tarp with doors compared to no doors and an unde rquilt cover or hammock cover sock

[Jake2c]

All good points and a lot of different ways to approach it. I hike in very poor weather sometimes so the options of doors seemed a good idea to me, I can always not use them. I also liked the extra privacy it gives me. I have used a regular tarp-no doors and just really didn't want to subject other people to me stripping down when I needed to. Maybe if I was a lot younger it wouldn't matter but at my age, it just isn't that pretty. I try to be a good neighbor.

[FLRider]

I was definitely looking at it from a hiking and weight perspective. My HG Winter Palace weighs 8.5 oz., so it seems kinda incongruous (aka stupid) to add a UQP that weighs almost as much. I don't need to supplement my insulation with a UQP because I have 40*, 20* and 0* quilt sets. I bring the right tool for the job when hiking, and don't carry more weight than I need.

As for shelter, a 4-season tarp with doors is inherently superior to UQP + skimpy tarp. It's not even a contest. From a cost/weight perspective it doesn't appear to make a lot of sense either.

Ripstop Nylon UQP 6.5 oz. $35 plus Warbonnet Edge 11.25 oz. $85 = 17.75 oz and $120.
Warbonnet Superfly 19 oz. and $130

So to save 1.25 ounces and $10 people would choose the tarp/UQP combo? Over a Superfly?

I understand that $35 bucks is a pretty cheap way to supplement one's insulation, but from a shelter/hiking/weight/cost perspective, it doesn't add up for me. I'll take a 4-season tarp every time.

Which makes sense, if you're not dual-using your UQP as a poncho. Yes, that introduces potential condensation issues...however, those can be solved with an additional ~1 oz space blanket or sheet of polycryo. My total tarp weight is somewhere in the range of 9 oz with lines and hardware...my rain gear/UQ is another ~8 oz. I'd be carrying that 8 oz regardless. Both are silnylon and cost me less than $50 in materials to make. The space blanket is another $5 and 1 oz, for a total of ~18 oz and ~$55.

Yes, I could spring for a Cuben tarp with doors--that would be ideal from a shelter standpoint but still not optimal from a weight or cost perspective. For me, at least.


That being said, to try and answer the OP's question: a sock will keep you warmest in the hammock. A tarp with doors will keep you warmest outside of the hammock. An UQP (if dual-used as a poncho) will offer the greatest weight savings and versatility, as long as you know how to manage vapor barriers.

Hope it helps!

[SilvrSurfr]

Which makes sense, if you're not dual-using your UQP as a poncho. Yes, that introduces potential condensation issues...however, those can be solved with an additional ~1 oz space blanket or sheet of polycryo.

What kind of poncho are you using and how do you attach it as an UQP? A poncho strikes me as a poor choice for dual use because it could be very wet when you attach it. I'm also not understanding how a space blanket or polycro would mitigate condensation issues; seems like they'll just exacerbate them.

[peterhase]

Basically what Shug said

[FLRider]

What kind of poncho are you using and how do you attach it as an UQP? A poncho strikes me as a poor choice for dual use because it could be very wet when you attach it. I'm also not understanding how a space blanket or polycro would mitigate condensation issues; seems like they'll just exacerbate them.

It's a DIY poncho, sized to my hammock by width (55") and myself by length (78"). I attach it via bra hooks (my hammock has several eyes on 3/4" elastic at strategic points; my underquilt attaches via the same method), which double as its closure system. Both short ends have 3/16" shock cord with cordlocks to snug those up to the hammock.

Yes, the inside of the poncho can be wet when I attach it. However, my quilt's shell is M50 and I leave the head hole on the poncho open when I use it with the quilt. This allows the majority of the moisture to drain, and--on the whole--it's less moisture than I put off during the night anyway when I'm not using my space blanket as a vapor barrier.

The space blanket goes between the hammock and the underquilt, causing the vapor barrier to be close enough to my skin to avoid condensation (the temperature gradient isn't great enough across that distance, given my 20* quilt, for the barrier to be outside my microclimate). This causes the vapor to rise through my top insulation and be dispersed into the greater atmosphere.

I'm a fairly wet sleeper (I couldn't get Insultex to work for me due to this; the temperature gradient wasn't great enough to avoid condensation), and I've used this combination in rain and fog (100 percent plus RH) from 55* down to 28* F.

Hope it helps!

[cougarmeat]

LiteTrek, This is the first time I saw your question so please know you are not being ignored. I have used all the combinations you've suggested. First, regardless of the "shelter" options, I'd say you still need an Under Quit or pad. If you have a single layer hammock, you can get an under quilt protector and put the pad in that. When I started, I put a Therm-a-rest in an UQP that would snug up to keep the air pocket under the hammock. It worked fine in the NW summer.

Then I moved on to under quilts but still keep the UQP to keep them clean and add protection for blowing rain.

Then one night I ended up with the tarp parallel to a mighty wind and was a bit cold. I had a HH Typoon with me and the next night I set up the doors - they made a world of difference and I was warm again.

Since then I have moved to socks combined with tarp. The sock can be opened when weather permits and still adds UQ protection and wind changing protection. The only downside is when a bug net is required but I haven't been in a swarm attack area yet. I mean I have - was almost carried away by mosquitoes in Alaska - but haven't run into flying critter problems with a hammock in Oregon. But I tend to camp at high elevation or around the San Juan and Vancouver Islands.

If you use a sock, you probably don't need doors but I am not a "multi-use" person, I am a belt AND suspenders person. Remember the tarp provides shelter for you And your hammock And your gear. So if it has doors, you can choose to close them or not. I like the configuration options and, being old school, I'm not afraid of a few extra ounces.

[litetrek]

LiteTrek, This is the first time I saw your question so please know you are not being ignored.

Thanks. i didn't mean to imply I was being ignored. Eventually I got a lot of information but it took awhile.

Anyhow, I have a bunch of gear that I've been using for many years. I know what I like about it and what i don't. I like to keep my pack weight down and compact. That has a bit of a challenge with hammock gear.

I have a clark TX-250 with vertex tarp and a DIY 11' single layer gathered end that I use with a hennessy hex tarp and a fronkey style DIY bug net. I have a 20 F down top quilt and a 25 F jarbidge under quilt. The jarbidge was on sale and it has been great, but it isn't ideal for me. I use whoopie slings with the DIY and I've modified the clark to use straps. I'm thinking of putting whoopies on the clark to reduce the weight and bulk a bit.

So I have a bunch of stuff to pick from and to date still haven't found what works well for me. The Clark is great but its heavy and bulky. It takes up a lot of space in my pack. The weather shield really makes a difference in cooler weather or blowing rain. The vertex tarp is huge and probably actually too big since it sometimes limits your campsite choices. So the Clark is very comfortable but its too heavy and bulky. Even with smaller tarp its still pretty hefty.

I like the open feeling with the DIY gear I use. I've been considering buying a cuben fiber tarp to use with my DIY hammock and my question was posed to help pick one out. Whatever I get I'd like to be able to use it with either hammock. I think I could get by with a small diamond tarp on the clark due to the weather shield, but it wouldn't work with the DIY. I could add a sock to my DIY but I may end up with a complete kit of gear that weighs as much and is as bulky as the clark.

I asked the comparison question to get some idea about how well the different solutions work so I could pick one and estimate what the whole package would weigh.

[dingbat]

After finally having a chance to use the winter tarp I made, I was surprised at how much heat it holds with the doors closed up tight. First time I used it was 9* low with a 20mph wind. Even with a foot of gap below the tarp, it was noticeably warmer under the tarp to the point that I could feel the warm air spill out when I opened the door to go pee in the middle of the night.

[pdxleif]

I've been thinking about this myself. There's been times on an otherwise warm night I've gotten chilly from all the wind. Hence what I was thinking when I got this UQP / poncho: to block wind:
http://www.jacksrbetter.com/shop/dri...n-kit-applied/
I haven't used it as a poncho yet, though - I'd probably rather wear a raincoat if I'm running around, unless the weather's truly terrible. It's reported as 10.3 oz. I could get a dutch sock for $50, at 8.8 oz, or some wilderness logics tarp doors at $45 and 4 oz per side...
Adding a set of doors sounds like the lightest option, but... bringing the tarp sides to the ground seems to add some strategic constraints (e.g. bushes, ground level), not to mention the reduced comfort of maybe not being able to stand up under the tarp, and having it close to your face. Also, if it's not going to rain, but you still want wind protection - another option might be more convenient / open.

[OneClick]

With a tiny tarp and UQP, it almost seems like were to the point of making a waterproof “pod” or hammock. I guess a "hanging bivy". Something lightweight that completely encapsulates you. Probably not for claustrophobics though!