I'm new to cuben fiber and am wondering if the material holds Permetherin? I used to use a Silnylon rainfly and would treat it every year with Permetherin. Now I use a Cuben Fiber Winter Palace. I'm wondering if it would be beneficial to treat it with Permetherin too. Does anyone know defitively the answer to this question?
Tarps are waterproof - I don't think treating a silnylon tarp with permethrin would be effective, and I definitely don't think treating a cuben fiber tarp would be effective. Is there any reason that you think applying a water-based insecticide to a waterproof tarp would be effective?
"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." Ralph Waldo Emerson
If I put enough on the silnylon it seemed to absorb it. It took a lot though. I suspect the cuben fiber won't absorb it to no matter how much I put on but figured I'd ask the community to be sure.
Dyneema fiber (Cuben fiber) is inherently water proof by design. The film used to make it will not absorb liquids. Permethrin would just bead and roll right off the stuff. The outer laminant isn't a woven fiber or an applied coating like silpoly or silnylon. It's kinda like transparent mylar that sandwiches dyneema fibers to give it strength. That's the the beauty of having a dyneema tarp or tent, aside from the awesome light weight. The material was originally designed for racing sail boats for the Americas cup. It was purposefully designed not to absorb water and to be abrasion and tear resistant for these specialized racing boats. Applying permethrin would only absorb in the grosgrain at the suspension and tie out points. I'd also be concerned adding a chemical to a high tech synthetic without knowing if it might damage the material. Personally, I'd leave the tarp as it is. DEET, for example is awesome at repelling bugs, but it melts plastics and similar materials. There was a post recently on a backpacking group I'm in regarding bug repellants. DEET was mentioned, of course, and a guy commented to be careful because he applied DEET to his skin. It was on his hands as he was using his touch screen GPS device and it started to dissolve the screen. The GPS is unusable junk now.
Last edited by JmBoh; 05-28-2018 at 16:55.
“I am losing precious days. I am degenerating into a machine for making money. I am learning nothing in this trivial world of men. I must break away and get out into the mountains to learn the news”
― John Muir
I'm thinking the same thing. Plus as expensive as the Cuben tarps are I wouldn't dare put any chemicals on it not get it near it. Treating your gear that isn't water proof should be more than enough to control the skeeters and other bugs.Originally Posted by SilvrSurfr
Cool. This is as I suspected, however I wanted to be sure. I've treated my hammock, backpack, socks, and trail runners. I should be good to go. Happy Hanging everyone!!!
P.S. I avoid DEET at all costs for the reasons mentioned in this thread. Permethrin seems to do the trick for me each year. I live in Mississippi and do a lot of hiking in the mid-south (MS, AR, AL, GA, TN) and on the AT. All pretty much tick and chigger infested. For those interested in an economical solution to Permethrin treatment...I buy concentrated Permethrin at Tractor Supply Company and mix 2oz. per 1 gallon in a pump sprayer and use that to treat my gear every year. It's worked wonders for me. I'm not growing a third arm or observing any strange twitches....yet
The Sawyer company, which sells a permethrin clothing and gear treatment product has some tips about bonding permethrin to cuben fiber on their faq page. Look for the question: Will Permethrin bond to Cuben Fiber?
From the website:
Cuben Fiber is a high tech laminated material. The top layer is polyester which permetherin will bond to; however, permethrin will not bond to the inner layers of Cuben Fiber. Therefore, permethrin cannot be applied to Cuben Fiber the same way it is applied to other fibers. It will (depending on the size of the material) probably take a few “wettings” to get the necessary 3 ounces dose of permetherin onto the fabric.
To apply permethrin correctly use this process spray the object, let it dry, spray again, let it dry, and spray again. If unabsorbed permethrin drips off the Cuben Fiber catch the drippings and reuse the permethrin. Apply as evenly as possible to the Cuben Fiber until the 3 ounce application is fully absorbed.
This would be true for DCF hybrids like the 2.92 or 3.5 used in pack applications which have a woven face, but not the lighter weights used for tarps which are non-woven laminates on both sides.
Caminante, son tus huellas el camino y nada más... - Antonio Machado
X7456 found the answer from Sawyer, but to elaborate, permethrin is a contact insecticide and does not have to absorb into a fiber to be effective. Typical commercial sprays use two methods beyond absorption to deposit permethrin molecules onto the surface of a fiber: polymer coating and microencapsulation. Both are similar but essentially involve binding permethrin to or encapsulating it with something that chemically or physically sticks to fibers. Think permethrin mixed with glue. So, yes, there is very good reason to think permethrin will work on waterproof surfaces.
Sunlight and physical wear will break down or scrape off the treatment, so its longevity isn't as good as fibers which have absorbed it, but it will still work and last for weeks with normal use.
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