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  1. #1
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    experimenting with the Hammocktent 90*

    I got this hammock to experiment with it, primarily because the thought of doing away with an UQ, especially on some of my more remote wilderness trips which I occasionally have an adventure on, really appealed to me. Unlike the Amok, this one is designed to be used with a pad, but does not require a pad either for insulation, or for a reasonable amount of function/and comfort. IOW, if something went wrong with my inflatable pad(no worries with CCF pads of course) deep in the Bridger Wilderness, as long as I had trees and something else handy for bottom insulation, I'd be fine. Though that might be questionable- if I was counting on a pad for primary insulation, would I also have enough insulation not needed for sleeping to go down below? Maybe not. OTOH, using a pad- even a CCF pad- along with some available puffy stuff to go on top or around the pad, as part of the plan, might be a way to go. And no trees, no problem with a pad. Or, not a big one, obviously not as comfy on the ground.

    But if I found myself needing- or just wanting- to camp above tree line, if I already had a pad for my primary insulation, I would be good to go. Plus, far less concern about keeping the wind and moisture off of my UQ while hanging. And probably no comfort would be given up by using a pad in this hammock, some would argue that it is as or more comfy with a pad than any hammock with an UQ. I'm not yet sure of that last statement, but it sure is at least fairly close. The only flaw I can see is a bit of knee extension with a full length pad, which might require a knee pillow. But so many of my GE hammocks are better with a knee pillow anyway. I know some members have modified the hammock to overcome the knee extension problem, maybe I should also?

    I have not yet been able to commit to this hammock over some of my other favs, but I continue to experiment with it. Today I hiked a couple of miles into the woods and tried out a < 20 oz, 30F UQ stuffed down into the pad pocket. It is impossible for me to check loft or if the quilt is positioned under all points that need insulating, because of the darned non-removable net. All I have to go by is that it was much warmer than without the quilt in the pad pocket. It was very, very warm, but then again the air was not actually cold, maybe in the high 60s under overcast skies? But it was a big difference with the UQ vs none. Also, when I used the hammock as a chair, I could tell there is plenty of loft under my butt, it is not much compressed, if at all.

    Here is a picture of the UQ stuffed into the pad pocket, followed by a picture of me inside the hammock. In the 2nd pic, you can see the foot end of the UQ coming out of the pad pocket opening, and I have the UQ suspension strap keeping it in position so that my feet are covered(probably not needed, but good for this pic)





    I see from this picture that I was off center to the left, but I did not notice that. If I had, I would have centered myself better or checked to see if I needed to lower the right side attachment to the tree. How do Y'all like my Permethrin treated pants tucked in my Permethrin treated socks? But I never see a tick, not in many years, even in the swamps of MS!

    Using this hammock without a pad is so different, it makes it really hard to get used to. I had put it away for a while while I went back to my usual hammocks, but I pulled it back out today.

    Impressions with no pad:
    1: as I get more accustomed to it, comfort is equal to or greater than any other hammock for flat on my back, with or without a pillow. There is almost, but still not quite, some knee extension. ( I have noticed some knee extension with a TR Neo Air pad, so would need a knee pillow)
    2:Most important of all, zero calf ridge, with or without pad
    3: side comfort excellent, though without a pad, there is a strong tendency to end up in fetal, the hammock wants to almost force me into fetal! Once in fetal- with no pad, probably the most comfy hammock I have been in, at least in fetal. And quite possibly more comfy(in fetal) than any position in any other hammock. It was sweet! I can't recall how fetal was with a pad, but I'm pretty sure it was at least very good, about equal to any other hammock. But without a pad, there is some fabric that pushes up into my waist, causing the exact opposite of the side twist that might be expected if I could not get diagonal enough, and had even a hint of banana position going on. But no hint of that with this hammock, more like the opposite, but just enough opposite for perfection. A feeling of no pressure points anywhere. Of course, this will not be the case if I am using a pad, then it will revert to only very good, or maybe as good as the best of the rest. And of course, this hammock working so great with a pad is the #1 reason I wanted to try this hammock in the first place!

    One reason I have had trouble getting used to this hammock is that- without a pad- it feels so strange when you try to move. Since the ends are not under tension, when I move, it moves, and there is not much to push against when trying to move. Add to that the feeling that this hammock is so light weight it seems fragile, and I have been afraid I am going to tear something when I try to move. ( but only with out a pad, that weirdness/sense of frigidity does not apply if a pad is used, which keeps everything stretched out more like a normal hammock that is suspended from the ends, plus the pad gives a sense of greater durability)

    Also, it occurred to me today that it might be possible to suspend an UQ from this hammock. But instead of suspending it from the ends, suspend it from the multiple loops that all the thin cordage which runs up to the RL are attached to, maybe 3 or 4 with shock cord on each side, or some kam snaps. I Think this would work just great while I was on my back or side with legs straight. But I do wonder what would happen when I went fetal for that superb fetal comfort that this hammock possesses. Would a bunch of channels funneling cold air develop when the hammock length collapsed the way it does to match my length when I go fetal? I do not know, but some one here probably does. (For that matter, would those channels develop if I have the UQ in the pad pocket?) Or, what if I had a closed cell pad in the pad pocket, just thick enough to force the hammock to keep it's shape when I go fetal, with the UQ around that(or CCF pad in the pad pocket, quilt suspended under and snugged up against the hammock)? Oh my, so much to try!

    Well, there is a lot for me to learn about this hammock. I remain unsure if it can replace my tried and true bridges and a couple of GE hammocks, the ones I have so many years of experience sleeping comfy and staying warm and dry in. (tarps with this hammock are reversed for which way the long end needs to go) But it certainly has a couple of really unique and strong points going for it. So different! And of course, as always, a couple of negatives(bottom line: as always, pros and cons), which I may or may not be able to overcome. But now that it is cooling off nicely, I will be finding out most likely.
    Last edited by BillyBob58; 10-13-2018 at 20:17.

  2. #2
    New Member
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    Interesting review, thanks

  3. #3
    Senior Member Johnny Gunz's Avatar
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    I really like my 90. At 6'2" , it's a wee bit short maybe, but still very comfy. Your sensation description while using it without a pad on your side is the same as mine. I'm not sure that's how I'd want to sleep, but man is it cozy! The 90 hugs and supports every ounce and it feels sort of like floating. With a LW pad, it's at its best IMHO. It is a really sweet design and so light.

    I have spent hours trying to figure out a way to hang my 3/4 and FL UQs to this hammock with no real success. I tried weaving shock cord through the suspension of hammock and quilt, but it didn't work at all and left gaps between attachment points. If you figure it out, let us know. Old Trail Dog has done more tinkering with the 90 than anyone and has some good hybrid pad ideas. Thanks for sharing your experiences.
    But for the grace of God, there, I go...

  4. #4
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by airoot View Post
    Interesting review, thanks
    Your welcome!

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Gunz View Post
    I really like my 90. At 6'2" , it's a wee bit short maybe, but still very comfy. Your sensation description while using it without a pad on your side is the same as mine. I'm not sure that's how I'd want to sleep, but man is it cozy! The 90 hugs and supports every ounce and it feels sort of like floating. With a LW pad, it's at its best IMHO. It is a really sweet design and so light.

    I have spent hours trying to figure out a way to hang my 3/4 and FL UQs to this hammock with no real success. I tried weaving shock cord through the suspension of hammock and quilt, but it didn't work at all and left gaps between attachment points. If you figure it out, let us know. Old Trail Dog has done more tinkering with the 90 than anyone and has some good hybrid pad ideas. Thanks for sharing your experiences.
    Your welcome! Thanks for your thoughts. Dang, I thought I almost had it today, just attaching a 3/4 length AHE Jarbidge, both with and without an almost full length Walmart blue CCF pad in the pocket. The pad was mainly just to help it keep some shape. Of course this was really screwed up since all I did was run the suspension biner on each quilt end up to the RL! But, it still was more or less working, and really warm on my back. I could not feel around to tell what was happening because of the danged non removable net(that is the one thing I strongly dislike about this hammock, seems it would be a very handy oz or 2 to make it so we could get it out of the way). But I could tell by looking that it was gaped away on the sides, but that should not be hard to fix. I've fixed many a gaping quilt with a little shock cord add ons. But there may have been gaps that I could not notice due to warm weather.

    But no go for you, with an external quilt, eh? Bummer. I would have thought shock cord tied to the hammock's suspension in 4 or 5 places per side would have done it. Have you had much luck with quilts in the pad pocket? I hope to soon be putting that to the test in some cool weather. Certainly seemed warm enough recently

    But like you say, it is designed primarily for a pad. I have been using my long, wide Neo Air All Season. I get the feeling vertical tubes would work better. I also wish I could try a shorter, but still wide, pad.

    You are right about Old Trail Dog, he is the man with the experience!
    Last edited by BillyBob58; 10-15-2018 at 07:34.

  5. #5
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    OK, now I see one reason they call it HammockTENT

    As I get more and more used to this set up, I am able to move around in it better. But once I put my TR Neo Air LW All Season in it, it becomes extremely easy to maneuver. I have been a little paranoid about damaging something when trying to move, and some new ways of doing thigs have made that easier. But once the pad is in, I feel many times less paranoid about putting a foot or elbow through the fabric(probably won't happen, but just feels more vulnerable than my hammocks which are pensioned from each end and might also be heavier material).

    But once the pad is in the pad pocket, if I push of against the "floor", I am now pushing off against not just the floor, but the pad, Which geatly limits how far the fabric can move and possibly be punctured. Now I feel confident just- for 1 example- lifting my butt and pushing off against my heels to push myself to the head end of the hammock. In fact, this is so easy to do, that something occurred to me: the dreaded mummy sleeping bag in a hammock!

    12 years ago, I was almost turned off from hammocks for ever after almost becoming hypothermic on my first night in a HHSS, primarily from inability to get properly zipped up in my Cat's Meow sleeping bag which had always served me so well at similar temps(22F that first night). I ended up waking up shivering, abandoning the hammock to sleep on the ground on a pad I had thankfully brought, under the stars, warm and toasty. I did not yet know about TQs and it did not occur to me to use my bag in that fashion.

    But it occurred to me use of a bag might be much easier in this hammock. So I dragged out that old Cat's Meow(had not used in years), got back in the Hammocktent 90, put my feet in the bag, lifted up and pulled it up under my butt, sat up and pulled he hood over my head, laid down and zipped up. This was not significantly more difficult than getting in a bag when using a pad on the ground.

    Not that I plan to replace my TQs with separate hood, but I could if I wanted to without much trouble. More importantly, a noob who did not have the money for a TQ, and was having trouble keeping warm enough using that bag as a TQ, could easily just use his bag in the normal fashion, just like on the ground.

    I don't think I ever tried this in my bridge hammocks, but I'm thinking it might be easier in those as well. Especially if using a pad.
    Last edited by BillyBob58; 10-15-2018 at 20:31.

  6. #6
    OlTrailDog's Avatar
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    I agree that it is the most comfortable hammock I own(ed). I've been hanging full time for the past year and a half and use a HT the most often. Occasionally I swap out to a DH Sparrow or WBBB XLC for a comparison ( sold the WBRR ). The nice thing about the HT is there is no fiddle/fidget to find the sweet spot, climb and I'm good to go. The WBRR was also fiddle free, but not as comfortable. The downside is it is takes a bit more to enter/exit, but once you get the "inch worm" shuffle down it isn't really a problem. You are right about the pros and cons angle for every hammock design.

    Have you come up with a tarp solution that works well for you during your experimental phase? A silnylon 10x12 with the short side on the ridge line axis worked for me for quite a while. Hiking poles guyed out in the middle of the head and foot ends for more room.

    I use a sleeping bag all the time because I have some top quality bags. They work fine for me in TQ mode and are more versatile and warmer for tenting or truck camping. But to each their own.

    I actually have the UQ conundrum solved for me. I have not used a pad for 10 months. I've been quite content using a Arrowhead Designs Ridgecreek or a HG Phoenix. I'm not able to share how to do this due to a commitment with a vendor. But one of these days I think you will be as pleased as I have been. Although if I was heading into country where hanging might be a challenge I would definitely take a pad just in case I was forced to ground.

  7. #7
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OlTrailDog View Post
    I agree that it is the most comfortable hammock I own(ed). I've been hanging full time for the past year and a half and use a HT the most often. Occasionally I swap out to a DH Sparrow or WBBB XLC for a comparison ( sold the WBRR ). The nice thing about the HT is there is no fiddle/fidget to find the sweet spot, climb and I'm good to go. The WBRR was also fiddle free, but not as comfortable. The downside is it is takes a bit more to enter/exit, but once you get the "inch worm" shuffle down it isn't really a problem. You are right about the pros and cons angle for every hammock design.

    Have you come up with a tarp solution that works well for you during your experimental phase? A silnylon 10x12 with the short side on the ridge line axis worked for me for quite a while. Hiking poles guyed out in the middle of the head and foot ends for more room.

    I use a sleeping bag all the time because I have some top quality bags. They work fine for me in TQ mode and are more versatile and warmer for tenting or truck camping. But to each their own.

    I actually have the UQ conundrum solved for me. I have not used a pad for 10 months. I've been quite content using a Arrowhead Designs Ridgecreek or a HG Phoenix. I'm not able to share how to do this due to a commitment with a vendor. But one of these days I think you will be as pleased as I have been. Although if I was heading into country where hanging might be a challenge I would definitely take a pad just in case I was forced to ground.
    Yes, I have gone extremely high quality and high tech with my tarp solution: I bought a $7 12X8(or some thing close to that) from Harbor Freight! Sweet! It is OK for now in my back yard, and I don't care if the sun rots it. I put the short side on the RL or over the top bar on my stand. Good enough for now. If I ever want to back pack with this baby, I'm thinking of SLD Winter Palace.

    With the cheap tarp, it keeps me dry but I can't block wind very well from the ends, or at least I have not really tried to. I may get a somewhat larger one, which may allow me to close the ends better for blocking wind. ( I also have been using hiking poles at the head/foot end) But I have been thinking of a few DIY UQP designs to accomplish the wind block. After all, I much prefer how easy it is for me to accomplish that with my old HHSS with it's under cover compared to any tarp I have used. I think it is far more efficient than trying to accomplish such with a larger tarp(though I might want the outside the hammock living space luxury of a large tarp). So why not try that with this hammock?

    It doesn't seem to me that it will be all that difficult to get an external UQ to work with this, except I don't know what would happen when I go to my side and the length collapses. But for on my back(or on my side with legs straight and/or just enough pad to make it keep it's length), it just seems to me I could lay the UQ out on a bed, lay the opened up hammock inside the UQ(or maybe do this on an ironing board with the hammock on the bottom, inside surface against the board, quilt laid over the hammock) and add some gros grain/shockcord loops around the hammock suspension loops, however many it might take on each side to keep the sides of the UQ tight against the hammock. But some problem I'm not seeing might pop up. But me finding the time to experiment with that and sew the loops on is another story.

    But, I admit this hammock is growing on me. I like your phrase "inch worm shuffle"! Exactly!

    On my previous experiments, I had little or no knee extension with no pad, but noticed just enough to need a knee pillow with my Neo Air LW pad. ( I wish I had a shorter but wide pad to try) But today, it was about the same with or without: essentially no knee extension. I don't know why the different experience. I also discovered that I could leave my heels a few inches outside the hammock and past the pad. It did not actually feel un-comfy on my Achilles Tendon, and seemed to put a bit of bend in my knees. It seemed to me my TQ footbox would insulate my heels OK as they hung in the air. I'll have to look into this some more.

    I've got plenty of experimenting to do! But, it is fun!

  8. #8
    Mogollon Monster's Avatar
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    I've got a couple version of this hammock and love them both. My only complaint is there is a bit of a banana shape that I wish was less pronounced, but it's not that big a deal.
    Check out our Youtube page for some fun hammock videos https://www.youtube.com/c/LloydLiving

  9. #9
    OlTrailDog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mogollon Monster View Post
    I've got a couple version of this hammock and love them both. My only complaint is there is a bit of a banana shape that I wish was less pronounced, but it's not that big a deal.
    The banana shape is able to be tweaked if you want to experiment with the lengths of the suspension lines. When I first got a a HT I had the same impression as you. But I've modified that in order to provide lift under the knee area. I am thinking about doing some reworking a number of suspension lines from the butt on down this winter on one of my "experimental" HTs. This will involve cutting some of the lines and splicing in additional length to some of them, or shortening from the head to the butt is another possibility too. Have to wait and see.

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