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  1. #21
    Senior Member
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    My thoughts are in the thread Randy posted earlier. (the handy randy not the smurfy randy)


    For the OP- just buy the 10* warmer quilt in an Econ model and be done with it.

    For the gram weenie- there is ZERO reason to consider overfill for a 950+ fill ultra light quilt.
    Love it and feed it and hold it and name it George.
    Overfilling 950 is like buying 850 in the first place and paying even more for the privilege.

    For the just in case person or casual backpacker who doesn't care... Get the 800 or 850 fill, which won't be as sensitive as 950 anyway and if you want to toss in an ounce of overfill... have at it.

    Down is historically very high quality and ridiculously cheap. These Econ and Budget models are insanely good deals.
    Just buy stuff now and there is no possible way to mess it up.

  2. #22
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    Just to beat a dead horse (someone said this would degenerate into this :-) )

    My ground set-up.... with the dreaded tent, sleeping pad & 30 deg. quilt.

    Ground Setup.jpg

    My purchased but not yet used Hammock set-up. I bought heavier options (HG Econ 20 deg. Incubator & HG Econ 20 deg. Wide Burrow), HG Hammock with net top, + UGQ Penny Pincher Winter Tarp 12' with end poles. The Hammock set-up has warmer quilt and my tarp is over the top large with the poles to make it into a circus tent. I could perform with elephants and lions in there. I have Dutch Straps + buckles, plenty of extra line and MSR stakes (six of them!).

    Hammock Setup.jpg

    I think I could carry either set-up and would be challenged to know which I was carrying at the end of a trip if I could somehow perform a blind test.

  3. #23
    Senior Member StrungUpNewfoundlander's Avatar
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    I’m about to buy my first quilt (an ‘under’). My FOMO has me getting all the overstuff that’ll fit in there. Might be more my Fear of Hypothermia. If you’ve had it or seen it, you understand. Belt and braces (and baffles and draft collars).

    Everyone has their risk/reward profile and the factors vary. My gear is often in a canoe or kayak and my focus is on warmth and durability with weight a tertiary consideration. If I was through-hiking, I’d rearrange my priorities.

    Live and learn and I’ll see how it goes.

  4. #24
    Senior Member FJRpilot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevperro View Post
    If you personally feel it is worth it.... go for it.
    Just as a point of clarity, I actually said I didn’t think overstuff added warmth, it just aided in migration which I think is what the OP was asking about.

    As to value, as you so sagaciously point out, each defines their own...


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    “The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men should do nothing.”

    - Edmund Burke

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by FJRpilot View Post
    Just as a point of clarity, I actually said I didn’t think overstuff added warmth, it just aided in migration which I think is what the OP was asking about.

    As to value, as you so sagaciously point out, each defines their own...


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

    I never know when I'm coming off as an *** (probably something to that). But I honestly don't want to mock anyone willing to spend big dollars to whittle their base weight down to the absolute lowest number. I'd just point out that people were thru-hiking the PCT & AT well before Ray Jardine started a trend. And we have all benefited for the OCD behavior of the masses. It is financially rewarding for the gear companies to shave weight off their products and it is relatively easy to put together a package that is easy to live with these days. And.... there are always tradeoffs for weight lost. You almost always trade functionality, comfort, longevity and/or price for the last couple ounces. Lighter is not always better, it is just one of many factors to consider.

  6. #26
    Senior Member OneClick's Avatar
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    But in regards to overfill, an extra $10 is hardly big bucks. 800FP is fine.

  7. #27
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneClick View Post
    But in regards to overfill, an extra $10 is hardly big bucks. 800FP is fine.
    It absolutely is not, especially considering the already high cost. An an extra oz or 2 is not much added weight. And, as always, whatever seems most logical or desirable to the individual.

    But the part that always confuses me(even though I have myself been known to pay a little more for some extra over fill) : Here I am paying much higher bucks to get that 850 or even 900+ down. Which is supposed to be already "over filled" by 20% or more than the amount needed to maximally fill the baffles, and maybe enough to stretch out the shell as far as it will go beyond the baffles. And after paying that extra money to get the highest possible FP with the maximum possible warmth for the weight, I now pay some more money to add some weight back to my system and get possibly some unknown amount of extra warmth and less migration of down. The latter of which would be available to me- I guess- with 650 or 750 down to start with. The difference in weight for for the down fill for equal loft for 750 vs 950(can you even get that?) will be 21%, do I have that right?

    Or, the down fill weight with an 800 FP economy 20F Burrow is 12.69 oz. For the premium 950 FP 20F Burrow it is 10.69 oz, you save 2 oz. and the cheaper quilt's down is 18.7% heavier. So now if I decide to add 2 more oz of Over fill to the premium, the down weight advantage is totally gone. Now MAYBE it is warmer, and maybe there is also less down shifting. But would the 800FP economy model already have less shifting? What about a MUCH cheaper 700 FP model, even less shifting? I really don't know, just asking.

    However, this I do know: for about the same cost as 2 oz over fill, but for only about 1.7 oz of additional weight, I can get a 10F premium Burrow, rather than a 20F Burrow.

    So if you want some guaranteed extra warmth out of a premium Burrow, after you have paid the big bucks for the premium 950FP approach, the only way to guarantee it is with the warmer rated quilt. You may or may not get it by just adding a couple of oz more down, to make your quilt now weigh the same as the economy quilt. If your main concern is down shifting, or some margin for moisture, would just buying the economy quilt with lower FP already accomplish that? I really don't know, but the Economy sure is lower cost.

    Bottom line for me: it is confusing, and I'm not sure how much benefit adding even more over fill gets you compared to just buying a warmer quilt. But it certainly cost more and adds weight/bulk, maybe weighing even more than the warmer quilt does. So I really don't know what the smartest move is. But I tend to lean towards going with the warmer quilt to start with. But, I may be totally wrong. Sometimes I certainly am.

    I tried to get over fill added to my AHE Climashield Apex Ridge Creek, but apparently the only way I can do that is to get the heavier, bulkier, more expensive quilt!

  8. #28
    Senior Member OneClick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BillyBob58 View Post
    So if you want some guaranteed extra warmth out of a premium Burrow, after you have paid the big bucks for the premium 950FP approach, the only way to guarantee it is with the warmer rated quilt.
    Not at all. I had a 40° in the past that seemed to have some bare spots. At those temps, it's not so critical to have the down evenly spaced. But after getting the same quilt with 1oz extra, it seemed to make a huge difference. I don't notice any thinner spots and I trust pushing its limit. People really need to get past the "it makes it warmer" and focus on WHY it makes it a warmer quilt.

    Wait, 950? I thought all HG quilts were 850. At least that's what mine have always been in the past.

  9. #29
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneClick View Post
    Not at all. I had a 40° in the past that seemed to have some bare spots. At those temps, it's not so critical to have the down evenly spaced. But after getting the same quilt with 1oz extra, it seemed to make a huge difference. I don't notice any thinner spots and I trust pushing its limit. People really need to get past the "it makes it warmer" and focus on WHY it makes it a warmer quilt.

    Wait, 950? I thought all HG quilts were 850. At least that's what mine have always been in the past.
    I know. I was surprised also:
    https://www.hammockgear.com/content/...ium_Burrow.pdf

  10. #30
    Senior Member OneClick's Avatar
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    Ok so you can choose 950 if you want. Not for me, but a nice option.

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