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  1. #1
    New Member
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    Beginner Needs Insulation Help

    Hello Everyone,

    This is my first post although I have been lurking this site for a little while. I recently went on a backpacking trip in Southern California and tried hammock camping for the first time. Although the temperature never dropped below 32F, my backside was FREEEZING throughout the night. I will post gear and pics below. I made sure to keep my body on the pad but even then is felt as if the pad did little to nothing at all. Am I doing something wrong? When I was able to sleep, it was amazing, but having to wake up every so often because I was so cold really got annoying. Any help is much appreciated. Thank you!

    1. Hammock: Hennessy Expedition Asym (Will be looking to purchase a different hammock, maybe the wbbb)
    2. Pad: Big Agnes Insulated Q-core (Rated to 15F)
    3. Sleeping Bag: Big Agnes Bellyache (Rated to 17F)

    Hammock.jpg
    PadSetup.jpg
    FeetSetup.jpg

  2. #2
    Senior Member dudeman_atl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    John's Creek, GA
    Hammock
    HH Ultralight Explorer
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    DIY Silpoly Hex
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    Quote Originally Posted by DCJohnson View Post
    Hello Everyone,

    This is my first post although I have been lurking this site for a little while. I recently went on a backpacking trip in Southern California and tried hammock camping for the first time. Although the temperature never dropped below 32F, my backside was FREEEZING throughout the night. I will post gear and pics below. I made sure to keep my body on the pad but even then is felt as if the pad did little to nothing at all. Am I doing something wrong? When I was able to sleep, it was amazing, but having to wake up every so often because I was so cold really got annoying. Any help is much appreciated. Thank you!

    1. Hammock: Hennessy Expedition Asym (Will be looking to purchase a different hammock, maybe the wbbb)
    2. Pad: Big Agnes Insulated Q-core (Rated to 15F)
    3. Sleeping Bag: Big Agnes Bellyache (Rated to 17F)
    That's a pretty sweet hammock! I'm sure someone will take it off your hands if you decide it's not for you...

    Where exactly did you get cold--directly under your hiney/kidneys or more off to the sides? Letting a little air out of the pad so that it wraps around you may help and exploring a SPE type device to widen the padding around your torso can really help.

    I had a few nights like that starting out where I was great, then rolled over a little off the pad and then it got cold quickly--not pleasant.
    Also, the SuperShelter for the Hennessey is a lot thinner than your pad, but it is wider and more flexible. It's gotten me down to 32 with just a top quilt.

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Albemarle, NC
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    I'm relatively new, so take what I say with a grain of salt. I have a Big Agnes Lost Ranger that's rated at 15F. After using the bag, I don't think 15F is a comfort rating, but maybe a survival rating. I love the bag, especially when I have to go back to ground hugging, but I'm comfortable in the bag around 25-30F. That being said, that rating is with the pad inside the sleeve on the bag. The bag's insulation will wrap down the side over the side of pad. I would think laying on top of the pad you could potentially get drafts. I would make three recommendations when you try it again: 1) deflate the pad just a little like the other post recommended. 2). Put the pad inside the sleeve 3). I'm not familiar with the Bellyache, but if it is down, be sure you :fluff the down prior to use after getting it out of your pack. I was cool the other night in my Lost Ranger at 25 F and I have been very comfortable at 25 F. When I got up the next morning, I noticed I had forgotten to fluff the down and it had all settled in the foot box. My feet were very warm, but my chest was cool.

  4. #4

    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Gonzales, LA
    Hammock
    DH Darien/DIY
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    WL Big Daddy
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    JrB, HG, WL
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    2,388
    Quote Originally Posted by DCJohnson View Post
    1. Hammock: Hennessy Expedition Asym (Will be looking to purchase a different hammock, maybe the wbbb)
    2. Pad: Big Agnes Insulated Q-core (Rated to 15F)
    3. Sleeping Bag: Big Agnes Bellyache (Rated to 17F)
    1. I have slept in one and was very comfortable. Not as comfortable as in a longer hammock though. The money may be better spent on a good under quilt instead of a new hammock.

    2. The 15°F rating may be when used on the ground. Up in the air things change. A good 20°F UQ will keep your bottom warm.

    3. Without good bottom insulation it doesn't matter what I have on top, I will be cold.

  5. #5
    SilvrSurfr's Avatar
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    Jul 2011
    Location
    Jersey Shore, NJ
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    Dutch PolyD
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    HG Winter Palace
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    I've never used anything but a ccf pad, but often hear you have to deflate air pads. I used a cheap, blue Walmart ccf pad for a couple of years, but condensation was always an issue. The last night I used a pad was a 22* F night where I woke up drenched in condensation.

    Keep in mind your pad's R-rating is for ground sleeping, not for hammocks. In a hammock, you're subject to convective air currents underneath the pad, which is not what it was designed for.
    "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." Ralph Waldo Emerson

  6. #6
    dakotaross's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Chamblee, GA
    Hammock
    SuperiorGear or Dutch netless
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    custom pentagon
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    down hammock or UQ
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    My experience with insulated BA pads is that they're very so-so with regard to retaining warmth. My insulated Air Core has been down to 32, but as my body heat dropped, along with the outdoor temperature (I was tarping at the time), it just can't keep the temperature up with the large volume of air in the thick pads. You can let some air out which will reduce the volume of air which should help it retain some, but then you still have cold air underneath that can directly impact the air within the pad. (as opposed to cold ground being of relatively stable temps through the night) With a 20" pad, you typically need some side insulation, but perhaps not if you've got the HH staked out. Has nothing to do with your bag, I presume, as you say only your backside was cold.

    You can either spend $$ on a heavy Exped downmat which does retain heat much better, or get an UQ for not too much more. Heck, you'd probably do better with a $100 Jarbridge quilt and foot pad.
    "I wonder if anyone else has an ear so tuned and sharpened as I have, to detect the music, not of the spheres, but of earth, subtleties of major and minor chord that the wind strikes upon the tree branches. Have you ever heard the earth breathe... ?"
    - Kate Chopin

  7. #7
    Senior Member Drybones's Avatar
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    Sep 2013
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    Gadsden, AL
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    I'm kinda at the same stage you are, I tried sleeping on a pad and finally gave up, fought that thing all night trying to stay on. I bought a synthetic UQ for $100 just to determine if the hammock would cure my aching back in the mornings, it did, so I'm now trying to determine what down UQ and TQ would work best for me. BTW, I have that BA Q Core insulated pad, wish I'd stayed with the Exped Synmat 7 UL for sleeping on the ground . Good luck with hammocking, don't fall out.

  8. #8
    Senior Member brianb's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Hammock
    diy insulated 10.5
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    Try a cheap ccf pad or deflate yours a good bit. Also, when it's very cold a silver windshield protector can make a huge difference. Pads aren't ideal for a hammock, but they're a good place to start.

    Good luck
    Crayons - they might look different, but they all taste the same

  9. #9
    New Member
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    May 2015
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    Thank you all very much for the advice. There are so many great responses and I wish I had time to reply to all of them! It seems clear that the issue is the R rating discrepancy between using the pad on the ground and using it in the hammock. I kinda figured that might be the issue but I wasn't positive.

    Where exactly did you get cold--directly under your hiney/kidneys or more off to the sides? Letting a little air out of the pad so that it wraps around you may help and exploring a SPE type device to widen the padding around your torso can really help.
    It was definitely under my bum and lower back. I am going to try letting some air out next time i take the hammock out! At the time, it seemed counter intuitive but it makes sense! Also, I saw the SPE device from one of Shug's video (that guy really cracks me up!) and I didnt understand its value until I rested my arms on the hammock fabric at 2AM, now THATS cold!!!!

    I have slept in one and was very comfortable. Not as comfortable as in a longer hammock though. The money may be better spent on a good under quilt instead of a new hammock.
    I may end up getting a new one anyways because I dont like how the bug net drapes over my face when I want to use the hammock casually during the day. Ive seen great reviews for the Blackbird and I believe the XLC version allows me to completely remove the netting when I am not using it. Nonetheless, is there a UQ you would recommend? I am looking into the winter yeti but at this point, i believe its out of my price range.

    Keep in mind your pad's R-rating is for ground sleeping, not for hammocks. In a hammock, you're subject to convective air currents underneath the pad, which is not what it was designed for.
    Excellent advice, and thank you for the explanation. It sounds like the air current just sucks the warmth out of my pad whereas the UQ would act as a barrier preventing that from happening.

    You can either spend $$ on a heavy Exped downmat which does retain heat much better, or get an UQ for not too much more. Heck, you'd probably do better with a $100 Jarbridge quilt and foot pad.
    I am gonna stick with the Insulated q core because when I do use my tent I love how comfy it is. I checked out the Jarbridge and wow, it seems like a great option. I love the videos they have on the website and the price seems very reasonable. Only thing Im worried about is how much it will compress. But still, excellent site, thank you!

    bought a synthetic UQ for $100 just to determine if the hammock would cure my aching back in the mornings, it did, so I'm now trying to determine what down UQ and TQ would work best for me.
    Same here, I have been having some back issues but only when I sleep (really weird wont get into details). There is no pain whatsoever when I wake up in a hammock, which is why i am so happy i found this website lol.

    Also, when it's very cold a silver windshield protector can make a huge difference.
    Interesting, I will look into the windshield protector, thank you!

    My ideal set up would be the blackbird, yeti underquilt, my bellyache sleeping bag (or a lightweight topquilt like the mamba), and the superfly tarp (it obviously wont be all in one purchase but I could pick up an item here or there over the next year or so). Hmmm, I think all of those are warbonnet. Im thinking i can cinch them down in one stuff sack and pack it externally on my Arcteryx Altra 75 and use all the internal space for other items, which would extend my ability to stay out in the wilderness by double. It will also pack nicely into a frame pack for some bikepacking. Plus, it seems like the tarp that comes with the Hennessy Expedition doesnt really offer much coverage, so at a price tag of $200 for the hammock, i might as well just get the blackbird. But unfortunately it will be a bit of a wait because Warbonnet has closed orders at this time.
    Last edited by DCJohnson; 05-11-2015 at 23:13. Reason: tpypo

  10. #10
    New Member
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    Kammock roo
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    Using a therma-rest pad myself and man let me tell you I get COLD in the middle of the night. I sleep great when I first sack out, I even woke up sweating once when I had my tarp all closed in but as soon as I move it's pretty much game over for any heat I had built up. most of my issue seems to arise from grabbing a drink or other item from my pack below me. As soon as I move around my pad tries to spin in the hammock and ends up only under my rump and nothing insulating my legs/feet or back/shoulders. Hammock sleeping on a pad is pretty tricky for me so far. I'm a newbie so I don't really have any advice, just commiserating.
    Hard work has a future, laziness pays off NOW!

    I prefer the term "indolence", it makes my laziness sound classy.

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