Attachment hardware or software for tie-out to ridgeline or guyline? Suggestions?

[GeneH]

I bought several of these Fastline tensioning clips from Yama Mountain Gear for the purpose of using them on my tarps.

https://yamamountaingear.com/collect...line-tensioner

Did not end end up using them for the tarp but have used them for several other purposes and a nice addition to have.

These would be the ultimate off-the-shelf-easy-to-use solution for a lot of things. Thanks! The are on my list.

[GeneH]

...Get a dozen or more split rings and put two at each of the ridgeline and tarp corners. You can get steel ones which can serve as an intentional failure point or get titanium ones which are unlikely to fail under typical conditions.

You can use the pairs of rings as descender rings, just as shown in the linked video for hammock suspension. Use the slippery half hitch to prevent slippage. The split rings would be threaded onto the ribbon loops at the tarp corners in place of the green cord which connects the to the hammock in the video. Just use your normal guyline cordage in place of the straps.

Split rings like the kind used on car keys? (the heavier ones, not the wire scrap) I cannot imagine those failing, but then I've never dealt with tents or tarps in 60 mph winds...

The descender rings look like a viable option, if not for this purpose, certainly others. Thanks - this goes on my list also. There are times when I don't trust the plastic strap tensioning hardware so will check this out.

[cmc4free]

Split rings like the kind used on car keys? (the heavier ones, not the wire scrap) I cannot imagine those failing, but then I've never dealt with tents or tarps in 60 mph winds...

The descender rings look like a viable option, if not for this purpose, certainly others. Thanks - this goes on my list also. There are times when I don't trust the plastic strap tensioning hardware so will check this out.

Yes, like a car key ring (not the throwaway kind), but smaller. 1/2" inner diameter, or so.
https://www.namagear.com/product-page/split-rings
And you're right - they're not too likely to fail, especially with two rings at each connection.

Very efficient for use on tarp corners, but one catch if considering to use them on the ridgeline connections:
Unless you can get the cordage to slip (like without the added half hitch), they are very difficult to release under tension. On a tarp corner, that's no problem because you could just pull the stake if you have to. On a ridgeline though, if the cord is strung tight between the tarp and a tree, there may not be much give to allow the rings to release their grip on the cord. Undoing the half hitch would likely allow the cord to slip enough that you could release them the rest of the way.

I thought this would be a decent suggestion based on the constraints you mentioned initially:
- Adjustability right at the corners of the tarp
- Low cost
- Guylines attached to stakes and not attached to tarp, due to changing tarp pitches

But again, I think it's a better option for the tarp corners than it is for the ridgeline connections.

[GeneH]

Ok - I'm posted a few more questions above somewhere - I really do appreciate the feedback. It helps so much to have it in one place and focused on my specific questions. Somehow I grasp the concepts better.

[bluesam3]

Split rings like the kind used on car keys? (the heavier ones, not the wire scrap) I cannot imagine those failing, but then I've never dealt with tents or tarps in 60 mph winds...

The descender rings look like a viable option, if not for this purpose, certainly others. Thanks - this goes on my list also. There are times when I don't trust the plastic strap tensioning hardware so will check this out.

The point is that they don't fail, except with forces so strong that the atlernative is the tarp failing, when you want them to fail.

[bluesam3]

NamaClaws are probably worth looking at too, for example: ridgeline, guyline.

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Don't want to high jack this thread. But think it relates. I have just gone to a CRL with NamaClaws (have that hardware on my tie outs too) and this last Monday night trying to deploy in terrible strom at 3500 feet (loud wind, rain in big big drops, termperature dropped from 94 to 62 in 5 minutes; out of daylight because was trying to get to the official camp site; and lost; and solo, and with glasses with bi-foicol/prisims), I managed to tangle my CRL; which I was of course putting up first. All ended well. But when I got home, I voted never to figure 8 my CRL again. One with NamaClaws is really difficult. So, I remembered all past conversations on this site and made a "spool" out of two McDonald coffee cups, cut 1/2 way down, bottom out of one to seat in bottom of other, held together with glad wrap and scotch tape. It works. At least at sea level in my shed. Which one of you guys came up with that? Where is the tread. If the "spool" failed, how? etc.

[MikekiM]

MikekiM - I this the above summarizes your current setup, right? mini ucrs on the ridgeline and tarpworms on the corner guy or ground lines?

Consistent across all of my tarps.. ground corners are tarp worms with 1.2 Z-Line. Doors are mini ucrs with 1.2 Z-Line. Tarp ridge lines.. split 12' ridge lines in Zing-It with a Zing-It Evo loop at the tree end and a mini ucr in Zing-it connected to diamond knots at the tarp ridge tie outs.

A couple questions then: Staking the sides directly tight to the ground I might get some sag in silnylon when really wet, right? Better to suspend a few inches above ground and run corner or guylines out a couple feet for tension adjustments?

Silnylon is going to stretch and sag when wet, so shock cord tensioners would be almost mandatory regardless of the what choose as your corner adjustments gear. Tarp worms come with the shock cord. If you choose the mini ucrs, just make a small loop of shock cord between the corner hardware and your mini ucr. I never get my tarp down to the ground.. the sides aren't wide enough. Even my old 12's weren't wide enough to go right to ground unless I wanted to crawl under.

Another option (not meaning to complicate things)... I used to use a single internal pole to open up the 12's. The pole will pull up and sag you might see when wetted out AND make a cavern out of your tarp!! I don't use it now other for the few times I car camp.

I would only use tarp worms when tarp sides are suspended above the ground and/or I'm using some kind of guy line. If the sides are staked directly tight to the ground I"ll just use the loops on the tarp to the stake.

You could. I don't and wouldn't. I would be concerned about wear on the tarps grosgrain loops. If you have the shock cord between the Tarp Worm and the manufacturer corner hardware and can get the corner down to the ground (I can't) use the shock cord loop as your anchor point.. maybe. What tarp are you using? Maybe I missed that.. sorry.

The mini ucrs would work just as effectively with a CL or not? No reason not to use them?

CL typically denotes Continuous Loop.. at the head and foot of a gathered end hammock. I am thinking you mean CRL.. Continuous Ridge Line. Sure they would work. Any place where you might use a prussik. In fact, I still have a continuous ridge line though I don't use it much. It has an Evo Loop at one end, and.. hmmm.. can't remember.. either a Dutch Wasp, or simple mil-spec toggle at the other tree end, with two mini ucrs in the middle that attach to the diamond knots on the tarp. With this setup, you lose the mechanical advantage gained when the split lines are threaded through the tarp hardware.

I don't understand this part: "When used on the tarp ridge line, the eye is looped over a diamond knot at the ridge tie out on each end of each tarp."

So below is one of my DIY 12's.. long gone at this point. Imagine that the Dutch Tarp Biner is a split ring (I had split rings at the tarp ridge tie out points); it's threaded through the tarp's grosgrain. A diamond knot is tied through the split ring. The mini ucr is on the tarps ridge line and it has an eye that captures the diamond knot. Makes the ridge line removable and the tarp connection totally modular. I have the diamond knots on everything! I mean everything!

So the red is a zing-it CRL. The green reflective cord is the diamond knot. Replace the biner with a split ring (this pic was during the first setup, before the rings went on). The yellow is the mini ucr and what you see is the loop I tied in the ucr using a double dragon knot. The constrictor goes out of frame. The orange is a locked sliding whipping knot. The eye of the mini ucr drops over the diamond knot and the slider is pushed up against the diamond to prevent it from popping out before the ridge line is tensioned.

Why do you hate prrusiks? Because of jamming? I have to fiddle with mine a little bit after tension in order to get them to slide. They really grip on the Lawson Glowire.

My hatred started when I first used them on a continuous ridge line. They are tough to tighten. Once they bit they are hard to release. I am in the North East, and we have tons of pine trees so sap on the ridge line doesn't play nice with prussicks.. I can go on and on.. just don't like them.

Split rings like the kind used on car keys? (the heavier ones, not the wire scrap) I cannot imagine those failing, but then I've never dealt with tents or tarps in 60 mph winds...

The descender rings look like a viable option, if not for this purpose, certainly others. Thanks - this goes on my list also. There are times when I don't trust the plastic strap tensioning hardware so will check this out.

I use 1/2" stainless split rings from Warbonnet. I believe their failure point is right below 100 lbs. Pointless to use anything stronger.. it defeats the purpose as you want the ring to pull out and fail before the tarp does. And yes, I have had one fail under really high winds.

Don't be tempted to use fishing tackle.. those are designed for the modularity and to NOT fail.. they are like 200 or 300 lb.

The point is that they don't fail, except with forces so strong that the atlernative is the tarp failing, when you want them to fail.

Exactly..

[GeneH]

NamaClaws are probably worth looking at too...

Don't want to high jack this thread. But think it relates. I have just gone to a CRL with NamaClaws (have that hardware on my tie outs too) and this last Monday night trying to deploy in terrible storm ... I managed to tangle my CRL...when I got home, I voted never to figure 8 my CRL again.

Glad you piped in. I forgot about Nama Claws. They look like an awesome no-brainer connector and adjustre in one. I'll put them in my reference table.

Regarding your cords in a figure 8 my longer lines tend to tangle. A few times I rolled my 25 ft lines into tight balls like yarn balls. Throwing a line over a branch to hang the food the ball would roll around on the ground and deploy without tangling. The downside is the lines never dry and it left my lines kinda kinky. I would think a spool would be bulky and take up pack space.

[GeneH]

MikekiM your last post reads like a detailed user guide. Pretty awesome. I should be able to figure it out...


Etowah rip stop nylon 10x10 tarp seemed to be a good price and weight balance at about $110 and 18 ounces, planning on an August purchase. I didn't realize that silnylon sagged that much. (someone posted just recently showing pictures of a really saggy tarp) Seems that I should be ok if I run a CRL, having it hang from the center tabs, maybe get additional tabs added for better diagonal support.

Silpoly seems to cost quite a bit more...not sure if I want to spend over $150 for a tarp.

Or maybe run my CRL under the tarp with a good drip line. Pitches I foresee are plowpoint (I really like that one), A-frame, or a wind shed wedge. I like to keep the wind and rain off me while I sit closed to a small fire with a great view. If I'm just backpacking and not spending time in camp, I'll take my tent, otherwise it's just the tarp or both for places like BWCA. Maybe I'll just ditch the tent someday, but not today. :-)