Cool weather is coming and it's time to break out the Palace....

**MikekiM** · 08-11-2019, 19:26

I know we've discussed this over the years, but maybe someone has a new way to get the Palace doors to close completely. Velcro, Kam snaps, toggles... folks have tried many solutions.

At one point I pinged HG about why I can overlap the doors on my Standard, but the Palace geometry doesn't allow it. The answer I got, if I remember correctly was that they needed to use the door shape they do, to conserve weight. I didn't buy that answer then, nor do I now.

At present, I've got a small toggle in the middle of the doors.. Used a piece of cuben tape with a small loop sewn in it on one door and the toggle on the other door, but that only gets the doors to touch.. no way I can get them overlap with a really steep pitch.

Does anyone have any new suggestions??

**TrailSlug** · 08-11-2019, 19:33

Get a new tarp

Seriously though how would the doors not touch if you bring the bottoms of the doors closer together.

**MikekiM** · 08-11-2019, 19:50

Touch yes.. overlap no.

You can get the door corners to touch. With the tension on the ground corners, the middle of the doors bow out and aren't touching. This isn't unique to my Palace..

**cmoulder** · 08-11-2019, 20:06

We need to look at this some more when we hike to compare door closure methods.

I noticed that if you pull the door corners straight in toward each other that the result is not as good as when the corners are pulled slightly down toward the stakes. This is why I use the combined shock cord and static cord and set it up so that the cords slide down the corner guy lines. I find this works well enough for me. But for a wider pitch, there isn't enough material. I'd imagine this would be really tough when using it with a bridge hammock.

**MikekiM** · 08-11-2019, 20:17

That's a pretty steep pitch. If you took the poles off it would be tight inside.

I have switched to Link Loc Hooks with shock cord, so I could go down to the ground stake, or to the opposite tarp corner. Current setup won't let me anchor the door mid-way on one of the guy lines.

You have the same issue right? If you go with a wider pitch the doors won't overlap... right? I you pull the doors straight in towards each other they middle of the door billows out.. no way to block wind. So I have been going to the opposite stake, down and out as you said.

Next hike let's throw the Palaces in the pack and play around with them..

**SilvrSurfr** · 08-12-2019, 21:06

I think it's an exercise in futility to get the doors of any tarp to close completely. I once camped in a snowstorm in the Pine Barrens, and I really had my Winter Palace locked down - I was sure I was secure from any wimpy snowstorm. I woke up in the middle of the night to discover about four inches of snow on my topquilt - most of it was coming through a tiny little gap of maybe an inch wide.

And even if you get the doors to close, the weather can just come in underneath the tarp. I saw this graphically during one of those 100% humidity rainstorms in Connecticut. I woke up feeling damp, and turned on my headlamp to see this huge stream of liquid air coming under the tarp, and up and over my quilts and hammock. Even if I were in a fully-sealed tent, I think I would have gotten wet that night.

As for keeping the wind off, I've always been of the opinion that cuben fiber tarps need as much air flow as possible - otherwise, you end up in a condensation nightmare.

**MikekiM** · 08-13-2019, 05:04

Not looking to get it closed up like a ziploc.. that would be unreasonable, considering.. it's a tarp.

It would be nice to get it to close in the same fashion as the Standard though.. Kind of odd that two tarps from the same manufacturer have such different characteristics.

**MikekiM** · 08-17-2019, 15:02

Had the Palace out today to see what's up.

It's as I remember it. If I pitch the same wide pitch I use on my Standard (which allows the Standards doors close and overlap if needed) the Palace doors are about six to eight inches apart. Forget about overlapping, they don't even touch.

I tried something I remember doing years ago. I clipped the door corners together first and then staked out the ground corners. Added one extra stake at the center under the door and used that to pull the doors straight down and, sure enough, I got the doors closed. The toggle I have in the middle of the doors pulled that together too. It is indeed a narrower pitch than I would normally do, but it works well enough.

I usually close the head end for sure and often leave the foot end open since I always enter from the foot end. This would work well. I'll see if my thoughts change as the temps drop. Driving rain or blowing snow will still get through the opening at the doors no matter what I do.

**TrailSlug** · 08-17-2019, 16:18

Yea unless you get snaps or something similar it's not easy to get a perfect no overlap door closure. I'm not sure I ever cared about overlap though? It is a tarp and not a tent

**MikekiM** · 08-17-2019, 17:16

I agree...

However, I would like to get as good a seal as possible anyplace above hammock level. Mostly concerned about blowing wind and rain.

With the Standard, I can overlap the doors and close off everything other than where the suspension is coming through.

Just seems poorly planned that the larger tarp, billed originally as the Winter Palace, has less of a winter seal than the smaller Standard.