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  1. #71

    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    Valpo, IN
    Hammock
    Towns-End Luxury Bridge
    Posts
    1,221
    Yar... I'm concerned for Josh too.
    He's a great guy and mainly doing this to help out. I certainly am not privy to his biz details but I suspect this is a fairly small portion of his work. I'm not sure if there are much more than a few dozen HF members who've made the leap.
    And many of them are fairly light folks at that. So these aren't really much past prototype stage overall as far as I know. Certainly not enough volume for him to truly commit any resources or testing to the product. He primarily does trekking poles, tent poles, etc. He doesn't deal in load bearing applications in any of his other products. I greatly value his expertise with CF materials, but this is uncharted territory for him as well. He's been around for quite sometime and isn't depending on a few outlier bridge users to put food on the table.

    Altruistically- Nobody wants to see anyone hurt.

    Cynically- All it takes is one jerk (lawsuit) and the party is over.

    There is a reason they aren't listed on the website or promoted and really only available via referral from folks at HF...
    Josh is being nice enough to take on producing these at our request.
    The kindest thing we can do is not abuse his kindness and use these responsibly.

    I'd love to see more business go his way, but only if it's good business for him long term.

    Generally- folks here are pretty good at accepting those terms of use and that's all I'm advocating.

  2. #72

    Join Date
    Aug 2017
    Location
    Louisiana
    Hammock
    Warbonnet Eldorado (Dream-Tex)
    Tarp
    Mountain/MiniFly
    Insulation
    Wooki, Diamondback
    Suspension
    Dynaweave, Becket
    Posts
    1,025
    How about just wrapping the head pole with some CF tape like Zpacks does to their CF staff? Should add a bit of strength and a lot of protection from flying splinters/shards.

    If you are PARTICULARLY pushing the limits, you could also just drape some heavy fabric over it as well. Thatís what I was taught to do when winching something with a chain or strap. Meaning I cover the most of the chain with a canvas tarp or furniture moving blanket in case the chain breaks and any particles fly off or in case the chain or strap itself whips in a bad direction.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

  3. #73
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Charlotte, nc
    Hammock
    DH Sparrow/WB RR
    Tarp
    Warbonnet Msc
    Insulation
    Loco Libre
    Suspension
    Beetles
    Posts
    217
    As someone who had one break, I am glad they are still available and glad my experience can move the learning curve forward. I feel we are much closer to dialing in them in and understanding their limitations. I will be out in the mtns this weekend hanging on my upgraded pair!

  4. #74
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Charlotte, nc
    Hammock
    DH Sparrow/WB RR
    Tarp
    Warbonnet Msc
    Insulation
    Loco Libre
    Suspension
    Beetles
    Posts
    217
    OK so I just got my replacement set with the 710 head Poles and my 600 foot pole. For anyone who was wondering, I put them on the scale with my most recent warbonnet aluminum poles and even with the larger diameter head pole there is still a 5 ounce weight difference between the carbon and aluminum.

  5. #75

    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    Valpo, IN
    Hammock
    Towns-End Luxury Bridge
    Posts
    1,221
    Quote Originally Posted by Gravitythief76 View Post
    OK so I just got my replacement set with the 710 head Poles and my 600 foot pole. For anyone who was wondering, I put them on the scale with my most recent warbonnet aluminum poles and even with the larger diameter head pole there is still a 5 ounce weight difference between the carbon and aluminum.
    Oddly enough the set for my bridges works out the same.
    Basically 12 ounces vs 7 ounces (6.93 technically).

    Mine are 43/36... I believe RR is 40/28 or so.

    Not sure what the 600 set you had was... but the 700 head pole is worth the minor weight penalty for the peace of mind.

    If someone was looking for the absolute lightest- then the only tradeoff to discuss would be a 2 piece vs 3 piece headpole.

    With all poles, it's the ferrule and glue up that adds the most weight. Close second is the tips. The tube itself is relatively small.

    If you were willing to trade the shorter collapsed size and nesting... you could knock these down.
    The absolute lightest would be single poles with no ferrules. Something I think Kitsap here did on a bridge if I recall correctly.


    Still a work in progress, but I do have prototype bridge trekking poles. These are doing well in 36" size for my 230 pounds and with the necessary pieces they are under 10 ounces for the pair. (no straps)

    I'm not a trekking pole user, so I can't really comment on how great they are as trekking poles... but they seem just fine and Josh's trekking pole is a pretty well respected one among UL backpackers.
    Seems similar to the gossamer gear sets to my untrained eye.
    I plan to get a few sets out to Happy Medium testers this season.

    I think the 'right' system would be using the trekking poles and carrying a single head pole resulting in about 12-13 ounces of 'poles' total.
    I've yet to meet a long distance hiker who didn't break a trekking pole at some point... and these are SUL poles.
    My other concern... is that in observing trekking poles used on places like the Appalachian Trail, nicks, cuts, scratches are inevitable. My understanding is that these are what leads to pole failures, or at least increase the odds greatly of an issue.

    Since my bridges are recessed bars it doesn't seem worth taking the chance with a trekking pole near your face.

    So one two piece head pole around 19" will mean you always have a structurally sound pole available.
    With the pair of trekking poles the odds are low you will break both at once, so while not ideal, even if you some how did that you can spend the night in a bridge with just the head pole.
    More likely and more common- if you walk away from camp or town without your sticks... you can still spend the night before you head back to look for them, lol.

    But out of the gate then you'd have one trekking pole for the bridge and the second pole for porch mode or as a pole mod for your tarp... which adds creature comfort without dinging packweight.


    The straps... they are there. But with Josh's system you can't have the straps attached at the same time as the bridge mod insert we came up with.
    So if you are a die hard strap user... you would need to remove the straps at camp, then attach them again in the morning.
    I'd like to find a solution to that, but I think the structure of the pole in 'bridge mode' is more important than the inconvenience of fiddling with the strap.

  6. #76
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    CT
    Hammock
    Ridgerunner
    Tarp
    Cloudburst
    Posts
    101
    For your next invention, come up with a way to use the poles as removable stays or frame in a UL pack. Then even those without trekking poles can take advantage. I've always wanted to see this, but have no ability to construct such a thing. But I bet you could pull it off

  7. #77

    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    Valpo, IN
    Hammock
    Towns-End Luxury Bridge
    Posts
    1,221
    Quote Originally Posted by Just Tom View Post
    For your next invention, come up with a way to use the poles as removable stays or frame in a UL pack. Then even those without trekking poles can take advantage. I've always wanted to see this, but have no ability to construct such a thing. But I bet you could pull it off
    Already have

    Just not ready to share.
    I'm not a trekking pole guy either...

    The nice thing about working with the FKT crowd is that limits are not acceptable.
    After I thought I went as far as I could go with the micro bridge... the first thing said to me was that .490 poles were too long.
    Here I was patting myself on the back and first thing I hear is 'not good enough', lol. So it pushed me to find a way to two piece those poles so they could work with a SUL FKT pack.

    I'm a huge fan of more with less. I have a prototype of this idea with the Luxury Bridge for a light weight full comfort system.
    But I'm more excited about making the push with my Happy Medium... with a 9'6" ish RL vs 11'6" on the Luxury... you save weight on the full rig simply by dint of shrinking the foot print.

    Anywho... the micro bridge did see some action with the spreader bars integrated into the pack, combined with a Cuben poncho tarp.

    Rough ballpark if I recall:
    Small Neo Air pad- 8oz (or GG foamy for less if it made sense for the trail)
    One of my Primaloft Gold FKT quilts at 12 oz
    Micro Bridge at 10oz+2 oz suspension.
    Backpack at 12 oz.
    CF poncho tarp 8 oz.
    Bit of line, stakes, and a headnet was around 3-4 oz

    Pack, shelter, insulation, rain cover, bugs... ground or air. 56 ish ounces, but I think 60 stands out with a water bottle and some other minor items tossed in.

    Shooting for a slightly less extreme version with my Medium setup... hopefully this season will be the big push on that design.
    The hardest thing with integrated and harmonious systems is the 'swiss army knife' problem.

    It's good to dump a bunch of things into one package, but then each of those things tends to suffer as individual tools.
    And with any UL stuff you have to be careful you aren't just doing spreadsheet magic to hit a weight; but actually delivering gear you would want to use and don't need to compromise too much on.

    So the goal is to nail the bridge itself, as that's the core of the system. Then the pack.
    Tarps, quilts, etc are easy enough to adapt once you've solidified the core components.

    It's been a joy helping the big boys... but this is the gear that gets me fired up and itching to use.

    The bridge is out for testing...
    So are the poles...

  8. #78
    New Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Posts
    1
    New to hammocks (and this thread) but two bits to toss into the discussion. One is to trade a little weight for a little insurance by sheathing each length of pole in a sleeve of heat-shrinkable tubing of the type used by marine electricians to shield wire splices in corrosive environments. I wouldn't use the type with the adhesive as it will be a bear to ever remove. I think the heat-shrink will serve to both contain shrapnel from a failure as well as protect the pole itself from abrasion. My understanding of composite structures includes the idea that small flaws or injuries to the structure can propagate when later stressed so I like to baby them when practical. My second thought is to wonder if a more resilient spreader bar might be built by bundling smaller CF tubes together rather than relying on a single tube. After all, this is how structures such as bamboo and trees manage to achieve both stiffness and flexibility in the same structure. The mix of stiffness to flex might even be tune-able. I realize it would complicate, perhaps fatally, issues like multi-part poles and how to rig the end caps. Just a thought.

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