Triple stitching should be plenty strong, but as mentioned above, don't sew your rows too close together and your stitches should not be too tight (close together). I would really be shocked if a double-rolled and triple-sewn end channel failed first on a hammock.
I sew things on youtube.
I don’t sew on commission, so please don’t ask. Thanks.
What are the suggested measurements and stitching length be for doing the channels? 3/8" between rows and 2.5 for stitch length? (I'm worried I'm going to wake up on the ground now....)Originally Posted by jellyfish
1/4" between rows... if you were a bit nervous about hitting that you're better off erring on the side of bigger than smaller; up to 3/8" is probably a good enough tolerance for general use.
Stitch length setting varies by machine, so what's less important than the number is the actual stitches per inch you get.
Technically 3mm would be good, but that could be 2.5 to 4 on your machine. So best to dial it in on a scrap piece of equal thickness. I like 8-10 stitches per inch. 13 or more is too tightly spaced. Much less than 8 per inch gets a bit sloppy.
https://1drv.ms/u/s!Apygyt54yYPwg7Z0PZIjFKznJv4ctw
https://1drv.ms/u/s!Apygyt54yYPwg7ZvNTZ0XhVaYtnqRg
A bit hard to see perhaps... but this second picture is an example of not dialing in the stitching for different material thickness.
This is a luxury bridge with an olive yellow pocket and black channel.
The pocket is three layers of 1.7 material, the channel is sewn through 6 layers.
The pocket is getting about 7.5 stitches per inch (yellow) and you can see how they look a bit loose.
The channel is hitting between 14-16 stitches per inch on the black and looks pinched. (Toilet papered)
This is mainly an example of what happens without dialing in the machine for the specific task.
The pocket is probably fine, decent clean row, but when the stitches get too loose they can be easier to snag and damage the thread itself. Likely the needle size is fine, but perhaps the tension could be a hair tighter and stitch length bumped down 1/2mm.
The channel is a combination of problems. Stitch length setting, too small a needle for that many layers, and likely operator error. Even on the industrial if you're punching through too much bulk (5 layers) there can be both too much drag on the needle/thread as well as a MM or more thread lost to the depth of material. So at 3mm stitch setting, but 1mm thickness... it can easily chew up thread as you go... reducing your stitches per inch and pinching the material. The tension setting is probably okay here, but the stitches look pinched and tight as the machine is trying to travel to it's next stitch position it's pulling too hard to get there because there isn't enough 'slack' thread to match how far the feed dogs are trying to pull the material.
For home machines... sizing the needle properly helps a ton.
I used to figure the smallest needle I could get to work with the thread, then add a number per layer.
So say you can sew cleanly with a #10 on one layer... then bump to a #12 for three layers... a #14 for 5 (or three plus grosgrain). Often you find you need a #16 with webbing. You want the smallest hole you can get... but if the needle isn't big enough for the thread to feed cleanly then it will tangle or pinch... the more layers the more likely the hole will close on the thread before it can complete the stitch.
Once the needle size is good. Check the tension (balanced stitches) and then work on the stitch length setting until your stitches per inch are coming out right. Try to give it a few inches, then check. I only mention it because I've tried to be cheap and squeeze in a stitch or two to adjust but find the machines I had took a few inches to settle into the adjustment.
Final tip... get a good foot you like and measure it.
When I bought my industrial Juki I actually went out of my way to buy a foot that was a full 1/4" from needle drop to edge of foot. The stock feet are more like 3-5mm. Good for garments but not so good for hammocks. So check the foot you like to sew with; using the foot to follow the last line of stitches is only useful if you're the right distance apart. Simply swapping out the foot for one with the correct distance is much easier than having to 'float' that extra bit you need.
99% of the work is dialing in the machine. Once the machine is working right, so long as you go slow, it does the work nearly by itself.
That's what I love about this forum....more detailed information about a miniscule detail than I could have ever even fathomed....FOR FREE no less!!!
Thanks Bill!
I apologize if this is too far off of the original topic but with the highly detailed description of different hammock ends can someone explain the WB ends?
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
https://www.hammockforums.net/forum/...ed-End-Hammock
I think that's all you're looking for.
I've never looked hard at one in person but its basically just a whipped hem/ball gather/whatever you want to call it as far as I can tell.
Hem the two sides, then hem the ends and you'll have an open channel you can feed the whipping cord through.]
I believe the RL is fed through the 'donut hole' of the whipped end before your suspension is girth hitched on.
Brandon has videos on how to swap out the suspension that would help you out if that's the part you're having trouble with.
To circle around though- this is an example of bypassing the stitches. The sewing isn't structural, just a quicker method of whipping and you don't have to sort out any pattern or method in your gathering of the fabric.
As opposed to a true whipped end something like the methods Jeff shows.
http://www.tothewoods.net/HomemadeHammock2.html
If you have a bugnet on the hammock- I wouldn't get creative.
If you have a traveler or similar- you could pull the whipping and try some of the stuff Jeff shows if you wanted.
Point being... don't think there's any real state secret there.
Just one of those things like a 'fronkey net' or 'knotty mod' where it got named something that sounds more exotic than it is
Now that I'm a good few years into it... seems more often than not 75% of learning about hammocks is decoding the local language
One or two folks might debate it, but as far as I am aware the only one doing anything dramatically different who sells gathered ends is Simply Light Designs.
TZBrown shared his parallelogram and I have a few I haven't shared. Others here have played with stuff and the new Sierra Madre hammock looks quite similar to things I recall others sharing here regarding a wave shaped end- https://www.kickstarter.com/projects...latlay-hammock
Otherwise it's still mainly a rectangle with a knot on each end.
I've been thinking of making another hammock... Got a link to the parallelagram hammock build?
Sent from somewhere east of Montauk...
Yes, my pack weighs 70lbs, but it's all light weight gear....
Bob's brother-in-law
https://www.hammockforums.net/forum/...k-with-Footbox
Keep in mind... you were not a fan of the 'N.A.P' Tim had... which was very loosely based on the original.
Keep in mind... much like the original, the name NAP (coined by Goobie) is short for 'Not a Parallelogram'.
Which is a roundabout way of saying there be a rabbit hole ahead if you take that on
https://www.hammockforums.net/forum/...k-with-Footbox
Keep in mind... you were not a fan of the 'N.A.P' Tim had... which was very loosely based on the original.
Keep in mind... much like the original, the name NAP (coined by Goobie) is short for 'Not a Parallelogram'.
Which is a roundabout way of saying there be a rabbit hole ahead if you take that on
Are you referring to the thing we couldn't figure out? If so, it's not that I wasn't a fan... More so, I (we) had no idea what to do with it! If only you could have seen the three of us sitting on stumps, chins in our hands.. staring at it. We could figure out what to do with it!!
It sure made for some great memories..
Yes, my pack weighs 70lbs, but it's all light weight gear....
Bob's brother-in-law
That's the one; which is extra funny because when used right it makes an excellent bench.
I'm sometimes cruel to my testers and just send things with no explanation. It helps me develop the instructions or videos down the line based upon the questions they have...or even help shape the product to be more intuitive to use. Course it seems Tim was sometimes cruel to his friends too and probably should have tried it at home first before sending you to the stump.
That one you had was extra confusing as I was trying a storage system out that would pair with my stakeless tarp and a single tent pole. The pole spreads it all open and gets the confusing parts out of your way. After your trip Tim had the aha moment he needed but he never got into it fully unfortunately.
At the end of the day... it's just a gathered end at heart... but the geometry gives you two totally different sleep positions depending on which end you put your head in. One way is a nice flat lay and the other puts you in a recliner type position. Working with more folks with sleep apnea; several of us noted it can help when sleeping in a lazy boy. So while there is a bit of shoulder squeeze to work out... that 'reverse' position lets you sleep upright in a very similar position while still being fairly 'hammocklike' in terms of lack of pressure. I suppose you could think of it like an 'L shape' overall or a long chaise lounge in that you could sit up on one end or spin around and lay flat on the other end.
With one minor trick in how you sit down... it turns into a really nice 'bench'. Rather than a scoop like you normally get when you lay across a gathered end it forms more of that 80* back rest you'd have in a park bench. (I think Tim was calling it the bench hammock). So it's nicer for that at camp and that's why I was working on the pole setup so you got a stakeless porch to cover you on your bench.
Anywho... I liked TZBrown's hammock because I've always been into reducing tree to tree distances. I believe he had close to an 8' ridgeline on his original idea. The only weak point for me; in an UL model (which was my interest) it started to add up and the 'add on' triangle is a tough seam to add for both production and durability on the commercial side too. It still is a pretty neat hammock and works great to bust calf ridge as well as to reduce RL distance... but at some point it just wasn't working for my needs. Here's a picture of my version of that hammock after a few tweaks that also shows roughly what I was going for down the line with the one you three were stumped by
https://1drv.ms/u/s!Apygyt54yYPwgupc9MUxMbpwS01umg
https://1drv.ms/u/s!Apygyt54yYPwgupfb5jzAwLIiiy8AA
Out of TZBrown's idea though;
I ended up with a 75* hammock that works pretty well. (think a cross between a short hammock and an Amok) and that idea is slowly creeping into a full 90* hammock.
I ended up with the N.A.P. which is now a distant cousin thrice removed from the original idea. It's not as light as I had originally hoped... but I am slowly realizing that hammock hangers are occasionally okay with a few extra ounces
PS- Speaking of testing- I replied to your last email... might be in your junk box.
PPS- Started sending out a few of those new bridges out for testing and hoping to get to you and Bob next.
PPPS- Goobie has been testing the NAP for about a year now, but wants a hybrid 1.2 version to go head to head with his streamliner... if I sit down to do one... might as well do two if you were interested in trying one.
PPPPS- too many p's... I need to use the restroom now.
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