to hot without the quilt on at all, but it was also in the mid 20's that night. Just food for thought.

[OutandBack]

I've been buying all this high tech hammock gear offerd around our HF vendors since 2010.
I have never had to replace any of my quilts but I have wornout or damaged 3 hammocks and had to replaced them.
Just something to consider.
Hammocks are the cheapest part of our hobby.

[Chriss]

I am sure that I will eventually purchase one of Fire's hammocks because I want to support the idea and I don't mind having a seasonal hammock. But I agree with pgibson about being able to vent the hammock during higher day time temps. Especially this time of year when highs can still be in the 80s and lows in the 40s in the South.

[WV]

I agree with Paul that cost doesn't really favor sewn-on underquilts. I think it's a toss-up, financially, unless you start placing a value on your time, and that's a whole other story. As to venting, that's a personal metabolic issue. I'm quite comfortable in an insulated hammock, even on warm nights. (Paul, what are you doing lollygagging in a hammock in the middle of the afternoon!)

If you use sewn-on insulation, it pays to minimize cost, weight, and bulk by making the insulating layer the right shape to fit the hammock. (It won't be the same shape as the hammock it's attached to.) The trade-off is that it's not simple - not even close. Good luck!

[ShellHammock]

I've been buying all this high tech hammock gear offerd around our HF vendors since 2010.
I have never had to replace any of my quilts but I have wornout or damaged 3 hammocks and had to replaced them.
Just something to consider.
Hammocks are the cheapest part of our hobby.

Good insight OutandBack. The hammock body in my Sheltowee Boone Hammocks is only attached to the insulation layer at the gather, so swapping out a damaged hammock body is easy (and affordable) to do. The expense of such systems is the Insulation layer (in my case, high loft down, baffled construction)

The main reason that I don't like an integrated quilt is that there are times when I want absolutly no insulation at one point in the day but need it later. On my last trip I hung out in my hammock during the hot afternoon and was still to hot without the quilt on at all, but it was also in the mid 20's that night.

Great point pgibson! This is something I do on a regular basis with my Sheltowee hammocks. Here in Central Kentucky summers and even this Indian Summer so far this year have been hot and muggy. It doesn't take long to cool off once settled in the hammock, and sliding that integrated bottom insulation layer of my Boone hammocks (even with a bug net or fabric 'topper' installed) is very easy and quick to do.

Bottom line is most experienced hangers don't leave home without bottom insulation, but going into insulated hammocks to save weight is the wrong idea; you are gaining quick set-up, ease of use and a more efficient bottom insulation option. You still need an extra layer to avoid sewing the integrated quilt directly to the hammock body.

[pgibson]

Lollygagging in the hammock is exactly what you should be doing on a zero day after catching a hundred or so fish. The breeze was well wanted on that day. I had to put the quilts on top of my tarp to add to the shade...it was to dang hot even at 8000'.

The trade-off is that it's not simple - not even close. Good luck!

+1 to that. Even the thiner 2.5 climashield will need a fair bit of differential cut on a Bridge hammock. Your going to be looking at closer to 3-4 inches wider for the outer fabric than the hammock empty.

[Just Bill]

Agree with the seasonal ideas- this one would be three season mainly, but I think could bridge to 70 degree nights. Let's face it, hot summer is hot no matter what you do.

This is for an UL hammock- mainly for fast packing/speed hiking. (should have mentioned that) Point being- it ain't a lounger, just a sleeper. So sleepy time temp is what matters. In a regular hammock I agree- the only reason to integrate it is to save weight- it doesn't add convenience or pleasure.

As far as complexity...
Down would be tricky- Synthetic would not. In fact direct sewn UQ and all the baffle stitching on a bridge body may be downright dangerous. (or require heavier fabric and defeat the point). Adding a layer of APEX 2.5 with a Argon .67 shell is not a massive addition to a bridge and requires no quilting or baffles.
In a gathered end- that's an entirely different deal IMO. The whole point of those is to move around- but I will have to check out the folks making them. This only makes sense in the relatively fixed bridge unless I'm missing something...?

As far as cost...
While the synthetic isn't cheap, it's cheaper than down, especially the real high end stuff.
Apex/Argon- 2yds of each will do ya, and run you about $50. Oddly, a regular synthetic UQ would require another $20 of Argon plus fastners- so a sewn in SYNTHETIC should be a savings. Apex in that setup is $30- down is easily double if not triple, plus baffle fabric. Materials alone you could easily tripple your cost without labor (which is hefty for down). My ground MYOG experience is $75 for synthetic, $150+ for the down equivalent.

A follow up question-
I would think you would actually find the material used warmer in an UQ as opposed to a quilt or sleeping bag. As in- would I get a little more out of Apex 2.5 as an UQ than I am used to getting from it in a Quilt that is stretched and snugged on my ground dwelling body? Does the breeze rob you of warmth or does Argon cut it enough?

I don't have enough experience in hammocks outside summer time, nor enough experience using Apex insulation this way to say.
Help me Hangers, you're my only hope!

[Just Bill]

+1 to that. Even the thiner 2.5 climashield will need a fair bit of differential cut on a Bridge hammock. Your going to be looking at closer to 3-4 inches wider for the outer fabric than the hammock empty.

That's the main thing to the construction I think. How much bigger to cut to avoid insulation compression or worse- stretching it out.

I've used and abused Apex 2.5 in ground quilts completely unquilted with no issues. I think if you got the cut right- all you're sewing is the perimeter and saving one shell layer.

And apologies if I am talking to one of the aforementioned owners of a hammock company- Don't know who is who yet.