Underquilt for the Hammocktent Gamma UL2?

[Udrian]

Hi guys. Long time lurker here making my first post (hopefully in compliance with community guidelines).

I was wondering if anyone have experience with using an underquilt with the Hammocktent Gamma UL2?

I bought the UL2 this season and was astonished by its comfort (6,3" side sleeper with bad shoulder). However I found it to be surprisingly cold when used in conjunction with the Exped UL LW at approximately 50 degrees. I've tried a thin CCF pad inside the hammock in combination with the UL LW as well as the Downmat 7, but both combinations felt too breezy for my liking (I do sleep somewhat cold).

My last resort before giving up the UL2 for camping in the low fifties (I live in Norway so that's a significant part of our season), is to buy an underquilt. Having absolutely no experience with an UQ I figured I would turn to you guys for guidance before splurging.

I have good experience with products from Cumulus (Poland) and was therefore considering the Selva 600 Large and maybe a Selva 250 for above freezing. However their UQs seem a bit wide (43" at the shoulders compared to the ul2s 34") so I am more than open to other suggestions.

Any tips?

Thanks,

Chris

[leiavoia]

43" would be considered a narrow underquilt to me. 34" would be borderline useless.

Be advised that the Gamma gains some structural integrity from the pad, so not having a pad could change the fit.

Also be advised that most commercial underquilts are made for gathered end hammocks and feature a side-channel suspension which might interfere with the Gamma's own suspension.

[BillyBob58]

I am surprised at your problems with the pad, though I don't know it's R value. I have been pretty warm at least in most spots using a TR NeoAir All Season(R value 4.9) at 25-30F. And this pad is only 2.5" thick, so it doesn't quite fill the 3" pad pocket(EDIT: a potential problem).

But, I have boosted this quite nicely by adding puffy clothing and or a thin quilt on top of the pad inside the pocket. So: my back, hammock, something puffy, pad, outer layer of pad pocket. Or, I have had some luck with simply stuffing an UQ into the pad pocket, no pad. I have a quilt which I have added cam snaps and to the hammocks pad pocket which helps keep it in place and stretched out to the sides. Of course, then the hammock does not have the structure the pad gives it, but despite this I find it very, very comfy.

Do you have an extra sleeping bag or quilt? If so, experiment by adding it to the pad pocket, either alone or on top of the pad. It will make a big difference. And just adding puffy clothing on top of the pad can make a big dif.

When I went to my side, I was even warmer in my torso, but developed some cold spots under my legs. I solved this by either adding some clothing on top of my pad, or just putting my cut down Walmart blue pad(used as a sit pad) under my legs, inside the hammock. Then I could move it around as needed. Again, this was at 25 to 30F, with that 2.5" pad alone, and clothing and/or sit pad added as needed for cold spots, and I was pretty warm.

Try some of these tricks, and let us know if it helps. EDIT: one more thing: these pads that have baffles sometimes have a peak between the valleys. Cold air can slip into those valleys. Adding puffy clothing on top of the pad can fill those valleys. Also, supposedly letting a bit of air out of the pad helps flatten those peaks so that the valleys are not so deep or are flattened. That might help. EDIT: but obviously, as you let air out, the pad is not as thick, so some insulation value might be lost, but you might be able to flatten those peaks with out losing too much thickness)

here is a 30º TQ on top of the NeoAir pad. This quilt is way more than needed for this. Probably a 50ºF quilt would be more than adequate to fill the valleys caused by the pad baffles, and fill any gap left by using the 2.5" thick pad in the 3"pad pocket:

Here I am stretched out with no pad, just the quilt in the pad pocket. Nice and warm.


Here is the quilt- NO PAD- inside the pad pocket:

Here is my nice view of a cloudless sky from the hammock:

Here is the view of side sleeping, I think the pad is in place here, but pad or no pad is very comfy for side sleeping, probably #1:
View out the side, towards the little pond in the middle of the woods:

[Udrian]

Thanks for your insight! My intention would be to use the UQ in combination with a cut down neoair to alleviate shoulder pressure. For the quilt to fit the gamma I imagine the preferred suspension would be loops contrary to a channel (?), that way I can attach it via paracord to where the gammas suspension is connected to the hammock. As the gamma is not based on the principle of a diagonal lay I struggle to see why the UQ should be wider than the hammock itself, or am I missing something?

[Udrian]

I am surprised at your problems with the pad, though I don't know it's R value. I have been pretty warm at least in most spots using a TR NeoAir All Season(R value 4.9) at 25-30F. And this pad is only 2.5" thick, so it doesn't quite fill the 3" pad pocket.

But, I have boosted this quite nicely by adding puffy clothing and or a thin quilt on top of the pad inside the pocket. So: my back, hammock, something puffy, pad, outer layer of pad pocket. Or, I have had some luck with simply stuffing an UQ into the pad pocket, no pad. I have a quilt which I have added cam snaps and to the hammocks pad pocket which helps keep it in place and stretched out to the sides. Of corse, then the hammock does not have the structure the pad gives it, but despite this I find it very, very comfy.

Do you have an extra sleeping bag or quilt? If so, experiment by adding it to the pad pocket, either alone or on top of the pad. It will make a big difference. And just adding puffy clothing on top of the pad can make a big dif.

When I went to my side, I was even warmer in my torso, but developed some cold spots under my legs. I solved this by either adding some clothing on top of my pad, or just putting my cut down Walmart blue pad(used as a sit pad) under my legs, inside the hammock. Then I could move it around as needed. Again, this was at 25 to 30F, with that 2.5" pad alone, and clothing and/or sit pad added as needed for cold spots, and I was pretty warm.

Try some of these tricks, and let us know if it helps. EDIT: one more thing: these pads that have baffles sometimes have a peak between the valleys. Cold air can slip into those valleys. Adding puffy clothing on top of the pad can fill those valleys. Also, supposedly letting a bit of air out of the pad helps flatten those peaks so that the valleys are not so deep or are flattened. That might help.

here is a 30º TQ on top of the NeoAir pad. This quilt is way more than needed for this. Probably a 50ºF quilt would be more than adequate to fill the valleys caused by the pad baffles, and fill any gap left by using the 2.5" thick pad in the 3"pad pocket:

Here I am stretched out with no pad, just the quilt in the pad pocket. Nice and warm.


Here is the quilt- NO PAD- inside the pad pocket:

Here is my nice view of a cloudless sky from the hammock:

Here is the view of side sleeping, I think the pad is in place here, but pad or no pad is very comfy for side sleeping, probably #1:
View out the side, towards the little pond in the middle of the woods:

This sounds very promising! I have a somewhat minimal down bag I could try in combination with my pads. This could as you say alleviate the draft that is caused by the gaps between the baffles and the hammock. Very excited to try this out!

[BillyBob58]

This sounds very promising! I have a somewhat minimal down bag I could try in combination with my pads. This could as you say alleviate the draft that is caused by the gaps between the baffles and the hammock. Very excited to try this out!

I hope it helps you, and it is a simple enough thing to experiment with. In my case, two things are being accomplished. First, as you mention, hopefully filling the valleys. But also, since my pad at max inflation is only 2.5" thick, and the pad pocket on my older model (I don't think that has changed) is 3" deep. So, I have been concerned that I might not be in very solid contact with the pad, as I would be with a pad at least 3" thick. (but I have still been warm enough, most of the time, in most spots, down into the high 20s- low 30s) So, adding a quilt on top of the pad also fills any potential small gap.If you look at the first picture, you can see that the inner hammock sleeping surface is actually raised up several inches above the pad, and into the hammock. So when I get in, I compress all of that loft down so that it fills only whatever slight gap I might have between the pad and my back or shoulders, as well as hopefully filling any valleys between pad peak and baffles. Seems to work nicely.

Again, keep in mind: if weight and bulk is a big concern, this 30F quilt that I have stuffed in there is WAY over kill for what I am trying to accomplish. 1/2 to 1" of total loft should do the job. So the lightest possible quilt that one could buy or make should do the job. So should adding any clothing that you don't intend to sleep in. I have done so, and it seemed to work for me. And that adds zero weight or bulk, assuming you were going to have that clothing with you anyway. If your pad was even lighter and thinner, then obviously you would need something with a bit more loft to fill the gap.

A bit of a problem is keeping the added quilts or clothing in place.You might need it at the shoulders, or feet, and it tends to bunch up in the middle. Hence my experiment with cam snaps on the sides and at the head and feet. That really helps. I have also heard of making a sleeve that wraps partially around the pad(don't need any extra on the bottom of the pad, so maybe just some straps to keep the quilt partially wrapped around the pad?). That would insure that the quilt stayed maximally spread out to the sides, foot and head.

Let us know if any of this helps!

[BillyBob58]

Also, condensation on top of your pad that wets your quilt(added on top of your pad) is a potential problem. I have had no problems with that so far. But, even if I did, I am a fan of Vapor barrier clothing anyway. If I started having a problem, I would just make sure I slept in my VB clothing, problem solved.

[hutzelbein]

I have an older HammockTent no-net hammock, and if the design of the layers of the current model hasn't changed, it needs a pad of exactly the right thickness. And even then there might remain air pockets between you and the pad. I haven't experimented a whole lot with 90° hammocks, yet, because I have no way to hang them indoors, but I approached the insulation issue similarly to BillyBob58. I have a semi-rec down sleeping bag, which I zipped up to create a "sleeve" which I filled with a Therm-a-Rest pad. It's fairly easy to shove this sandwich between the layers. The pad will keep the hammock stretched out and hold the sleeping bag in place. The sleeping bag will loft and fill the air gaps. It seemed to work pretty well, but I haven't been able to spend more than one night in it. As soon as I have built my 90° hammock stand, this will be the approach I will be following.

[Udrian]

Short update: I tried adding a super thin down sleeping bag (Haglöfs LIM down 1) on top of the pad, and the added warmth made the 90 degree hammock acceptable down to about 40 Fahrenheit. It is not as warm as I would've hoped but it works, so thanks for your input! However, if possible I would like to use my hammock below freezing - anyone have experience with using an under quilt on this type of hammock? I've seen photos of UQs being used with the gamma, but hard to say if it would actually add significant warmth due to the pad and distance between the sides of the hammock and myself.

[OlTrailDog]

I have developed a modified version of the HT that has several benefits including the ability to successfully and comfortably use a UQ. A couple of years ago following a discussion with Luke of HT I contacted a vendor to see if they were interested in commercially developing the idea. They were and requested that I keep the idea under wraps. A couple of months ago I contacted the vendor to see if they still were interested. They were, so mum is still the word honoring my commitment. Won't be everybody's cup o' tea, but if it was there would only be one hammock design in the world, eh?